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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:20 PM

A few years ago I got a new welder, I welded everthing in site... Needless to say I never understood shrinkage.

I installed an Engman kit and not only did I rosette weld the kit in, I fully stiched the whole thing. The end result, a stiff chassis - but a bent tub.

My door gaps are totally fuquered. My passenger rear fender was replaced and they must have welded the front, then the back and I have a weird bubble in my fender well. So not everthing is the same.. My passenger side gap has been messed up since I got the car, huge gap at the back of the door.

Here's my measurements, not to be reconciled with the factor charts too much, I am sure I am measuring from different dimensions than that. Anyways my measurements are from the same spots side to side

Targa opening D 62.7, P 63.5 CM
Latch to hinge D 110.5, P 110.5 CM
Diag mid latch plate to top of targa D 109.4, P 108.4
Front bulkead to targa, D 42.6, P 141.5


My guess is:
the passenger cowl fell in, so did the drivers side
The drivers targa fell in, passenger stayed staticd (lots of welding on the e-brake area)

Pics to follow....

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:21 PM

Here is a post from a while back with a similar situation.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=103941&st=60

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:50 PM

asdf


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:51 PM

asdf


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:56 PM

driver side rear


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 17 2012, 10:57 PM

So the front cowl has definately fell in. The rear targa bar on the drivers side, I think fell in too. I remember having to reaseal the rear window after my welding extravaganza

Seals and stricker plates are out of the doors. You would think there are more issues on the driver side with the tight gap, measurements prove it's the passenger side with the biggest problem

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 12:01 PM

Hey Travis, Just wanted to let you know I saw this post. I will comment on it later. I have to head out for awhile.

Posted by: jmill Mar 18 2012, 06:31 PM

Racine, WI is a little closer than AZ but this is how he hooked me up.




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Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 18 2012, 07:35 PM

Dont show pics of Rick. He aint that pretty

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 09:11 PM

Hey! I resemble that remark!

Anywho, The photos show the issue pretty well. If you were closer I would drive over and tweek it for you. But for now all I can suggest is to do your best and try to un-do the issue.

Normally You could tweek the chassis with a port-o-power or my turnbuckle tool like John's car. But after the chassis stiffeners are welded when you try to push the chassis it bends in places it most likely shouldn't. This only makes matters worse.

So what I would suggest is to figure out where you went wrong and back up to that point. This may require cutting through the stiffener to weaken the car enough to bend it back in place.

This tool works very well. If you want I'll put it in a cardboard tube and ship to you. You pay shipping both ways. It's heavy and shipping won't be cheap.




My second suggestion would be to see if there is a local body shop that has one and would either loan or rent it to you. You can move a door opening with very little effort.

Posted by: MoveQik Mar 18 2012, 09:13 PM

Travis, I'll be over in 5. We'll have it straight by morning.

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 18 2012, 09:20 PM

giddyup! lol

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 18 2012, 09:23 PM

My plan is to cut through the stiffening kit at the cowl on both sides. push out the passenger side first, then driver side. next make a cut in the stiffening kit at the rear of the drivers door and push the drivers side targa bar back.

Sound like the right approach?

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 09:27 PM

That sounds reasonable. But you should be sure to put in a support through the door opening before you weld again.

Edit: also pull the catches off the "B" pillar so you car adjust the doors without any interference from the latch. Once your done welding and the doors swing free and line up you can replace the catch.

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 18 2012, 09:41 PM

So I will make my cuts here in the front


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Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 09:50 PM

Show me the stiffeners. I would likely cut the stiffeners not the stock inner longs.

Posted by: Eric_Shea Mar 18 2012, 09:53 PM

That is the stiffener...

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 18 2012, 09:58 PM

LOL, you're looking right at them. i did my best to make it look like i never installed one - and yes, i would only cut through the stiffener and not through the longs.


