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Posted by: richardL Apr 10 2004, 05:30 PM

Here are pictures from this morning. I tried to get pictures of most everyone's cars. There was a very fast 'non-windshield' car from Sacramento, but my battery had died by then

http://members.rennlist.com/rlinsdall/indexQ.htm

Enjoy!

Richard

Posted by: seanery Apr 10 2004, 06:03 PM

That looks like you all had fun!
Lots of nice cars!

Who was that getting crossed up in Andy's car? Kinda looked like B.

Posted by: richardL Apr 10 2004, 06:29 PM

That was Andy, B wasn't driving (at least not when I left). Andy was fighting understeer and had just disconnected the sway bar - and now was fighting oversteer

There was also a GT2 just arrived as I left - don't know if anyone else was doing photos though.

R

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 10 2004, 08:48 PM

I'll get my pics uploaded in a few mins, right now im putting on aloe vera

No red 951 pics?

Which car did you have Richard?

Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 08:59 PM

I dig the gray car!!!!! I'll post some picts here later. Its fun to see so many 914s out there.... finally!!!

Posted by: SirAndy Apr 10 2004, 09:49 PM

yupp, ttod if i'm not mistaken. he ran a 1:02 and the next best guy had a 1:09 or something like that. pretty crazy fast ...

Andy

Posted by: SirAndy Apr 10 2004, 09:51 PM

tell me about it

first i can't get it to turn in, then it turns too much and to top it all, the front brakes locked up on me all the time.
i suck ...

oh, btw, there was only one other guy in my class and he didn't show up,
so, guess what, i won my class

now back to my suspension setup ...
Andy

Posted by: tesserra Apr 10 2004, 10:16 PM

Great day.
It was really nice to see that many 914s out there doing what they do so well.
It was also nice to meet all the people in person from the club.

George

Posted by: Rich Bontempi Apr 10 2004, 11:01 PM

Thanks Richard for all the nice pics. Everyone seemed to have a great time. Looking forward to the next one.

Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:10 PM

A couple picts came out....


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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:10 PM

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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:11 PM

qwersdf


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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:13 PM

adsgsf


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Posted by: Bleyseng Apr 10 2004, 11:13 PM

How do you get one of those cool High Preformance House suntints???

nice pics!

Geoff

Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:13 PM

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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:14 PM

yuiuo


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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:14 PM

uyotiu


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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:16 PM

To get a HPH decal, ask Rich. I think they are less than $50.


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Posted by: Rich Bontempi Apr 10 2004, 11:24 PM

Way Less!

Posted by: SirAndy Apr 10 2004, 11:36 PM

you will have to talk to THIS guy

also note those FANCY numbers ...


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Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 10 2004, 11:38 PM

Thanks for the picture Richard! I appreciate it.


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Posted by: ChrisReale Apr 10 2004, 11:42 PM

You guys are KILLING ME. Rich B, Im coming down on Monday to give you $$. I need to AX soon. It is a matter of sanity and national security etc....

Posted by: Rich Bontempi Apr 10 2004, 11:46 PM

Sounds like a plan!

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 12:07 AM

Ok, loaded the pics..

http://www.teamgracer.com/cars/pca-ax-041004/PCA-AlamedaAX4-10-04.htm

Lots of pics there..

Dial up, dont even try... lol

Andrew

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 12:16 AM

For those of you with dial up.. I'll put in some of the high lights..

Heres the A-hole himself, great pic.


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Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 12:17 AM

Here's a good view of some of the 914's.. On the grid (btw, the grid was packed full...).


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Posted by: Britain Smith Apr 11 2004, 01:44 AM

Man Andy...you don't let up on the numbers...After I put those on there, I added 10hp to Rich's car...lol!

-Britain

Posted by: Britain Smith Apr 11 2004, 01:48 AM

Yea...Brad, Andy, Angel (my wife) and I were up at HPH late Friday night getting everything together and putting those stickers on all the cars going to the autocross. I think Andy and I counted 5 or so stickers.

