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Posted by: Tom Aug 22 2011, 06:54 AM

EDIT: 3/06/13
I won't be providing these kits any longer. I apologize to the members who have been waiting. Please feel free to use any info in the thread to help you come up with a fuse solution that meets your individual needs. Parts list on last page.
Tom
NEW INFO FOR EARLY CARS. THEY CAME WITH ONLY THREE RED WIRES!! Two 4.0mm and a much larger wire running forward to the dash area. Please check before ordering.
Last round this summer. Maybe next winter I will do this again if there is a demand.
See pics of the new 4-way and 6-way kits, and the completed install of mine. Kits are designed to go on the outer edge of the battery box, however some have mounted elsewhere. If you have need for longer wires so you can mount yours differently, let me know and we can make that work for you.
Also, please see the two pages of info below. You should be able to print copies.
From the supplier: 4/6 individually fused circuits with connections that enter and exit from the bottom allow this fuse block to be mounted in narrow locations. Clear plastic dust cover is included. Max load capacity for all circuits combined is 50 amps, 65 amps for the 6-way. Connections are made using 1/4" female push-on connectors.

I will open round four as I already have 3 folks who want one. There will be two models, a 4-way and a 6-way, and three stages; 1-basic, 2-connections on and soldered, 3 - with new battery connector.
4-way
stage 1- basic kit $25.00
stage 2- connectors on and soldered and harness heat shrinked $30.00
stage 3- With new battery connector $32.00
6-way
stage 1- basic kit $30.00
stage 2- connectors on and soldered and harness heat shrinked $35.00
stage 3- With new battery connector add $37.00
I will leave this open until 5 June, them order parts. It looks from the last round that you can expect about a month to receive the kit. IE: if I order parts by 6 June, the kits will ship no later than 30 June.

.


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Posted by: tradisrad Aug 22 2011, 07:42 AM

I think putting the fuses in place for the always hot wires is a great idea. On the early cars there is a hot wire that jumps from the ignition switch to the turn indicator and it seems that this wire is prone to shorting out (from the 4 steering columns I have and all 4 are burnt), so the fuses may be a good idea to prevent a car from burning.
I would probably be in for a kit.

Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Aug 22 2011, 07:44 AM

Why? I have never heard of an instance where those wires have shorted out. Not once in the 38 years I've been working on 914s. Besides it being a non-issue, you'd need fuses capable of handling the entire max load of the subcircuits and their current users at max capacity. Big fuses.

The Cap'n

Posted by: Tom Aug 22 2011, 09:50 AM

Cap'n,
A member in Canada just had a fire last week. Fire originated at the 14 pin connector at the relay board. Probably damaged the wiring harness before he could get the batt disconnected. Wiring harness is pretty expensive and a fused red wire would have prevented that.
Fuses shouldn't have to be too big. Max capacity of stock alternator is 55 amps. I think each red wire fused at 25 amps would be sufficient. Do you think that would not be enough? Just trying to get the info needed to make a decision.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: 76-914 Aug 22 2011, 10:17 AM

Besides the "cheap insurance" issue, I think the greatest benefit will be separating the wires from the main + cable. When tracing a short, it is much easier if you can check each red wire for current draw, one at a time. I'd take one just to replace this. Yours is much neater.

Posted by: andys Aug 22 2011, 11:26 AM

I'm not going to contest the 914 electrical system, but most modern systems have a power distribution module somewhere near the battery that contains fuses, circuit breakers, and assorted relays. I think it's wise to have something similar, and fusing those hot's is a safeguard. For my V8 car, I did away with the red wires, and ran a main hot to a power distribution module (of my own design, but in retrospect I would have rather used an OEM type module) with circuit breakers and relays where needed.

Andys

Posted by: shoguneagle Aug 22 2011, 01:20 PM

I have just completed complete wiring of my Sixer including the engine to car items. To protect my electrical since I had the potential for shorts, I fused all the battery wires plus the battery wires I added with 20amp fuses (fuse holders can handle 30amps) for protection. The car is alive with complete electical functioning. Did not have even small sparks on the negative terminal when connecting the battery. Only problems I had was with the turn signals/emergency flasher lights, light connections, and a couple of grounds.

I decided to leave the fuses in on the hot battery wires and so far I have not had any problems. It does make trouble shooting for shorts, etc. easier since the circuit can be more readily traced.

Steve Hurt

Posted by: r_towle Aug 22 2011, 03:32 PM

seems like there are two people in this thread that had burned wiring without a good fuse solution in place.

One of the guys has 4 wiring setups that melted.

Seems like a very valid idea.

Rich

Posted by: Scarlet75 Aug 22 2011, 04:00 PM

I am interested.

Posted by: Razorbobsr Aug 22 2011, 04:31 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Aug 22 2011, 08:54 AM)

Posted by: wingnut86 Aug 22 2011, 07:37 PM

I'll be in as well...

Posted by: Tom Aug 23 2011, 11:26 AM

I'll order some parts and when they get in, I'll put mine together and add pics and some instructions as to what I did. In researching, I've found that 14 ga. wire is good for 40 amps, so really no need to go 12 ga. Of course you are welcome to modify yours as you think necessary. Wire is expensive!!
Later,
Tom

Posted by: JmuRiz Aug 23 2011, 11:41 AM

I'd be in...I've got too many red wires running to my battery...this would make it look not so cobbled together.

Posted by: swl Aug 23 2011, 05:39 PM

Good initiative Tom. The border is too much of a hassle for me to get involved but I'll happily steal your idea

Posted by: Scarlet75 Aug 23 2011, 06:26 PM

QUOTE(swl @ Aug 23 2011, 07:39 PM)

Good initiative Tom. The border is too much of a hassle for me to get involved but I'll happily steal your idea

Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Aug 23 2011, 06:43 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Aug 22 2011, 08:50 AM)

Posted by: swl Aug 23 2011, 06:44 PM

QUOTE(Scarlet75 @ Aug 23 2011, 04:26 PM)

QUOTE(swl @ Aug 23 2011, 07:39 PM)

Good initiative Tom. The border is too much of a hassle for me to get involved but I'll happily steal your idea

Steve I am an hour from you.

