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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ Self Sustaining Electric 914
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 16 2013, 08:09 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
Posted by: rick 918-S Nov 16 2013, 08:13 AM
Back that is! Where you been?
Oh! 
Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Nov 16 2013, 03:15 PM
You will need to offer equity in your company to generate capital 
Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Nov 16 2013, 04:08 PM
TNSTAAFL.
The Cap'n
Posted by: PThompson509 Nov 16 2013, 05:52 PM
Interesting. Word of caution: do NOT use Electro Automotive - you will lose your money. Lots of people already have lost their money, don't be another.
Cheers!
Posted by: Mike Bellis Nov 16 2013, 06:00 PM
Kind of cool but kind of like 
I'm taking donations to build a 12 cylinder 914. Any takers? 
Posted by: d914 Nov 16 2013, 07:11 PM
Perpetual motion ?
Posted by: skeates Nov 17 2013, 12:38 AM
Let us know how those pesky laws of thermodynamics treat you...
Posted by: Elliot Cannon Nov 17 2013, 01:07 AM
If it works, how long before the oil companies make you an offer you can't refuse? 
Posted by: 7TPorsh Nov 17 2013, 01:12 AM
If it works, how long before the oil companies make you an offer you can't refuse?
watch out...may end up like Rudolf Diesel...
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 17 2013, 06:25 AM
Hey jeff and rick and everybody else! yep ir has been awhile. i have been traveling all over the planet for the last few years.
where is dr evil? aaron cox still around? Scotty b?
i must apologoze as i am on the road doing a tour of local machine shops and corporate machine shops promoting my wind engine. sending this from my smart phone.
be back home on mo.day.chat with all you guys more then!
Posted by: Steve Pratel Nov 17 2013, 06:55 AM
Man this brings me back..... When I was young and ambitious and considered myself inventive, I came up with a plan similar to this. A perpetually powered electric car. The problem was the need and ability to reliably generate and store more power than you are consuming. Given the needs for accelleration, grade increases, accessory/load demands, I figured that if you allowed for a 25% overhead (100KW generate, 75W motor) and had enough capacity you would be fine, but the math (according to my electrical engineer uncle).
The plan was to generate power two ways, 1 was regenerative through a wheel driven generator, second was solar power cells. The theory/idea was sound, the math diddnt hold up. Something about entropy, etc and that the ratio of consumption to generation wasnt right. I thought a 2-3 speed transmission to step up the ration on the generator would address this, but there was little available to make that happen.
So, I decided to scrap the design and went instead for a system with: solar panels (roof & hood), a wheel generator (front wheels) and a small onboard gasoline powered generator (engine compartment) all 3 would dump power into the batteries, solar when the sun was out and independedent of all movement, the wheel generator when moving, and the gas generator for when demand outpaced the ability to generate or the battery levels dropped below 40%. I still liked the idea of a 2 speed transmission to double the speed of the generator relative to speed, the theory being generating twice the power and outpace consumption. This system worked out great on paper and the math worked too. The only problem was I was 13-14 years old and had no access to do anything other than old lawnmower parts, scavanged junkyard parts, and a 1960 VW beetle shell. But this was the 70's, I was 14 and of little means, so I just sent the idea to the General.... Along with my driverless highway idea.
Of course real cars, motorcycles, girls, sports, college, family, Army all got in the way, and I gave up being an inventor, just inovating and improving what I have.
I dont have any idea of the other project you did, but I'm intrigued! Will be watching this thread!
Steve
Posted by: ClayPerrine Nov 17 2013, 07:21 AM
Kind of cool but kind of like
I'm taking donations to build a 12 cylinder 914. Any takers?
Don't be so flippant about a 914-12. All you need is a VW W-12 motor. It is actually shorter than a 911 engine, and will bolt up to a Boxster transmission with no conversion parts.
(Yes, I have considered it.....)
Posted by: bulitt Nov 17 2013, 07:37 AM
Kind of cool but kind of like
I'm taking donations to build a 12 cylinder 914. Any takers?
