Here are some photos of the new aluminum oil tank. It has stock OEM fittings, and is a direct bolt in for a factory tank. It has additional oil capacity of about 1 1/2 quarts.
I've got one more in stock, and I've got all the factory tank seals, boots, and 914-6 oil lines.
PK
914 Network
a914man@netease.net
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Another photo
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A detail shot of the critical area. It uses a stock Porsche filter console. Sorry the res. isn't better.
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PRICE... we need pricing. Much better than the cast Vellios stuff... but he really needs to find a better welder or have the sheet pieces cut to tighter tolerance.
I know it goes in the fender... but quality..quality..quality.
B
OH.. can I order them with AN fittings in the -20 variety and -16 ?
B
It looks like it was Mig welded. I wonder why it wasn't Tig'd? Or he just used waay too much rod.
If the pieces dont fit.. the welder has to "fill the gap".
I know Dave Shepard has contacts with Ron Davis. You would think that RD could whip this out "total pro" like their radiators.
B
It does look quite "home made" for lack of a better term. I guess price is the key thing, but honestly I would not be inclined to use a clone part for a crucial application like this unless it were 1/2 (or less) or the real thing became totally NLA.
Don't take the above the wrong way...I am definitely always stoked to hear when people are making specialty 914 parts.
More capacity is gooder. 9.5 to 11 quarts in a stock system.
I do hope that's a prototype... or if not, is priced accordingly.
Are those large seams going to rub anywhere (i.e. through paint and cause rust long-term)?
-Lawrence
Perry,
I think that looks very nice! Contrary to the amateur critics around here. :finger2:
A good welder who can make strong and consistantly attractive tig welds in aluminum is hard to find. I don't think there is anything wrong with those welds.
If it were being made in production quantities I might expect a higher level of precision in the weld beads.
If it fits and doesn't leak it is much better than the cast aluminum tanks.
Being an amateur critic myself, from what I've heard alumn is very tough to make pretty. I think people are too used to seeing master welders on TV shows making alumn welds look like a stack of nickles If the price is low, maybe there will be more 6 cyl converts out there (even though I like the oddball stigma of a big 4).
Looks damn good
Is there any baffles inside ??
How many hours and at what hourly rate does it take to weld up a tank like this? I would think that is where most of the cost is.
Perry,
sorry for all the anoying questions...
I'd be interested in the weight of this one?
do you really think it will be lighter than stock? looks like a toss up, but its probably unreasonable for me to guess on a picture.
thanks and no rush
brant
This is the best reproduction oil tank I've ever seen AND, it's made from a material that's not going to rust. Mechanically it is identical to the factory tank, ie baffling, bolting up, filter console and filler neck mounting, boots, OIL LINE CONNECTIONS, etc.
The factory tanks weigh right at 7.6 lbs and these weight 5.8lbs.
At this time there is not, or has not ever been a reproduction 914-6 oil tank like this.
If you wanted to convert to AN, you can remove the factory oil line fittings and use M22 x 1.5 adapters. AND, it holds more oil.
It may be hard for some to understand this, developing a tank like this takes time which equals money. Not everyone is going to go through the trouble of disecting a factory tank, developing the designs for the custom machined internal parts, and then GIVE IT ALL AWAY, or post all the blueprints on the internet and HOW YOU CAN DO IT YOURSELF!
The suggested retail price is around $700. Factory tanks are now over $800.
The Velios tanks were/are like $495 (if you can get one or would want to get one after seeing these tanks), and from my experience one out of four is a leaker. AND they weigh in at probably three times the weight of this new tank. At this point, and the problems I had dealing with George Velios, I wouldn't sell any of his products. In addition to the fact that I've heard he's gone out of business anyway.
$700 to $750 was my guess on price. Hand built and worth every penny. This is the product I will recommend to any -6 conversion customers I have in the future.
Thanks Perry!
Not to piss on this parade, but the fact that aluminum does not "rust" does not in any way say that you won't have any problems. I had an oil filter console (aluminum) where the flange outside of the O-ring was completely corroded away. Actually, rust is a particular form of corrosion that affects iron and steel. The biggest problem is where aluminum and steel come together and you get galvanic corrosion. You only have to take a look at any aluminum parts on the car to see what problems can develop. That said, I'd go for an aluminum tank myself. Just install carefully.
The tank looks nice, I have used both factory and the cast tank from V. As long as you get the later tanks from V with the baffle in it, you should be fine. Yes, it is pretty heavy, but aslo pretty sturdy. If you can find a factory tank, use it. Many backyard "Bob's" can make parts, but cannot compete with the money spent to develop a part like the factory can. If this tank is truly in the $700 range, I would opt for a factoy tank. Otherwise, you might as well go buy a good universal tank for $250 and stick it in the front trunk. You can have a 20qt system if you want then, plus lines already run for a cooler etc. I make quick six bars and 914-6 tin for my conversions. But nothing I would want to sell. It all looks like hell, but works great. It takes so long to make the stuff, I would have to charge a lot of money to sell it just to break even. This tank looks like the same? If it could be produced in numbers and the price dropped some, I might pick up a few.
Just my 2 cents.
Oh, V is still around, disapeared for a while, but I picked up a tank from him not too long ago.
I have some experince welding aluminum besides I like learning stuff and it doesn't look that difficult. And if I decide I can't do I'm not above having an expert take over but at least I tried and learned.
