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Posted by: larss Sep 16 2010, 11:03 PM

When I move each CV joint ball from side to side in the cage openings there is quite a resistance. Also when the joint is assembled and I try to flex the joint there is a notable, un even resistance since all the balls then has to move in their openings.

Is this normal?



/Lars

Posted by: familienauto Sep 16 2010, 11:39 PM

The outer cage thing is probably installed one groove off, if you will. At least that can happen with Type I CV joints.

Posted by: larss Sep 16 2010, 11:51 PM

Thanks!
No, I have checked the assembly, it is OK done.
And also when I move each CV joint ball from side to side in the cage openings there is quite a resistance, this is even when the cage is naked by itself on the bench.

The resistance is from the cage openings being very tight to the CV joint balls, they type of snap in their holes. The balls are the original ones from the actual joint and cage. There is no significant wear in the grooves and just noteable marks in the cage where it holds the balls.

Any ideas if this is normal?


/Lars

Posted by: avidfanjpl Sep 17 2010, 01:53 AM

No kidding, the cage may be on inside out. I did that once. Broke in 500 feet.

There is an in and an out with domestic CV's, at least. And when assembling, it almost falls apart in your hands if it is installed correctly. 1/6th out is out, and there are definitely two ways to put new cages in.

Look at the CV completely disassembled, and you will get what I am about to say here.

Old cages will not hold the ball bearings in the center of the opening (worn out), and the small tip of the CV that goes on the splines must point the tip of the triangle to the WIDE part of the CV Outer shell. AND the CV cage must be smaller diameter cage side TOWARD the tranny. This is for inner domestic CV's only. I bought mine from a Texas joint, and they seem superior, but not before I installed one with the cage inside out and it broke apart 1 block from my garage.

They are a PITA to install the first time, then you are a surgeon, guaranteed.

Never installed any in the trailing arms.

I cannot remember outer CV's breaking.

Good luck!

John

Posted by: larss Sep 17 2010, 02:25 AM

Many thanks, this learned me a lot!

Since my problem is that the balls do not move easily even with the cage alone on the bench joint not assembled) I suspect that the cage is worn out at the small area where it holds the balls.
I would have thought that as the cage worns out the balls should move more and more easy until the cage do not hold them at all but there Im wrong?

If I continue using the joint as it is will that be at risk for sudden failure?


/Lars S

Posted by: Van Sep 17 2010, 05:21 AM

Since you've inspected the inner race and outer race for wear, I assume everything is really clean? (i.e. there's no debris in there causing this "tight fit"?)

I would try assembling it 2 grooves away, and 4 grooves away - just in case it has a "natural position".

A brand new CV joint is pretty firm/stiff, but not "uneven"... You're testing that by tilting it? How does it feel if you extend/collapse it?

Posted by: larss Sep 17 2010, 05:37 AM

Thanks!
Yes everything is clean and no sign of wear in the races only some minor sign of wear where the cage holds the balls.

Most important of all: the resistance of moving the balls (ny hand) in the openings in the cage is there even when the cage and balls are fitted separately without races involved.

Yes the stiffness increases when collapsing/extending as when tilting the joint (since then the balls have to move in the cage?)


/Lars

Posted by: Van Sep 17 2010, 06:05 AM

Sure it will get stiffer when you extend/collapse it... the balls are moving to less worn parts of the grooves.

My hunch is, if you're moving this by hand (even though it feels tight by hand) it will be just fine on the car.

Posted by: larss Sep 17 2010, 07:04 AM

Thanks, that was what I was hoping for. Since 3 of the CV's are stiff, but can be moved by hand without to much force, and only one is loose as melted butter I thought that the 3 might not have gone bad all at once.

Thanks again!


/Lars

Posted by: larss Sep 19 2010, 12:56 AM

After assembling the joint to the drive shaft, tightening the shaft to the wheel hub and rotating it at different angles (no gearbox present) it feels like no resistance at all in the joint...maybe id is hidden in the overall resistance in rotating... Neither can any noise be heard...

/Lars S

Posted by: rick 918-S Sep 19 2010, 04:19 AM

I just went through this. Check this thread just to be sure the joint is assembled correctly.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=31536

Posted by: Van Sep 19 2010, 06:20 AM

For future reference, I've also made a video about CV joints.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LsytyVzokBg

Posted by: cary Sep 19 2010, 06:42 AM

I use the picture in the Haynes manual. It goes together in multiple ways. But only one is the right way. When its right, it will be like butter.
BTDT about a 1/2 dozen times. You think you did it right, but you didn't.
Good Luck ...............
Make sure that CV bolts are good and clean so you get a good purchase with the allen/triple square sockets. They are pretty soft and you don't want bugger them up.
I always come back in a couple weeks and recheck the torque.
My .02c for this am.

Posted by: larss Sep 19 2010, 06:51 AM

Thanks!
Van, your two CV joint videos were most instructive, Im now 110% sure I have assembled the joint correctly.
I can also feel at two of the other the other joints (which has not been disassembled) that they also have some similar resitstance when I bend them to their limits or when bending them if extended/collapsed.
Guess thats a sign of the joints being worn to some extent. Only one is like butter.



/Lars S