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Posted by: trekkor Apr 23 2004, 12:25 PM

I have a line on a 911 engine with Webers in the 245hp range for, say...$1500.

I don't have any of the details on displacement, CR, builder, age, blah, blah...yet.

Of course, you buy it.

Question is, What will I pay to finish the install?
After exhaust, fuel set-up, adapters,oil tank,etc...Bottom line is?

$2000...$3000...$5000...tell me straight up, I'm sitting down!

What are the positives and negatives of doing this?

Posted by: Jeffs9146 Apr 23 2004, 12:29 PM

If you decide not to buy it, drop me a note and I will put it in mine!!

Jeff

Posted by: tat2dphreak Apr 23 2004, 12:34 PM

I dunno... I did a search, but couldn't find it again... but Brad posted a complete list of parts needed and the prices to budget last year sometime... the total came in close to 10K... but I dunno what he was figuring on budgeting for the engine... probably MUCH more than 1500 though...

positives I know of: more hp, more torque.. better resale value

negative I know of: not as much hp or torque as a chevy conversion and more expensive than a chevy conversion

but what do I know?

I say go for it! I personally think a -6 is cooler than a SBC anyday!

Posted by: trekkor Apr 23 2004, 12:37 PM

If I don't buy it, everytime I'm out in public people will point and laugh...Even the children!

Posted by: vortrex Apr 23 2004, 12:41 PM

245HP? I guess this is a built 3.2L then? seems like one of those too good to be true stories. I wouldn't get my hopes up if I were you.

Posted by: trekkor Apr 23 2004, 12:48 PM

Here's the story.
Friend's grandpa builds motor for dune car.
Doesn't use ( due to his being currently dead.)
Friend's dad inherits motor.
Sits and sits.
Friend to me: " hey, wanna six? "
Me: " Uh, Yes "

Posted by: Mueller Apr 23 2004, 12:49 PM

first I have to say: on the 245hp motor for $1500

even if you got a motor for free, you are looking at a a few thousand dollars minimum to pay someone to install it for you....oil tank-500,motor mount-400, you can figure out the rest, it is not cheap to do....if was even close to your lower figure, there would be handfuls of conversions going on every week.........if was that easy and cheap, almost everyone would do it.........

is it worth it??? I doubt it, I'm sure everyone that spends $10K to $20K to do a bitch'n conversion had no social life and just wanted to spend time and money on a POS car

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 23 2004, 12:56 PM

Figure 4-5K plus the motor.

Posted by: Lawrence Apr 23 2004, 01:05 PM

A six conversion will cost everything you have, and everything you'll ever have. ;-)

If you do it yourself, include the cost of: personal relationships, social life, all your time, space, emotional energy.

DO IT!

The file that was referred to should be found here: http://www.914world.com/downloads/914%203.6%20Conversion%20Details/3_6914.htm

-Rusty

Posted by: 1973914 Apr 23 2004, 01:10 PM

Cost for the motor alone:

$1500 - purchase price

THEN if you are smart:

Tear down the motor and ensure it was done right, refresh what has gone bad from sitting (how long), and put back together. This number could be anything from $1000-5000 depending on what motor and what it needs. Ask me how i know you cant just slap a motor that has sat and sat into a car and EXPECT it to run fine....

Then of course all the conversion stuff.

Posted by: 9146986 Apr 23 2004, 01:23 PM

I'm going with what he said!

A 245hp six for $1500??? TGTBT, I promise.

Let's just say OK you got the deal of a lifetime on the engine. You'll still have to get the chassis, suspension, and brakes to handle that kind of horsepower. AND then the six conversion parts, with additional oil cooling for your high output gift engine.

I'm saying $15,000 all said and done, providing you find more left testicle deals and do all the work yourself.

Or you can bring it to me next summer and I'll do it for $45 and hour, and 15% over cost on parts and outside labor.

PK

Posted by: vsg914 Apr 23 2004, 02:25 PM

Perry, If I was doing a six conversion, I'd jump on that deal.

Posted by: boxstr Apr 23 2004, 07:22 PM

I have done the math many times, figure when all is said and done $8000-10,000. That is why I look at every 914-6 conversion or 914-6 that is available, it makes more sense in the long run, you have a car already done that you can jump into and turn the key and drive. Not one that sits in youir driveway or garage waiting to find this part or saving money to buy this and that, And then it gets to be such a long drawn out project that you finally sell it for $.50 on the dollar to some else who finishs it and drives into the sunset.
I would be wary of a $1500, 345 hp 911 motor, but then you never know.
CCLINWISHIHADAV8,OHIDO

Posted by: 9146986 Apr 23 2004, 08:51 PM

Well really, just buy someone else's car. There are cars out there if you have the time and patience to wait for the right deal. It's always cheaper to buy a completed car than to build it up.

It's not unusual to find cars built with a build sheet in the 30's, for sale in the low 20's or high teens.

More fun to do it the way you want, but lots more money.

PK

Posted by: 9146986 Apr 23 2004, 08:53 PM

For $1500 I'd probably get the engine, if it had Webers and all the parts. Wouldn't you?

Posted by: anthony Apr 23 2004, 09:12 PM

That's what everybody says but when you are really looking with money in your pocket nice cars never seem to come up for sale. I've been looking for about a year now and the more I look the more I think I'm going to have to build the car myself someday.

Posted by: SpecialK Apr 23 2004, 09:24 PM

Trade it to Jake for one of his BIG IV's with Nickies!!

Save a lot of time and grief on installation, and you'll be on the road in no time

Posted by: john rogers Apr 23 2004, 10:25 PM

A close estimate when we did the six conversion on my race car last year was as follows: $6000 for a well built race engine with new distrib, good Webers, headers, stingers and muffler and 184 HP at the rear wheels. New -12 oil lines to the front cooler to replace the -10 and fittings about $400, dry sump system $000 as we had one but did some relocation, front engine mount from Patrick $400, engine tin from Patrick $400, new shift linkage parts $225 and finally some labor at a shop to do the mount up of the engine, test run the engine and get all sorted out $1500. The engine has sat for about a year and had a couple of hours of run time and leak down was about 3 to 4% which was great. I was lucky since it came from a 914 race car the alternator connections plugged right into to the existing relay board. Finally be aware that the gearing in a 4 cylinder 914 will never work with a six and if you want to race you are looking at a limited slip (GT) and a new gear set such as M-S-V which will drive the cost up substantially. Good luck

Posted by: klink Apr 23 2004, 10:30 PM

OK we're in the middle of a conversion now. Oil tank $700, Oil Lines $350, Bosch Distributor to replace the Marelli $150, Turbo valve covers and gaskets to replace the bad originals $150, Motor mount and misc. parts $500, Headers with heat exchangers maybe $1500, new accelerator cable, new fuel pump, new voltage regulator, sheet metal if you don't have it. K&N air cleaners, some type of exhaust, shift linkage, six cylinder tachometer $75. Pressure fed cam tensioners if you don't have them (like I don't) $450. Let's call it $4000 ballpark. The sound of a six....Priceless!

Posted by: Brad Roberts Apr 23 2004, 11:15 PM

The tank alone is 700$. You'll pay another 150-200$ for all the console parts. Dont forget the bell crank conversion for the tranny (unless you have a very early intermediate case with it tapped for the pivot rod)

8-10k every time if you drop it off to me and say "Just do it" the unknown variable is the engine choice. Injected anything will need a bigger fuel pump.

Most people dont factor in gearing the tranny either. Driving a 3.0 around on stock 901 gears gets OLD real quick when gas is over 2.00 a gallon.



B

Posted by: campbellcj Apr 23 2004, 11:40 PM

Add to the list some kind of external oil cooler (depending on the engine, application and climate) and very likely "some" work on the Webers even if the engine is sound.

Also, think about stuff like CV's and axles as your ancient original ones could give up the ghost quickly when asked to transmit 2-3X the torque of a stock 4-banger.

And all the stuff you would do on any -4 or -6 car being upgraded becomes all the more important with a high-perf project -- fuel lines, brakes, suspension, steering, lights/electrical, etc.

Basically, take nothing for granted and assume the worst case i.e. that EVERYTHING on the car will need to be checked and refurbed or replaced. If you happen to luck out in certain areas, then great. Better to have "positive" surprises than negative ones...why do you think so many incomplete six conversion projects end up for sale? Unrealistic expectations going in... I thought I would have my car "done" in a year; no dice, it will be more like 2 1/2 years before it is at a reasonable doneness state per my original vision. I was not too delusional on costs as I had the BTDT factor to go by (plus stories from this board and others.)

To echo the usual advice, if you can find a car that is already "close" to what you want to end up with (and have cash to fund it all at once) then BUY IT as you virtually always come out waaaay ahead.

Posted by: trekkor Apr 24 2004, 02:14 PM

Excellant advice and thanks for all the details.

I will see the motor this week and so will you. ( pics coming )

As for the costs... I am one resourceful fellow.
Just so happens, a VERY qualified, self-employed mechanic with a shop to die for, in his backyard, with a lift, ten minutes from home, needs a bathroom tile job. hmmmmm.

I might even make money doing this.

I figure, I could do this for cost of parts alone.
As for time...I WILL not start until all parts are in hand/view.

This is me " ".

All goes well, this " "...oh, yes.

Posted by: J P Stein Apr 24 2004, 02:41 PM

All right.

DIY, 4-5K which, with some careful shopping, would even include a good external cooler. I ain't one much for "letting" anyone else work on my car....much less paying for it.

As for the rest of the "stuff", you can easily double that, but you didn't ask that question

Get some "specs" on that motor & report back.

Posted by: trekkor May 26 2004, 09:00 PM

O.K.

everyone's been too busy.

This saturday is supposed to be the look see.
I'm taking the camera, getting engine # and I will show you the pics. Sorry for the wait!

Posted by: TBrads914/6 May 27 2004, 07:36 AM

I've been trying to get this 6 conv. done for about 3 years off and on (trying to keep some sort of normal life along with working many hours a week) and here is what I've seen so far. Total cost of the project so far is $10,887.01. This doesn't include the cost of the car to start with. It does include getting screwed by one of the only porsche mechanics in Lexington, KY that skipped town to my suprise after the engine was built and before it started ( name given in private email for protection of others that might come in contact with....last known location...Vegas). Right side cam out of time and valve crash. Includes next rebuild done myself. Just got the carbs back rebuilt and bench started and tuned the engine Monday 5/24 . Includes 911 SC front suspension waiting to go in. Includes fuch wheels but no tires yet 16X7-16X9 (looking for 8's). Does not include all the start and stops of progress (time = $) for parts or trips for missing items or work of others . None of my labor has been counted which is many hours. The engine will be installed in the car 6/5 . Still to do: convert rear suspension to 5 lug and powder coat (have stub axles, need hubs and e-brakes). Install front suspension, running the electrical, interior, and then repaint. All I can do myself but the stiching for the seats. Some days I cuss myself for even seeing this car let alone starting the conversion. Remembering how fun it was to drive with the 4 in it and hoping for much more enjoyment along with small victories along the way keeps me going. Hopefully, by July, I will be breaking the engine in and all the suspension and brakes will be finished. It seems the farther you dive into making a top notch conversion the deeper it gets. Your starting out with a 28 to 34 year old car. I've seen 6's done that looked like they got the thing in there and running and that's about it and it looks like it. If your after a professional done ride that is safe and dependable along with being drop dead in looks like I am, it takes the time and money.

Posted by: Eric_Shea May 27 2004, 07:51 AM

Fuch the engine numbers... get us that guys phone number

You got the right prices above., Conversions ain't cheap. Do what I do; save all the receipts in a folder for the next guy to add up. Under no circumstances should you add them up yourself.

Posted by: campbellcj May 27 2004, 10:00 PM

LOL...never add up the receipts...and NEVER NEVER EVER let your significant other find them!

I have come to gauge how expensive a project is by its thickness...i.e. 2" of receipts, 8" etc....

Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 07:19 PM

O.K. Sorry to be a carrot dangler.

I have the appt to FINALLY see this motor in 40 mins.
pics follow.

I hope we're not disappointed.

Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 09:08 PM

Guys...Really..What would you do?


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Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 09:09 PM

MMMM


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Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 09:10 PM

Webers


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Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 09:12 PM

engine# 911 670

he says it's a 225hp 3.0...Brad? others?

what displacment case is this?