It was my first autocross and I am really happy that I went, I had a blast. My little 1.7L with no sway bars really wasn't all that bad. I think I might actually put some money in it, lower it from 4x4 level, and get it corner weighted and balanced for the next event. Now I really need to get my 912 done so I can have a bit more power.

-Britain

Posted by: chunger Apr 11 2004, 04:26 AM

Looks like you guys had a blast! I was monitering this thread wanting to drop by, but I had a rough framing inspection by the structural engineer for my house I was fretting about today.

I will try to make it out next time w/o 914, but just to help out if I can. Please post again when the next AX happens. . .

-'Chung

Posted by: seanery Apr 11 2004, 07:16 AM

So Andy, does that mean you won your class twice now? MUSR & this one?

Posted by: Bleyseng Apr 11 2004, 07:28 AM

Britan, remember these are momentem cars so a set up 1.7 car can do very well.

I wanna know how much help that big ass spoiler helps?

ChrisReale, How come your car still isn't done? Man, your car has been under the knife forever.


Geoff

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 11 2004, 09:37 AM

My God, lookit' all that concrete.....Oh, nice cars too Wish I was there.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 10:59 AM

Man o Man.. I really really feel bad for the rest of the 914 people in the USA. When was the last time you had 20+ 914's show up to an AutoX ??

I had fun (even though we did a spring change on the winged car and I got through 80% of a clutch cable change on another car)

Thanks for the shot Andrew. I learned in that moment (that you caught on camera) that Bill Pickering had too much negative camber in the rear of his car for his selected tire.

If more Bay Area people are interested in running their car.. please watch the calender of events or contact any admin about dates/times. As you can clearly see it is all about fun and getting out in your 914. Several of us help "coach" and "guide" you through a AutoX day.


B

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:01 AM

Somebody send Randall an email... it is shots like this that tell me he is too soft.


B

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:05 AM

NO sway bars hooked up. Can anyone guess the torsion bar rates/rear spring rates ??


LOL


B

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:09 AM

This is understeer for those of you following along at home.

We dialed it all out by raising the rear spring rates 100lbs from 250lb to 350lb. He finished in the top 3.


B

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:12 AM

This is the V8 914 that had the oil and water coming out of the oil pan I shot a few weeks back. The injection is not 100% and has a weird flat spot from full throttle. George the owner and I will get it squared away with a dyno tuning session and a O2 install. The car now has a Tarret bar installed.. nice and flat...


B

Posted by: anthony Apr 11 2004, 11:13 AM

Andrew, why don't you resize those pics for everybody?

You know that you can do it all in one shot in batch mode, right? Even the freebee Irfanview has a nice batch mode facility. It would only take a minute or two to resize all those to 1024x768 or 800x600.

Posted by: Mueller Apr 11 2004, 11:16 AM

killer turn out !!!! I'm just like Chris....reading these posts and seeing the pictures are making me sick with jealousy.....gotta get the car running, gotta get the car running

Hey B, you coming by today??

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:16 AM

I cannot make this car run *crisp*. The IDA 3C's Webers keep bogging the car in tight turns. The last issue I found with it: the throttle shafts are well worn out. I tuned it the best I could, but until the shaft issue is taken care of.. I think all the bottom end is going to be sluggish.


B

Posted by: nine14cats Apr 11 2004, 11:19 AM

Randal,

You're too soft!



There....I said it!

Bill P.

Posted by: nine14cats Apr 11 2004, 11:23 AM

The Alameda Auto-X was alot of fun...I've been fighting car issues the last month but we still ended up posting some respectable times....

Here's a shot of the spring change....done in 12 minutes trackside

Thanks for help B, It would have been alot longer without your help...

Bill P.


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Posted by: nine14cats Apr 11 2004, 11:27 AM

Here's Andrew Blyholder, normally in the hunt for TTOD but 914 mechanical gremlins kept him from challenging on this day....

Is this a theme?


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Posted by: nine14cats Apr 11 2004, 11:29 AM

And here is Tim Martin's 914-6 with a broken clutch cable...Tim and B had the car back up and running in time for the end of the day beers at Chili's!


