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Posted by: bostonmeche Jul 19 2004, 09:30 PM

So I gotta ask. I know that I can shoe horn a 3.2 by just flipping a few bits on the engine and a engine latch. What about a 3.6? Has anyone put one in without cutting up sheetmetal? (Except for the front mounted oil cooler of course) Better yet, anyone have pictures of their conversion?

Posted by: SirAndy Jul 19 2004, 09:39 PM

So I gotta ask. I know that I can shoe horn a 3.2 by just flipping a few bits on the engine and a engine latch. What about a 3.6? Has anyone put one in without cutting up sheetmetal? (Except for the front mounted oil cooler of course) Better yet, anyone have pictures of their conversion?

Posted by: bostonmeche Jul 19 2004, 09:51 PM

That's exactly what I was thinking

But what about the sheetmetal? Does the 3.6 fit as nicely as a 3.2?

I keep trying to do a search of the site but my connection keeps timing out.

Posted by: Randal Jul 19 2004, 09:53 PM

If you think about it a stock 3.6 is probably about 290 odd hp. With a chip and headers you're probably over 300 hp with a relative stock engine. You don't even need to adjust the lifters as they are hydraulic.

300hp with 2000 lbs would be a rocket.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jul 19 2004, 10:24 PM

95 and up 3.6's are hydraulic. All the 964 3.6's have to be adjusted.

The sheet metal changes are minor between the two.

I know we have several threads showing/detailing the changes needed to make it happen.


B

Posted by: nine14cats Jul 19 2004, 10:46 PM

Brad,

I'm really interested in the 3.2/3.6 motor idea. Problem is I'm worrying about blowing my tranny up...if I get into a 915 I'm into the whole thing for big $$$.

What's your opinion on the 3.2 stock injected or carbed motor versus my pumped 2.7? a wash in lap times? or is one better than the other for a 2 driver car?

Bill P.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jul 19 2004, 10:52 PM

The tranny will last as long as you are smooth and we install a heating element for the gear lube (or some such heating method). Lots of people running bigger engines out there with serious pumped 3.2's against 901's. I think the lap times would be a wash. I think the torque of the 3.2 would help a lot in AutoX'ing.

You could have taken TTD this past weekend. It made me puke when I when I walked the course...


B

Posted by: Steve Jul 19 2004, 11:26 PM

I paid $5500 for a 231hp stock euro 3.2.
It worked fine with the stock sheet metal.
All I needed was the KEP adapter.
A 3.6 with hydraulic lifters (95-98) can cost twice as much.
With the 3.6 you have to cut up the tin to make it fit.
I was told roughly 40 hours to do it.
With a 3.6 I was also told you need to flip the injection so you don't have to cut the trunk up for the MAF
Check out this link.
http://www.pelicanparts.com/914/914_photo_gallery/Karl_Johnson/johnson_914.htm
You also have 12 spark plugs that are a bitch to get to.
If you go with the 90-94 964 engine you still have to adjust the valves and they are a real bitch to get to.
If your going with a 3.6 I would definetly get the 95-98 993 Engine so you don't have to adjust the valves.
BTW the 95 engine does not have the Varioram.
Non Varioram 272 hp vs. Varioram 285 hp.
But you can buy a chip for the 95 engine and bump up the HP a little bit.
The chip for the varioram is big bucks.

-Steve

Posted by: nine14cats Jul 19 2004, 11:55 PM

Thanks for the info Steve!

I just have so many choices to choose from...it's really mind blowing...let alon engine blowing....

I've got to think this through again....

thanks,

Bill P.

Posted by: SirAndy Jul 20 2004, 12:30 AM

someone was selling carbon-fiber "sheet-metal" for 3.6 engine swaps ...

don't remember who. AIR maybe??? seemed like a good idea, no need to cut up expensive /6 sheet-metal.
Andy

Posted by: banderson Jul 20 2004, 06:31 AM

TK, dude, your nuts. But I'll be watching.