Posted by: swl Aug 23 2011, 07:04 PM

QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Aug 23 2011, 04:43 PM)

Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Aug 23 2011, 07:58 PM

I'm thinking about this a little more. Basically, the only things fused on the panel are the fuel pump circuit and the rear window defroster. If there's a short at the points, say the wire is hooked to the hot side of the coil by accident, it'll fry the wire right back to the ignition switch. Tach wire might do something similar. The backup lights aren't fused until the fusebox, but that would blow before the wires cooked. I don't see where a fuse in the power supply is gonna prevent any of that. I could be wrong here, but it still seems to me you're adding complexity for no really good reason. Good maintenance and care in hooking things up seems to me to be the way to go. If you allow a connector to become hot because the connection is raggedy, you're gonna start a fire.

The Cap'n

Posted by: swl Aug 23 2011, 08:20 PM

That fuse also protects the heater fan and the AAR.

All the fuse box that Tom is proposing will protect are the two power leads from the battery to the relay board (pins 12 and 14) and the run to the forward power distribution box. In normal operation these extra fuse should never blow. But of course that is also true for any fuse in any car.

I do agree that care and maintenance should eliminate the need but ...

These connections are getting really old and the insulators are getting old. The risks are rising with time.

The cars are also being maintained by non-professionals who do make mistakes. Sometimes we have to protect the cars against ourselves.

So for a couple of bucks we can protect our expensive wiring harnesses. Not necessary but good insurance. As someone noted earlier, modern cars are being designed with the fuse box right next to the battery. The designers have learned about best practices over the years.

If nothing else the process is bringing to light the dangers of unfused power and people are learning to be careful.

Posted by: Tom Aug 23 2011, 09:54 PM

Steve,
Don't think I could have said it any better!
For everyone's info, the 4 red wires being talked about are:
2 4.0 mm wires, one runs to the KEY switch at #30 and the other runs to the fuse block and ties fuses 10, 11, and 12 together on the unfused side to the battery.
The other 2 wires are 2.5 mm and both run to the relay panel in the engine comp. Positions 12 and 14 of the 14 pin connector.
Sent an e-mail to order enough parts for 5 kits today. We will see how long that takes. I want to get mine done with pics and test it before I send any out. Really don't see any problems tho'.
Tom

Posted by: SirAndy Aug 23 2011, 10:12 PM

QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Aug 23 2011, 05:43 PM)

Posted by: montoya 73 2.0 Aug 23 2011, 10:33 PM

Put me on the list for just one.

Posted by: Tom Sep 13 2011, 09:55 AM

I'll be sending out Pm's to those who expressed interest in this kit. Got some parts in and will need more, but need info from those interested first.
Tom

Posted by: type47fan Sep 13 2011, 08:36 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Sep 13 2011, 08:55 AM)

Posted by: moparrob Sep 13 2011, 10:35 PM

Count me in. PM sent.

Posted by: Tom Sep 17 2011, 12:41 PM

Finally got it finished and tested. All good. See first post for installation pics. You may not be able to see from the pics but I used two 20 amp fuses and two 25 amp fuses. Tried the starter, lights, turn signals which are the higher amperage loads, no problems.
If you are interested in this kit, be aware that it requires some rewiring and connection of lugs and proper connections are critical. I always use uninsulated lugs where possible and solder them at the lug end of the wire slightly just to be sure of a good connection. If one is careful, even insulated lugs can be soldered at the lug end without damaging the insulation. PM me if you are interested.

EDIT: the wires in the top picture are for illustration only, they are not the correct size.

Tom


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Posted by: Harpo Sep 17 2011, 03:38 PM

Good afternoon Tom,

I would also be interested in one of your kits.

Thanks

David

Posted by: michael7810 Sep 17 2011, 05:20 PM

I would like one kit also if it's not too late. Thanks

Posted by: JmuRiz Sep 22 2011, 02:35 PM

I'm interested too...may as well upgrade the system while the engine is out.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Sep 22 2011, 08:02 PM

Also interested in a kit.
I'll be going through my wiring this winter.

Zach

Posted by: Gint Sep 23 2011, 05:23 AM

I'm interested also. If for no other reason than I hate that clump of brittle old wires going to the battery terminal.

Posted by: Tom Sep 23 2011, 07:22 AM

All of the kits have been spoken for. I would have to order some more parts to get more kits together. I'll get back to all interested later.
If any of the club venders would like to add this to their product line, let me know and I will send you all of the info. Ordering in small numbers is costly and time consuming.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: wingnut86 Sep 23 2011, 09:01 AM

P.S.

Thanks Tom!

Posted by: jimkelly Sep 23 2011, 10:16 AM

see these

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=82534&hl=open++barrel

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=42674&st=20

are these decent quality connectors??
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/RFW-BM8/?rtype=10
http://www.summitracing.com/parts/RFW-FM100/?rtype=10

jim

Posted by: SirAndy Sep 23 2011, 11:33 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Aug 22 2011, 05:54 AM)

Posted by: Tom Sep 23 2011, 02:03 PM

I had no idea there would be such a demand. My first kits used the two white standoffs made out of solid PVC and machined on my lathe. The following kits will have these made from PVC pipe. If that is a problem for anyone, let me know.
The following have said they want a kit.
wingnut86
Type 47 Fan
moparrob
76-914
michael 7810
Panel Billy
rwilner
Harpo
Jmuriz
Vacca Rabite
Gint
Sir Andy
Scarlet75
bigkensteele
Rleog

I will be ordering enough parts and wire for these kits over the next few days. Please bear with me and I'll get them ready as soon as I can.
Tradisrad and Montoys 73 2.0 , yours are ready to ship when the funds are received.
Payment is check or money order. I'll PM all involved with the address some time next week.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: Scarlet75 Sep 23 2011, 04:12 PM

Pretty sure I said I was interested when this first posted never got that pm See post #9 also SWL expressed interest. So where do we fall in this?