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Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:29 AM

I didnt realize how many people where off the pace and *want* to be ON the pace. Each AutoX will take a slightly different setup, but one season of testing/changing and all seasons after that you can dial the car in prior to the event. People like Andrew Blyholder and Demick who change alignments and HAUL ASS in mostly stock 914's should tell everyone something about what it takes to run in the top 10 when you have over 80 cars entered.


B

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:31 AM

Bill,

Why is Andrew not on the club site ? I didnt know he was having problems.. I would have tried to help him out.


B

Posted by: nine14cats Apr 11 2004, 11:38 AM

Hi B,

I haven't spoken specifically to Andrew about the site...he's a busy guy like all of us...

As far as his car, he normally drives a highly modified X class car that has been lightend considerably. But he spun a clutch at the first event and hasn't had time to fix it yet. So he showed up in his daily driver 914, changes the alignment and rear toe settings at the track...plays...and can get close to TTOD with a stock car....

I tell ya...Andrew, Demick, guys like that....they really show what a stock 914 is capable of against the big motor, modified guys...For those that appreciate it, it really is fun too watch them drive!

Bill P.

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 11:49 AM

I met Andrew 4 years or so, he was auto xing his 914 at an scca meet. Rode with him then, (he told my dad that I could ride with him yesterday, but I didnt get to talk with him)

Anthony, I'll resize them in a min, I was just getting those pics out there so you guys could see them.

Batch mode eh? alright.

Brad, Thats alot of helpful information you have there, someday you'll have to teach me what those tire temps and such (0utside, inside center tire temps) mean in reality, I heard it once, but didnt stick. 12 min spring change? Schiiit!! Mines taking like 3 days.. but im sanding my rusty koni's and my rusty springs (got em cheap) and painting them.

BTW (dang, off subject..) How exactly do you measure the pounds of a spring (ie 140lbs, 180lbs) Cus I dont know what the spring rate is for these springs I got.. I just want to know before I get them on. I have one spring loose from the shock..

Thanks
Andrew

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 11:59 AM

It is pretty easy:

IMO = Inside/Middle/Outside

Bill's inside rear temps where in the 160 range, his outside temps where in the 100 degree range (if I recall correctly).. this means he is not using all of the available tire. This tells me (quickly) that he has too much negative camber in the rear and that he is not rolling the slick over enough to flatten it out. Taking some negative camber out of the rear will get the temps a little closer to even over the tire surface (the tire will have more static and rolling contact patch).. basically whomever did his aligment doesnt understand what a bias ply slick needs. They set it up with too much negative camber. Typically a bias ply slick likes anywhere from "0" negative camber to 1.5 max. I'm betting Bill's car has 2.0 to 2.5 neg in it just from looking at it from behind. I'll know when I change his complete setup over the next few weeks.


B

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 12:27 PM

Interesting, very interesting.

We just installed hoosiers that probably had 25-40% left (alot of tread.. Im just guessing, never seen new hoosiers) So, were switching the tires before we left and the right rear tire had a running cord (bout 2 cm) all the way around the tire on the inside. We have LSD in the trani, so it wasnt like we where lighting up the inside like crazy, I did spin once.. but I tried to let it roll so as to not flat spot the tires (did that already.. now im blaming this one on dad..) I should have been taking tire temps.

Next time..
Maybe I'll have my own helmet by then

Andrew

Posted by: mikey Apr 11 2004, 12:36 PM

Saw most of this event and it looked like a lot of fun. I just gotta get my car on the road by this summer!

WTF? Some of the cars had two people in them. Seems like the extra weight would slow them down. What's the point of carrying a passenger?

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 11 2004, 12:38 PM

Carry passenger = passenger learns OR they are instructing the driver.

I was riding shotgun with a person in a 2.0 914 a few weeks back and we took top time of day while I was in the car with him.


B

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 11 2004, 12:45 PM

Passenger is an instructor or driver is an instructor while passenger is a learner. Basically its like your dad holding you while your learning to ride your bike..