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Posted by: trekkor May 31 2004, 09:15 PM

The price really is $1500.00

He doesn't need any tile work

He has agreed to drop it at my mechanic tomorrow pm for a once over and comp test. Maybe we'll run it?

I have access to a bell housing with a starter to crank it.

ME WANT.

Posted by: SirAndy May 31 2004, 11:44 PM

that looks schweet!

even if you don't convert your car, you can always sell it for more than $1500!

have it tested, then do a dyno run and see how much HP you get ...

then start collecting conversion parts.
Andy

PS: we need a HOOKED smily!

Posted by: Dr Evil May 31 2004, 11:52 PM

I'd say "gimme gimme gimme." The hel with the cost of conversion. If this thing doesnt go into your car you could sell it for more than you paid. Don't be discouraged, but what do I know, I'm a nut job.

Posted by: Dr Evil May 31 2004, 11:53 PM

Oh ya, and a small part of me hates you.

Posted by: meursault May 31 2004, 11:55 PM

No WAY is that engine a 3.0. That case is an early aluminum case, early lower valve covers and everything. It's likely still a 2.0. At most it could be a 2.8. But for $1500 complete and running, it's not a bad deal...

Posted by: 1973914 Jun 1 2004, 06:47 AM

What was this engine running in before? Some sort of dune buggy? Good deal reagradless if the HP numbers are as advertised and a full checkout comes up clean. Webers alone would fetch 1k if in good shape. You would have to at least rethink that exhaust routing...

Posted by: Chris H. Jun 1 2004, 07:04 AM

Take it and run my man! That is a helluva deal. I will give you $1600!

Posted by: seanery Jun 1 2004, 07:52 AM

early aluminum cases are desirable, and if that one has had the necessary machine work done, that could be a great motor!

Posted by: tat2dphreak Jun 1 2004, 08:51 AM

1500 is a steal... check the compression and see what happens, post lotsa pics of the conversion for us to live vicariously through you!

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 1 2004, 10:28 AM

Uhhh... sorry to burst your bubble.

That serial number is for a 1967 911 2.0 (1991 disp) motor. In stock form the 901/06 produced 130 horsepower @ 6600 rpm. It had 9.0:1 compression and Weber 40 IDA carbs. Those could very well be the original carbs.

I can't possibly imagine a 3.0 built on that case. If it was built to 911R specs of the same year, it *might* hit 220 hp. But the 67 911R motor turned at 8000rpm, had 10.3:1 compression and 46 IDA carbs.

Even so, a clean, nice running small /6 with Webers is STILL worth 1500, easily.

-Rusty

Posted by: trekkor Jun 1 2004, 04:47 PM

Thanks for all the feedback thus far.

I'm going to further inspect the motor now.

Too bad it's the small six.
I don't know how they came up with there size and HP figures.

I'll take more pics of the process.

Will the rocker arms show us something if there has been mods?

Supposedly comes with an extra 4 puck clutch.

It might be fun to modify the 6 into 1 Supertrapp header for the mid engine.

What can be done to squeeze more power outa the small six w/Webers?

I'll report later.

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 1 2004, 05:12 PM

Well... I haven't dug into my notes but it should be a sand cast aluminum block. If so then you can build on it. They should be strong enough to handle 2.2S goodies. The thought would be to make it a 2.2S motor with the proper P&C's, cams and heads. Good luck finding early 911S P&C's, Cams and Heads though.

It would be a fun 170-180hp if you could put it together. Short-strokers are one of my favorites.

Here's another option. 90mm Carrera RS P&C's, S-cams and some 2.2 heads cut to S-specs. They made a lot of them (90mm's) so they're cheap (in 911 terms). You would have a problem with low compression. Some recommend cutting the heads but that leaves a lot of slack in the chains. There are some machine shops out there that re-bush the rod ends (my choice) to bring the compression back up. This gives you a 2.5 liter short-stroking 220-250hp powerhouse! Yeee-fuching-haaa. That's basically what's going in my GT (built on a 2.2 platform, your sandcast case should be stronger)

Posted by: brant Jun 1 2004, 05:23 PM

dangerous territory here ... asking what can be done to squeeze more HP out of a small six....

Its a slippery slope your on my friend...

hopefully that motor is already a larger displacement.

A 2.0 can be built to 220hp.. a bit more with a twin plug.. but your talking about wheel barrels full of cash here.. Its cheaper to go to bigger displacement than add cubic cash into a small bore...
or you can buy used 911S pistons/cylinders, crank, heads, cams and you can get to S specs for around 150hp....

brant

Posted by: trekkor Jun 1 2004, 10:29 PM

Bought the motor...I think congratulations are in order!

First, we checked the cylinders for leakdown with a air testing device. 4 were great, 1 good, 1 a little blow-by. This was done dry and cold so we are pretty sure after valve adjust, running the motor and running oil through it, letting it loosen up a bit, it should be O.K.

The plan: get it running next week on the bench.
I'd like to put the six in my car basically as is. Just get it running well.

If I can get 130-140hp that should keep me happy.

Labor will be a fair work trade for a bathroom remodel. I can do a lot of the mechanical work myself.

I'm going to clean the six tomorrow ala McMark style to get a quick fix.

If all goes well, I'd like to see the car in full dressed six by winter


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Posted by: Mueller Jun 1 2004, 10:42 PM

congrats

while a mid sized to big block /6 motor is a blast, the smaller /6 motors are still fun....the sound alone is almost worth the conversion (my wife went for spin with me when I first got my first 914/4 and was looking for the large and loud lawn mower always following us )

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 2 2004, 06:30 AM

Congrats!

If the motor is basically sound, you got a good deal. I have an small /6 (2.0), and am very happy with it. If you get 130-140 hp out of that motor, you got an EXCELLENT deal.

Open up the carbs and clean out the float bowls. Cheap insurance.

way to go!

-Rusty

Posted by: seanery Jun 2 2004, 07:12 AM

Good job Trekkor.
The other stuff adds up $, but I believe you got a good deal.

Posted by: theol00 Jun 2 2004, 01:29 PM

Congratulations!
I am in the process of doing the same thing with a 2.2 ltr - so far the cost for parts (w/o motor) including motor mount, oil tank, clutch, accellerator cable, engine tin (fibre glass), headers w/o heat, oil cooler adapter, 5 lug conversion including SC brakes and spring upgrades are under $4K - careful shopping will help you to control your cost - for example - cost differences between oiltanks is from $450 - as high as $700 - - good luck!

Posted by: J P Stein Jun 2 2004, 01:40 PM

There is a number serise stamped om the top of the case.....right side, facing the fan, just above & behind the chain housing.....should be 901/XX.....the type number.

That will tell you what the stock motor was...minus any "improvements".

Also, if the cylinders are aluminum.....that's gud.

Posted by: trekkor Jun 2 2004, 08:16 PM

This project is exciting...but.

Is it worth going to all the trouble and expense for only a 2.0?

Those of you with experience convince me otherwise ( I'll be an easy sell )

What are the performance plus and minus'?
4 vs. 6 - 2.0 vs.2.0 ( 1971cc vs. 1991cc )

I want better acceleration.
I like to a/x, but class and placing isn't really that important to me. Just for fun.

What I really want is a well rounded, fast, excellant handing. Don't we all?

BTW- I like carbs. F.I is cool, too.

J.P.- I had the part # you asked me about but I can't remember it. It not home with me now. Maybe 901/xx/8372? No help I know. Next week.

Posted by: Duffster Jun 2 2004, 09:58 PM

Congrats on a smooth deal Trekkor!!!

Cases for sixes are that much, still attached to all the stuff that has gone bad. I had a 2.2 in my car (before I let it slip to Mssrs Kravig and Sager that I was dreaming of a 2.7), The 2.2 180 hp engine was an absolute blast... the 2nd most fun it is possible to have in a sitting position! I think it may be in Zois' 356C now.

Good advice about not adding up the receipts in the presence of spouses and spousal equivilents. Mine got real pale when the magic number was revealed. She let me know in that wordless way that they have that I owe her something BIG down the road.

Someone on this board said that 130 hp in one of these cars will make you scream and you'll mess your pants at 250. Absolutemente!!!

Posted by: McMark Jun 2 2004, 10:35 PM

IMHO, the ONLY real reason to do a six conversion is resale value. It's harder to sell a big 4 than a six.

Oh course, my opinion of that is

If anyone is building a car to make money they chose the wrong car! We build them to have fun.

In short, sell the six and put that money towards a big 4.

Posted by: trekkor Jun 2 2004, 10:54 PM

Mark, thanks for the advice. I'm kinda torn here.

No one has said "Hey, bro, I've got a small six and it rocks. It is so much better than that fuel injected 4 I had. I really love the way it winds up and gets me going"

Is that because the small six is garbage?

Who has this motor, and is diggin' it big?

I like the idea Anthony had of putting it in there until a... huh, huh...
really cheap, 3.2 comes my way.

I'm going to run it ASAP on the bench and think a little more. Also listen to the board. Also thought you all might like to know, Brad says "NO. Stay 4 "

BTW, Mark, did you see those carbs...whooo hooo ( sorry )

Maybe I save it for the baja.

Posted by: SirAndy Jun 2 2004, 10:55 PM

no, the ONLY reason to do a /6 conversion is to have FUN with the car!

that's also why you do BIG /4s and V8's and V6 conversions ...

Andy

Posted by: SirAndy Jun 2 2004, 10:59 PM

if it's a more or less stock 2.0L /6 engine, it's NOT any better than the /4 2.0L ...

i think, if you go through all the trouble and $$$ to do a /6 conversion, go and get a low-milage 3.2 or 3.6 and be done with it.
LOTS of HP in stock trim (read: reliable HP).

if you go with a 2.0L /6 you will still throw $10k into the conversion easy and end up with:

A FRIGGIN TWO-LITER ...

which is exactly what you have right now, less 2 cylinders and less $10k out the window ...

just my 0.02 euros,
Andy

Posted by: seanery Jun 3 2004, 06:35 AM

Personally, I think it's worth it. I drove an extremely worn original factory 6, it smoked, looked like hell and was generally trashed, but oh, what fun it was to drive. Any 6 is going to be fun to drive. AND sixes have That Sound oh, that wonderful sound. Once you do the hard stuff it's done. So, do it, drive it, enjoy it. If it's not enough power in a couple years you can sell the motor and find a big one. At that point it's plug and play.

do it do it do it

Posted by: 9146986 Jun 3 2004, 06:45 AM

I don't know anyone who's properly done a six conversion and said "gee, I should've just gone with a big four".

PK

Posted by: theol00 Jun 3 2004, 09:25 AM

it seems the majority of 914 owners is striving to have a six - $1500 is a very good entry level price - the 2.0 ltr is a very solid and strong motor that also sounds great.
You can always sell that motor for what it cost you.
You don't need additional cooling and plumming -other than the oiltank - which makes the installation/conversion less costly and time consuming.
Looks like the whole deal shouldn't go for more than $6000 incl your motor and 5 lug conversion.
Once you have done the basic installation - you can always go for a bigger motor later.
My advice - if you can afford it - go for it and enjoy the ride!

Posted by: maxwelj Jun 3 2004, 09:26 AM

As another original-6 owner (who admittedly, has never driven a 4)... the sound is the thing... My '70 didn't (and won't) have any sound proofing betwixt engine bay and people bay, so if I ran open headers and free flow aircleaners and then the chains themselves added to the din.. (not HP, though...) the drive was heaven... And the responsiveness of the small 6 is something else again.... not too much for the factory suspension and gearbox... but plenty enough for fun....

Posted by: trekkor Jun 3 2004, 05:28 PM

I'm sold!
Told you it would be easy!

If I don't like it ( is that even posible ) I'll just buy another car and start over with my stored 2.0-4.

I guess somebody would buy my car with all my upgrades for $8-10K

Or have two 914's ( 914-6 baja...Why did I just say that? )

I'll start next week.

I already ordered new plugs, wires and coil.

As for exhaust I'll start with a heatless header. Possibly modify the Tri-Mil Supertrapp I already have into a mid-engine under car instead of the baja tee-pee thing.

This will be fun. Thanks for all the help 914club!

Posted by: ! Jun 3 2004, 05:32 PM

A 2.0/6 from a 914 IS a waste of time....IF you are doing a conversion.....

HOWEVER.....a 2.0/6 "S" motor is 180 peaky HP....which has been.... so far ...... a kick in the ass....