Posted by: Rleog Sep 23 2011, 06:23 PM

If you haven't ordered the extra parts yet, please add me to the list. If I'm too late, tough luck for me.

Posted by: bigkensteele Sep 23 2011, 06:53 PM

Tom, I just saw this thread. I would also be interested for the same reason as Gint. I hate looking at the hillbilly wiring on my positive post. Please put me down for one if you haven't already ordered the parts.

Thanks,
Ken

Posted by: moparrob Sep 24 2011, 10:31 PM

Is your panel basically the same as these pre-wired ones?






http://bmcautos.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=42

Posted by: Ian Stott Sep 25 2011, 11:41 AM

QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Aug 23 2011, 09:43 PM)

QUOTE(Tom @ Aug 22 2011, 08:50 AM)

Cap'n,
A member in Canada just had a fire last week. Fire originated at the 14 pin connector at the relay board. Probably damaged the wiring harness before he could get the batt disconnected. Wiring harness is pretty expensive and a fused red wire would have prevented that.
Fuses shouldn't have to be too big. Max capacity of stock alternator is 55 amps. I think each red wire fused at 25 anps would be sufficient. Do you think that would not be enough? Just trying to get the info needed to make a decision.
Thanks,
Tom

It would be interesting to know how and why a fire originated in the 14 pin connector. and why the fuses for some of the circuits that go through there failed to protect the wiring.

The Cap'n

Posted by: Tom Sep 25 2011, 01:28 PM

Ian,
If your key was in the OFF position, the only power to the relay board is the two red wires from the battery, which are unfused.
Tom

Posted by: Ian Stott Sep 25 2011, 01:31 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Sep 25 2011, 04:28 PM)

Posted by: FourBlades Sep 26 2011, 08:04 AM

I am interested in getting a kit.

I also want to run my headlights and driving lights off relays.

I'd like to run a new power line from the battery to the front of the car to 3 relays
to power the lights (low, high, driving). It makes sense to me to fuse this line
right next to the battery.

Would that require 5 fuses in a block?

Thanks,

John

Posted by: stugray Sep 26 2011, 01:02 PM

I like the concept & that looks really clean, however why not use just one of these:

http://www.vteworld.com/content/electromech/fuse/html/anl/anlfuse.php

They even have them with integral voltmeters:



http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM5039089501P?sid=IDx20101019x00001a&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=SPM5039089501


oohhh:



http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=263-624

I would run one wire directly to the starter, then put a 50 Amp fuse for the rest of the car.

Stu

Posted by: Tom Sep 26 2011, 01:15 PM

OK, the parts are on order and the following folks have PM's
wingnut86
Type 47 Fan X
moparrob X
76-914 X
michael 7810 X
Panel Billy X
rwilner
Harpo X
Jmuriz
Vacca Rabite
Gint X
Sir Andy X
Scarlet75 X
bigkensteele X
Rleog X

Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: moparrob Sep 26 2011, 01:42 PM

Thanks Tom, PM received. I was hoping you would respond to message #41 above so I could get a better idea as to the design of your fuse block and how it may differ from that pictured. Thanks.

Posted by: Tom Sep 26 2011, 06:06 PM

Moparrob,
The fuse block looks the same, but the wires are smaller. I am supplying two 14 ga. and two 12 ga. wires. Did you not get the pics?
E-mail me at t.powell@wavecable.com and I can send some more pics of what the kit includes and how it looks installed. Installed pics are on the first post of the thread.
Tom

Posted by: moparrob Sep 26 2011, 09:14 PM

No problem. Got it. I'll send a check out as soon as I get some stamps (I am a Paypal addict) tomorrow.

Thanks.

Posted by: Tom Sep 27 2011, 11:09 AM

At this time all of the kits have been spoken for. After some questions, I realized I never put up a pic of what the kit contains. There have benn a few design changes; the plexiglass plate is dark grey and thicker, the female lugs are 4 14-16 lugs and 4 10-12 lugs, and the two stand-offs will be pvc pipe at about 1/2" diameter. Oh, and I'm adding a 15 amp fuse for a total of 7 fuses.
Kit doesn't show the heat shrink or two cable clamps, but they will be there.
Here are a couple of pics:
Tom


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Posted by: Tom Oct 2 2011, 02:31 PM

Update on the kits and those who expressed interest.
In post #47 there is a list of the folks that I sent a private message to on 26 Sept. The names with an X behind the name have answered the PM. The rest who haven't, are you still interested?
Parts should be here later this week October 3-7. I can start sending kits on Friday or Saturday after receipt of payment.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: moparrob Oct 2 2011, 05:07 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Oct 2 2011, 01:31 PM)

Posted by: Tom Oct 4 2011, 11:44 AM

Got the tracking number for the parts and they will be here Friday. I can ship kits as early as Saturday if payment has cleared.
The payment has been received from the following and you guys will get kits shipped Saturday.
Montoya 73 2.0
Michael 7810
Harpo - sent you a PM.
bigkensteele
Rleog
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: Gint Oct 4 2011, 05:44 PM

I'm a horrible procrastinator with a check. But I actually mailed mine this morning. I'm in no particular rush to get it though. Thanks.

Posted by: Tom Oct 4 2011, 07:26 PM

OK Gint, I'll keep on the look-out for it.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: wingnut86 Oct 5 2011, 01:25 PM

USPS "...Money Gram for Mongo..." is en route Tom. I'll send receipt numbers when I get home tonight...

