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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 5 2004, 11:42 AM

UPDATED 2/25/05

My $500.00 1975 2.0

I will be posting pics of my progress as I clean up this engine and put it in my '71 that currently has the stock 1.7L. Engine was running when it came out of the '75 about 3 years ago. About 10,000 miles on rebuild before it came out of the car, according to PO. No plans at this point to tear it completely down or do anything special (or costly). Just clean it up and replace/repair whatever is necessary.

I welcome in comments/suggestions/opions that anyone wants to throw my way.

Hopefully by next summer my I'll be driving my new toy.

Time to get greasy!

Sean


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Posted by: SpecialK Sep 5 2004, 12:25 PM

Looks very complete! And the MPS looks brand new (or at the very least "less dirty" ) I'd scrap and replace all hoses and vacuum lines, including the intake runner boots, just to be on the safe side.

Be careful, it's very easy to say "Well hell, I've got it this far apart...I might as well...", and the next thing you (your wallet) know(s) you're doing a complete rebuild.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 5 2004, 01:32 PM

I am going to have to try really hard to keep myself from doing that.

Posted by: Mike9142.0 Sep 5 2004, 03:04 PM

Pull all the tin and clean all the crap off the cyilnders and oil cooler.
Take the alternator off and have it tested before the engine is in the car.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 6 2004, 01:21 AM

Progress from tonight, this thing has been sitting a while that's for sure.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 6 2004, 01:25 AM

Not Sure what to think about this?


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 6 2004, 01:29 AM

One more-
Can anybody tell me why someone would do this?


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Posted by: synthesisdv Sep 6 2004, 04:21 AM

Is it an old style starter disable for an alarm system?

dr

Posted by: Mike9142.0 Sep 6 2004, 11:01 AM

Look's like the round fuel pump relay went out and was relaced with a more common relay.

Posted by: porschefool Sep 6 2004, 12:37 PM

Yep, That's it. Mine went dead on me, had to wire in a jumper to get the fuel pump running. I'm planning on doing a proper fix during the winter down time, but for now, flip the switch and drive!!
:finger2:

Good luck with the 2.0.
I'll be interested in watching your results...

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 7 2004, 08:19 AM

Didn't get much done this weekend but here it is...

Everything has come apart easy so far.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 7 2004, 08:23 AM

These will be nice once I get them cleaned up.
Anybody have a good way to get these clean.


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Posted by: seanery Sep 7 2004, 08:24 AM

castrol super cleaner...the purple stuff...can't remember the exact name

Posted by: brant Sep 7 2004, 09:12 AM

Rhodes,

if you can find a set of 73/74 heat exchangers and back date, you will pick up 5hp....

(I know its a "while your there, kinda thing"

brant

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 7 2004, 09:51 AM

What do you mean by "back date"

Will the 73/74 fit without any mods?

What causes it to have more hp?

Thanks I appreciate the input.

Posted by: SLITS Sep 7 2004, 09:54 AM

If you can't find the set he is talking about, use the entire system off your 1.7. It will flow better than the smog setup. The '75-"76 set up was a two cylinder into one pipe and is restrictive, especially when combined with the cat converter.

It appears that the air injection holes in the heads are already plugged off, so the PO must have removed the smog pump and associated tubing already.

You will like the 2.0

Posted by: SpecialK Sep 7 2004, 09:54 AM

Oven cleaner worked great on my heat exchangers (WEAR GLOVES!...duh). Let it set on there per instructions, and scrub them with a scotchbrite pad. A wire brush will work also, but you have to be very careful not to flip the oven cleaner on you while you're scrubbing.

And "while you've got it apart this far" take a large bastard file and "square" the tops of the exhaust inlets. It'll make for a better seal when re-installed.

Posted by: brant Sep 7 2004, 10:26 AM

Sean,

(sorry for not paying attention and using your name correctly before)

The 75/76 style is pretty restrictive..

I meant by back dating that yes, you can bolt up the complete early style system.... You can find SSI's or even stock 2.0 stuff will work well.

I think you will need the all the bits...
- a pair of Heat exchangers
- I think the early style muffler (or bursch or any
aftermarket for an early style 2.0)
- an early style 2.0 muffler bracket (or you can make your
own)
- the muffler gaskets for the early style system.

brant

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 7 2004, 10:44 AM

If I can use the system off of my 1.7L I will do that for now. Will it bolt on like it is?

I was definitely going to go with a different muffler set up but if I can use the 1.7 then I will do that.

Yes the injection holes were plugged, smog pump was taken off at some point.