Posted by: brant Jun 4 2004, 10:51 AM

Mike,

what did you do to your S motor to raise it up to 180hp?

brant

Posted by: ! Jun 4 2004, 11:05 AM

That's what an "S" motor is rated at....

Posted by: Duffster Jun 4 2004, 11:22 AM

Z... did you buy your 2.2 in Frankensteen from Sager/Kravig at the last 914 swap meet? If so, that is probably the one that came out of my car. And yes, it was a peaky, screamy, adrenaline-soaked, ass-grabing-the-seat motor in a 914.

The 2.7 is a different ride. It motors around town feeling like a 2.0 T IV when you feather-foot on the idle jets, then just melts the tires and disapears over 4000 rpm when the mains kick in. Makes me wonder what a built-up 3.8 Euro RS would be like

Posted by: brant Jun 4 2004, 12:03 PM

Mike,

is it an aluminum cased or a 69 mag cased 2.0 S motor? I think the 69's were rated at 180 but the increase was due to the mechanical fuel injection in 69... I thought you were running carbs?

the common thought is the 67 S motors were rated optimistically by the factory at 160hp.... I have a 67S motor going into my vintage car.

just curious because I'd love to learn more and hope that the 160 rating I have is legit...

brant

Posted by: ! Jun 4 2004, 12:43 PM

I bought BOTH motors from Glen Sager.....the 2.0 was an S motor but the specs aid it was the model that came with Webers.

On the 2.2.....did you run a CDI with it? I just got it running and it runs a little rough.....I'm thinking the jetting is off as I have carbs on it from a 2.4.....got any specs or suggestions for jetting?

Posted by: Duffster Jun 4 2004, 12:54 PM

MSD box. The carbs wound up on my 2.7, after a venturi change to 34 and major jetting work. The cam in my motor is a more for torque that 906-ish peak. Not sure what the jets were on the 2.2 as they came with the motor. The secret is locked up in Kravig's head.

Posted by: Duffster Jun 4 2004, 12:56 PM

the venturis were 30s, I believe...

Posted by: brp914 Jun 4 2004, 05:36 PM

Hey, I realize its probably too late, but dont do it. True, a /6 is a great sounding, and even with a 2.0, a reasonably quick car. But, notice how your FI /4 starts right up, even on a cold day? Not so with carbs. And how your FI /4 drives and responds under all conditions? The carb'd /6 will run crummy until its warmed up, and even then never as well as the /4. And thats the best you can hope for. Lotsa luck if the engine and/or carbs aren't happy, or if something has been done to that engine that the carbs dont know about. Or vice versa. Also, expect about 22 mpg vs. 30 for the FI /4. A car that doesn't run well will get old fast.

Not to mention the cost of parts and labor. And emissions testing, if applicable. And how about the quality of the work? Will it look like something that has come from Porsche, or some hack job replete with cheap crap from the local hardware store.

Is your /4 running now? Do you really want to fix it if it ain't broke? Knowing that the time and money spent will not be recouped if sold? Hopefully food for thought.

Posted by: seanery Jun 4 2004, 06:19 PM

welcome to the club.

Should we just call you Mr. Happy?

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 5 2004, 03:15 AM

Let me help you out.

I have a small /6. I believe it's basically a stock 2.0. It rocks. I love the feel, I love the sound, I love the Webers breathing behind my head.

I HATE fuel injection. I HATE wires, tubes and vacuum hoses all over the engine compartment. It looks like an Intensive Care Unit setup for a dying motor.

You CAN be happy with a small /6... I am.

-Rusty

Posted by: ArtechnikA Jun 5 2004, 03:37 PM

you already know the answer to the 'tubes and hoses' problem - MFI ! (and 'E' cams will really wake up a stock /6 engine...)

there is nothing quite like the sound of a short-stroke MFI 6...

(which is not stopping me from looking to uprate the 911 to 2,8 tho ...)

Posted by: campbellcj Jun 5 2004, 10:41 PM

Z - I think you'll certainly want a Bosch CDI or aftermarket (i.e. MSD) with that engine. All of the factory high-performance engines had 'em, IIRC. It should help with the low speed plug fouling and idle to main circuit transition, but don't expect miracles as even with perfectly jetted Webers or MFI these engines are just kinda "bitchy" at lower rpm's and/or when cold.

What jetting do you have now? My carbs were fairly farked up and I set them up to 2.0S specs (except F26 emulsions vs F3); much mo betta now but I may need to bump to 60 idles.

Posted by: seanery Jun 6 2004, 07:33 AM

petronix has a new msd box.

Posted by: ! Jun 6 2004, 10:14 AM

Yeah....I spoke with the former owner of the 2.2 that's in Frank....I have six or seven oem Porsche CDI boxes that need some repairs.....my neighbor has the parts at work and I have a copy of the Porsche schematics for the three prong series, so we will rebuild them....also have a fireball ignition system from the Type IV and a Crane type CDI box....will look thru the schematics and see which is the most idiot proof....

More welding this week on the pans....then install the seats, replace the leaking exhaust gaskets and take Frank out for a spin....

Posted by: Jake Raby Jun 6 2004, 12:43 PM

Once again I'll say if you are gonna do a conversion, just drop a Small Block chevy in it..

Easier and cheaper to repair than a six.. You can get 300 HP and never even try to do so! Just bolt it together. Hell all the parts can come from Summit!

TIV, or V8 if you ask me...

Posted by: MXMARK Jun 6 2004, 06:36 PM

I have a 2L 6 that has been sitting for 8 years. I never had the money to install into the 914. I do have a 2533 4 in there now. I love the sound of my six in the 911 but I also love the sound of the 4 when I am passing guys with big V8 muscle cars. I love the big four. Just my feeling. If you want to go big talk to Jake on the four. Good luck with the 6. Thanks Mark

Posted by: trekkor Jun 18 2004, 10:06 PM

Did some work to get ready to run the six. New plugs, wires and coil.

Found an oil tank ( under the cushions of my sofa ) and had some oil lines made for testing.

We're shooting for a monday fire up!

Posted by: Eddie Williams Jun 18 2004, 10:23 PM

What is a good fuel pump choice for a -6 conversion with Weber carbs?

Posted by: trekkor Jun 18 2004, 10:55 PM

I expect there is a popular electric pump that produces low pressure that everyone uses. Along with a regulator to get down to 4-6 psi.

Is it possible to retain the stock pump with a regulator and bypass line to return to tank?

Posted by: SirAndy Jun 18 2004, 11:09 PM

yes.
it also makes for a nice 914-bonfire ...

Andy

Posted by: trekkor Jun 18 2004, 11:21 PM

I believe it would be a 914-6 bonfire...actually

Posted by: ArtechnikA Jun 19 2004, 05:55 AM

914.6 fuel pump:
911.608.107.00

Posted by: seanery Jun 19 2004, 07:28 AM

I've got a facet on both my cars -4 and -6.

Posted by: Gint Jun 19 2004, 12:58 PM

Just re-read this thread.

Do It! Do It! Do It!

I do, and I love it.

But mine isn't stock. I know that, and so does everyone that ever drove it. No one knows for sure what's in it. According to a mix of advertisements from Larry Lee's db that seem to be correct based on the seat of the pants dyno, and what I can definitely confirm, it is - built on a stock 914/6 case, with E-cams, S-pistons and dizzy and 11 blade fan. If I had to guess, it's 120-140 HP at the rear wheels, maybe a tad more. The car will go on a dyno when the resto is complete.

Posted by: theol00 Jun 19 2004, 08:25 PM

Go for it - I just got mine back - 2.2ltr 6 - e cams - lots of fun - goes like stink - and sounds like an angelic choire !

Posted by: trekkor Jun 19 2004, 11:19 PM

I definitely want to stink! In an angelic way, of course!

Mooseheads for all a ya!

I'll video tape the start up and run.

Posted by: J P Stein Jun 19 2004, 11:38 PM

Stink is gud.

Replay of a vid some of you may have missed.

http://www.914world.com/downloads/Videos/P3280103.MOV

You'll need Quicktime.

Posted by: SP9146 Jun 26 2004, 11:23 AM

I'm restoring a factory 6 and have the stock 2.0L out of it now. Car was sitting about 10 years when I bought it. Had the leaves cleaned out of engine bay, new hoses, rebuilt webers, etc. Drove the car two months before beginning the resto.

I also have an '86 3.2L Carrera.

I've never driven a 2.0L 4-cyl. 914 just the 2.0L six. I wouldn't say it rocks but it's a very nice engine in such a light car. The exhaust system was bad and so the sound wasn't perfect but still good, like a Porsche flat 6. Compared to the 3.2L the sound is a higher pitched.

The sound of the 3.2 is different. Deeper and more of that classic Porsche 911 sound (not sure if engine related or 911 vs. 914 body related). Fuel injection makes it like a 2.0 4-cyl., always fires up. The Webers in the 2.0 are more tempremental when cold. When warm they're fine.

The problem with the 2.0 six is that it doesn't make much power. Don't get me wrong the car moves well but you have to really work the gears. The 3.2 feels like a truck motor in comparison, lots more torque.

I really wanted to replace the 2.0 with a 3.2 but then figured I'd end up with a $45K 914 worth maybe $25K instead of a $35K 914 worth $25K. I figure a completely stock factory 6 restored well is worth about the same as a converted factory 6. So I'm doing same thing as you putting in the 2.0 seeing if I like and if not upgrading to 3.2.

I heard there's not a whole lot you can do to get power up on a 2.0 but I'm going to ask mechanic to do as much as possible without doing a rebuild. Any ideas on easy power upgrades that don't change the character of the engine? I'm going with a 911 exhaust system.

If I was in your situation and needing to pay for the conversion on top of the engine I think I'd take a hard look at the 3.2 or Jake's motor. You'll have maybe $5K (?) more in project after selling the 2.0 but a much faster car that's not just "nice" but also rocks. I think your car would be worth much more with a larger than 2.0 engine, probably more than the investment difference. Financially you'd come out ahead.

If I imagine that 3.2 out of my Carrera in the 914-6 it just seems like nirvana. Brad makes a great point about the gearing of a stock 914 tranny, seems like it would be too low for a big engine like the 3.2.

Pete

Posted by: trekkor Jun 26 2004, 02:34 PM

Keep us posted on your project , too SP.

Everything is in place to start the engine today...EXCEPT. I had tickets fall into my lap free for the Giants vs. A's game tonight at 6:00.

I'll be leaving for that in an hour or so.
Maybe tomorrow it'll come to life.

Anyone know about " The Racer's Group" in Sonoma for engine dyno's. Brad?

I must *know* for sure what I have before I commit.( or commit myself )

Also saw an ad on pg.51 of June Panorama for " Racing Cams ". $299 for the set, exch.

Feedback please.

KT

Posted by: seanery Jun 26 2004, 03:49 PM

Trekkor, E cams would probably be good for you. You give up some ultimate horsepower for torque. I think for a street/autocross car that would be a good choice.

Posted by: 9146986 Jun 26 2004, 09:09 PM

For all around great performance, I'd probably go with the "Solex" grind. My personal preference is "S" cams or even hotter (GE60) for 3.0's and up.

I can give up low end grunt for high end scream, but that's my personal preference.

The last customer car I did had a 2.7 build up on a 2.4S, with real RS pistons and Solex cams. That engine is pretty impressive. Loads of torque, and respectable high end output. The customer (don9146) purchased the engine complete and running from a guy going to a 3.2.

PK

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 27 2004, 01:19 AM

You mentioned solex cams... I've read that they provide a very streetable power-band on smaller engines, too.

When I get home, I'm considering a rebuild on my /6. I have an oil leak at the caseline that I can't get rid of without splitting it. I've done some reading and research... I have two choices:

1. Rebuild the existing motor, bored out cylinders to 2.2, solex cams and custom JE pistons. A bit of headwork will help make it flow. Add piston squirters, the oil bypass mod and other clean-up machine work, and I'm in the 6-7k range for the motor I think.

2. Buy another used motor outright (up to 2.7), and box up the stock motor for a future project.

Any used motor is a risk, but some risk can be mitigated. Buying outight is immediate gratification. Anything up to 2.7 will be bolt in, no flywheel mods required. With rejetting, my Webers will work on most any motor up to that size, cept for some RS spec monster. We all know how I feel about FI. :finger2:

Building my own has it's own unique challenges, but I'm pretty sure I can do that. Overall, less cost effective, but you pay for the experience and the knowledge that things are done right, and will last.