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Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 10:02 PM

Oh, ya ok... Yes just through the stiffener. Be sure to remove the catches. Take your time. Measure twice then measure again. Make yourself a diagram to keep track of your progress. Brace the openings after you get them set before welding.

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 18 2012, 10:59 PM

Rear catches are out, front quarter windows & caps are out too. door panels tomorrow and let the cutting begin.

one last question, i will put the porta power at the base of the long and the rear firewall, the front, I presume that i will push on the panel flange at the upper hinge height (or should it be higher?)

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 18 2012, 11:16 PM

Stay about the upper hinge height. Use blocks of wood or thick rubber pads and watch to see that your not crushing the pressure points where the port-o-power cintacts the body. The windsheild frame should be in the right place. Don't tweek that unless your vent window is binding. It shouldn't be..

Posted by: FourBlades Mar 19 2012, 08:05 AM

I'd like to see a lot of pictures of how this works.

I did the same thing to my passenger side when I welded in my Engman.

The door closes fine but the gap is really small.



John

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 08:57 AM

I will be documenting this all the way through, good, bad or indifferent. i know there are a lot of people on here that have run into an issue with a bent tub

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 07:38 PM

I did my cuts like I showed you before, only cutting through the stiffening kit. I pushed out the passenger cowl - going very slowly, rechecking the door fit and top. the passenger side might need a little more, but I decided to do the drivers side a push and looks like I am going in the right direction.

heading back out to take some measurements and snap y'all a couple of pics.

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 09:11 PM

the car on jackstands, notice that i have the jackstands behind the cowl, this will give me a little more leverage


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 09:12 PM

here's how i was positioning the porta power


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 09:14 PM

here's the gaps after the push, looking a lot better in the front. the rear has an even gap, but it's big. the passenger side quarter panel was replaced at some point and it was put in a little screwy - more on that later.


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 19 2012, 09:15 PM

tomorrow i will push back the driver's side of the targa bar.

Posted by: 76-914 Mar 19 2012, 09:54 PM

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 19 2012, 10:26 PM

Good idea with the stands. Be sure to check your targa bar to windsheild measurements. It would be easy to get ahead of yourself and end up wide at the top now. Good job so far!

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 21 2012, 09:31 PM

a couple days ago i pushed out the drivers front cowl a bit, mostly there..

today I cut the drivers side door opening at the rear of the door. A litle pushing to from the front wheelwell (right behind where the heater tubes are) up to the seat belt recoil mechanism - removing the seat belt mech first of course). anyways - this side is done!!! just need to weld it back up.


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Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 21 2012, 09:32 PM

and a before pic - just for comparison. the drivers side is no longer a door slammer!


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Posted by: MoveQik Mar 22 2012, 08:01 AM

Looks good Travis. We leave at 1:30 tomorrow so hurry up!

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 22 2012, 08:42 AM

I am trying, but I am not holding my breath

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 22 2012, 09:05 AM

Looking good Travis!

Posted by: sofi2t81 Mar 23 2012, 11:33 AM

Good to follow that thread.
I have the problem that the PO messed up my passenger door gap when restoring the hell hole. He welded in the inner wheel house without supporting the longs, so my door gap is 1mm at the top.
My plan is to but the car on jack stands. Push the door gap open like you did and then weld in the Engman kit with little heat as possible.
Do you think that would work, or do I have to cut the longs? (I don’t like that idea )

Peter

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 23 2012, 12:09 PM

Dont cut your longs!!!! I just cut through the stiffening kit only which was already installed

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 23 2012, 12:10 PM

If there was no chassis stiffening done yet you should be able to move the gap. Once there, be sure to brace it before welding. Don't forget to check the targa top opening as you go.

Posted by: Travis Neff Mar 23 2012, 12:43 PM

Show us a pic of where you are at

Posted by: rick 918-S Mar 23 2012, 10:52 PM

Posted by: jdlmodelt Jan 8 2013, 08:20 PM

Do I understand that to mean that if there was no chassis stiffening done then there is no cutting to do...just put the power jack in and straighten?