Another question - the oil filter is touching were the heat exchanger bolts to the exhaust coming out of the passanger side head. Is this normal? Maybe the filter is larger than it should be. Doesn't look like anything is tweaked.

Posted by: seanery Sep 7 2004, 10:46 AM

yup, it'll bolt on directly.

Posted by: SLITS Sep 7 2004, 10:50 AM

All of it will bolt right up no problems, but you must use the exhaust hanger from the 1.7.

The bolts shouldn't touch and will cause a transfer of heat to the filter - get the correct filter for it.

Posted by: brant Sep 7 2004, 10:51 AM

It would be easy to upgrade later, after the motor was in the car and running...

The 1.7 exhause also gives up 5hp or so to the early 2.0 stuff.....

It sounds like the 1.7 is better than the late 2.0 (I honestly don't know).... but down the road you may want to upgrade the the early 2.0 and get those 5free hp)

brant

Posted by: RustyWa Sep 7 2004, 01:38 PM

Don't forget the two tin pieces that attach to the motor case and the heat exchangers. The two pieces that you can see when you look under your car and up at your engine.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 7 2004, 01:57 PM

Funny you should mention the tin, while dismantling there was only one peice of tin underneath on the drivers side going from the engine to the heat exchanges.
Should there be one on the passenger side as well?

Posted by: RustyWa Sep 7 2004, 02:04 PM

Yes there should be one on each side. The later style ones ('75-'76) do not work if you are planning on back-dating your exhaust system. Also, the tail-shifter tin for the drivers side is different than the side-shifters tin.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 8 2004, 12:41 AM

Starting to look a little better.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 8 2004, 12:50 AM

What can I do about those cylinders?

Little bit of surface rust.

I don't think that I am going to break the engine down is there anything that I can spray on them like it sits now?

Thanks for checking out my post!
Time for one of these

Posted by: SpecialK Sep 8 2004, 10:16 AM

I'll probably get "smacked down" by the other members for this , but as bad as the rust looks aesthetically, it probably helps the cooling some. Seems to me that the rust would increase the surface area, and generate a small amout of turbulance in the airflow across the cylinders. I'd hit them a little with a wire brush to knock the big stuff off, and leave it at that. You could try Naval Jelly on them, but I'm not sure what adverse effects, if any, it'll have on the aluminum heads and block. Then there's Oxisolv and the like which is probably a little less harsh:

http://www.eastwoodco.com/jump.jsp?itemType=CATEGORY&itemID=380

"While you've got it this far apart", you might as well pull the oil cooler, give it a thorough cleaning, and replace the seals. Much easier to replace them now, than to find out after you've got the engine installed that they've developed a leak.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 8 2004, 10:24 AM

Thanks for the advice Kevin. I was just thinking about that last night. Debating whether I was going to pull the oil cooler or not. You just pushed me in the rigth direction.

Posted by: SpecialK Sep 8 2004, 11:20 AM

Sean, I hate to drag you down into my little "while you've got it this far apart" hell , but here's another "simple" suggestion, replace the push rod tube seals. Extremely easy to do while the engine is sitting all exposed like yours is right now. Pop the valve covers, remove the two rocker shaft retainer nuts (do it one side at a time so there's no issues on how everything goes in there), pull out the push rods noting from which valve they came from, give the tubes a twist and pull them out through the head. The Vitron push rod tube seals are said to be the best, and are cheap insurance against getting oil all over your nice clean HE's again. There was an excellent thread here recently about what, if any, sealants/adhesives to use, and where to use them. If I can find it, I'll repost a copy of it here, or you could email Jake Raby at 'aircooled.net'. Back to the valves. After you've reinstalled your tubes with the new seals, reinsert the push rods back into their original position/location and reinstall the rocker assy. loosely. Give each rod a wiggle to ensure that they've seated back into the center of the lifter/tappet, retorque the retainer nuts to spec. (10 ft. lbs according to Haynes) and re-adjust the valve clearances. Repeat for the other side, and install fresh valve cover gaskets. It sounds like a lot, but it shouldn't take more than 30-45 mins.

If that sounds like too much , at the VERY least adjust your valves now, you'll be glad you did!

Posted by: Root_Werks Sep 8 2004, 12:01 PM

Did someone already mention the main seal? Might as well replace that to right? It never ends! Come on man, just tear the whole thing appart! If you are anything like most of us, you will have your engine done by the time your children have children.

Posted by: SpecialK Sep 8 2004, 12:30 PM

Crap! How could I forget the main seal! Which means you'll have to remove the flywheel and clutch assy. to replace it. Might as well resurface the flywheel and check/replace any/all worn clutch components, replace the input shaft seal on the tranny. And "while you've got it this far apart"...