Posted by: 76-914 Oct 15 2011, 10:56 PM

Wow. Opened my kit tonight. It's very professionally done. I think Tom might be related to Mikey914

Posted by: moparrob Oct 15 2011, 11:08 PM

Yep, I got mine too. Thanks again - it looks good!

Posted by: Tom Oct 16 2011, 07:23 AM

Thanks guys,
I have three to ship out Monday to Type47 Fan,wingnut86, and rwilner and then there a couple of guys I'm waiting on to see if they decided or not. If they don't, I already have several guys wanting to purchase the left over ones.
Also adding a pic with the cable clamps installed and the fuses down graded. 20 amp in the outside fuses and 15 amp in the two inside ones. If one blows, I'll up it to the next higher. In this case, smaller is better.
Thanks again,
Tom


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Posted by: 76-914 Feb 7 2012, 01:42 PM

Thx, TOM. The fuse block saved me again. I pm'd TOM & thanked him regarding the 1st incident but thought I would make the 2nd time public. I installed a Ford Style starter solenoid for preventative maintenance. Turns out it was a cheap CPOS. After < 2 weeks it bit the dust. I had just re-installed the engine and after perhaps 3 starts it reared its ugly head. It fused and the starter would not quit turning over. Before I could grab an SAE wrench to loosen and remove the neg post the 25a fuse blew. Whew! Wires were warm but still intact. I bypassed the solenoid until I can make it to the junk yard to buy a good one. Anyway, that's twice that your kit saved me. Thx, again, kent

Posted by: Tom Feb 7 2012, 02:02 PM

Kent,
That is good news to hear!! That the fuse block saved damage, not your solenoid going bad! Really makes me glad I went thru the making of these.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: clapeza Feb 7 2012, 02:49 PM

Any chance of another run of these coming together?

Posted by: Tom Feb 8 2012, 01:23 PM

If there is enough interest, I will consider it.
Tom

Posted by: Casper Feb 8 2012, 01:34 PM

To get the ball rolling, I'll take two.

Tom Cooper

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 8 2012, 11:23 AM)

Posted by: burton73 Feb 8 2012, 01:36 PM

QUOTE(Casper @ Feb 8 2012, 11:34 AM)

To get the ball rolling, I'll take two.

Tom Cooper

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 8 2012, 11:23 AM)

If there is enough interest, I will consider it.
Tom

Posted by: zymurgist Feb 8 2012, 01:42 PM

I will buy one.

Posted by: wingnut86 Feb 8 2012, 02:24 PM

Tom,

I hope this grabs alot of interest, especially since many had questioned whether this would do enough to warrant moving forward.

One extremely important milestone has been reached. The answer is: yes, it helps to mitigate electrical fires.

Dave

Posted by: euro911 Feb 8 2012, 03:43 PM

I'm in for one as well.

Posted by: clapeza Feb 8 2012, 04:04 PM

Of course, I'm in for one.

Chester

Posted by: 1988Hawk Feb 8 2012, 04:58 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 8 2012, 01:23 PM)

Posted by: somd914 Feb 8 2012, 05:05 PM

I'm in for one, perhaps another for a friend.

Posted by: Scott S Feb 8 2012, 05:09 PM

I will take one as well -

Posted by: Black22 Feb 8 2012, 05:18 PM

I'll take one.

Posted by: bandjoey Feb 8 2012, 05:19 PM

+1

Posted by: potomacmidget Feb 8 2012, 09:11 PM

I will buy one too.

Posted by: bcheney Feb 9 2012, 07:39 AM

+1 for me

Posted by: JRust Feb 9 2012, 09:23 AM

I'm in for 2

Posted by: rgolia Feb 9 2012, 10:09 AM

I will take one

Posted by: rwilner Feb 9 2012, 03:05 PM

Thought people might be interested in some installed pics...

Kit looks clean and can be installed in 1 to 2 hours if you're being careful. (I happened to do mine while the engine was out of my car which obviously makes it a snap.)

Note: tom includes a plastic mounting plate, I substituted a piece of stainless bar I had lying around.

Posted by: Tom Feb 9 2012, 07:11 PM

Rich,
Thanks for posting the pics. I have been waiting to see how others would like to make the mounting. I went with the plastic due to the insulating qualities, but don't see why a metal one wouldn't be just as good. Maybe the new kits will include your idea, if that is Ok with you. The plastic is difficult to work with and is more expensive too. I thought of a aluminum piece with a coating might be good. anyone have any better ideas?
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: jmill Feb 9 2012, 07:45 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 9 2012, 07:11 PM)

QUOTE(Tom @ Aug 23 2011, 11:26 AM)

Posted by: wingnut86 Feb 9 2012, 08:20 PM

Carbon Fiber

Posted by: jmill Feb 9 2012, 10:25 PM

QUOTE(wingnut86 @ Feb 9 2012, 08:20 PM)

Carbon Fiber

Posted by: rwilner Feb 10 2012, 07:47 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 9 2012, 08:11 PM)

Posted by: Tom Feb 12 2012, 03:53 PM

Well, it certainly looks if there are quite a few interested in this mod. I'll search around for some aluminum bar stock to make the mounting plate from and see what patrs I need to order. No one seems to be using the sticky pads, so I'll drop them from the kit, I didn't use them either. When I get everything together, I'll let everyone know the cost, but probably $25.00, shipping included.
I will leave this open for say 10 days before ordering parts, to give all who want one time to answer.
Tom

Posted by: Black22 Feb 12 2012, 05:15 PM

I posted earlier, but wanted to say I'm still in for one!

Thanks for doing this again Tom!!

Posted by: wingnut86 Feb 12 2012, 06:27 PM

Sometime the local Tractor Supply Company will carry odd bits of aluminum in stock.

John - That's humor, everyone nowadays wants CF parts for replacements for just about anything.