My instructor (cordinator of the event no less) ditched me in the afternoon sesions. (I think it was more that he wanted me to do it on my own.. but still )

I would rather have an instuctor thats going to tell me to go faster, than me telling myself to go faster..

You learn more.

(there was maybe 10 first timers out saturday from the show of hands..)

Andrew

Posted by: dan10101 Apr 11 2004, 01:38 PM

Hey,
I never light up the tires... much.

What are you going to take temps with? We could try Moms baking thermometer.

A helmet would be a good investment.

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 11 2004, 02:25 PM

Heh......
At SCCA AX, there is seldom any other 914s......and maybe 3-4 other Porsches... out of 150 cars.

I feel sorry for 914 drivers that don't do SCCA......there are stone quick drivers/cars at em'.
Some of theses guys really KNOW what it takes to go fast and, consequently, run 40 or so AXs a year.
I'm gonna have to work at gettin' in 20 this year.

My car set-up is not the worry, it's the chump behind the wheel.

Posted by: SirAndy Apr 11 2004, 03:15 PM

3 times!
MUSR & LPR (03/21/2004) & GGR (04/10/2004)

at least, at MUSR i had some competition (and wasn't driving MY car) ...
Andy

Posted by: URY914 Apr 11 2004, 07:25 PM

Man, that looks fun, wish I was there!!!

Paul

Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 11 2004, 09:14 PM

It looks like Brad and others had their arms in a few cars. Awesome. You can't buy this experience and knowledge. It's great to have support at events by people who know what they're doing. The end result is a higher level of competition and better times. Both good things.

Again, its good to see all the 914s out there! Thanks!

Posted by: campbellcj Apr 11 2004, 09:23 PM

Looks like a fun time -- thanks for all the pics and stories.

I was there in "spirit" with you guys. I spent a lot of the weekend cutting, drilling, grinding and riveting on the 914. This one effin' car could keep me busy the next 3 years of weekends.

Posted by: Demick Apr 11 2004, 10:25 PM

I can usually get to top 5 or top 7 out of 100-120 cars. The last 2 years I managed top 3 at almost half of the events that I went to - but this season there are too many fast cars for me to manage that (too many 914 race cars like Steve, Randall, Bill, Andrew, etc).

I don't mess with alignment settings or anything like that (I have what I call an aggressive street / mild autox alignment). My auto-x prep involves only changing tires to Victoracers. Engine is completely stock 2.0 with F.I. 140 lb rear springs, 19mm adjustable front sway bar adjusted fully soft. Other than that the car is bone stock.

More than anything else is time spent behind the wheel. It took me 4 years of autox to get 'competetive'. Just get out there and drive and make sure you're having fun.

Demick

Posted by: Scott Carlberg Apr 12 2004, 01:24 AM

Would this be a picture of a 914 withOUT a Front Sway Bar???


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Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 12 2004, 02:39 AM

It has a front bar. His orginal setup was for Hoosier DOT tires.. he switched to slicks and didnt change anything but his alignment. I'll be working with him over the next few weeks to nail his car down also. He was complaining of clutch slip.. I told him it was tire slippage... NOT clutch. He needs a limited slip or some serious spring rate changes.


B

Posted by: Randal Apr 12 2004, 11:54 AM

Hey, I forgot how to post at the BBS.

Anyway I guess I’ll show up at the next AutoX with a Viagra T-Shirt; looks like we, me and the car, need it. Thanks for the advice Bill!

And thanks to Brad for figuring it all out. Maybe it was easy for him, but no one else has ever told me what was going on. Just keep coming to the events Brad!

Now I know why I’m so tired when I finish a run…it’s tough holding the car up like that!

Makes you wonder how much time your leave out there spinning the wheels, missing shifts and just about leaning into the ocean?

And wasn’t it fun to have Rich out there. Now that guy can really drive.

More events will be coming up at Alameda this year, so check out the GGR website for times.

I think most of the PCA guys feel that Alameda is the best AutoX venue around. The surface is flat and gets sticky in the PM. What?