Posted by: seanery Sep 8 2004, 12:36 PM

you know, you coulf get some nikkies and 103s!

Posted by: Root_Werks Sep 8 2004, 02:04 PM

Muuuuuhahhaaa! Just pick up the wrench Sean, a few small turns and you will be in disassembly Hell!

Oh yeah, while your in there, don't forget to strengthen the case, buy a new crank/rods etc. Hey, might as well since you've gone this far right?

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 8 2004, 02:50 PM

You guys ar killin' me LOL. Seriously thank you far all the input/advice. I think that I will definitely do the push-rod tube seals. I have been going back and forth on the clutch assy/flywheel/main bearing, Since I have it out and sitting there on the garage floor I might as well. I mean how stupid would I feel if I got it in the car and the clutch went out, or the main seal started to leak.

Of course there is plenty that I could do... time is not an issue but $ is. Anybody in Oregon need a home loan? One good loan fee and I could go crazy on this thing.

Keep the suggestions coming.

Posted by: SpecialK Sep 8 2004, 03:57 PM

The initial stages of "Dirk Wright's Disease"

Welcome to the club Sean -

Seriously, anything you can fix/replace, within budget of course, at this stage of disassembly will save you a lot of time and aggrevation down the road.


Here's a link to the post I mentioned earlier. 'Silver2.0' (4th reply down) gives his "detail" recipe for a leak free engine. He recommends "Nada" on the tube seals.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?act=ST&f=2&t=15774&hl=sealant

but, while you've got the engine tin and manifolds off, now is a good time to prime and paint them


P.S. - Your console is finally boxed and ready to send, but like a dumb-ass, I didn't take any pics of where all of the brackets reattach. I'll email you some high quality pics of the correct bracket locations with my "Blurrmaster 5000 Digital Camera" as I install my recovered one.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 9 2004, 12:43 AM

Not much work tonight, shopping night at the farmers market, gotta get those fresh fruits and veggies, as well as some fresh fish.

I'm getting OT here

I did clean up the tin, mostly in pretty good shape but I think that I will paint it "while it's off" I'll spare you the pics this time.

Still trying to decide if I am going to pull the clutch/flywheel. I am going to talk to the previous owner and try to find out exactly what was done "10,000 miles ago"

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 15 2004, 12:11 AM

Haven't been able to work on the 914 for a while but in honor of today I tried to get something done. Just a little painting and clean-up of the fan housing. It's not powder coating but it does look better than it was. As soon as I get some parts in the mail I can do a little work to the engine.

Until then cheers!


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Posted by: synthesisdv Sep 15 2004, 06:25 AM

sean, looks sweet,

how did you polish the blower housing?

dr

Posted by: maf914 Sep 15 2004, 06:39 AM

Sean,

The polished fan shroud looks nice, but you probably need to clear coat it to keep the finish. On the Shop Talk Type 4 Forum one of the guys (Griznant with the pretty T4 912) polished his and said it oxidized quickly and that it neeed clear coat or paint.

Good luck with your new engine!

Posted by: rhodyguy Sep 15 2004, 08:09 AM

i'll spend a bit more of your money. think about new front engine mounts. there is no better time to do the renew. a new cork gasket for the oil fill tower. gaskets for the intakes to the heads. check the cable for the air cooling control. it never ends.

kevin

Posted by: Root_Werks Sep 15 2004, 08:49 AM

Sean, those front engine mounts, I have had a new set sitting around forever, also you will need intake gaskets for the manifold. I have those sitting around as well. PM me and you can have them for a "song". FYI - you should be getting your other stuff I would think today?

Looking great! I love the fan shroud!

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 15 2004, 09:37 AM

Thanks for all the great replies.

Oh yes the fan shroud, I wasn't really planning to do that but I just wanted to see what a a wire wheel would do. Once I got started I couldn't stop. It turned out really nice. I am trying to figure out what kind of clear coat to put on because yes I'm sure it will oxidize quickly. Too bad you won't be able to see much of it, It would have looked nice in the '74 VW Bus I once had, oh well I will know how cool it looks.

More progress this week, I hope.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Sep 17 2004, 12:15 AM

Nothing to show for engine work but I was poking around the car a bit and found a little rust. It's mostly the jack point but definitely needs to be dealt with.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 5 2004, 06:18 PM

Yes it has been a while since I have done anything to this engine, having to much fun getting the other engine running and actually driving the car a bit. Now that I have a taste I want to pull that engine and stick this one in.

So I pulled the heads to see how things looked under there. Not sure how much work I will do, money is a big factor.