I read of some guys that were planning to produce whole Jagr E-class bodies from CF. Too rich for my blood

Posted by: Tom Feb 15 2012, 01:29 PM

I found some 1/8" X 1" bar stock that I think will do the job nicely. I will include a larger piece of heat shrink that can be placed just under the fuse block area if anyone has any concerns.
I don't supply the mounting screws or bolts to mount these kits. Some may want metric, others std., so I will leave that up to the individual.
I have, previously, stressed the importance of good solid connections in electrical systems. The system is only efficient in carrying current and voltage as the poorest connection allows. So I will put together the 4 wires and connectors between the battery positive and the fuse block if you so desire. There will be a slight charge. $2.50 per kit. See pic #2.
Basic kit will be $25.00 with shipping included, $27.50 if you want the connectors installed, and $30.00 if you need a new battery connector shown in the pic. The connector on the wires to the battery is the same ID size as OEM, so if your positive batt connector is in good shape, they will fit the stock bolt.
There are 5 days left before I order parts.
For you guys who don't desire a kit, be advised it would be a great idea to check your wire condition at the connector to the positive connector. I dissected my connections and was surprised at how many strands of the original wire were broken due to vibration. On one of the 2.5 mm wires which had 32 strands of 0.28mm copper wire, over half were broken. What this does is cause trouble in trouble shooting electrical problems. That wire would read continuity just fine, voltage just fine under no load conditions, but under load would drop excessive voltage. Any of you who have the hot - no starter issues would do well to closely inspect this area and maybe put new connectors on. Just for your info, the 4.0mm wires have 55 strands of 0.28mm copper wire. Spent some time on the computer trying to find out why different wire companies make wire different. Gets too involved for this thread. US standard seems to like 19 strands of different dia. copper wire to make up different current ratings for most of the more common sized wires.
Later,
Tom


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Posted by: wingnut86 Feb 15 2012, 02:33 PM

Thanks Tom!

Once I land again, I'll double my effort on a fuse box option/solution.

I've narrowed it down to the late model Beetles and BMWs - trying to keep it German and price point minded. Plus there are a helluva lot of these cars in junkyards, not the best option but better than 40 year old firestarters!

Recently, having been thrust into the middle of a rear-ender my wife and daughter experienced allowed me to view the whole Toyota Prius as a bunch of rear parts were replaced. The Prius has a very compact and rugged fuse panel under the front hood for the major electrical needs, minus the regen motors and fuel cell rack. It also provides standoffs on the panel so you can jump the car if the 12v battery is drained - yes, I had to test this one night.

The sealed dry cell battery is located in the back of the car. This arrangement is a bit harder to source in junkyards but I still want to pull one complete for a view.

Dave

Posted by: rgolia Feb 15 2012, 05:34 PM

I am still in.....I will take the $30 version

Posted by: bcheney Feb 16 2012, 05:17 PM

QUOTE(rgolia @ Feb 15 2012, 04:34 PM)

Posted by: Tom Feb 16 2012, 07:31 PM

I have received replies from all except Zymurgist and Somd914 about what style of kit they want and as soon as they let me know, no hurry as I know some are checking their friends, I will order the parts, hopefully not later than 22 Feb. Expect about two weeks to get all of the parts and begin putting kits together. As soon as I get the parts, I will send everyone an address to send either a money order or personal check for payment. If you have any requests for longer wires for a different location, and/or no aluminum mounting plate, let me know and we can make that work for you.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: Gint Feb 16 2012, 10:38 PM

Put me down for a $30 setup.

Posted by: euro911 Feb 17 2012, 12:05 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 16 2012, 05:31 PM)

Posted by: zymurgist Feb 17 2012, 04:56 PM

I'll take the $27.50 setup.

Posted by: Tom Feb 17 2012, 07:09 PM

Ken,
You will have it in a couple of weeks. Only one left to make up their mind and they are checking with some friends. Parts should be ordered on 22 Feb. After I order the parts, I'll let everyone know, by PM, where to send either a personal check or money order.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: mzalanka Feb 18 2012, 01:59 PM

If it's not too late, I'm in for the $30 kit.

Michael

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 17 2012, 05:09 PM)

Posted by: 7275914911 Feb 18 2012, 05:55 PM

I am also intersted if not to late...PM has been sent.

Thx in advance..

Posted by: somd914 Feb 19 2012, 09:09 PM

I'm in for the $30 kit. PM sent as follow up.

Posted by: wingnut86 Feb 20 2012, 06:44 AM

Is it Andy or Zach who has the Limo project?

Tom, you may want to offer a one-off price on that one, the copper alone could bankrupt you

Posted by: Tom Feb 20 2012, 08:38 AM

Yes, I expect that the wiring harness would be a major project!!
Tom

Posted by: mikea100 Feb 20 2012, 12:50 PM

Tom, put me down for a $30 setup.

Posted by: Steve Feb 22 2012, 09:34 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Feb 15 2012, 12:29 PM)

Posted by: porsche914gt Feb 22 2012, 09:53 AM

I'll buy a kit.
Thanks.

Posted by: Tom Feb 22 2012, 10:32 AM

OK, I'm going to order parts. If you posted here, I have you on my order list and I'll be getting payment info to you via a PM.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: porsche914gt Feb 28 2012, 09:15 AM

Tom,
I sent a pm, but its not showing up as a sent message in the control panel.
Did you get it?

Posted by: Tom Feb 28 2012, 10:26 AM

porsche914gt,
No I sure didn't. Must be some setting on your controls. I need to know if you want a 4 way or a 6 way. Same price. 4 way is the one in this thread, pic of 6 way attached. Also what type, basic, connectors on and soldered and if you need a new battery terminal.
Scott S, sent you a PM.
Thanks,
Tom


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Posted by: Steve Mar 2 2012, 10:32 AM

So when are these supposed to ship?