Don't be so flippant about a 914-12. All you need is a VW W-12 motor. It is actually shorter than a 911 engine, and will bolt up to a Boxster transmission with no conversion parts.
(Yes, I have considered it.....)
Lot of work to get 270hp ?
Posted by: scotty b Nov 17 2013, 07:45 AM
Hey jeff and rick and everybody else! yep ir has been awhile. i have been traveling all over the planet for the last few years.
where is dr evil? aaron cox still around? Scotty b?
i must apologoze as i am on the road doing a tour of local machine shops and corporate machine shops promoting my wind engine. sending this from my smart phone.
be back home on mo.day.chat with all you guys more then!
Aaron quit, Evil is busy with his new high falootin 911 owning doctor friends, and they kicked me out
Posted by: jgara962 Nov 17 2013, 08:34 AM
You're building one of these?
Attached image(s)
Posted by: Joe Sharp Nov 17 2013, 09:22 AM
You missed the Tropical Ramble. Just winding down now. They are talking about a boat trip this afternoon to the Swamphouse on the St Johns river but that will be the end of the ramble. Making plans for next year.
Posted by: barefoot Nov 17 2013, 10:48 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
Feom your video, it seems the widn turbine is spinning with no load. next step, connect a generator to your turbine powerful enough to run your box fan, then get it started with house current, then switch over to generator power and see how long it will run.
BTW, look at this link from sailing anarchy.
http://forums.sailinganarchy.com/index.php?showtopic=82175&hl=%22ddw+faster+than+the+wind%22
Posted by: brant Nov 17 2013, 10:55 AM
Bummer. The only person I've ever had to block. Ever
Posted by: Rand Nov 17 2013, 11:09 AM
If you pitched this on Shark Tank they would rip you to pieces. You are asking for money before demonstrating anything based on reality. A little premature, don't you think? How much power it can generate? Spinning it with a fan doesn't prove anything. What was the point of that?
Hook it to a generator and show us the numbers, along with accurate numbers regarding how much is needed to power a car across the country.
Attach your prototype directly to a prop on a boat and show us how fast you can go (since this is an application you suggested). Try a go kart prototype before asking for $100,000 to go straight to a car.
Fool or scam artist?
Posted by: Rand Nov 17 2013, 11:33 AM
Are you serious about the boat sailing straight into the wind because of this thing? Because by aiming directly into the wind, it would turn a prop hard enough to power a boat forward against that same wind?
I'd like to hear the rest of that explanation, because something's missing. 
Posted by: Chris H. Nov 17 2013, 12:20 PM
Don't be so flippant about a 914-12. All you need is a VW W-12 motor. It is actually shorter than a 911 engine, and will bolt up to a Boxster transmission with no conversion parts.
(Yes, I have considered it.....)
Uh boy
...this is one of the few swaps Mike hasn't done....and once he decides to do something... Mike USE A DIFFERENT TUB THIS TIME....PLEASE!!!! Posted by: 69telecaster Nov 17 2013, 05:40 PM
It's a couple of those laws I kinda remember from many years ago: "you can't get something for nothing", and "nothing is perfect". Let's just say I'm skeptical.
cm
Posted by: Rand Nov 17 2013, 05:56 PM
I apologize for my comments.
Posted by: Tom Nov 17 2013, 09:37 PM
What does TNSTAAFL mean? And should I know with out asking?
Tom
Posted by: pcar916 Nov 17 2013, 09:39 PM
TAN-staf-ful/ intj,n,v: "There's no such thing as a free lunch." Coined from Robert Heinlein's "The Moon Is a Harsh Mistress"
My Note: There seems to be a little discrepancy about which book, but I first read it in a Heinlein book at some point in my 20's. Also...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There_ain%27t_no_such_thing_as_a_free_lunch
Posted by: Steve Pratel Nov 18 2013, 06:38 AM
Ah, looking at the comments, I'm assuming the original poster is a bit of a troll?
Posted by: Mark Henry Nov 18 2013, 07:47 AM
Ah, looking at the comments, I'm assuming the original poster is a bit of a troll?