Here are some pics.


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Posted by: redshift Nov 5 2004, 06:20 PM

That's why your car is idling funny cold! The damned heads are off!




Miles

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 5 2004, 06:28 PM

Funny Miles, that would have an effect wouldn't it.

A couple more pics to come but i keep getting a fatal error, damn dial-up

Posted by: SLITS Nov 5 2004, 06:28 PM

Take Miles advice and send it to his engine builder

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 6 2004, 07:42 AM

matching cylinders


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Posted by: Bleyseng Nov 6 2004, 10:05 AM

Running a tad rich. What is the numbers on the MPS and the ECU? Test the MPS with a vacuum tester to see if it holds a 15hg for 5 minutes.


Geoff

Posted by: brp914 Nov 6 2004, 10:36 PM

If you pull the flywheel put in a new pilot bushing. I had one of those go once and it trashed the input shaft to the gearbox. Sort of like that Murphys Law thing where the $300 picture tube blows out in order to save a 10 cent fuse.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 7 2004, 02:39 PM

I'm gonna pull the flywheel, what else should I do while it's off?

Can't wait to see how this thing compares to the tired 1.7 that I finally have working ok.

Posted by: Bleyseng Nov 7 2004, 07:06 PM

Change the rear main seal, resurface the flywheel, new pressure plate and clutch, throw out bearing, throw out arm cup bushing, add the spacer to the arm pivot etc....DWD is setting in..

Posted by: 914forme Nov 7 2004, 07:52 PM

Zoopseal is the only way to go here clear coat would be a choice on the cheap, but will wear out.

http://www.zoops.com/zoopseal.asp

Posted by: 3d914 Nov 7 2004, 09:00 PM

Welcome!

If you're going to keep the stock Fuel Injection, got through and clean some of the mechanical parts & electrical contacts as follows:

• Soak Aux Air Rgeulator in penetrating oil for a couple of days. Blow it dry, then test it with 12V - to make sure it closes in 10-15 miuntes.
• Makre the the Fuel Pressure regulator is up to snuff. Fluctuating Fuel Pressure will play havoc with the FI.
• Go through the wiring harness from the ECU and check every line for continuity from the main connector to each connectors respective end.
• Clean the contacts of connectors with contact cleaner from Radio Shack or equivelant.
• Clean all contacts on the Relay Board (the one that goes behind the drivers seat in the engine bay).
• Verify that you have the correct & working relays & fuses on the board. The picture showed two blue fuses. one shold be blue & one red (I forget the amps - check the book).
• Clean all three ground conections - there are three. 1) Located form tranny to bolt under rear trunk. 2) Behind air box (plenum) mounted at one of the rear case bolts. 3) Right underneath the Relay board - down in the corner of the engine bay.
• Find a cover for the relay board. Even on it doesn't keep the board water tight - but it helps a lot.

I'm sure there's more, but this is what I can come up with off the top of my head.

Did anyone say you're REALLY going to love the 2.0 L compared to the 1.7.

Enjoy!

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 7 2004, 09:27 PM

Thanks for the input guys I will add what already wasn't on the list to the list.
Had to share a photo, probably the last day on the road until I get the 2.0 and sideshift tranny in. Just to many unknowns with the 1.7 need to focus my attention on the other, I just had to drive it a little.

Not bad for $700...


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 17 2004, 09:52 PM

Here is one piston and cylinder set, I have a line an some 94mm bus P&Cs that I have been told I can use the cylinders. They are a good deal and I am checking into them some more. These are prolly fine but new is nice too.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 17 2004, 09:54 PM

Here is one piston and cylinder set, I have a line an some 94mm bus P&Cs that I have been told I can use the cylinders. They are a good deal and I am checking into them some more. These are prolly fine but new is nice too.


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Posted by: Root_Werks Nov 18 2004, 10:45 AM

So when are you gonna split the case?

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 26 2004, 02:40 PM

I think this is as far as I am going to go, except for the flywheel coming off to replace the seal.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Nov 26 2004, 02:49 PM

Wife and son are out shopping, , little girl is napping, dad gets a little garage time.

Cleaned up the pistons, deglazed the cylinders and cleaned up the fins, one broken one.

Still debating on sending the heads for a going over, after reading other thread today leaning towards having them worked on. Pretty sure my wallet wont like that one.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 2 2004, 10:10 PM

Took the heads into a local VW shop, Ole Volks Home, and had the guy clean them up and check them out. Said they looked like they had been worked on recently, with new valve put in not many miles ago. Which jives with what the guy told me that I bought the engine from. Spark plug holes look good, no cracks that I can see.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 2 2004, 10:20 PM

and the other one


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Posted by: Eric Taylor Dec 3 2004, 01:15 AM

Hey Sean - Do you live in Sunriver? I see the company in your aviator is in the village. My girlfriend has a house over their, next time I'm over i'll have to look you up.
Eric

P.S.
Sweet project. Those head's look great. What's the history on that Engine?