-Rusty

Posted by: seanery Jun 27 2004, 06:45 AM

Rusty, any date on coming home?

I think I'd buy a core motor and rebuild it while you can still drive your current one.

Posted by: anthony Jun 27 2004, 08:18 AM

Why not a 3 or 3.2L? So what if you have to change the flywheel? And it will be cheaper than rebuilding.

I looked at a 914-6 where this lady had over $10K into a 2L -> 2.2 E/S rebuild. The invoice for parts alone was $5K for E heads, E cams, S pistons and cylinders, and all the other small parts needed for a rebuild.

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 27 2004, 08:37 AM

Nope, no date. Lots of rumors, but that's all they are. I come home when I step off the plane.



I believe it. The /6 parts are astronomical. Why not a 3.2?

1. I hate fuel injection. Don't try to convert me: I'm happy to be a heathen.
2. A 3.0 or larger means new flywheel (something I just replaced), and more HP on my stock 901 transmission. I don't need all that extra power, and it will just end up chewing up my gearbox.
3. Anything larger than a 2.7 means that a front mounted oil cooler is mandatory. Again, not interested in cutting my chassis or the expense.
4. Anything larger than a 3.0 won't breathe well with stock heat exchangers... and that's what I intend on keeping on the car.

Sometimes smaller IS better.

-Rusty

Posted by: ArtechnikA Jun 27 2004, 09:06 AM

standard 3,0 SC's have the trombone cooler; turbo's got the radiator cooler.
many 2,7's had front coolers, and IIRC all 3,0's and up had at least the front trombone (which is basically just a way to turn the oil around and get it back to the tank - a significant amount of the cooling is actually done by the line fore and aft.

911's have significantly better airflow into the engine compartment than 914's, which always ran a little hotter than the 911 with the same engine (for which reason Porsche moved the red zone on the oil temp gage a bit to the right).

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jun 27 2004, 11:57 AM

When people say: "The small engines are fine" I immediately ask them if they have ever ridden in a 3.0 or 3.2 powered 914. 99% of the time the answer is NO.

The price to rebuild a small 6: 10-12k. price to rebuild a 3.0 and up: 10-12k

The small engines look good up front because they are normally REALLY cheap.

Porsche changed when they released the 3.0. Quality went WAY up.

Unless you are governed by some racing rules or building a car for a specific class.. run a 3.0/3.2/3.6.

I also factor in driveability. An injected 3.0/3.2/3.6 quickly becomes a awesome daily driver with enough balls to run with just about anything being produced today and still get decent gas mileage.


B

Posted by: Lawrence Jun 27 2004, 12:19 PM

Those prices must factor shop labor. If it's going to cost 10-12k to rebuild a small /6, then I'll just take my car to the junkyard when I come back stateside, and just buy a Honda.

-Rusty

Posted by: trekkor Jun 27 2004, 12:29 PM

Pg. 51 June '04 Panorama-

Motor Meister
rebuild kits
2.0-2.7=$599
3.0-3.2=$649

Complete rebuilt long block 3.6 =$5495 exch.

I want to run my 2.0? and then save my money and look for a fire breathing six bomb.

Posted by: 9146986 Jun 27 2004, 12:38 PM

By the time you do all the machine work upgrading the (basically) 1969T engine, you may as well find a good 2.2E or S core and build it. In the long run it would probably cost you less.

I'm no FI expert, but I'll tell you that a 3.2 with Motronic is the way to go with large displacement 914's. I feel very competent and comfortable tuning Webers, but I'd trade that skill for reliable, no back firing when cold, turn the key and go, Motronic.

The Motronic system isn't like the 914 FI system. Have you ever drove a 914 with a 3.2 Motronic engine??? It would change your tune

But it's your car and your $$, you need to do what makes you get wood.

PK

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jun 27 2004, 12:39 PM

He doesnt know about MM.


B

Posted by: ArtechnikA Jun 27 2004, 12:41 PM

find out *exactly* what's in those "rebuild kits" - sounds like it's just a gasket kit, rod bearings, and rod bolts. MAYBE rings.

find out EXACTLY what MM puts in their "complete rebuilt long block"...

Posted by: trekkor Jun 27 2004, 12:47 PM

It's true I don't know.

I'm a know knothing knothead ...Today.

Tell me what I need to know.

Posted by: seanery Jun 27 2004, 12:48 PM

I talked to those guys (MotorMeister) before I started the conversion process on bluecar. They use and are proud of using, used parts. They feel those are better? I was turned off by them, then discussed them with folks in the LA area and decided it was best to forget they exist.

Posted by: trekkor Jun 27 2004, 12:53 PM

Are you saying they sell used: bearings, rings, gaskets, etc. as a rebuild kit?

Not likely. Esp if they are a consistant advertiser in Pano. ( $$$ )

Stranger things do happen...I know this to be true.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jun 27 2004, 12:59 PM

He said:

They like to reuse old cylinders/pistons/rods/rod bolts... everything Porsche recommends you replace.

You get what you pay for. It ranks right up there with their *rebuilt* trannies. They collect semi worn used parts and *rebuild* trannies with them.

They sell new bearings/seals.


B

Posted by: Air_Cooled_Nut Jun 27 2004, 06:30 PM

Though Porsche is my #1 car, a Ferrari would be a worthy stallion for my stable. I look at the Ferrari engine and it looks gorgeous, especially those with the red textured valve covers. That's what I think of when I hear Ferrari. Heck, I'd be happy with a mock engine (gutless) as a base for a glass table. It's the engine. When I think of Ferrari I think of a beautiful car with a gorgeous Ferrari engine, not a Ferrari body with a common Chevy or Mazda or Subaru engine.

So, when it comes to Porsches, they gotta have the Porsche engine. Now I know the history of the little 914 and even though they did come with the VW four-banger my head, my soul, thinks of the 914 as a true Porsche sports car that has the six-banger powerplant. Open the bonnet and bask in the glow of a pure-Porsche sixer. How could you ever stop smiling?

I say go to the expense and install the six. You can always swap something bigger once the current loans are paid for Do it for the purity, the passion, and the self-gratifying oohs-n-aaaahs


Okay, before feathers get ruffled about the 4-banger...I have a rebuilt 2.0L, stock FI (FI is superior to carbs and the path I choose to drive) in my 914. My Squareback has a BUILT air-cooled engine (carbed ). It's fun to give the snooty V8 crowd and punk rice boyz in Mummy&Daddy's pimp-mobile a serious run for their money in a powerful four-banger, heck yeah. But for my 914 (if I had the $$$) I would definitely drop in a 2.0L six-banger. It's all about the soul.

Posted by: trekkor Jun 27 2004, 10:51 PM

I ran into a little snag on the test oil line fitting today

One end is the wrong size. Oh well. I'll look tomorrow.

On a positve note, I drove a friend's Boxter today.
He just got new tires and it was blast. It has the 2.7 with the 5 speed.
The sound and the power of the six was AWESOME.

I am going to make every effort to do this project.
The actual transplant, motor checks out O.K., will be after a/x and into winter.

Posted by: McMark Aug 18 2004, 09:03 PM

Come on trekkor, you're slow! Vroom, vroom!

Posted by: Gint Aug 18 2004, 09:29 PM

The small engines are fine. Yes, I've driven a 3.2 powered 914. But it's your car, do what you want with it.

Here's the thing Trekkor. You got a decent deal on a running small 6. Do the conversion, pop in the motor, and if you want more power later, All you need do is find a lareger motor and fork over the $$$.

Posted by: trekkor Aug 18 2004, 09:57 PM

Vroom Vroom is right. We started that thing...Tonight

Mark thanks for your help...again.

Had to shim out the VW bus bell housing to get the starter gear off the flywheel after start-up..

Carbs need rebuilding...No surprise there.
Fired right up though and revved up. I'm very satisfied.

All you SIX nuts, help me with this.
Weber 40IDA's have 55 idles, 30 chokes and 180's visible down the sight hole ( emulsion tube stack? )

We made a video of the intial start and run ( with flywheel clatter ) . Mark will post it tomorrow night for your entertainment. I wish we shot some footage after some tweaking. The first couple of minute were...well, rather smokey.

Anyway, progress.

Cheer me on!

KT

Posted by: Randal Aug 18 2004, 10:10 PM

Remember that Larry Sharp's little 914 6 - 2.0 used to clean up at GGR autox two/ three years ago.

He knew how to drive and had a solid car.

Posted by: trekkor Aug 18 2004, 10:15 PM

here


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Posted by: trekkor Aug 18 2004, 10:16 PM

yeah, baby!


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Posted by: nebreitling Aug 18 2004, 10:21 PM

awesome, trekkor. your face in that picture says it all!

i say find a way to keep that exhaust as is!

Posted by: McMark Aug 18 2004, 10:30 PM

The exhaust would be easy to install as is, just take out the rear window. The only thing is I don't think a SuperTrapp 3 inches from your ear is a great idea. Now if he could turn it around, that might be cool.

Posted by: Root_Werks Aug 19 2004, 08:20 AM

Good job locating an engine Trekkor! Now just put the thing in your 914 and enjoy. Don't listen to people who are talking 3.0/3.2/3.6. The engines cost money, a lot of money. You now have a six to put in. Do it, drive it until something better comes along that you can afford.

Congrats! Looks great!

If you need anthything that I can help with, let me know. I would be willing to help out with my back yard bob 914-6 tin, bell crank throttle linkage and muffler bracket if you like.

Sweat! Another 914 will be a six soon!

Posted by: McMark Aug 19 2004, 09:58 PM

Here's the video. It's almost 60 MB. If somebody can shrink it, please do.

http://www.914world.com/members/markd/movies/trekkor6.mpg

Posted by: trekkor Aug 19 2004, 10:37 PM

I really enjoy this video. The engine is absolutly RAW.
Once it get gets off the rough idle it ROARS to life. Deafening.

Listen to the starter dinking up my flywheel.

This is literally the first start-up footage for you.
The thing was running and revving after about twenty seconds after sitting for up to 4 years. We didn't even have to prime the carbs or use starting fluid.

I am very stoked, as the engine is only idling on three cylinders.
Mark cleared the idle jets, we shot smoe carb cleaner at it and it improved greatly. YESSSSS

Next video will be it bench-roaring on rebuilt Webers.

GO SIX!

KT

Posted by: SirAndy Aug 19 2004, 10:44 PM

so, you'll be running FM as well ???

Andy

Posted by: trekkor Aug 19 2004, 10:49 PM

I'll finish out the year in BP. This is my winter project, Sir.

Next year, we'll be using the new GGR point based classing.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Aug 19 2004, 10:53 PM

If the the motor was in there right now and it is a 2.0 I'd be in FP.
2.2 and I'm GP.

Slicks and I'm FM with the 2.0, 2.2 = GM

...anyway.

KT

Posted by: Gint Aug 20 2004, 08:08 AM

With the exception of the idle, that thing sounds BAD ASS!

Posted by: ! Aug 20 2004, 09:36 AM

And they say "I'm" crazy.....

Posted by: MXMARK Aug 20 2004, 10:44 AM

Trekkor, That video makes me want to go home and hook up an oil tank to my 2.0L six that has been sitting for 10 years. Wow!! That was cool. Go little six Go. Mark

Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2004, 10:49 AM

wow... the clink clank. did that mess up yur starter/flywheel? sounds cool dude! and flip the exhaust and run it out the engine lid

Posted by: McMark Aug 20 2004, 12:51 PM

The flywheel and starter were fine. We shimmed the bell housing back a bit. It was a vw bus bell housing, so the dimensions were a bit off.

Posted by: trekkor Aug 21 2004, 02:39 PM

Easy 800th post.

Watch the video and tell me something!

KT

http://www.914world.com/members/markd/movies/trekkor6.mpg

Posted by: trekkor Aug 23 2004, 07:36 PM

Brad, you would of loved it. Even if just to mock me for burning my arm on the header.

KT

Posted by: nebreitling Aug 23 2004, 07:55 PM

"That's HOT!"


nice ending!

Posted by: MXMARK Aug 23 2004, 08:28 PM

Trekkor are you selling that trick exhaust? Maybe I need to buy a dune buggy and put me 2.0L six in it. How did you rig up the oil tank? I have a trans and a starter I just need to get the oil system to bench run my motor. Good luck with the project. Thanks Mark

Posted by: trekkor Aug 23 2004, 09:14 PM

The exhaust is likely uneeded. Tri-Mil 6 into 1 with Supertrapp...Ouch. ( that's hot.) pointing.