Posted by: Tom Mar 7 2012, 02:47 PM

Got an e-mail from the parts supplier and the parts have been shipped, 3/7. So I should have the parts no later than Saturday, 3/10. I will get them out as quick as I can.
I wanted to post my completed install pics to show the cable clamps and nylon ties. It is important to secure these areas to prevent vibration from damaging the soldered connections.
Thanks,
Tom


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Posted by: narino Mar 9 2012, 09:53 PM

Tom,

I missed this round. But am interested if there is a 3rd round.

Posted by: Tom Mar 13 2012, 01:05 PM

New info post #1
Tom

Posted by: Tom Mar 13 2012, 11:08 PM

Parts are all here and I have begun work on these. Over half are going with the 6 way fuse block. Remember when you are hookin up things where you want what amperage fuse to go and be sure to use the corresponding ga. wire for that slot. For mine I run 20 amp fuses for the two 4.0mm wires and 15 amp fuses for the 2.5mm wires. The kit comes with 30,25,and 20 amp fuses. The 6 way have two additional slots. Also remember that this fuse block is rated for 65 amps max. Unless you have upgraded your alternator, you could discharge your battery if you are using it to max. Attached is a pic of a sheet I put together to try to determine amperage during operation.
After you get all installed, it is easy to determine which fuse powers what by removing one fuse and then seeing what no longer has power. Make yourself up a small sheet to carry in the glovebox or your Haynes manual to help with troubleshooting.
I will start shipping on Wednesday 3/14. Probably only a few per day, so it will be a week or so to get them all done.
You should be able to save the pics to your files and print copies as needed.
Thanks,
Tom


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Posted by: Tom Mar 14 2012, 08:13 AM

Thought I would post a couple of pics of the connector attachment process I use to ensure a very good connection.
In the first pic #1 you see the wire stripped back 1/4" and the female spade connector sized to fit a 12 ga. wire. Takes a little manipulation of the connector to get it just slightly larger than the copper.
#2 you see the crimp completed.
#3 you see the soldering completed. The hemostats are used as a heat sink to keep the solder from "wicking" up the wire.
#4 is where the heat shrink goes on and in the second pic #4 you can see the second piece of heat shrink over the spade connector.
I had posted this process before but did not have the correct size wire and just wanted it shown the right way.
Tom


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Posted by: Tedman5 Mar 20 2012, 06:35 PM

I'll take a $30 setup if you have extras now or put me in for one if you do a third round. I need this. Had a meltdown years ago in a 72 model. Don't want that to happen again and this is a good safety measure. Thank you in advance.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 21 2012, 12:49 AM

I received my 'kit' a couple of days ago, Tom. Thank you

Posted by: SLKWrx Mar 22 2012, 01:44 PM

These are fantastic. If you're going for more, I'm in.

Posted by: wingnut86 Mar 22 2012, 03:50 PM

Tom,

I'm gonna need the upgrade kit for the 1st series I bought, as called out in SB#TomTToTheRescew-1

Posted by: 7275914911 Mar 25 2012, 05:51 AM

Got my kit installed...
I only used 1 set of holes in plate and also cut the pvc in half..





Thanks Tom...

Posted by: Tom Mar 25 2012, 10:21 AM

Ken,
Looks good. Two feet was just right. I put those numbers on with cellophane tape just so your would know which connector went to which fuse. It probably won't last when exposed to heat.
Tom

Posted by: Tom Mar 25 2012, 12:16 PM

Update for those waiting for your kit. I had to reorder some heat shrink as what I ordered would not perform as I expected. I ordered 1/2" for the piece that covers the spade connector and it just doesn't shirnk enough to make me happy. I ordered a new bunch of 3/8" and I expected it to be here by Saturday, 24th. Didn't come, maybe Monday. I have most of the rest of the kit done, just need to get that 3/8" shrunk on the 100 plus wires and finish them up and package to ship.
I had enough to get 5 kits shipped by last week, and I hope to have all of the kits shipped a few days after the material arrives.
Sorry for the delay,
Tom

Posted by: Tom Mar 29 2012, 07:32 PM

Parts came in 28 March and so far have shipped 10 kits. I PM'd the guys I shipped to. Hope to get the rest out in the next couple of days.
Thanks for being patient,
Tom

Posted by: Black22 Mar 29 2012, 10:47 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Mar 29 2012, 06:32 PM)

Posted by: Tom Mar 30 2012, 02:27 AM

QUOTE(Black22 @ Mar 29 2012, 09:47 PM)

QUOTE(Tom @ Mar 29 2012, 06:32 PM)

Parts came in 28 March and so far have shipped 10 kits. I PM'd the guys I shipped to. Hope to get the rest out in the next couple of days.
Thanks for being patient,
Tom

I didn't get my PM....

Posted by: Black22 Mar 30 2012, 08:12 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Mar 30 2012, 01:27 AM)

QUOTE(Black22 @ Mar 29 2012, 09:47 PM)

QUOTE(Tom @ Mar 29 2012, 06:32 PM)

Parts came in 28 March and so far have shipped 10 kits. I PM'd the guys I shipped to. Hope to get the rest out in the next couple of days.
Thanks for being patient,
Tom

I didn't get my PM....

You will tomorrow, I am working on your kit right now as soon as I get off this computer.
Tom

Posted by: bandjoey Apr 1 2012, 09:30 PM

Got mine yesterday and it's a work of art. Thank

Posted by: dadaDaveed Apr 1 2012, 11:05 PM

Put me down for a $30 6 way kit... round 3 or if there's extras before then

Posted by: Tom Apr 2 2012, 11:47 AM

New info in first post. Round 3 begins. Let me know what your needs are.
Tom

Posted by: dadaDaveed Apr 2 2012, 11:58 AM

Ok, make mine the whole shebang $37. 6-way, assembled harness, and new battery connector. Thanks.