Posted by: tesserra Apr 12 2004, 05:02 PM

Randal needs to be thanked by all for a GREAT course design.
I am sure it took some time.
I am sure glad that the rumored loops did not make it onto the course, those SUK.

Thanks Randal
George

Posted by: dan10101 Apr 12 2004, 09:48 PM

Thanks Randal for the great course. It was well worth wasting a tire for.




http://www.pca-ggr.org/photos.html#041004autocross

Someone even got a picture of Andrew driving. Something I couldn't do while I was working. Thanks!

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 12 2004, 09:52 PM

Andrew even shot a pic of Lyressa sitting in here 914 doing homework.


B

Posted by: Randal Apr 12 2004, 10:10 PM

Hey George,

Thanks for the compliment. This is the second course I designed, but I must give credit where credit is due. First of all my friend Pat Costin, past president of the Reno chapter of PCA, always lets me know when the course gets to busy.

Also I’ve spent time reading the Solo II Course Design that was developed by Roger Johnson. Roger is actually a very communicative guy who will answer your questions. This is a great design book that is available on the web.

BTW the design book was given to me by Dean Thomas when I told him I was interested in designing a course. Dean is providing some great leadership as the Zone 7 Director of the PCA.

Also I need to mention that the course design changed when we put it together on Saturday morning. The back half of the course was revised so that it would be safer and a bit less busy, i.e., we lost the second loop and added the fast left/right box after the big sweeper at the end. Demick Boyden was pretty much taking care to lay out this section, so deserves the credit.

Also David Leong worked with us on the first leg of the course to add the third box that took - all of us - time to master. I had originally designed the course with a long 600+-foot straight, but when we looked at it we worried it would be a bit fast. After all there is only a 75 foot safety space between the course and the bay.

In the end it ended up being a great group effort and a tough course to master. I didn’t hear anyone say they felt that they had gotten through the first part of the course as quickly as they wanted, i.e., mistake free.

All in all a perfect AutoX day.

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 12 2004, 11:31 PM

I loved that track, first part showed me im I could improve incredibly.. (never got it right, dont think anyone did), sweeper (end of track) was incredibly fun!! fethering the throttle, staying right, trying not to loose tracksion (God, now I want to go to the big courses!!!) After the sweeper, foot to the floor (lightly lift for certain turns) till the last problem area. Me and dad where turning in WAY to early, I could never get that corner right, always went way slower than I could (didnt want to spin out, dont like locking up hoosiers) Thanks for the course Randal!!

Brad, I figured that thats who that was.. Just couldnt tell what the heck she was doing that whole time.

Andrew

Pic is of me.. Shameless self glorification (and because I like it)


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Posted by: TimMartin Apr 13 2004, 05:47 PM

Big thanks to Brad, Andrew, and Bill who all helped me fix my clutch cable so i could drive home. And when i say "help" i mean Brad got down there and replaced it for me while i was working my last course shift. I got back to the car and all i had to do was screw on one nut, adjust the pedal play, and put the interior back together.

Thanks a lot!

I really should bring the car by and have the alignment set up and check to see if i'm running the right combinations of bits and pieces. I can rebuild an engine, machine my own parts, and fix just about anything--but i don't know much about setting up the suspension and tuning for events.

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 15 2004, 11:47 AM

He says "Howza about a pic of the TTOD 914, eh?".

We can do that.
Eye candy to me.


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Posted by: Mueller Apr 15 2004, 11:56 AM

what motor does the TTOD car have???

sweet looking ride

Posted by: Andyrew Apr 15 2004, 12:38 PM

http://www.pca-ggr.org/acresults/041004.html


Results...

Andrew

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 15 2004, 01:29 PM

Yowza......4 sec clear. His worst run woulda taken TTOD. Brad musta been helping him (insert needle smiley here )

I would really be nice to see some details of that car.

Posted by: nine14cats Apr 15 2004, 03:19 PM

TTOD went to Steve Nieslony from Sacramento. Hi car is a very light (~1600 lbs) 2.0L 4 banger that's carburerated. Has some mods...but not Raby stuff. He redlines around 7K.