What about tires? I assume that you have, or can fit 205/60-15s on the stock fenders. Will that be enough for serious HP? Or will you have to feather it out of the turns and up to speed?

Posted by: boxstr Jul 20 2004, 08:00 AM

Or you could....
CCLINICOULDHAVEHADAV8


Attached image(s)

Posted by: Dave_Darling Jul 20 2004, 11:05 AM

Check Steve Iverson's pages on his 3.6 conversion:

http://www.pelicanparts.com/MotorCity/siverson/914/36/index.html

He believes that the 901-based gearbox is not up to the challenge of the 3.6 engine.

--DD

Posted by: East coaster Jul 20 2004, 11:20 AM

I went back and forth on the 901 vs 915 question and finally decided to play it safe (and costly) and go with the 915 for my 3.6 project. Time will tell if it's the right decision? One thing to keep in mind if you go with the 901 with the thought of doing a 915 later is that the flywheel will not work for both. This will add to the cost of changing it later.

As far as sheetmetal mods and fitment issues. The sheetmetal mods are not really very difficult. If you can wrench a 3.6 into your 914, then you should be able to modify some aftermarket sheetmetal kit to fit. I modified a kit to fit mine in about a day.

Here's the link to pics when I did mine: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=10558&hl=

As far as fitting in the engine bay, if you flip the center intake cross tubes (plenum) it will place the air filter/ flow sensor towards the front right behind the passnger seat and it will fit great without cutting any sheetmetal from the bulkheads. It's really not that hard.

Good luck with whatever you choose!

Oh yeah.....search on posts from "RON S". He's done a great job documenting his 3.6 conversion.

Posted by: bostonmeche Jul 20 2004, 04:02 PM

banderson,
This is all your fault. If you never brought your 914 to work I never would have been in this mess. I'm running 205/60-15 now. I will probably see how much money I have left over before putting flares on and doing the extra body work. By goal here is to keep the car as stock looking as possible. Though if it makes the car undriveable then I guess I will have to belly up for some GT sheet metal and get some fat tires.

Everyone who replied... Thanks I appreciate all the links. With a little luck I just might not be one of those projects that go up for sale from time to time.

Posted by: curtis Jul 20 2004, 06:07 PM

you can get custom made sheet metal ready to install from patric motorsports. Looks real nice and fits real nice as well. At the moment a friend and I are working on his six installing a 1995 3.6 liter 993 motor.If you like I can post pics of the install.Man it sure looks great stuffed in that hell hole!

Posted by: Caveman Jul 20 2004, 06:16 PM

I've been milling over the 3.2 swap for awhile. The cost effective way to go for either case is find a wrecked 911 (84-89's salvaged go for as little as $5k as I've seen). You get engine, tranny, suspension, wheels, and a few other useful knick knacks off the body. I guess it really wouldn't be as effective for a 3.6 swap, as the suspension and other things don't add to the value, not to mention they are WAY more money, even wrecked.

Posted by: bostonmeche Jul 21 2004, 02:04 PM

Curtis,
Pictures are always welcome. It keeps me inspired as to what could be done.

Posted by: curtis Jul 24 2004, 11:33 AM

bostonmeche, I will post some of my friends pics of the istall as soon as I can. He lives out in the desert about 100 miles east of me ,so I am going to try to get out there some time this week. We are supposed to finish the oil cooler install this coming wednesday and take her out for a fun run test!I am going to keep my fingers crossed!We have been dying to drive that thing!

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jul 24 2004, 11:40 AM

Curtis,

What tranny ??


B

Posted by: curtis Jul 24 2004, 11:47 AM

Whats up brad? He has a 1984 915 with a limited slip and a velios nose cone and a weilmiester short throw kit.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jul 24 2004, 12:23 PM

I should have recognized the death street behind the shot of your car.. Still reminds me of Frogger.


B

Posted by: curtis Jul 25 2004, 12:22 AM

Whats the matter brad? You mean to tell me that you didnt have fun helping me push the L.E. car across a busy street and up my steep drive way?!?