Oil tank is just leaning against my toolbox out of the picture.

Trekkor

Posted by: trekkor Sep 22 2004, 06:38 PM

Update:

The last two autocrosses had 914-6's that trashed me!
...And I picked up my Patrick Moly Mount today.

One more item to cross off the list.

KT

Posted by: Steve Sep 22 2004, 08:48 PM

Nothing personal against the four bangers but any six is cool no matter what the size is.
My favorite song will always be a six with webers.

Posted by: SirAndy Sep 22 2004, 08:50 PM

i don't know ...

the *roar* of a 1.8 with D-Jet and a monza is hard to beat!
Andy

Posted by: McMark Sep 22 2004, 11:37 PM

I've been enjoying a couple of Pepe Deluxe albums lately, so I guess those are my favorites.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Sep 23 2004, 09:03 AM

Trekkor , since you've got your motor mount..it looks like you're converting to 6-congrats !
An old friend of mine , Joe Miller (founded TriMil) built your dune-header. Joe passed on recently-but he built some crazy stuff !
I started our parts upgrade company in 1976, and focused on the 914. Since then I've still got it bad for 914s. If you need some decent mandrel (correct) headers for your conversion- - I can hook you up with a pair when you're ready. These are close copies of the factory race style used in the early 70's, direct fit without extensions.
Since we are both board members here ...you can have these at the W/D price (call me-- can't post $!)
Marty/ msdsinc. 818-507-6937

Posted by: Root_Werks Sep 23 2004, 01:56 PM

Trekkor,
I haven't forgot about you! I will get some templates off to you soon for the engine tin, exhaust (muffler) hanger and whatever else I can dig up for you. I still have the P Moly mount on my conversion, works just fine. Sorry I didn't get that stuff to you earlier, but my after hours shop still has a waiting list. It is fun work, but man! My wife has been giving my looks lately.

Posted by: trekkor Oct 9 2004, 09:08 PM

Headers, we've got headers.

Thanks to Marty at MSDS.

http://msdsinc.com

KT


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Posted by: ArtechnikA Oct 10 2004, 10:37 AM

very, very pretty !

Posted by: trekkor Oct 16 2004, 05:27 PM

I got a muffler yesterday from Martin. Thank you.

Ansa four tipped dual quiet packs.

Got the sheet metal templates last week as well, yay!
thanks, dan.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Oct 16 2004, 07:44 PM

pic


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Posted by: trekkor Oct 16 2004, 07:45 PM

pic


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Posted by: ! Oct 16 2004, 07:45 PM

That should rust in about a week....

Posted by: trekkor Oct 16 2004, 07:53 PM

Rust is good...It will match my car.

Posted by: Aaron Cox Oct 16 2004, 07:54 PM

splurge on the exhaust. you dont want it to look like a vw do you?

Posted by: trekkor Oct 16 2004, 08:03 PM

VW, I love VW's.
I want something inexpensive that I can use for street only. This was it.

I'm open to other options for track. Or not.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Oct 17 2004, 09:27 PM

I'm setting the bar...
I want to have the motor in the car by the end of November!

I need the oil tank and lines.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Oct 20 2004, 09:35 PM

Red Headers


KT


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Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 21 2004, 10:49 AM

Trekkor, I like the headers! I opted for the insta-rust Bursch ones. Hey, I'm cheap!

Do you have the throttle linkage sorted out? Can I help with that at all?

Posted by: trekkor Oct 21 2004, 05:47 PM

I need some advice and pictures to set up the linkage.

You could really help.

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 22 2004, 03:28 PM

I just drove the 914-6 last night w/o wife. Hammered the snot out of. That poor 2.2 just loves to scream.

Yeah, let me pull my latest bell crank off this weekend. I want to re-do it and make a cleaner one from a jig. This one was a test one that just happened to work perfect. So when the time comes, you pay for shipping and it's yours. I want to make nicer looking ones to sell to suckers..... I mean customers.

Posted by: trekkor Oct 22 2004, 06:57 PM

Yes, I want it!

I can use the stock-4 cable right?
Post some pics here would you?

KT

Posted by: Eric_Shea Oct 22 2004, 08:40 PM

Keep this up Trekkor... you'll have yourself a Halloween Classic; Night of the Living Thread

Posted by: trekkor Oct 22 2004, 08:46 PM

I was thinking more along the lines of...

"Thread time for Bonzo"



KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 25 2004, 10:04 AM

Yeah, useses the stock 914-4 cable. You need nothing but a couple of hand tools to install and adjust. That's it. I'll even make and throw in another rod so it will be a complete kit for you.

I almost, mind you almost got to it last night. I lowered the 914 about 1" set it down and adjusted the front to match. But by the time I was ready to put it back up to start doing the heater tubes and pull the throttle, I had to go to a Cub Scout thingy. Oh well. I will start on it tonight again.

The only pic's I have suck. But I will take better ones when I pull it off.

Posted by: trekkor Oct 25 2004, 02:32 PM

Great!

Looking foward to that!

KT

Posted by: trekkor Nov 10 2004, 01:02 AM

Ran the motor for a few minutes this afternoon.

It just fires up and runs well.

My earball was spot on with the timing light.
35 degrees at 6000 rpm's.

I love revving it up.

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 10 2004, 09:53 AM

Sweet! Yep, gotta love the sound of a six.

I can't ship off the prototype bell crank until I get my parts from Gary (Parts Obsolete). I am hoping to get everything this weekend. He said he never had anyone order 10 balls and 20 ball cups before. He didn't have them in stock. Anyway, yesterday he said he should have them this week and shoot them off to me.

So, have you striaghtened your shifter bar yet?

I still have my 914 up in the air and will take some pic's of my heater system. It works good, but not great.

Posted by: trekkor Nov 10 2004, 08:14 PM

Dan, Thanks for the update on the throttle parts.

Shifter is still in use

I'm still a little confused about the shifter.
One SIX owner says his shifter is unmodified and works perfect

I'll do it ...only if I must.

KT

Posted by: 9146986 Nov 10 2004, 08:45 PM

Tailshifter, has to be. There's no way a stock side shifter shift rod will work with a six. You'll do it, cause you must

Posted by: trekkor Nov 10 2004, 08:57 PM

Then.. I must.

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 11 2004, 09:37 AM

You willll, modifiy you shift bar (insert Jedi hand wave here).

Yep, on the side shifters, the bend in the bar hits the engine or the headers. I can't rememeber anymore, it has been too long since I installed one that wasn't modified.

You can do it yourself, or you can send your bar to me and I will weld in a straight peice for you.

When do you plan on pulling the 4cyl out?

Posted by: trekkor Nov 11 2004, 09:43 AM

The FOUR should be coming out in a couple of weeks.

Make way for the SIX!

KT

Posted by: Kerrys914 Nov 11 2004, 10:47 AM

Guys, how long is the shift bar? I need to get a shipping box from work and need the length.


Cheers

Posted by: Brad Smith Nov 11 2004, 01:19 PM

Let the bidding begin...

Posted by: Brad Smith Nov 11 2004, 01:32 PM

Corvair 6. Cheap, easy 175 hp, air cooled so you don't have to mess with that plumbing crap.

Brad

Posted by: 9146986 Nov 11 2004, 02:28 PM

IIRC that engine turns the wrong way, so you'd have five killer reverse gears and one granny forward! Oh and that awesome fanbelt set up! Good reason why they didn't make that car too many years!

Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 11 2004, 02:45 PM

Well, when I straighten bars, I cut out 73 1/4" so add another 6" to each side for good messure and I would say the bar is no longer than 86"?

Posted by: Series9 Nov 11 2004, 02:47 PM

Well, you could use a 915 tranny without having to flip the diff...

Posted by: Mueller Nov 11 2004, 02:51 PM

then you have to add on $600 for the adapter plate and flywheel (regardless of transmission used) hmmmm what gearbox did the Corvair use??

Posted by: sixnotfour Nov 11 2004, 03:47 PM

Not to Keep the Corvair thing going but, they did produce them from 1960 to 1969 with a
huge suspension improvemenet in 1965.
When I was 16 i had an air cooled and turbocharged first car with a tach ,cyl. head temp gage, and a boost gage ,and a horizental cooling fan.
3rd place in year end points for autocross that year too.
Oh ya cost me 300 bucks. Jeff

Posted by: 9146986 Nov 11 2004, 03:56 PM

Nah, you either got your numbers transposed or scored some primo dude

I know it's not seven feet long!

IIRC (I made a jig so I wouldn't have to remember), it's something like 34 1/4" center to center of the cross hole, and set screw hole.

Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 11 2004, 04:07 PM

OOps! Dang, that would be one long shift bar! Yeah, I think I cut 34 1/4" section out? Dang, now I can't remember? I was too busy playing with beer girl(see other forum).

Posted by: 9146986 Nov 11 2004, 04:12 PM

Obviously I've forgotten how long Chevy did make them... oops

One of my sister's boyfriends had one with daisy stickers all over it.

Posted by: Brad Smith Nov 11 2004, 04:21 PM

True... but a reverse grind cam costs the same as a "regular" performance cam. No big deal there.

Posted by: sixnotfour Nov 11 2004, 06:28 PM

Dont forget the valve seats fall out on a regular basis, I lost more valve seats than fan belts.
I even had one with weber 40IDA triples.angle exhaust ports custom headers
Porsche 6 or chev v-8 dont waist your time on the corvair engine.
I know your a 914 owner but you cant be that desperate. (its a joke)

Posted by: trekkor Nov 21 2004, 02:02 PM

Update time.

Motor is in time and carbs are synced.
Super smooth idle.
There is still a little snapping and popping around 2500-3200 if I slowly raise the rpms.

If I rev it fast it romps up to 6000+ right now. Yowza!
My remote tach only reads to 6k

When it comes off high rpm it sits at 2k for a moment and then settles back to 1k idle.

I picked up a 9x12 yard canopy so I can work on the install in the next week or so regardless of the weather.
$18 at a garage sale.

Threaded in new studs for the engine mount, also.

I should have my oil tank and lines, throttle linkage and engine tin by the end of this month.

Wife says go for it, *but* only after the house projects are done.


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Posted by: trekkor Nov 21 2004, 02:08 PM

a little something for the folks...


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Posted by: McMark Nov 21 2004, 02:11 PM

Let me know when you need/want my help. I'm ready for some fun.

Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 22 2004, 01:14 PM

Cool beans Trekkor! I can't wait to see some of the "Pull" pics and "install" pics! Great job!

Posted by: VintageExcellence Nov 24 2004, 10:13 PM

I must say: 4cyl engines = bla bla yuck yuck whether it is a build 2.0 or a big 4 (even those rabbi engines bla bla, I'm better than all of you with my perfect big 4s that cost more than 911 engines), V8s ehhh they are ok but never have the resale and they don't sound German (ya big deal but it means something to many of us) you also loose the trunk,

Ahh the Porsche 6 cyl... YES! costs money to do but it is well worth the trouble. I go to Porsche shows and hang out with the other 914-6 guys, its like being part of a special group. I can relate to 914 guys with 4cyl engines very well. A 914 with 200hp is a completly different car. So much fun and so worth it.

For a street car I like 3.0 and larger engines, less revs but much more torque, I can use 3rd gear for everything if I wanted. I was so pleased with my 3.0 Weber engine that I pulled it and bought a Euro 3.2 and I'm going to use the Motronic. So its FI time for me. More work but 250hp sounds very nice. Now that I have so much power I am fixing all the other stuff on the car to effectivley drive this car. I am tweaking the suspension heavily, doing Boxster brakes all the way around, seats with bolsters to hold me in one place, regeared transmission, and I am going to build a huge ralley bar for spotlights and such for fast night driving.

Its worth the trouble, hands down. Of course I built my whole car for very little, but then I am a Porsche mechanic and a parts vendor so I come across deals here and there.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 02:42 PM

Parts, parts...Whose gots da parts?

Parts, parts...I gots da parts! ( sung to your favorite music )

I'll post the pics later. I drove like 300 miles and made several stops. Left at 11:00 a.m. yesterday and got back at 1:00 a.m. today

Bay area traffic is RUDE.

I now have ALL the main components for the conversion.
Only spent $3400 including the engine thus far...