Am I missing something as well? Was this guy a troll before? What was his old user ID?
If not then a few people need to take a fucking chill pill.
He seems to know a few of us. There's a whole bunch of self promoters on this site that don't seem to catch this flack. He is converting a 914 so that is definitely not OT.
BTW I'm sceptical as well, as no perpetual motion type of machine has ever been proven to work. But hell.... it's interesting to see him try...with a 914 no less.
If you don't like what he's selling (promoting, whatever) don't buy it. He wasn't even outright self promoting....and if he knows anything about this site he knows it's full of cheap ass bastards...come on you don't think he really expects to find a single investor here....do you?.
Hell I bet a few are interested to see if it works because they think they can copy it.
Posted by: Chris H. Nov 18 2013, 09:59 AM
I think the old user name is "jwalters" right? Seems like a normal teener guy from previous posts...
Hey why not use your old account 
? Someone can reset it for you if need be.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:22 AM
You will need to offer equity in your company to generate capital
You got something in mind Jeff??
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:22 AM
![popcorn[1].gif](style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)
great projectThanks - hey are you related to Scotty b on here?
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:23 AM
TNSTAAFL.
The Cap'n
Hey Krusty - good to see you have stuck it out.......
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:24 AM
Interesting. Word of caution: do NOT use Electro Automotive - you will lose your money. Lots of people already have lost their money, don't be another.
Cheers!
Feel free to PM me with details........
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:26 AM
Man this brings me back..... When I was young and ambitious and considered myself inventive, I came up with a plan similar to this. A perpetually powered electric car. The problem was the need and ability to reliably generate and store more power than you are consuming. Given the needs for accelleration, grade increases, accessory/load demands, I figured that if you allowed for a 25% overhead (100KW generate, 75W motor) and had enough capacity you would be fine, but the math (according to my electrical engineer uncle).
The plan was to generate power two ways, 1 was regenerative through a wheel driven generator, second was solar power cells. The theory/idea was sound, the math diddnt hold up. Something about entropy, etc and that the ratio of consumption to generation wasnt right. I thought a 2-3 speed transmission to step up the ration on the generator would address this, but there was little available to make that happen.
So, I decided to scrap the design and went instead for a system with: solar panels (roof & hood), a wheel generator (front wheels) and a small onboard gasoline powered generator (engine compartment) all 3 would dump power into the batteries, solar when the sun was out and independedent of all movement, the wheel generator when moving, and the gas generator for when demand outpaced the ability to generate or the battery levels dropped below 40%. I still liked the idea of a 2 speed transmission to double the speed of the generator relative to speed, the theory being generating twice the power and outpace consumption. This system worked out great on paper and the math worked too. The only problem was I was 13-14 years old and had no access to do anything other than old lawnmower parts, scavanged junkyard parts, and a 1960 VW beetle shell. But this was the 70's, I was 14 and of little means, so I just sent the idea to the General.... Along with my driverless highway idea.
Of course real cars, motorcycles, girls, sports, college, family, Army all got in the way, and I gave up being an inventor, just inovating and improving what I have.
I dont have any idea of the other project you did, but I'm intrigued! Will be watching this thread!
Steve
Hey Steve,
Hey man, at least you tried to do something! More than what many are capable of (not including this place - we are ALL masters of our universes here)
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:28 AM
Hey jeff and rick and everybody else! yep ir has been awhile. i have been traveling all over the planet for the last few years.
where is dr evil? aaron cox still around? Scotty b?
i must apologoze as i am on the road doing a tour of local machine shops and corporate machine shops promoting my wind engine. sending this from my smart phone.
be back home on mo.day.chat with all you guys more then!
Aaron quit, Evil is busy with his new high falootin 911 owning doctor friends, and they kicked me out
Scotty b - good to see you are still around hiding in the shadows!!
How have you been bud? Tell me, has enough time passed by yet to ask just what the flipping hell happened way back when with the thing about the thing??? I have always been curious.....
