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Posted by: Mueller Oct 6 2004, 10:36 PM

well, I broke down today and ordered the Renegade Hybrids radiator and hose kit, so now I'll have to cut a hole in my front '74 chrome bumper to get some air into the front trunk.....

sawzall seems like it would be too ragged and I don't think my air nibbler would be able to cut the metal due to it being too think

Posted by: skline Oct 6 2004, 10:47 PM

I would pick up a black bumper and cut that one instead of the chrome one. Or pick up a fiberglass bumper, maybe the GT one with the front lower valance also. Save the chrome one since they are so hard to find.

Posted by: trekkor Oct 6 2004, 10:48 PM

Drill 4 corner starter holes. Mark your cut out with blue tape.
Use a jigsaw or even the 'Zall with a high quality blade.
10 minutes max.
File it out. You win

KT

Posted by: SirAndy Oct 6 2004, 10:50 PM

Posted by: bondo Oct 6 2004, 11:01 PM

Pound some big dents in the part that you're planning to cut out, then it won't be such a loss Have you considered a plasma cutter? They cut without heating up too far from the edgs, dunno what it would do to the chrome tho, maybe you could try it on some chromed scrap. Besides that, my only other thought would be an air body saw. (with lots of tape on the part you're keeping so the foot of the saw doesn't scratch the finish)

Posted by: boxstr Oct 6 2004, 11:01 PM

The fiberglass bumpers on the market today take alot of work to try and fit. I would cut my opening in the wall area behind the bumper a little larger and then just cut the front lower valance, leaving the bumper as is.
I have done alot of research on this and this is the way I will go with JLO.
CCLINGOWITHTHEFLOW

Posted by: Mueller Oct 6 2004, 11:08 PM

chrome bumper is staying, had the 'glass (carbon fiber actually) bumper before...no thanks

I had not looked at the valance area too much, I like that idea...besides with my smaller motor, I won't need the cooling like I would with a HiPo V8 motor

Posted by: boxstr Oct 6 2004, 11:19 PM

The fans are going to do all of the work. What about the times you are sitting at a stop. No airflow. Fans will kick on when needed. I have a thermostatic control and a flip switch if needed.
CCLINKEWLDADDYO

Posted by: Mueller Oct 6 2004, 11:23 PM

I need to call Scott and ask him about the ducting for the hot air....i currently have a big @ss hole in the front trunk for the dealer installed A/C, I have a new (used) trunk floor to use if it would be worth the effort to do so....

Posted by: BIGKAT_83 Oct 7 2004, 02:19 AM

Here is a picture of a car I found on the internet. The opening in the bumper is smaller than most you see,but if you look you can see that the area around the valance is opened up.

On a good hot day this summer I took my V8 car and covered up my air intake on the bumper and ran in traffic and at highway speeds to see just how small of a hole was really needed.
With a intake opening of about 50 sq inches I could cool fine. I would stop the car and turn the fans off and let the engine get in the 220 degree range and then drive at 55 mph with no fans. It would start to cool down as soon as I started moving and in less than a mile would be at 180. (thermostat)

On my new LS1 914 project I'm going to start with a opening no bigger than a 914 GT oil cooler valance and bumper. Its always alot easier to go bigger than it is to go smaller

Bob


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Posted by: John2kx Oct 7 2004, 02:32 AM

I faced the same challenge with a freshly rechromed bumper. The results turned out well using the method mentioned (drill a hole at each corner, tape the outline to prevent scratching..........I used a air powered jig saw to cut out the remaining material........no scratches).

John


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Posted by: GWN7 Oct 7 2004, 02:42 AM

I think someone will have a painted one for you to cut up...wasn't there a pile of them sitting outside HPH in one of the pics from there?

Cutoff wheel, tape the outline.

Posted by: Lawrence Oct 7 2004, 07:39 AM

This would be my plan, if I wanted to cut a chrome bumper.

Tape down the surface you want to cut. Draw your lines on the tape.

Cut the lines with a dremel. Just cut through the chrome surface and into the steel a bit. That should save the chrome from major flaking or chipping.

