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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ 1.8 ljet double Relay
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 11:02 AM
Is this an Ljet double relay?
Posted by: ejm Sep 24 2012, 11:11 AM
yes
Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Sep 24 2012, 11:33 AM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 11:36 AM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Thanks , it is a 75 1.8
Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 24 2012, 09:31 PM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Thanks , it is a 75 1.8
Where did that come from in the car. I just pulled the whole harness out of my 75 1.8, that does not look familiar...
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 09:36 PM
They are located In the engine bay , by the battery .
Posted by: tim_nd Sep 24 2012, 09:46 PM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Thanks , it is a 75 1.8
Where did that come from in the car. I just pulled the whole harness out of my 75 1.8, that does not look familiar...
Why did you pull that? Did you switch to carbs? Are you interested in selling it?
Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 24 2012, 09:49 PM
They are located In the engine bay , by the battery .
Hmmm, definitely not found in my car, must be one of the "other versions" as mentioned by the Cap.
Btw, mine is a CA car, not sure if that makes a difference in this part.
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 09:51 PM
Long story . .... The car had a broken suspension ear, I stripped it 9 months ago and obtained a new shell . I gave it all to my brother and I am helping him putting it back together on the new shell . My knowledge is limited on ljets as my other two are arbs and djet . Tryng to sort things out.
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 09:53 PM
They are located In the engine bay , by the battery .
Hmmm, definitely not found in my car, must be one of the "other versions" as mentioned by the Cap.
Btw, mine is a CA car, not sure if that makes a difference in this part.
Afaik all ljets have them. I know there is an aluminum looking version. It sits next to the resistor pack.
Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 24 2012, 09:53 PM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Thanks , it is a 75 1.8
Where did that come from in the car. I just pulled the whole harness out of my 75 1.8, that does not look familiar...
Why did you pull that? Did you switch to carbs? Are you interested in selling it?
Whole car is stripped for a vintage 6 racecar build. Not ready to sell off engine or harness yet...
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 09:55 PM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
Thanks , it is a 75 1.8
Where did that come from in the car. I just pulled the whole harness out of my 75 1.8, that does not look familiar...
Why did you pull that? Did you switch to carbs? Are you interested in selling it?
Whole car is stripped for a vintage 6 racecar build. Not ready to sell off engine or harness yet...
Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 24 2012, 10:02 PM
Ahh thanks for the description, must be this:
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 10:06 PM
You got it!. What year was that?
Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 24 2012, 10:14 PM
You got it!. What year was that?
75 1.8, That's why I was confused
Posted by: 914itis Sep 24 2012, 10:20 PM
As the cap'n mentioned there are different ones. I am wondering what is the difference, color, part number or what?
Posted by: jim_hoyland Sep 25 2012, 07:01 AM
The original metal and newer plastic dual relay for the 914 work the same-from my experience. The main difference is in the bases. I prefer the square white base fittings. Also, there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
Attached image(s)
Posted by: 914itis Sep 25 2012, 07:16 AM
Thnks Jim
Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Sep 25 2012, 08:00 AM
The original metal and newer plastic dual relay for the 914 work the same-from my experience. The main difference is in the bases. I prefer the square white base fittings. Also, there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
There are different pin assignments as well as different cases and plug configurations. Different part numbers, too.
The Cap'n
Posted by: type47 Sep 25 2012, 08:40 AM
... there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
interesting, would you have a link?
Posted by: jim_hoyland Sep 25 2012, 08:44 AM
... there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
interesting, would you have a link?
It's on the other board at http://www.914club.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=235816&hl= ...I can repost it here a little later if that would be suitable
Posted by: Drums66 Sep 25 2012, 02:18 PM
The original metal and newer plastic dual relay for the 914 work the same-from my experience. The main difference is in the bases. I prefer the square white base fittings. Also, there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
.....ECHO, from my experience also.....I prefer the metal
1's myself(this has been discussed, over&over)
(do searches man)
Posted by: 914itis Sep 25 2012, 03:40 PM
The original metal and newer plastic dual relay for the 914 work the same-from my experience. The main difference is in the bases. I prefer the square white base fittings. Also, there is a thread on how to test a dual relay; all that is needed are a 9 v battery and two leads
There are different pin assignments as well as different cases and plug configurations. Different part numbers, too.