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:29 AM
You missed the Tropical Ramble. Just winding down now. They are talking about a boat trip this afternoon to the Swamphouse on the St Johns river but that will be the end of the ramble. Making plans for next year.
You got a blog or lots of pics about this somewhere Joe? I would love to live vicariously through them.......
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:32 AM
Don't be so flippant about a 914-12. All you need is a VW W-12 motor. It is actually shorter than a 911 engine, and will bolt up to a Boxster transmission with no conversion parts.
(Yes, I have considered it.....)
Uh boy
...this is one of the few swaps Mike hasn't done....and once he decides to do something... Mike USE A DIFFERENT TUB THIS TIME....PLEASE!!!!Hey, it would be very interesting! I remember quite fondly of the "Alien" build. He did great work on that project. Rick you got any youtube vids of the alien?
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:35 AM
I think the old user name is "jwalters" right? Seems like a normal teener guy from previous posts...
Hey why not use your old account
? Someone can reset it for you if need be.Seems obvious right? Well Chris I have been away for so long that I no longer use the email that I had associated with my original account. I *thought* I remembered my password, but it seems no. So I made a new account....I just wanted to get on here and give the guys a shout out.
Last time I was here, right before I went M.I.A. there was an epic, earth shattering meltdown of the club...............I'll leave it at that.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 11:39 AM
Ah, looking at the comments, I'm assuming the original poster is a bit of a troll?
Am I missing something as well? Was this guy a troll before? What was his old user ID?
If not then a few people need to take a fucking chill pill.
He seems to know a few of us. There's a whole bunch of self promoters on this site that don't seem to catch this flack. He is converting a 914 so that is definitely not OT.
BTW I'm sceptical as well, as no perpetual motion type of machine has ever been proven to work. But hell.... it's interesting to see him try...with a 914 no less.
If you don't like what he's selling (promoting, whatever) don't buy it. He wasn't even outright self promoting....and if he knows anything about this site he knows it's full of cheap ass bastards...come on you don't think he really expects to find a single investor here....do you?.
Hell I bet a few are interested to see if it works because they think they can copy it.
Hahahahahahahaha!
Hey Mark! Yepper its me the fabled one and only jwalters of yore.....
Thanks for that Mark, I appreciate it.....
I guess it is good to see the club hasn't changed much.....
Good thing? Bad thing? ahh hell, I am back home.....
Edit:
Ohh, BTW NO, it is not based on the principles of perpetual motion - I am lifting aviation technology and re-purposing it. Kinda like going "around" the wall vs head strong through it.
When I finish it, and my investors see how I accomplished it, I can assume that one or more chief designers might be let go......it is actually quite simple, well, now in this day and age anyway.....
Posted by: scotty b Nov 18 2013, 11:46 AM
What? No reply to reality? Asking for funding without promise of return to investors? TNSTAAFL? Perpetural motion? Spam? Laws of physics? Still no comment?
Answer up or you are looking at yet another discharge. This one isn't looking so honorable as your others. (Although we don't know what they were for.)
Chill the fuck out Rand. He clearly stated in his initial post he was on the road and wouldn't check back in for a few days. He's an old member that probably got tired of the bullshit and needed a break. Posts like this one from you are a quick way to turn people off from this place, Including some of the long timers
Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Nov 18 2013, 12:05 PM
TNSTAAFL.
The Cap'n
Hey Krusty - good to see you have stuck it out.......
Good to have you back. Just 'cause you have a new account doesn't mean you get another free pass. I believe you've used yours, so you're fair game for my Krustiness ........................ HA!
Seriously, welcome back into the fold .........................
The Cap'n
Posted by: Rand Nov 18 2013, 12:18 PM
Chill the fuck out Rand. He clearly stated in his initial post he was on the road and wouldn't check back in for a few days. He's an old member that probably got tired of the bullshit and needed a break.
You are correct. I apologize.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 18 2013, 12:30 PM
TNSTAAFL.
The Cap'n
Hey Krusty - good to see you have stuck it out.......