Then, cut over the same lines with a larger cut-off wheel to actually make the hole.

If you're not comfortable with this idea... do you have a shop in your area that specializes in repairing chrome bumpers? Maybe if you call them, they have a favorite method for custom fabbing stuff.

Hope this helps,
-Rusty

Posted by: serge914 Oct 7 2004, 07:58 AM

I had the same concern and decided not to cut the bumper. Just the GT fiberglass valence seem to get me enough air flow.


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Posted by: Slowpoke Oct 7 2004, 08:03 AM

water jet

Posted by: seanery Oct 7 2004, 08:50 AM

I'd try Serge's method and if that's not enough then I'd cut a matching hole in the bumper. If you scratch it just send it out to get rechromed.

Posted by: Mueller Oct 7 2004, 12:44 PM

Posted by: andys Oct 7 2004, 05:00 PM

I'm in the selection process as well, to determine what exactly to do with the front bumper/valence/spoiler on my V8 conversion. That said, I would like to ask anyone that has a good picture of the 916GT front bumper WITH the oil cooler cut out on a completed and painted car (4, 6, or V8). Since I'm converting a '75, I can go any direction.........maybe some posts of all the various front treatments would be nice. I would greatly appreciate it.

Andy

Posted by: andys Oct 8 2004, 01:39 PM

ttt

Posted by: Mueller Oct 8 2004, 01:57 PM

for a bunch of pictures of GT front openings, try here:

http://home.hiwaay.net/~jonlowe/

Posted by: dlee1967 Feb 3 2005, 10:16 PM

Blue tape and Sawzall worked fine, but I still chose to press on some windlace. Found it at an upholstery shop for about .29 per foot. The opening on the car in the picture now has a mesh grill behind it to keep out the opossums. It is silver at the moment, but the wife keeps asking me to paint it black. This car is now her Friday car. DLee


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Posted by: redshift Feb 3 2005, 11:02 PM

I was going to freak out, and say don't cut a chrome bumper, but these look great..

I like Rusty's idea about scoring the chrome on the line first, for sure if it's been restored before... rechroming is sometimes thicker, and not as sticky as the factory stuff.


M

Posted by: bondo Feb 3 2005, 11:06 PM

QUOTE (dlee1967 @ Feb 3 2005, 09:16 PM)

Blue tape and Sawzall worked fine, but I still chose to press on some windlace. Found it at an upholstery shop for about .29 per foot. The opening on the car in the picture now has a mesh grill behind it to keep out the opossums. It is silver at the moment, but the wife keeps asking me to paint it black. This car is now her Friday car. DLee

So that's enough air for a V8 in texas? Seems like most people cut huge holes, I was wondering if less would work. I'm going to try for leaving the bumper intact but have a valence hole that is as wide as the front of the hood. If it doesn't work I'll go bigger.

Posted by: boxstr Feb 4 2005, 12:54 AM

Mike I got a picture with the paperwork from the yellow V8 that I just bought. It is a stock bumper, I think fiberglass?? but the owner added an exra grille on either side of the existing ones. SO you have four non fog lite grilles in the front bumper. Sorry no pics available at this time.
CCLINCOOLINGHOLE

Posted by: SteveSr Feb 4 2005, 09:53 AM

QUOTE (Mueller @ Oct 6 2004, 09:23 PM)

I need to call Scott and ask him about the ducting for the hot air....i currently have a big @ss hole in the front trunk for the dealer installed A/C, I have a new (used) trunk floor to use if it would be worth the effort to do so....

Mike,I am at that stage right now. I need to cut the hole in the front for cooling air.
Was thinking about cutting below the hood latch but after looking at the pics above,I may need to re-think my plan. Here is the hole I cut last weekend for the hot air exhaust..................