Along with the car, Steve is an awesome driver and a really nice guy. We often pit together at Zone events. And his car is dialed. He never adjusts it at the event. He just gets in and wins. In fact, he was helping me bleed my brakes and helped me finish before going out and 10 minutes later he burns another hot lap.

He is undefeated this year in 2 Zone events and 2 GGR events...

Yikes!

I love watching him drive....

Hopefully he'll make the WCC!

Bill P.

Posted by: Randal Apr 15 2004, 03:30 PM

This car is very lightweight. I'd bet somewhere around 1600lbs or less. I'll have to ask the original builder again, but when I asked before I didn't get a straight answer.

The motor is a "hot rod" 4 that I know Steve rebuilt last year. My guess is 170-180HP, but Brad would have a better idea - having watch and observed the car last Saturday. The motor just keeps pulling…. sounds like 7500 or higher when he is running.

For some reason it seems even faster this year than last, but he is, I think, still running a 2.0, even though he could run anything he wants in “X” class.

When this car runs you can actually see it accelerate, especially on a closed course like an autox.

Steve has been driving 914’s for 25 years, so knows autox and has the perfect car. When he has lost it was for good reason, i.e., worn out slicks or electrical problems, the latter of which gave him fits last year.

But no question that the blue car (and Steve) were working together last Saturday. The course was at least 4000 feet long, so his 4-second margin was at least 250 feet over the nearest competitor.

Posted by: Mueller Apr 15 2004, 03:34 PM

the GT2 must have been fun to watch as well.....is it the car or the drivers or a combination for thier low times?

Fiid, why the "fun" classification?

Posted by: Demick Apr 15 2004, 04:22 PM

Top time of day is ALWAYS a combination of driver and car. You just can't get there without both.

That being said, in the 6+ years that I've been autocrossing, I've never seen anyone run away with a 4 second lead like last weekend. That's just plain crazy. I can't really figure out how he did that.

Generally, this was not a 914 friendly course. 914's only managed 2 of the top 10 slots. Last month's autox (which was proclaimed to be a 993 course), 914's took 6 of the top 8 slots. Go figure. TTOD was once again Steve N (same blue 914), but he only won that one by .35 seconds.

Demick

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 15 2004, 07:12 PM

JP..

I'm almost 100% sure that the TTOD car (the 914) is a Ex Jeff Reitmer car (guy who won just about everything to win at the SCCA AutoX Nationals back in the late 80's early 90's...multiple times.) His wife Staci even won in the 914 several times. If it is not... it is built identical to it.

The driver rocks. He's got the shit going on. I have a car cut down similar to that one right now....


B

Posted by: Randal Apr 15 2004, 10:18 PM

Responding to Mueller:

There is no question that the GT2 is a rocket. As to how much is car and how much driver.....most I think would agree to favor the car.

Now the fun begins....

There is so much discussion and positioning over how to tell the best driver. Take a look at the PCA web site and the new complex classification method for trying to equalize cars. The past method was hopelessly unscientific (PAX) as in my opinion the guys putting together the classification were also competitors. Read this a conflict of interest.

I think their new classification method, while interesting, has the same flaws. The people building the plan will always feel that the other guy deserves a higher classification, depending upon whether they are more stock or modified. In other words there isn’t anyone that doesn’t have a strong opinion here.

My view is that a plan needs to be a true handicap plan, like golf or horse racing, to be successful.

Of course, the only real way to tell better driver or car or combination thereof is to set up a same cars, same track comparison.. Even then people will find something to complain about.

Posted by: Rob Ways Apr 16 2004, 02:43 AM

I've drooled over Steve's car many times. He's a good guy and great driver. He was my first AX instructor at the AX school just about 3 years ago. Seat time with Steve is well worth it.

Demick is right on about the blend of car and driver. Then again, Demick tips the scale on the driver side of the equation for a Bi car. Yeah, I'm kissing your butt Demick as I'm typing underneath my two 2nd place GGR plaques.