Posted by: type47 Dec 3 2004, 09:09 AM

you know, while you're in there......

JB weld the oil galley plugs.....

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 3 2004, 01:35 PM

Hey Eric, yes my office is in the Sunriver Village Mall. I live about 7 miles outside of Sunriver, couldn't live with the Sunrvier CC&Rs - very restrictive. Drop me a pm or email if you are heading this way you can check out my project and we can shoot the sh!t.

History on the engine is that there is a guy that lives not far from me that has 3 parts 914s, two ok running 914's and is in the middle of a V8 conversion. he know about this place but isn't a poster.This engine is out of the car that he is converting. It's a 75 and all the smog stuff was removed long ago. I actually know the person that owned the car previously and work was done right before it was sold. I got a good deal on it.

BTW both my brother and sister graduated from the U of O, they loved it there.

type47

Think I should?

Posted by: Jeff Bonanno Dec 3 2004, 04:02 PM

http://www.shoptalkforums.com/viewtopic.php?t=4803&highlight=

read this whole thread about oil gallies (there have been many here and at shoptalkforums)

edit - oops, fixed link

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 3 2004, 05:00 PM

Thanks Jeff for the link.

After reading that and a few other threads on here the galley plugs scare me but since the case is together I can't drill and tap. What other options do I have?

Posted by: Eric Taylor Dec 3 2004, 05:07 PM

Sean- Sounds good. Yeah I was sondering about the regulations in sunriver. I couldn't imagine a 914 their, people would bitch . Anyway yeah, the U of O Is pretty cool I really like it so far, but i'll pm you next time we go.
Eric

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 26 2004, 10:32 PM

Yes its been a while since I have posted anything on this thread but progress has been slow, and its cold in my non insulated garage. I got some time the last few days and the assembly has begun. Heads are back on, flywheel, and valves adjusted.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Dec 26 2004, 10:35 PM

I'm not sure what to think about these valve adjust screws on cylinder #2. It seems like they are backed way out to get them into adjustment.


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Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Feb 12 2005, 02:56 PM

Yes its been a while but it is time for an update so here it is.

Start off with the engine as I got it.



Now the cleaned up version, ready to go back in the car.




Engine is now in the car

Hopefully fire it up in the next couple of days.

Posted by: Headrage Feb 12 2005, 03:02 PM

Great progress. I gotta see how it runs. I see you routed the oil breather to the plenumn. Let me know if it sucks oil.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Feb 12 2005, 03:11 PM

QUOTE (Headrage @ Feb 12 2005, 01:02 PM)

Great progress. I gotta see how it runs. I see you routed the oil breather to the plenumn. Let me know if it sucks oil.

Yeah we'll see, from the diagram I had that was the routing.

I used the filler off my 1.7 cause the fitting on the breather from the 2.0 was too big for the hose that's why it wraps around kinda funny

Posted by: Bleyseng Feb 12 2005, 03:12 PM

I was looking at that too, probably should get the 73-74 2.0 or 1.7 breather tower with a PCV valve on it to keep the oil from being sucked into the plenum.

Geoff

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Feb 14 2005, 10:18 AM

Oh the frustration. Tried to do a test fire last night, tried to fire on one cylinder. I knew I had spark. Pull the injectors and 1 of the 4 were working. They were supposed to be in good working order.

So I soaked them overnight, we'll see what happens.

Posted by: Rhodes71/914 Feb 25 2005, 09:11 PM

After getting the injectors all cleaned and tested I got the engine to fire up, but I had a possible head leak. I hadn't lapped the cylinders to the head.

So I yanked the engine back out and stripped it all down and did what I should have in the first place.

That was a weak and a half ago and today was the big day. Did the static timing thing and that is the way to go, never had a 5deg mark on the fan before but I put one on. She fired right up and smooth too. Ran it at 2100 for 15 min, adjusted the idle, checked the timing and went for a drive around the block.

WOW how different it is than the tired 1.7 that wasn't even running when I got the car.

Now on the the thousand other things to work on, hopefully not on jackstands for awhile.

Posted by: redshift Feb 25 2005, 09:18 PM

Good deal! It looks 100 times better.. it's nice when it's nice.

I can't believe what Ron said... God will have his way..



M