SteveSr


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Posted by: scott thacher Feb 4 2005, 10:35 AM

damn this thread has been dead for a while, dead since oct 8 till somebody brought it back fed 3.

as far as i know at this point he is not doing a swap at all, leave it to mike to buy parts to do something and not finish it.

and with those small intakes for v8's everybody hopefully will stop saying a suby swap with the radiator in the engine bay will not cool

Posted by: dakotaewing Feb 4 2005, 11:44 AM

The cleanest front end - air intake that I have seen is on Richard Fishers V-8 car -
Unfortunately, I can not find any pics of it....

Thom

Posted by: bondo Feb 4 2005, 11:45 AM

QUOTE (dakotaewing @ Feb 4 2005, 10:44 AM)

The cleanest front end - air intake that I have seen is on Richard Fishers V-8 car - Unfortunately, I can not find any pics of it.... Thom

Augh! Can you at least describe it?

Posted by: andys Feb 4 2005, 01:19 PM

Here's some technical info from the C&R Racing site. These tech tips are of particular interest (Admin, I assume it's ok to quote for their site?):

"Most importantly, keep in mind to increase in volume from the inlet or grill opening to the core face."

"A common misconception among inexperienced racing mechanics is to “scoop” air into the radiator, cooler, or inlet duct. A scoop that tries to “grab” as much air as possible and funnel it into a restrictive duct will create a damming of the air, directing it around the duct, thus defeating the purpose. Air, like water, will follow the path of least resistance."

http://www.crracing.com/apparel/shirts.html

Andy

Posted by: bondo Feb 4 2005, 01:38 PM

QUOTE (dakotaewing @ Feb 4 2005, 10:44 AM)

The cleanest front end - air intake that I have seen is on Richard Fishers V-8 car - Unfortunately, I can not find any pics of it.... Thom

I found a pic.. anyone care to crop it down to just the nose of the car and lighten it? (I don't have that capability on my work computer, if nobody else does it I'll do it when I get home)

http://members.rennlist.com/alb/RichardFisher.JPG

Posted by: Mueller Feb 4 2005, 04:35 PM

wow, old thread...should have deleted it

no wasserpumper for me....the VR6 engine I picked out would have been too ugly of an install due to the height of the engine...

going back to air/oil cooled

Posted by: McMark Feb 4 2005, 05:10 PM

QUOTE (Mueller @ Feb 4 2005, 02:35 PM)

going back to air/oil cooled

Yay! Another one see's the light.

Posted by: dakotaewing Feb 4 2005, 08:21 PM

OK,
I found a much better pic of Richards front end, but it is about 900k.. I do not know how the resize it on my XP, but I will happy to email it to someone to resize....
Thanks-

Thom

Posted by: Joe Sharp Feb 4 2005, 08:51 PM

Dakota: Go to the FAQ at the top of this page and look at the bottom of the window. Its like 2 clicks to resize a picture.
Joe

Posted by: marks914 Feb 4 2005, 09:00 PM

Here is mine. Works well. There is also a lower opening that you cannot see.
I tried to run with just the A/C opening and I ended up cutting out the wheelwells.
Mark


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Posted by: dlee1967 Feb 4 2005, 09:33 PM

Yes even in Texas the "smaller" openings work well. I,ve provided a pic of my other V8 car with rubber bumpers and an ultimate air dam. The cutout is hard to notice unless you get down low to look for it.

The key is to get the hot air out. Many folks try to vent through the floor or are nervous about cutting out the inner wheel wells. The best results are obtained by prviding a good sized cutout of the wheel wells for exhausting the air.

David Lee


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Posted by: bondo Feb 5 2005, 01:34 AM

QUOTE (bondo @ Feb 4 2005, 12:38 PM)

QUOTE (dakotaewing @ Feb 4 2005, 10:44 AM) The cleanest front end - air intake that I have seen is on Richard Fishers V-8 car - Unfortunately, I can not find any pics of it.... Thom I found a pic.. anyone care to crop it down to just the nose of the car and lighten it? (I don't have that capability on my work computer, if nobody else does it I'll do it when I get home) http://members.rennlist.com/alb/RichardFisher.JPG

ok, this is the best I could do.. (it's not that visible.. oh well.)


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