FWIW I found a NOS factory tank for $400 not that long ago. Cash deal, no shipping or taxes. Scores are still out there if you have a bit of luck and timing.
Again maybe it's just me but I do not see anything compelling to lead me to buy this product at no significant cost savings compared to the factory part...now when the factory tank becomes NLA Any Day Now then we will all be kissing the ground that somebody makes these specialized parts.
Perry, I wish you would have a little conviction and quit sitting on the fence about this issue!
Don't get me wrong, I don't know V at all. Just used his tanks a couple of times, but purchased them through dealers. I have never paid more than $400 for one of his tanks. Only having installed and used a few, I probably don't have the history to make proper judgments on the guys work.
On another note, I have heard a couple of people mention cost. Long have I visited this site without sticking my nose into anything, but thought I should start chiming in to let people know converting to a 6 is not hard or that expensive. You single largest purchase will probably be the oil tank.
I still stand by if this tank is $700 (it looks great), then I would buy a factory tank for $800. Although, I wouldn't spend more than $400 on any tank, but that is just me. Sheese! I can remember doing some of my first conversions when you could pick up a factory tank from GPR for $450!
If you can weld mild steel and like to tinker and build things, then you can make most of what you need on your own. A quick six bar is a piece of cake. The 914-6 is also not hard. The throttle linkage is also not hard. All low dollar stuff. Heck, I have numerous plywood jigs for tin, bulkhead and quick 6 bars I have made over the years. Nothing pretty, but I don't think I ever spent more than $100 making the throttle linkage, tin, cross bar or bulkhead mount and oil lines. The only item I have evern spent money on is the tank.
Exhaust you ask? Even easier. Go to ebay and pick up a set of headers for a 911 that someone decided it was not worth the trade off for heat. $50 and $10 in exhsaust pipe will stretch those out.
Cheap, just think cheap. I have even seen two differnt 914-6's with early 911 oil tanks (not bad installs at all). Just use the imagination a little. It will save you thousands.
OOPS! Sorry, I think I misunderstood. The headers from a 911 you can, the heater boxes from a 911 you cannot.
Everyone got a little excited about welding aluminum, but several members have obviously developed decent skills welding steel for body repairs. Is there any reason this tank could not be made in steel? You still need to understand the internal requirements, but steel may be more realistic for the do-it-yourselfer.
I remember in the past on the bird-board a fellow hammered out a six-tank using sheet metal and I think 911 tank fittings. I don't know how it worked but he did do it.
Perry, when TIG'n the aluminum (or any type of alumimum welding) did you use different shades for your eye protection??? I've found that for different materials, special shades are needed so that you can see the "puddle" much easier.
Mike I also haver an auto dimming hood, I adjust the amount of darkening depending on what is being welded...
Tig on alumi have it at about 9.5-10
Mig on steel is at 11
for gas welding aluminum, I have a special color lens, it filters the light so that you can see much better....it's green I think, instead of the gray/smoke color
Mike,
thats to filter out the glow from the flux so the puddle is visible.
Tig welding has no flux involved, so no need for color filters.
Umm...back then when I learned to do a bit of aluminum welding at a workshop, I was told to use the cobolt (blue) lens for aluminum welding as it's easier to see the "puddle" when welding. I used one at the workshop and was impressed, especially using thier precise gas welding torch!
I 've not been able to find one for a long time and have used the auto-darken hood with the shade of 10 dark gray, it sure was hard to see the puddle, but do-able to get the job done. Currently, I use the Miller TIG instead of gas welding the aluminum as a hobby....damn best tool to have!
j
Some thoughts:
- I agree that you should never deal with Vellios. What a pain in the ass.
- However, what's wrong with the Vellios tanks? Are they really that much heavier, I never noticed... I've used mine for about 7 years and it's been leak free. What else is it supposed to do?
- Why doesn't someone make a repro STEEL tank? To be honest, I wouldn't really care if a larger factory-style steel tank was a couple pounds heavier than the factory tank. Wouldn't steel be a lot easier to work with (cheaper), and with the proper new coatings last forever as well...
-Steve
Yes, tig it or gas weld with it mild steel filler rod. It may not be as light as sheet Aluminum but the function would be the same. If wieght is a concern go on a diet.
It's great to see someone bring a low cost conversion part to the market. Cost of all the excessory parts (mount, oil lines, exhaust, tank, throttle linkage, etc.) is what makes the 914-6 conversion out of touch for most.
The key to success with any aftermarket part is to keep cost down. A tank that fit and functions like the factory tank should be priced like the Vellio or less. If I made the part I would attempt to price it around $ 225.00 to $ 350.00. It's a tank with a screen to knock air out of the return oil. I had a book make once to a site with a cut-a-way of the 914 oil tank. I can't find the link or I would post it.
What ever happend to the plans for that Carbon Fiber oiltank?
cheers,
Jeroen
The aluminum tank looks OK...from what I can see.
The inside is more important than the outside. Aluminum would seem the best choice for fabrication.
As long as the thing fits up properly & don't leak, who cares how it looks? At some point the stock tank is gonna be NLA......cept for someone looking to retire off the thing.
The stock tank is copper plated for corrosion resistance...in and out. This is no place for amateur hour experiments. Mine ALWAYS shows moisture when I look at the cap/dipstick. God knows what kind of caustics are formed in there.
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