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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ Do U use Anti Sieze on....

Posted by: bandjoey Oct 17 2012, 11:21 PM

Wheel lugs?

Alloys on 4 lug hubs. I use it and check torque about every 1000 miles. Never found a loose lug.

Got yelled at when getting the wheels balanced. What's right?

Posted by: Black22 Oct 18 2012, 12:07 AM

I use it on my 5 lug Fuchs. Only on the threads not on lug nut seats. I take my wheels off a lot though and always check torque.

Posted by: McMark Oct 18 2012, 12:32 AM

From the 914 factory manuals...

Attached image(s)

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Oct 18 2012, 08:47 AM

Wow. 108 ft/lb!

I had been using about 80 ft/lb like I do with the rest of my vehicles.

I always use antisieze. I have pulled out too many studs trying to remove lug nuts that never had anti-sieze put on them.

Zach

Posted by: bandjoey Oct 18 2012, 08:49 AM

So the ball part. Not the threads.
I think the 108 was for steel wheels only.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Oct 18 2012, 08:51 AM

I would coat the threads.

Posted by: Tom Oct 18 2012, 09:45 AM

I know adding a lubricant will greatly change the actual torque on the bolt. From what McMark posted, I gather the bolt torque is for dry threads. Putting 108 Ft lbs on lubricated threads is like 140-150 dry torque. Maybe a little more. You could be stretching the bolts excessively. Reason for this is when torqueing dry, a lot of the rotational torque is thread friction, not bolt stretch.
Funny that this should come up as I was wondering what to torque the suspension bolts to and looked it up, but no mention of dry or lubed threads.
I took a class years ago and the instructor made it pretty plain that anyone torgueing a bolt dry would fail the practical. What I got from this was to always lube bolt threads, now it seems some torques are engineered for a dry torque spec. If this is so, how is one to know which are OK dry and which need lubricant?
Tom

Posted by: Racer Chris Oct 18 2012, 10:47 AM

108 is correct for steel wheels.
94-95 is correct for alloys.
Torque should always be measured on a lubricated bolt, both the threads and the face.

Posted by: sean_v8_914 Oct 18 2012, 10:53 AM

always

Posted by: Tom Oct 18 2012, 12:06 PM

Porsche IManual says different. Clean the bolts/studs, no lube on lug nuts.
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=how%20to%20%20%20torque%20bolts%20for%20wheels%20on%20porsche&source=web&cd=4&cad=rja&sqi=2&ved=0CDkQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.porscheownersmanuals.com%2F2012-911-carrera-owners-manual%2F6%2F236%2FWrench-socket-for-security-wheel-bolt&ei=tEWAUILfI4KMigK7kIG4BA&usg=AFQjCNFrxeG5lJYP_bx_ADI2YTSBTPrYUQ
My question is, are the torque values given in the manual for dry torque or wet?
Following is from one of the searches. By the way, half of the searches for torqueing lug bolts/nuts has you lube them, other half no lube.
When applying torque to a dry bolt more friction is created than applying torque to a wet bolt with oil or other automotive fluids on the threads. With less friction (wet threads), the bolt will stretch more before a torque wench will click. Because friction is such a big factor in bolt torque, it is important to know the difference between applying torque to a dry bolt and a wet bolt. Using oil, anti-seize or other types of thread lubricant is a common practice, but an understanding that wet threads require less torque than dry threads because of friction is very important. Since every type of lubricant has a different loss of friction coefficient, it is recommended that every technician own a chart showing how much to reduce the torque when using different bolts and lubricants.

I wonder how many torques I have applied incorrectly. I always use lube of some kind.
Tom

Posted by: bandjoey Oct 18 2012, 07:25 PM

McMarks information above from the 914 manual states Dry torque with lube Only on the ball socket.

The tire man said..'old school was lubed but new school is only dry'

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Posted by: brant Oct 18 2012, 09:16 PM

I've actually seen lug nuts gall and strip at the track
you would be amazed at the temperature these can get to at the track

I've had steel open lug nuts so hot that you can't hold them in an ungloved hand.

lube always

brant

Posted by: pete000 Oct 18 2012, 09:37 PM

Always do on the threads, Had a set get frozen on a Michigan car and it was He11 to get them off. Also had a set of 911 alloy lugs twist when removing because they got stuck.

Posted by: Gint Oct 21 2012, 01:02 PM

I use it if they need it. I like to go real light on anti seize. Never done the ball seats though. I might start.