Posted by: narino Apr 2 2012, 12:25 PM

(1) 6-way, stage 3 please.
Does this require drilling holes into the battery tray to secure it?

Thanks Tom!

(edited to add the battery connector)

Posted by: Tom Apr 2 2012, 12:30 PM

Jorge,
That is what this kit is set up to do, but you can use any method you feel OK with to secure the fuse block. Just keep in mind that there are soldered connections involved and this was designed to clamp the harness to minimize vibration to the soldered connections. I drilled two small holes in my battery tray to fit 10-24 screws.
Tom

Posted by: Tedman5 Apr 2 2012, 12:46 PM

Put me down for (1) 6 way stage 3 (new batt connector)
PM sent. Thanks!

Posted by: Scott S Apr 2 2012, 02:45 PM

Hi Tom,
Mine arrived Friday. You do beautiful work!
Thanks very much!!!
Scott S

Posted by: porsche914gt Apr 2 2012, 04:53 PM

My kit arrived today, and it looks really good.
Thanks, Tom

Posted by: Tom Apr 2 2012, 06:44 PM

Scott S, porsche914gt,
Thanks, You're welcome. I try hard to do a good job for you guys.
Tom

Posted by: Black22 Apr 2 2012, 07:39 PM

I just unpacked mine Tom...you do some pretty amazing work! Are you sure you're breaking even on these kits! Wow! I appreciate it and I can't wait to install it!

Posted by: Tom Apr 3 2012, 09:40 AM

Yep, I get about a beer or two from each one. It isn't a money maker, it is a safety thing for our members. Least I can do for the great membership here.
last of round 2 kits went out with the mail today.
Thanks to all who participated so far and round 3 is open for requests,
Tom

Posted by: Tom Apr 6 2012, 04:02 PM

6 days left before I close this round and order parts.
Tom

Posted by: computers4kids Apr 7 2012, 12:31 PM

QUOTE(Tom @ Apr 6 2012, 03:02 PM)

Posted by: Tom Apr 7 2012, 01:22 PM

I'll PM you with payment info after I order the parts.
Thanks,
Tom

Posted by: narino Apr 7 2012, 10:49 PM

Tom, please add the battery connector to my order. Just checked the one in my car and it should be replaced. Thank you!

Posted by: Tom Apr 10 2012, 08:18 PM

Thursday morning this round closes. So far only 7 have answered up.
Scotti, sent two PM's no answer.??
Tom

Posted by: Tom Apr 12 2012, 12:13 PM

Round closed, Ordering parts. I will PM all who requested one.
Tom

Posted by: Scott S Apr 13 2012, 10:03 AM

Hi Tom -
I came across something interesting last night. Went to install my kit and found that my car only has 3 wires coming out of the main harness. The harness looks to be completely original and untouched.

I have not yet pulled the wiring diagram to see if different year cars are set up differently. Mine is a 1972.

I was going to still use the kit, but the one wire coming out of my harness is a significantly larger gauge and would require a much larger connector, and then a much larger secondary wire to the battery after ther fuse. I dont think there is room in the fuse block for the heavier gauge.

Here is a pic...


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Posted by: rwilner Apr 13 2012, 10:26 AM

QUOTE(Scott S @ Apr 13 2012, 12:03 PM)

Posted by: Scott S Apr 13 2012, 11:44 AM

it does now...... but it wasn't born that way!!

Posted by: Tom Apr 13 2012, 12:29 PM

Scott,
That is sure different! I would be willing to bet someone has modified the wiring harness. Check the 14 pin connector at the relay board to see if two 2.5 mm wires go to pins # 12 and #14. If so, the check the fuse panel under dash for a 4.0 mm wire going to fuses 10,11,and 12. The other 4.0 mm wire goes to the key switch at terminal 30. If you have those 4 wires, then someone has spliced somewhere.
I have a possible solution however. On one of my orders, I made some mistakes and received 3 in-line water resistant type fuse holders that take ATC type fuses. I measured the wire and it is 4.9 mm, probably 8 ga. Attached is a pic. You would need to cut the wire wherever it would fit best for you and then splice and put on a connector.
Let me know and I'll send it to you with a couple of 30 Amp fuses.
Don't know why someone would use such large wire, that size could handle the entire car's load.
I can't tell from the pics, but are the two smaller wires 2.5 mm or 4.0 mm? That could give us a clue as to what wires may have been spliced.
Tom


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Posted by: Tom May 23 2012, 04:59 PM

ROUND #4 is open!!

Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby May 23 2012, 05:23 PM

Early cars (1970-72) only have three red wires to the battery+ terminal. The two smaller wires go to the relay board, the single large gauge wire goes to a terminal block under the dash where it splits into smaller red wires that continue on. Check the factory wiring schematics for details.


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Posted by: narino May 23 2012, 05:48 PM

My apologies for the late post, things have been nuts as we just closed on our 1st home! I wanted to make sure to come back and thank Tom for the kit! It arrived quickly and looks great!

Salud,

Posted by: Tom May 23 2012, 09:03 PM

Thanks Jeff. I had a 70 but that was 36 years ago and I don't remember how many wires I had. Looking at the Haynes manual for early years, it agrees with what you are saying.
Thanks again,
Tom

Posted by: Tom Jun 6 2012, 09:17 AM

Round 4 closed. Due to the lack of interest I will not be making any right now.
Tom

Posted by: 76-914 Jun 6 2012, 07:22 PM

I hope to get that last kit installed soon. My wife finally let me off the chain. Geezy Cripes it took me 30 days to floor our downstairs but Now I'm back in her good graces with an extended time "kitchen pass".