Let's celebrate

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Dec 2 2004, 02:50 PM

Your bell crank kit (missing the ball cups) is in the mail.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:02 PM

oil tank


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:03 PM

t-stat and cooler


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:07 PM

rebuilt alt. and guages


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:10 PM

I'm hijacking my own thread

Gots me a set a dees, too.

KT


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Posted by: nine14cats Dec 2 2004, 05:16 PM

Trekkor,

Can't wait till you join us on the dark side.......6 cylinder power!

Muuuuhuuuuhaaaahaaaahaaaa!

You watching this, Randal?

Go six Bud!

Bill P.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:17 PM

Also, i saw Theo's 914-6 2.2 conversion last night.
Nice, nice, nice!

His side shift rod is unmodified with no interference, as he told me...I saw it.

No mod needed!

Has Patrick moly bar mount and headers.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 05:19 PM

Thanks, Bill for the support.

GO 3.6, GO!

KT

Posted by: brant Dec 2 2004, 05:31 PM

Trekkor,

if you get the patrick bulkhead mount low enough you don't have to modify the rod...

still its better that you do modify the rod.. straighter the bettter..

I put my patrick mount as low as possible and could get a straight bar in there.. (I did put a 1 degree bend on the rear 6inches of bar, just to smooth up the motion)

brant

Posted by: Randal Dec 2 2004, 06:01 PM

But of course, but hopefully not from behind all you mucho guys (and girls) with those 6 cylinders motors!

All I want for Christmas is a Raby 2.7, a 2.7, a 2.7.....

Keep good thoughts for me!

Posted by: nine14cats Dec 2 2004, 06:16 PM

Hi Randal!

I hope Santa is okay giving you that Raby 2.7......which way is SHE leaning?



I just had to......

Bill P.

P.S. I think it would be cool if you could do a big type IV. It would be fun to have the small 6 (Trekkor), the big 4 (Randal), and the big 6 (Bill P.) going head to head in Auto-x and Time Trials...

Posted by: Randal Dec 2 2004, 06:47 PM

You're a perceptive guy Bill, you must be in sales!

It would be a blast to get a few more folks up there competing for the top 3 or 4 spots in AutoX.

Now time trailing is a totally different game. Although a big Raby in a car that tipped the scales around 1850 would go like stink, especially with 12" slicks.

Posted by: theol00 Dec 2 2004, 08:43 PM

HI Trekkor - it was great to finally meeting you - can't wait to see you up at sears the next time - good luck with the car !

Posted by: SirAndy Dec 2 2004, 08:57 PM

aren't you forgetting someone ?

Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 09:36 PM

Theo, thanks for the tour and dinner. See in in Sonoma.

Andy, I know you're a competitor. I can't forget you.

Here's the start of my engine tin, ala Root.
I had a piece of tin off a stove that protected it before install and piece of copper that already had the bend in it.

I'll drill the holes and paint it tommorrow with high temp BBQ paint ( FBF )

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 2 2004, 09:40 PM

tin. Root!


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Posted by: Randal Dec 2 2004, 11:52 PM

How could anyone ever forget you Andy?

The next couple of years are going to be really fun, now we have all the 914 Club people running.

With the Sac chapter of PCA running in Stockton, LPR at the Marina, GGR at Alameda and Monster Park and Zone 7 events we could be running every other weekend.

Bring lots of money for tires Andy.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 11 2004, 07:33 PM

My prevoius alternator problems are all squared away now!
No scraping and full 14.15 volts of charge.

The engine idles better and ramps up high rpms without the flutter with the full voltage to the coil. Very exited.

I should start tearing down the car on the 20th if all goes well. I'll take the rest of the year off of work to finish the build up.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Dec 18 2004, 05:47 PM

Took of the big Baja header off and all the test hoses and wires today. Motor looks a lot smaller to me.


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 18 2004, 05:50 PM

Also marked the flywheel for timing and valve adjusts.


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 18 2004, 05:58 PM

My goal start dates needs to be pushed back...Again.

These clients want their tile work finished.
Can you believe that?

So, looks like Dec 27th now. Driving by midnight Dec 31st seems impossible

KT

Posted by: Kerrys914 Dec 18 2004, 06:57 PM

KT, are you running the engine on the ground?

I am thinking about doing that but would like to hear of any issues you had first.

Cheers

Posted by: trekkor Dec 18 2004, 09:23 PM

Why, yes. I do run the engine right there on the ground.

You need some simple test items.
Test exhaust ( see above ), trans bell housing, starter, oil tank and lines, test starting wire harness, fuel tank, fuel pump, and a battery.

In the picture, the blue junction box has a start switch and a coil/fuel pump power switch.

The engine will run smooth on the bench without dancing all over the place. I revved mine well over 6000 rpms with NO problems.

I'm all done testing, so it's all off now.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 18 2004, 10:34 PM

I like pictures


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 26 2004, 12:30 PM

I'm in.

Parts off or disconnected as of 9:45 this morning:

Battery, F.I. brain, relay board, blower motor, air cleaner and hoses, driver side injector harness, aux air regulator, misc wires.

See ya a little later.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Dec 26 2004, 02:04 PM

Here's what the nieghbor's get to see.
Kinda circus theme...


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 26 2004, 02:10 PM

Here's the business end

Since our last visit more parts are off:

Muffler, muffler hanger, fuel lines, clutch cable, speedo cable, throttle cable, pass side injector harness, C.V. joints, shifter rod, battery cable and some more wires.

Hmmm... Can I drop it tonight?
I'll be out for a few hours before I can re-engage.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 26 2004, 09:06 PM

Guess what?


It's gone...

KT


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Posted by: boxstr Dec 26 2004, 09:19 PM

Maybe a little late but there are only 2 ten mm bolts that hold the engine lid on. I always like to make it easy on myself when insdie the engine bay.
Anyway congrats, you got alot done today.
CCLINEASYRIDER

Posted by: trekkor Dec 26 2004, 09:22 PM

It's really gone!

I'll miss that powerplant...Taught me a lot.
Thanks little FOUR.

KT


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Posted by: Maltese Falcon Dec 26 2004, 09:26 PM

Trekkor, keep your car and your 10 cyls (old four & new six !) covered up from the rain coming to Cali right about now
Don't forget to take some goofy pix of yourself while your workin down in the engine bay and have yourself a Happy New Year...
Marty

Posted by: trekkor Dec 27 2004, 12:49 AM

Thanks, Craig, Marty.
FOUR is under a tarp and the SIX is still in the shed!

This week I hope to do the battery tray repair and cut the holes for the oil tank and install it. Plumb for cooler.

I have a little rust repair to do as well.

Tomorrow, I hope to split the trans away from the FOUR and store them away.

I am waiting to hear if a racing pressure plate is available to me or not. ( lightened/balanced/high pressure unit )

If not the clutch and pressure plate on the FOUR came off the SIX.

I may make the 12/31/04 midnight goal yet...

Stay tuned.

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Dec 27 2004, 10:04 AM

Sweet Trekkor! You are well on your way!

Posted by: ! Dec 27 2004, 10:11 AM

QUOTE (boxstr @ Dec 26 2004, 07:19 PM)

Maybe a little late but there are only 2 ten mm bolts that hold the engine lid on. I always like to make it easy on myself when insdie the engine bay. Anyway congrats, you got alot done today. CCLINEASYRIDER

"I" notch the arms so that the lid slips on w/o having to completely pull the bolts out. Makes it easier (can be done with one person) to reinstall as well.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 28 2004, 05:13 PM

Here's what I'm looking at:


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 28 2004, 05:17 PM

tray, pedestal and MPS mount- gone.

911 sport mounts- in.


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 28 2004, 05:20 PM

yuck


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 28 2004, 05:24 PM

cut some holes

I'm going to go get a 4-4.5 inch hole saw for the filter, too easy.

Also cut off the blower motor pedestal- gone.

I'll naval jelly all the rusty areas, then use a rust coverting paint/primer.

It looks worse than it is.

KT


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Posted by: Aaron Cox Dec 28 2004, 05:34 PM

Posted by: McMark Dec 29 2004, 03:18 AM

Happy Hell Hole!

Posted by: Kerrys914 Dec 29 2004, 06:36 AM

I just drilled my holes this past weekend PITA I was off alittle on two of my holes so they ended up not so round

Talk about TORQUE

I also test fitted the oil tank..WTF that thing doesn't just slide in? It took some doing to get the oil tank into position.

Looks good keep the photos coming.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 29 2004, 06:25 PM

Did the BIG HOLE today.

QUOTE

Talk about TORQUE

That was a challenge not to break my wrist.
I didn't even take the label off, just sawwed through it too.

Anyone need a *new* hole saw.


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 29 2004, 06:26 PM

chasing rust...


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Posted by: trekkor Dec 29 2004, 06:31 PM

top view.
Looks bad, I know. Not one bit of rust on the lower longs, motor mount ears or suspension console.

Quite a pile of dirt fell out when I popped the rocker off.

I'll do battle some more tonight.

KT


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Posted by: Eric_Shea Dec 29 2004, 06:59 PM

QUOTE

Anyone need a *new* hole saw.

I'm next... send it on.

Posted by: Kerrys914 Dec 29 2004, 07:14 PM

Your 4" hole is rounder then mine That just doesn't sound right.

Have you decided on what to use for a hole edge liner?


I am sure you know, but make sure you drilled the hole in the shelf for the lowest oil hose to pass into the engine bay. There should be a flat spot already there.

Looks good

Posted by: trekkor Dec 29 2004, 07:48 PM

QUOTE

hole edge liner

Two possibilities.
plastic u-channel or braided German vacuum line that I will carefully razor cut to make it into a u-channel.

QUOTE

the hole in the shelf for the lowest oil hose to pass into the engine bay

Got it, too. Thanks

KT

Posted by: trekkor Dec 31 2004, 08:59 PM

I finished the rust repair.

I found a nice tube to use as oil tank hole liner.
It's soft vinyl drip irrigation tubing. Found it in white.
Cut it into u-channel, nice fit.

Tomorrow I will paint the engine bay, install the oil tank, maybe the SIX, too.

The area under my car is crazy messy right now.
It looks like my tool shed blew up.


KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 12:14 AM

Clutch is on...


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 12:16 AM

Engine mount bar is also on...


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Posted by: boxstr Jan 2 2005, 12:24 AM

If you have an extra hood the black trim on the edge can be used for the oil tank holes.
CCLINEDGY

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Jan 2 2005, 01:49 AM

Trekkor, do you have the right engine oil cooler for your 6 ? The one in the jpeg seems to have a straight fitting on the end...you need a hard 90, which will clear the undercarriage. I'm just checking...
Marty

Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 01:56 AM

Can't I just use a 90 fitting off the cooler?

Will there be a clearance issue?

KT

Posted by: sixnotfour Jan 2 2005, 07:34 AM

Marty's right What are you going to do ?

You have an early oil cooler, 72 and later has a bigger inlet tube on the cooler. and to make it work you can saw it flush with end of the cooler, pipe thread it ,and screw in an 3/4pipe to -12 AN ,90 elbow . use some epoxy too. Or weld it. Thats the simple way. But you need the later oil cooler.

Dan Root, uses your cooler saws it off and slides the hose over and clamps it.
Works ,but there is better ways .

Someone makes a machined piece that is welded to the end of the cooler.

Find a six cooler. But You have a Vellios tank that uses AN fittings,so thats a problem.
Have someone weld a AN -12 90 to your cooler.
I am sure there is other ways also.

Do you know what chain tensioners are in the motor ?
you may want to look and make sure they have gaurds on at the least.
Its easy now with the motor out.
Hope this helps Jeff

Posted by: Kerrys914 Jan 2 2005, 08:05 AM

That dam oil cooler

Seems like the best price I found was $115 to modify your cooler to have a 90deg fitting welded on.

The hose route is the easiest and cheapest but maybe not the "correct" way??? IIRC this hose is a low pressure line so hose clamps will work.

I am holding off on making my choice for mine. I will see how the funds hold up over the next few months.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 11:13 AM

QUOTE

the "correct" way

This motor in my car will never be correct.

If the oil system functions and doesn't leak, for me, that's correct.

I may have a hard line made. I may use Porsche fittings on one end and AN's on the tank end of the oils lines.

I'm not picky. I want it to work. Look good. And last.
I you don't like that, don't go under my car.

Factory original, concours, all matching parts.

I need to know if the cooler that I have, with it's exit will work or not. Does it come close to the chassis or body when in the car or not.

