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Posted by: Stutgart46 Nov 11 2004, 06:29 PM

I was just looking over my copy of this months "Sports Car" magazine (SCCA's monthly mag). I have noticed that there seem to be no 914's running at the top of any class. Why is this? Are the rules written in such a way that the 914 is just can't be competitive? I understand that at the Runoffs these guys have poured buckets of money into whatever they're driving. But why hasn't anybody poured a ton of money into a 914 for SCCA? I have seen several in HSR and PCA that always competitive and they usually finish on the podium.
Oh well, jus thought I'd ask.

Posted by: SLITS Nov 11 2004, 06:43 PM

I've been out of it for years, but Bob Kirby was the teener racer.

With the way SCCA started homogulating classes, the old sports cars that SCCA made it's name from just kinda died off I guess.

Posted by: butch Nov 11 2004, 07:13 PM

I ran Tiggr in ITA, and could beat Miata's when I was on it. Severe HP handicap. Not that fun. I need a bigger unfair advantage than just better handling. The ITA rules allow no engine mods except the header...

Soooo... we put in a hot 2.1L which I ran in ITE then promptly blew up. Currently waiting on a Brad motor.

I ran a couple SCCA vintage events, which was big fun and there were lots of people to pass...

Posted by: Jake Raby Nov 11 2004, 07:24 PM

Just wait a few months, at tops maybe a year and you'll see some big changes.

I have a E production ongoing that is just plain nasty and also Chris Foley who is an excellent driver and does great things with lesser power than most is also getting a sponsorship from me. These two engines will make some big changes in the SCCA 914 world... Sure its competitive, thats why they give us some dumb rules and weights..

Posted by: Racer Chris Nov 11 2004, 07:26 PM

Most of the competetive guys who ran 914s moved on to other things by now. Dave Finch won in his 944 in GT2 this year. He used to race a 914. There really hasn't been a lot of interest in racing 914s in SCCA for a while until recently. SCCA made it tough on 914s after they won a bit.
The current rules may be more conducive to running a 914 competetively, but I'm running against $100,000 Huffaker built Midgets. I met Bob Kirby (former champion) at the runoffs this year. He has a competetive FP car built by Finch, but I lapped him twice in the Runoffs. He's just too old and has lost his edge IMO.
I'm still working on my program to become competetive in FP, but my budget is small and the competition is fierce at the front. I ran as high as 12th place during this years runoffs (Watch it on Speed on Nov. 27th). There are a few new guys in EP with 2 liter 914s, both 4 and 6 cyl. versions.
Don't give up on us yet, as I feel the best is yet to come.

Posted by: Jake Raby Nov 11 2004, 07:39 PM

absolutely! especially since we have new developments that SCCA don't even know exist yet that are still within their current rulebooks!

Posted by: Joe Ricard Nov 11 2004, 09:02 PM

I have only done 4 SCCA Solo II events and I am the only 914 running.
Get lots of "hey cool car" Since I put the big cammed motor in have to run in SM-2. But then who cares I still ge to drive the car near MY limits. Some day I will get closer to the car limits.

Posted by: Jamie Nov 11 2004, 09:31 PM

I fondly remember the old days in late 60's before Solo II ruined all my fun with my Bugeye in HP. After the Army in 1970 I also had a wife, so no racing interest since then. I retired last year and now that I have a 914 "sport type" car rather than an F 350 Powerstroke CC dually I may check out the SCCA scene again for old times sake!

Posted by: J P Stein Nov 11 2004, 09:57 PM

An old sayng "the best way to make a small fortune racin' is to start with a large one"
Chris hit the nail on the head ....running against 100K cars. Them guys are serious and have big money and reputations to protect. They'll do it any way they can....money, rules.....whatever. You can go be a field filler and be welcome, but you're gonna need a shitload of money, desire, & talent to get up up on the poduim.

SCCA solo is similar, but different....for 914 guys. I'm also the only 914 guy that regularly runs in. There's a trend here. Any of you CA hot dogs run SCCA? I've had many folks comment " it been a long time since we've seen a 914 *like that* around here". (Got the same comment at my only DE, also.)
There is one big buck 914 that is competitive on a national level, so it can be done.

It seems to me that the interest in 914s is generally picking up. MAybe someone with more money than good sense will come along & put the 914 up towards the front of the pack.

Posted by: ChrisReale Nov 11 2004, 10:03 PM

They are talking about the primered flares

Posted by: J P Stein Nov 11 2004, 10:14 PM

Probaably

Posted by: synthesisdv Nov 12 2004, 06:39 AM

You guys have said it all.

The TIV has never seen development at the level Jake is approaching now. It won't be long before he can match and even surpass what some of the other top production class engine builders are doing, and though they are doing it with more modern or more widely developed motors.

We all know the superior qualities of the 914 handling wise so it will only be a matter of time before we start seeing teeners at the front of the production fields.

Posted by: Racer Chris Nov 12 2004, 07:09 AM

A fully prepared F Production MG Midget outcorners an equally prepared 914.
Why? The rules allow enough mods that they can nearly replace the entire car with highly developed components, and they weigh a lot less. The advantage of a 914 in FP over the front runners is horsepower. The extra weight we carry completely eliminates the handling, acceleration, and braking advantages we normally rely on.
Things are reversed in EP where the handling of a 914 is its advantage, and the hp is its biggest shortcoming.

A National Championship program takes a huge commitment in dollars, time invested and innovation, in addition to top notch driving skills and determination.

Posted by: Stutgart46 Nov 12 2004, 08:00 AM

I love the "never die" attitude guys.
Your confidence and excitement is great.
Chris, I hope that SPEED has some shots of your car in their upcoming coverage of the Runoffs. It was great to see your name with "914" next to it on the grid.
As far as the Miatas go, I ran a couple of races last year in a fast (if there is such a thing) Spec Miata and I was bored. It was good close racing but there was not half as much excitement as when you're on the track in a Porsche. Especially a 914.

Posted by: Racer Chris Nov 12 2004, 08:57 AM

Wife:"Either that thing goes or I go!"
Driver:"Goodbye! Close the door on your way out."

This story has been told to me more than once from dedicated National drivers.

I have made some concessions to keep Mary next to me at the track. One of them is that we will be doing more of what she wants in a few years.

Posted by: ppickerell Nov 12 2004, 09:41 AM

Just getting started on this myself at the age of 48! But I see fun times ahead with my son in the red car! I'll see you guys on the tracks in the next couple of years. In the meantime I will continue to flog the AX courses and my wallet.

Posted by: Rleog Nov 12 2004, 10:22 AM

Chris:

For those of us with 914s but unfamiliar with SCCA rules that make it difficult for you to be competitive, could you elaborate on the weight/power/suspension differences that seem to penalize the 914.

Such as, at the runoffs, how much weight were you forced to carry, and what suspension mods did they forbid.

thanks

Posted by: groot Nov 12 2004, 12:46 PM

Personally I think there are quite a few 914s running around in SCCA racing. Given the various other venues that 914s can run (PCA, POC, Vintage), the 914 is fairly well represented.

If you run a British car, you can race vintage or SCCA... that's it. Since Porsches have more venues their numbers are fewer in SCCA.

There could be more (and will be), but if I wanted to run a car that everyone else was I'd run a RX-7 or Miata.

Posted by: groot Nov 12 2004, 12:47 PM

I'm actually more surprised at how few 911s run SCCA, considering the number of 911 race cars there are.