Posted by: Tedman5 Jun 7 2012, 01:26 PM

@ Scott S...I have the same wire configuration on my 70. They changed the wires post 72 (I think) from 3 to 4 wire harness. I just used the largest connector that was supplied and with a little finess and solder, got mine to connect in the connection point that the largest wire would be on as diagramed. Although, I did have to increase my fuse to a 30amp to hold the load after popping a few. I tested it and discovered there was a 27 amp draw vs. 15. Its tested and tried, working perfect. I purposely went out driving with EVERY electrical component I could turn on. Nothing overloading, nothing hot.

Posted by: Tom Jun 19 2012, 12:52 PM

I added a new thread on current measurements that would be good info for any of the fuse block kit buyers.
Link to thread http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=188773&hl=
More fuse block test info: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=192540
Tom

Posted by: jsconst Jul 28 2012, 08:30 AM

I'd like two of these when you make them again.

Jeff

Posted by: no1uno Jul 28 2012, 10:35 AM

I'd be in for two also.

Posted by: gothspeed Oct 30 2012, 08:39 PM

Bump, to say I would be in for 1 if/when they are available ...

Posted by: flash914 Oct 31 2012, 01:16 AM

Dorman 85668 sold through summit racing for $3.95 A little wire and you can do it yourself. I mounted mine to the fire wall on a piece of nylon scrap. Car is wraped up or I would include pictures. Gordon

Posted by: Tom Oct 31 2012, 05:47 AM

Del-city has those prices beat.
4 way fuse block - 73801 $2.71 ea.
6 way fuse block - 73803 $2.92 ea.
You can also order the heat shrink, terminal lugs, correct wire, nylon ties, sticky pads, battery connectors all from there. They have no idea about what size wire or fuses you will need. You have to figure that out for yourself. Then you can put it all together and test it to make sure you are doing things that will not come back to bite you later. I think I put in about 3 days of on/off research, including testing, to make sure I was providing a kit that would not only perform the job it is intended to do but would do so while remaining safe.
Looking at Summit's kits, I should be charging more. , nah, this was about providing a service to the club members at a reasonable price.
Tom

Posted by: wingnut86 Oct 31 2012, 05:58 AM

Tom- you should be charging more, as the kit is a life if not dream saver.

OT- my project has taken a backseat to unemployment again, so I can begrudgingly break open the shadow box on my wall of fame and remove my display case with Tom's kit if someone pays top dollar for it. Tom, what is it worth in Sterling?

Dave

Posted by: Tom Oct 31 2012, 06:15 AM

Dave,
If I remember right, you have a 6-way with the soldered connectors. Summit's 7 way kits are $65.00 +. And, Summit doesn't do the soldering or crimping for you. So I would offer it for somewhere between what you paid and that. I know you are just kidding, me too.
Hope that new job gets you back on your schedule to complete your car.
Tom

Posted by: gothspeed Oct 31 2012, 10:15 AM

Great thread and great info !!! I thank you guys for posting those Fuse Block part numbers from Summit and Del-City ......... I do try to buy from members who provide parts on here ...... as what they do saves time/effort and that is worth paying for ...

Posted by: Tom Mar 6 2013, 11:52 AM

I won't be providing these kits any longer. I apologize to the members who have been waiting. Please feel free to use any info in the thread to help you come up with a fuse solution that meets your individual needs.
I PM'd those who requested one in the last year or so and I hope I remembered everyone.
Tom

Posted by: Black22 Mar 6 2013, 12:53 PM

Thanks for making these Tom! Glad I bought mine and installed it when I did. It has saved me from being a dumbass... twice!

Posted by: underdog Mar 6 2013, 02:01 PM

you should know the one who's name implies the cover of a cow patty (liquid center) knows all.

Posted by: bandjoey Mar 6 2013, 02:15 PM

Tom: You Saved my car from a fire with your kit. I'd pay 3x the amount for what you did for me. Members out shopping for a do it yourself kit don't see the quality of your kit or understand the value of what you have done for us. Thanks for being a great 914 vendor! Bill

Posted by: euro911 Mar 6 2013, 02:16 PM

QUOTE(Black22 @ Mar 6 2013, 10:53 AM)

Thanks for making these Tom! Glad I bought mine and installed it when I did. It has saved me from being a dumbass... twice!

Posted by: Tedman5 Mar 7 2013, 12:03 AM

Thanks! Mine has worked flawlessly since day one. It's nice having extra terminals to go to with accessories and no worries of fire. Glad I have one!

Posted by: dfelz Mar 7 2013, 01:57 AM

QUOTE(Tom @ Mar 6 2013, 09:52 AM)

Posted by: Tom Mar 7 2013, 12:00 PM

Glad to hear of the positive results from you guys! To think I was instrumental in saving a car is just fantastic. With so many weekend mechanics among us, I figured our cars could use a little help.
Here is a list of the fuse blocks and associated parts. You may be able to pick some of the things up locally and in smaller numbers.
fuse block 4 way - 73801
fuse block 6 way - 73803
wire, red, 12 ga GXL cross-link 100 ft. 4114101. You can get this in 25FT rolls also, but different number- see delcity site.
ATC fuse 15 amp 78155
ATC fuse 20 amp 78205
ATC fuse 25 amp 78255
ATC fuse 30 amp 78305
Black single wall heat shrink
3/16" 98030505
1/4" 98032505
1/2" 98033505
Female push on terminal 12-10 ga. (100 min) 193005
Ring terminal 1/4" stud 12-10 ga. (100 min) 453145
Please check the part numbers to make sure they haven't changed. All of these parts came from Delcity.com.
I didn't list all of the nylon ties and sticky pads as it seems a lot of folks don't use them.
If you decide to make up one of these for yourself, please use proper crimpers and secure the ends of the cables near the battery and fuse block to control vibration.
Tom
PS: does anyone know what post #166 means?

Posted by: Tom Mar 8 2013, 12:06 PM

Bump so those interested may see.
Tom

Posted by: wingnut86 Mar 17 2013, 12:56 AM

Thanks Tom



P.S. found the permanent job. Moving to Ohio...