Posted by: ! Jan 2 2005, 11:55 AM

T,

Take it from me....I've done a few conversions....the easiest, stoopid proof way is to use braided aircraft line and AN fittings.....as to the tank....two ways.

You can used the adapter conversion fittings to AN or cut the Porsche fitting off and weld an AN fitting on. Depending on how good a welder you are or how much you pay to have it done...the welded AN/Porsche fitting is the best...the conversion ones are fine, but tend to reduce space and have a few more leak paths....

Posted by: brant Jan 2 2005, 12:42 PM

Trekkor,

I can't quite see it in the picture.. so I'm not absolutely positive which cooler you have there....

but a 911 cooler will interfere at the suspension ear if its not modified in one of the above ways...

doesn't have to be concours stock, but does have to be modified to clear.

people are probably sick of this picture, but here is a shot of one modified:


brant


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 04:48 PM

I'd like to see some more pics of this area.

Posted by: sixnotfour Jan 2 2005, 05:27 PM

You have about 2 3/4 inches from the cooler to the side of the trailing arm.
That does not include the threaded fitting sticking out from the side of your cooler.
Sorry no picture .

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 2 2005, 08:33 PM

OK, Here's a shot lookin' up at the area.


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Posted by: J P Stein Jan 2 2005, 08:34 PM

And here's one looking forward.


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 08:38 PM

here's my cooler.
Is the suggestion to remove the cooler, weld it, re-install it?

Brant's set-up looks good.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 08:43 PM

JP, those shots were perfect.
Thanks!

KT

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 2 2005, 08:49 PM

By all means, take it off. Otto's did my cooler conversion.
If you have AN lines, have an AN fitting welded on...

BTW, you have to install & tighten that oil line to the tank before you install the tank......unless you have a some kinda magic wrench.....gud luck.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 2 2005, 08:50 PM

heli-coiled and installed the studs into the back of the motor.


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Posted by: Maltese Falcon Jan 2 2005, 11:34 PM

I found out the hard way on my first 6 conversion ('78)--while the engine was goin in . I found an aluminum welding shop open on a Sat and he put a 90 deg AN#16 on the cooler . I also went over to Earl's in Hawthorne --yes they used to have a store--and got a #16 tee fitting/ cap and used this for a drain point just after the lower fitting coming off of the oil tank. I can now get lots of oil drained out during maintennance

Posted by: McMark Jan 3 2005, 12:02 AM

Trekkor, TEM machine shop can weld aluminum if you need.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 3 2005, 12:09 AM

Tomorrow it'll get done.
Just need to decide if I keep the Porsche fitting or just go AN.

KT

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 3 2005, 12:33 AM

What/which oil tank do you have?

Posted by: trekkor Jan 3 2005, 12:44 AM

this one


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Posted by: J P Stein Jan 3 2005, 12:56 AM

Vellious?
Go with AN.....16 or 20 on the supply side.
Don't dick around with that cooler. Take it to someone that KNOWS what they are doing.

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 4 2005, 11:47 AM

Pics......feed line ....to below cooler


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Posted by: J P Stein Jan 4 2005, 11:49 AM

More.......Scavenge line to tank.


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Posted by: J P Stein Jan 4 2005, 11:50 AM

Same line from underside


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Posted by: J P Stein Jan 4 2005, 11:53 AM

Scavenge line routing from case.....goes aft, then fwd......there's too much "stuff" in the way to just go fwd initally....for me, at least.


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 4 2005, 12:09 PM

That is great! This helps me get a better grasp on what is happening down there.

I'll follow up with my set-up shortly.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Jan 5 2005, 06:32 PM

Cooler mod is done.


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Posted by: ! Jan 5 2005, 06:34 PM

Hmmmmm, you sure that's gonna clear the swing arm?

Posted by: trekkor Jan 5 2005, 06:34 PM

'gain. Still have to put it on the motor.

The motor and trans combo is assembled and staged right behind the car.

Tonight, there may be a party.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 5 2005, 06:49 PM

Mike, I'm good...

Brant and JP's pics a page back showed me the way.

Got fresh -16, -12 lines, various fittings and firesleeve for the sections near the headers.

Found a -12 fitting to come out of the side of the case out at Sears , as well.

KT

Posted by: Kerrys914 Jan 5 2005, 07:01 PM

Details on the mod..Did you go it or have a local welder do it? WHhat type of fitting did you use? Looks like a 90deg AN-16 x ?

Cheers and nice work

Posted by: trekkor Jan 5 2005, 09:20 PM

Local welder-$100.

He blasted off the anodized coating off the -16 AN 90 and slipped it over the supply tube. He had to bore out the inside diameter of the 90, slightly, to fit it.

He welded on a support gusset as well. I'm happy.

KT

( Motor should be installed by 9:00pm... )

Posted by: nebreitling Jan 5 2005, 09:25 PM

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jan 5 2005, 07:20 PM)

( Motor should be installed by 9:00pm... )

what the heck are you doing posting?! get out there and finish! i'm on the edge of my seat here!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 6 2005, 12:11 AM

Hey...I've got a SIX!!!

It has finally happened.

It was in at 9:03.

Followed by a lot of

McMark is the man!

We had it from furniture dolly to installed in 1 hour.
BTW, take off your Webers before install, the axles won't clear.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 6 2005, 12:15 AM

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Posted by: trekkor Jan 6 2005, 12:18 AM

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Posted by: trekkor Jan 6 2005, 12:25 AM

To all who have helped me get this done.
Thank you very much.

Fact: my shift rod will need a mod.

Fact: my oil cooler mod is perfect. No issues.

I'm pumped

KT

Posted by: McMark Jan 6 2005, 02:15 AM

YAY! I can't wait for a drive.

Posted by: nebreitling Jan 6 2005, 02:47 AM

trekkor, congratulations. i'm literally cracking open a beer right now in your honor.*

i want to see video footage of your inaugural drive!!

here's to you!




*(what the hell. it's only 12.45am and i've only got another 4 hours of work to do before teaching a 9am class. for f--k's sake.)

Posted by: gaz914 Jan 6 2005, 05:40 AM

Well done trekkor

Posted by: sixnotfour Jan 6 2005, 06:24 AM

6 not 4
nice cooler, great progress

Posted by: Root_Werks Jan 6 2005, 09:46 AM

Sweet! Nice clean cooler mod. I have to pull my engine to replace the chain rails. When I do, I plan on re-doing my cooler mod as well. Looks great! Thanks for the pictures!

Posted by: Randal Jan 6 2005, 09:54 AM

Congratulation Trekkor

Great Work

Can't wait to see it run at Alameda where you can use all that power!!

Posted by: scrz914 Jan 6 2005, 03:12 PM

FAARDUP!!

Posted by: Gint Jan 6 2005, 11:14 PM

Nice goin trekkor!

Posted by: Series9 Jan 6 2005, 11:18 PM

Chant: SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX SIX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 7 2005, 12:47 AM

Thanks for the compliments!!

Without this club, none of this would have ever happened.

More progress!

Oil return tubes are on. ( horrible project, took two hours. Better than a tear down. )
Headers, axles.

You can look for yourself...

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 7 2005, 12:58 AM

looky looky


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 7 2005, 01:05 AM

Replacement oil tubes.


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 8 2005, 08:24 PM

Progress report

Carbs, clutch cable, speedo cable, shift rod mod all on.

Taking a break right now.

If I go back out tonight, will report back with some pics...

KT

Posted by: McMark Jan 8 2005, 09:12 PM

Show us the shifter mod.

Posted by: Aaron Cox Jan 8 2005, 09:24 PM

how long till the paint on the header burns off

Posted by: Gint Jan 8 2005, 11:14 PM

When's it gonna run?

Posted by: trekkor Jan 9 2005, 12:05 AM

Here's the shift rod mod.

I took a different approach to what's been done here by some.
I just rotated the rod without the set screws and noted the amount of rotation to clear the header.

I cut the rod ends with a sawsall and ground the ends clean.
Tacked the rod together and tested it.

Made slight adjustments and welded it up, grind, clean and paint. Got about an hour into it.

It hangs down as far as the headers, so I'm not worried about clearance issues.

Should run the motor tomorrow or monday.
First drive may have to wait 'til weds.

High temp paint will last as long as it lasts.

KT


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Posted by: trekkor Jan 9 2005, 12:09 AM

from other side

Forgot to tell you. This mod method requires no measuring or new rod stock. You only lose the width of two saw blades.

KT


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Posted by: Aaron Cox Jan 9 2005, 12:10 AM

thats a fatty ass bend!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 9 2005, 12:16 AM

The bend you saw on the shift rod is the stock unmodified bend. The rod is just rotated approx 60 degrees counter-clockwise.

Trek

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Jan 9 2005, 10:05 PM

Hey Trekkor...nice progress on the SIX ! I can't tell if you're running the support bracket off of the trans to the L and R side header collectors (?) Make sure you fab yours up to fit...as it will eliminate stress loads on the LONG headers.
Some lucky 914World.commer will take a set of these MSDS headers home at the WCC'05 Raffle this April
Now let's hear that six rip...
Marty MSDSinc.

Posted by: neo914-6 Jan 10 2005, 12:19 AM

QUOTE

Some lucky 914World.commer will take a set of these MSDS headers home at the WCC'05 Raffle this April

Marty,
Makes me want to go P-six in my Neo914. I just afford the $15k+ for late 3.6 and modded 915. although it's already set up for oil tank, cooler...

Posted by: brp914 Jan 10 2005, 12:44 AM

The pic of the oil tank seems to indicate the qtr panel is off the car. If so, why?

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 10 2005, 12:50 AM

QUOTE (brp914 @ Jan 9 2005, 10:44 PM)

The pic of the oil tank seems to indicate the qtr panel is off the car.  If so, why?

Ain't his car. I cut off the quarter panel on mine so's I could take a pic for him

Posted by: Series9 Jan 10 2005, 01:06 AM

QUOTE (Neo914 @ Jan 9 2005, 11:19 PM)

Makes me want to go P-six in my Neo914. I just afford the $15k+ for late 3.6 and modded 915.

$15k for a late 3.6+915? Are you kidding? If I could have done it for $15k, I would have saved $5k.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 10 2005, 01:29 AM

More progress tonight...

Oil lines made, oil tank in, bell crank throttle linkage in.

Setting up the fuel system.

McMark came up with some great ideas to sort out the electricals using the FOUR's relay board and harness.

Marty, thanks for the headers, the muffler hanger is on!
( prior pics didn't have it, good eye. )

Goal is to run it tomorrow night.

KT


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Posted by: SirAndy Jan 10 2005, 01:50 AM

QUOTE (914RS @ Jan 9 2005, 11:06 PM)

$15k for a late 3.6+915? Are you kidding?

nope, that's about the going rate around here.

biggest factor is how cheap you can get the 3.6 for ...
Andy

Posted by: SirAndy Jan 10 2005, 01:51 AM

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jan 9 2005, 11:29 PM)

Oil lines made, oil tank in, bell crank throttle linkage in.

dude, you'll need some engine-tin!

looks great man, can wait to beat you at the next AX ...
Andy

Posted by: nebreitling Jan 10 2005, 01:55 AM

QUOTE (SirAndy @ Jan 9 2005, 11:51 PM)

looks great man, can wait to beat you at the next AX ...

hey, get in line andy!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 10 2005, 02:10 AM

QUOTE

engine-tin

I have it...

QUOTE

looks great man

Thanks, I'm having a blast!

QUOTE

can wait to beat you at the next AX ...

QUOTE

hey, get in line andy!

Here's an engine shot.
I'll do a daylight pic tomorrow.

KT


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Posted by: neo914-6 Jan 10 2005, 02:19 AM

Trekkor,
Great job!, can you itemize how much did you spent on this conversion?
Felix

Posted by: trekkor Jan 10 2005, 02:36 AM

Sure.

Motor $1500
Oil tank, cooler, thermostat $800
Headers, muffler $400
Motor Mount bar $200
Shift rod mod, engine tin, bell crank $Free
Cooler mod $100
AN Oil lines and hose end fittings $400
Fuel pump $100
Fuel pressure regulator $50
Alternator, guages, motor mounts, hardware, misc bits $400

$3950.

Shop for deals! Used, uneeded items, DIY, etc.

My goal of a $4k conversion is possible.

KT

Posted by: ! Jan 10 2005, 08:42 AM

Did you ever get a six cylinder tach? I have an extra one....btw...