The Cap'n
What is the pin assignment / part numbers based on? Year, ecu?
Posted by: jim_hoyland Sep 25 2012, 04:43 PM
Jeff Bowlsby posted this on his web page :
http://bowlsby.net/914/WiringHarnesses/HarnDia_FI_EC75-1.8.pdf
That for a '75 L-Jet, a '74 is slightly different
I've attached my dual relay diagram
Attached File(s)
Dual_Relay_part_1.bmp ( 1.37mb )
Number of downloads: 155
Posted by: malcolm2 Jun 8 2013, 12:38 PM
Keep in mind there are more than one version, and they DO NOT interchange.
The Cap'n
CRAP...So what does one do when they have parts from each version?
Is that what I have?
Posted by: malcolm2 Jun 9 2013, 09:20 PM
I've attached my dual relay diagram
I tried the test and got clicks....They only clicked ONCE per touch of the battery. I attached one lead on both ends as described. Then the other lead had one end on the relay and the other end poised above the 9v battery. As I touched the battery I heard ONE click. Is that right?
Should the there be a continuous clicking while all the leads are made? I expected Click, Click, Click, Click. but just got Click.
BTW your connection numbers are good but their actual location compared to your drawing are a bit wacky. Kind of an upside down mirror???
Clark
Posted by: timothy_nd28 Jun 9 2013, 09:36 PM
No repeating clicking, just one click when you apply voltage to the pins explained in the test procedure.
The test you just performed only checks the coil parts on the dual relay. You really need a ohm meter and check resistances on the internal switches.
Posted by: Jaydebeers Dec 7 2015, 11:17 AM
No current to thermo time sensor. Relay checks out ok but no power to, term 86 The diode between connection 86 & 86a might be shot. Did not attempt to open up relay. Does anyone know the value of that diode is? And would a feasible fix be to splice one in external to the relay?or am I stuck getting a whole new relay. It's all working otherwise. Any fix possible?
Posted by: timothy_nd28 Dec 7 2015, 03:58 PM
I don't see a diode between pins 86 and 86a on the dual relay, and I doubt the snubber diode is even bad. Start a new thread stating the problem you face
Posted by: Jaydebeers Dec 7 2015, 06:45 PM
I don't see a diode between pins 86 and 86a on the dual relay, and I doubt the snubber diode is even bad. Start a new thread stating the problem you face
Thanks Timothy your correct was looking a wrong circuit. Stuck with it & everything checks out ok. The strange thing is my thermo time switch is marked "35deg C" & 12 sec. It takes about 5 cranks to start at around 55F & below It's a 78 super beetle btw but same circuit. Maybe I'm running too lean at warm temps? About 60F it fires right up less then a crank.
Posted by: timothy_nd28 Dec 7 2015, 08:29 PM
That is strange, 35 degrees Celsius is 90 some degrees F which would be too warm and useless for the cold start valve to activate. The cold start valve is activated thru the thermotime switch, typically in 30 degree weather. On a Ljet setup, pins 86a and 86 on the dual relay will both receive a momentary 12volts from the ignition switch. This voltage is only present when the key is turned to the "start" position, and voltage is lost when the key is released. You can verify this voltage by having a helper turn the key to start while you probe these pins with a DC voltmeter.
12 volts leaves pin 86 at the dual relay and sits idle at the thermotime switch. If the thermotime switch is cold enough, it will complete the circuit and inject 12volts to the 5th injector. Again, this is only dependent on temperature and how long you hold the key at the start position. Being that you are experiencing 55 degree weather, the thermotime switch should remain open which will keep the 5th injector off. I don't think this is your issue.
You could be running lean, start with checking for vacuum leaks. Check for proper fuel pressure. Make sure your distributor isn't too advanced. I don't know if this superbeatle has hydraulic valves or solid, if solid, check the valve lash.
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