Posted by: Root_Werks Jan 10 2005, 08:51 AM

I love it when a six comes together.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 10 2005, 09:46 AM

QUOTE

six cylinder tach

Thanks Mike, I do have one.

KT

Posted by: ! Jan 10 2005, 09:50 AM

OK...raining like a MOFO nad I was bored....went thur my parts drawer....it's amazing what you find when YOU ARE NOT looking for it....still can't find my box of studs....but I found two tachs, a bunch of conversion fittings and a pic of the old girlfriend from 20 years ago.....geeez, WHAT was I thinking.....?

BTW....Kerry914....you can have it...for a trade or something....

Posted by: Kerrys914 Jan 10 2005, 09:53 AM

Cool

What are these oil fittings you have?

Also, I like you other avatars better then this one

Posted by: MXMARK Jan 10 2005, 11:01 PM

Great job Trekkor, I already have the 6 so maybe mine will get to go in soon. Thanks Mark

Posted by: pete-stevers Jan 10 2005, 11:14 PM

Fantastic job getting this car togather!!!
If it wasn't for threads like and the club i'd be hesitant to attempt my project...
Thanks and hats off to you!
Cheers
steve

Posted by: trekkor Jan 13 2005, 01:43 PM

Here we go...

Today should be THE BIG DAY. I need about four more hours and I'm driving down the road.

I'm off work for the day already.

Engine tin, battery, electrical, and connect fuel line to pump.

I need to go round up a few things after lunch. Let's do this!

KT

Posted by: Root_Werks Jan 13 2005, 04:08 PM

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jan 13 2005, 11:43 AM)

Here we go... Today should be THE BIG DAY. I need about four more hours and I'm driving down the road. I'm off work for the day already. Engine tin, battery, electrical, and connect fuel line to pump. I need to go round up a few things after lunch. Let's do this! KT

Man, I wish I could be there for the intial fire up and drive!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 13 2005, 09:01 PM

I'm slow...

I'm going to the hardware store for some electrical connectors and wire.

I will start it tonight.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Jan 13 2005, 11:41 PM

Ran it!

Tomorrow morning I'll put it back on the ground and drive it.

It was around 9:00 when I started it up and around 35 degrees...brrr.

I set the fuel preesure regulator while running to 3.5 PSI.
Takes a while to get an idle when it's this cold out.

The header paint is stinky and smokey.

KT

Posted by: JOHNMAN Jan 14 2005, 01:17 AM

Trekkor,

Whose tank is that (a Vellios?) I thought they were different than that. Maybe they changed the style?

How much was the tank? and is there a drain or is it like original and have to disconnect a line?

Posted by: trekkor Jan 14 2005, 01:28 AM

Yes, Vellios.

Got it used.
Don't know the new price with all the parts. Filler neck, cap, dipstick, filter console and fittings.

No drain. You have to pull a line.

Posted by: Root_Werks Jan 14 2005, 09:57 AM

I knew a guy who just soldered up some pipe with a drain plug to the oil cooler for a 914-6. very slick, I never thought about soldering, but he said it was good to like 600-700 degrees, so I am thinking I might just try that one myself. He spent like $10 on pipe fittings from a hardware store. That sort of price is right up my alley!

I wanna see pictures Trekkor!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 14 2005, 12:28 PM

Took it for a drive this morning before work...

Whoa, It's a totally different beast.

It through me right back into my seat and the acceleration is amazing. And the sound...

I still need to install the engine tin and make some minor adustments to the clutch and carb linkage.

Overall a nice morning...And sunny, too.

I'll get back at it after 3:00.
May need to raise the rear end a touch or put in the 200# coil springs.

I don't want to go back to work right now.
The job is less than five minutes from home. I forgot something and *had* to post. ( I keep hearing that SIX chant )...

Have a 914 day.

KT

Posted by: trekkor Jan 14 2005, 12:40 PM

Here ya go , Dan!

I'm gone.

KT


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Posted by: Root_Werks Jan 14 2005, 12:46 PM

Right on! Isn't that sound just pure music! Who needs a radio with a six just behind you!

Good job! I drove my 914 into work yesterday. Man! I love that car.

Posted by: sixnotfour Jan 14 2005, 02:02 PM

Are you sre you should run those air cleaners with all that Rain you guys are getting ? hydro lock,
Just kidding I live in Rain, WASHington and have that style.

Looks awesome , now youre ready for some great SIX

Posted by: 9146986 Jan 14 2005, 02:08 PM

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jan 14 2005, 10:28 AM)

Took it for a drive this morning before work... Whoa, It's a totally different beast. It through me right back into my seat and the acceleration is amazing. And the sound... ( I keep hearing that SIX chant )

Are you sure you did the right thing???

Don't you think you would've been just as happy with a big four??????

Us sixerheads are full of it right???????

Congrats Trekkor, and you thought you loved your car before......

Posted by: GTeener Jan 14 2005, 02:46 PM

QUOTE (trekkor @ Jan 14 2005, 10:28 AM)

Took it for a drive this morning before work... Whoa, It's a totally different beast. It through me right back into my seat and the acceleration is amazing. And the sound... Have a 914 day. KT

Congrats!

Welcome to the club!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 14 2005, 08:46 PM

No regrets. I like this "new" club.

Had a blast driving this afternoon after work.
It's wild getting used to all the new shift points with the new RPM band.

Adusted the clutch a little. The carbs still need some tweaking.

KT

Posted by: Lawrence Jan 15 2005, 12:25 AM

QUOTE

Took it for a drive this morning before work... Whoa, It's a totally different beast.   It through me right back into my seat and the acceleration is amazing. And the sound...   I still need to install the engine tin and make some minor adustments to the clutch and carb linkage.

Told Ya!

This is Gint BTW, not Rusty. All of the carb party members here at Rusty's say Congrats!

Posted by: trekkor Jan 15 2005, 11:48 PM

OK...I'm insane now.

Revving to 7300 RPM's in a 914 with SIX barrels of power on my neck is rather nice.

The dwell angle was off by 17 degrees and acted as a rev limiter, keeping me at 5300 rpm's ( which was fun BTW )

Hmmmm....Whose next?

KT

Posted by: nine14cats Jan 15 2005, 11:54 PM

Trekkor...Isn't that a kick having that 6 with Webers behind you just revving up a storm? I just love the sound of that! What kind of rev limiter are you running on the motor?

The reason I ask is that you will need something. The motor will just continue to rev to the moon and during auto-xing you will find yourself spinning that thing waaayyyy up!

You need some protection from yourself....I should know....

Bill P.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Jan 16 2005, 12:03 AM

Trekkor, you can always retard your ign. timing way back and always keep your headers RED !
Don't Do It...

Posted by: trekkor Jan 16 2005, 12:08 AM

QUOTE

rev limiter

7300 RPM Rev limiting rotor came with the motor.
I'd like to upgrade to electronic ignition, MSD?

Anyone know where I can find a Pertronix module for an old scuzzy little six?...

KT

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Jan 16 2005, 12:43 AM

www.pertronix.com (aka Patriot Exhausts--acquired from Thunderbird Exhaust), They're down here in SoCal, email them for a dearler near you --or give them a re-sale # and they will sell to you @ dealer $. MSD Ignition won't sell to you...you'll need to buy from Jeg's or a local speed shop. MSD also offers a good selection of "Soft touch" rev limiters. Also , your ign. rotor should have a rev limiter (yr.?) in it , my old 2.7 did.

Posted by: Randal Jan 16 2005, 10:02 PM

Some tell about a very fast 914-6 tearing up a (beautiful) hill climb road in Napa this evening with a couple of 914 club guys on board.

Yes, Trekkor's car is working, so well in fact that I am having to re-think about a big 4, given the performance of his 6. This 2.0 liter goes like stink.

Trekkor's installation work is first class and the proud owner is probably still smiling, as we was when I left him. But, so is the passenger.

Great job Trekkor! You've got a great car.

Posted by: J P Stein Jan 16 2005, 10:10 PM

QUOTE (Randal @ Jan 16 2005, 08:02 PM)

Yes, Trekkor's car is working, so well in fact that I am having to re-think about a big 4, given the performance of his 6. This 2.0 liter goes like stink.

Sing along now.....
Anything a 4 can do, a six can do better.

Posted by: trekkor Jan 16 2005, 10:19 PM

That was fun, Randal.
You showed up just in time, right after I put the final touches on the carbs.

JP, I love that song
Come race with us.

KT

Posted by: trekkor May 27 2005, 09:31 PM

O.K.- fours months later

Pertronix and MSD ignition have been added, so it's easy starting and reliable.

Only had one oil leak.

I've got seven a/x's and a track day (WCC) on it as well.
This car is really great and I love the sound.

Revving on grid and just before the green flag drops is a good way to get all stoked up.

I HIGHLY recommend doing a SIX conversion to anyone who wants more power and performance out of their 914.

thanks to all who have helped me do this.

KT

Posted by: grantsfo May 28 2005, 10:06 AM

QUOTE (trekkor @ May 27 2005, 07:31 PM)

O.K.- fours months later Pertronix and MSD ignition have been added, so it's easy starting and reliable. Only had one oil leak. I've got seven a/x's and a track day (WCC) on it as well. This car is really great and I love the sound. Revving on grid and just before the green flag drops is a good way to get all stoked up. I HIGHLY recommend doing a SIX conversion to anyone who wants more power and performance out of their 914. thanks to all who have helped me do this. KT

Trekkor, I'm thinking of starting a thread, "how to build a race car around a stock 1.8" It was fun going through this thread again!

Oh yeah and thanks for proving a sub $6K conversion is possible if you want to work hard and shop around for deals.

Posted by: ! May 28 2005, 10:18 AM

Now that Manfred has been dialed in....it's time to do a head to head Trekkor....we both have 2.0/6s and I wanna see what my ride does against yours....where do ya wanna meet? Loser buys lunch.

Posted by: trekkor May 28 2005, 01:32 PM

Mike, If you come up to Marina ( Monterey ) for an a/x, I'll buy you lunch regardless.

Glad to hear you plan on keeping Manfred for a while at least.

QUOTE

a sub $6K conversion is possible

Grant, you can do this for $4500 if you don't do all the hopped up extras unrelated to the actual conversion.

KT

Posted by: thomasotten Jul 30 2005, 07:50 PM

Early on is this thread, when Trekkor was undecided about the "small" six, there were several who told him to go ahead and buy the engine, do the conversion, and then upgrade to a larger engine in the future. Is that really feasible? For instance, don't you have to size your headers based on your engine size? Replacing headers can be expensive, especially if you opted for heat exchangers.

Posted by: Travis Neff Jul 30 2005, 08:01 PM

If you opted for OE heat exchangers you only get one size. As for the aftermarket ones I dunno if they offer different sizes. For headers I think that after 3.2 in size that is when you step up in size, bigger will give you top end power, smaller will give you more low end torque.

Anyway, Trekkor's car is a fun ride. The sound of a short stroke six is awesome.

Posted by: trekkor Dec 25 2005, 12:57 AM

It's coming up on one year since the first drive.

Great year

15 a/x's and 7 track days on the conversion with no signs of trouble.

I added the front mounted oil cooler and thermostat for improved cooling on the track.
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=36902&hl=cooler

It always starts, no breakdowns and really fun.
I hope this can be of help to any considering the SIX path.

See you on the track


KT

Posted by: J P Stein Dec 26 2005, 10:36 AM

Good for you, Trekkor.

Since building my 2.7L (in 2000) I haven't had a single mechanical problem. In that time, I've missed 2 AXs due to electrical difficulties (owner stupidy ). I have had to swap out a few fouled plugs in the lanes, tho. There's prolly around 800 AX passes there.

The 911 engine is about bullet proof with a bit of care. It smokes at startup more than when new....the pistons rattle
a bit longer. One more season & I'll tear it down (I said that last year ).

Posted by: autohausdolby Oct 13 2006, 02:35 AM

I just read this entire thread - coool! I love it when it all goes well, especially when people have been going "no, it won't work" or whatever

Posted by: trekkor Oct 13 2006, 08:14 AM

Thanks.

All is still well, BTW.


KT

Posted by: Sammy Oct 13 2006, 09:39 AM

IMHO, I'd rather have a crappy running small six than a perfectly tuned big four any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Get her up and running, you will never look back.
EDIT: oops, just looked at the dates and realized this was on old thread. Never mind.