Good to have you back. Just 'cause you have a new account doesn't mean you get another free pass. I believe you've used yours, so you're fair game for my Krustiness ........................ HA!
Seriously, welcome back into the fold .........................
The Cap'n
I would expect nothing less from your holy krustiness!
Yepper, feels like I never been away.............
Posted by: stugray Nov 18 2013, 03:12 PM
Oh, you could definitely make it work.
Then put it in hurricane force winds for a week to charge a battery.
Then you might be able to drive for a couple hundred yards....
TNSTAAFL - Heinlein is my favorite
Quick sanity check:
~80hp = ~60 kw
60 kw wind turbine in 20 MPH winds:
http://masteringgreen.com/wipo-60-kw.html
So you need a windturbine bigger than a house and weighs thousands of pounds.
Posted by: Chris H. Nov 18 2013, 03:57 PM
Anything's posssible .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=flge_rw6RG0
As fate would have it there's a bay window on the left...
Posted by: barefoot Nov 18 2013, 05:00 PM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
Posted by: skeates Nov 18 2013, 05:38 PM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
The difference here is that (I think) the original poster expects to use the relative difference between the vehicle speed and ambient air speed (termed here as "wind") to power his vertical wind turbine which is in-turn expected to power the vehicle. Since this "wind" is actually generated by the vehicle itself there is no energy to harness that is coming from outside of the vehicle's energy system - hence the 'perpetual motion' designation. At best the original poster may be able to recoup some of the energy used to propel the car when he wishes to slow down in a form very similar to regenerative braking, but second law losses will severely limit exactly how much of that is recouped. If it is being used to capture energy from actual wind (e.g. energy in the atmosphere) then certainly this is no perpetual motion device...but as was alluded to before there simply isn't enough there to capture to reach his goal of a cross country trek, even if he had a constant headwind the entire way! Same goes with solar power (PV). There simply isn't a high enough energy density of solar radiation to power a car of this nature - especially given the pathetic efficiency of PV panels.
All that said welcome back to the site 1jwalters and good luck with your project. We all need hobbies!
Posted by: messix Nov 18 2013, 06:35 PM
interesting. up wind at better than 2.0/1 speed.....
so once you get going ?????
http://phys.org/news/2012-07-blackbird-cart-fast.html
Posted by: Dr Evil Nov 18 2013, 10:30 PM
Dont listen to Scooter, I am still here........for now 
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 05:51 AM
Oh, you could definitely make it work.
Then put it in hurricane force winds for a week to charge a battery.
Then you might be able to drive for a couple hundred yards....
TNSTAAFL - Heinlein is my favorite
Quick sanity check:
~80hp = ~60 kw
60 kw wind turbine in 20 MPH winds:
http://masteringgreen.com/wipo-60-kw.html
So you need a windturbine bigger than a house and weighs thousands of pounds.
Ughhh, well there is more ways than your way to skin a cat.
Funny how people seem to be soooo clairvoyant and just "know" what components I am going to use, even when I have said nothing at all.....
Well stugrey I am using components that you are not aware of....and I am using MY design of wind turbine which you do not comprehend of...I am not doing what others have tried and failed - what would be the point of that? Plus that would certainly make all my licenses and certifications questionable...
But thank you for your,,,,comment, I guess....
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 05:57 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
So what I am reading here is.....why should I try? Because some "law" ....."says" something.....
Listen guys - I am not going to pass the gravy here!
What I am doing would be considered "outside of the box." So when you guys start citing "laws of thermodynamics this, and laws of perpetual motion that" you are all way, way wrong.......on a total other planet even..But the REAL skinny is I am really not doing anything groundbreaking - I am just the one who was able to see the forest through the trees is all
All too many times people get bogged down with "data" and that alone is a stumbling block. When I have a question to something I do not "google" it...I research it...
You nay sayers are going to be sooooo upended when you discover my method of accomplishment it will be talked about for years to come.......
Glad to be back home, like I said before, it is as if I have never left! For over 5 years that is......
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
The difference here is that (I think) the original poster expects to use the relative difference between the vehicle speed and ambient air speed (termed here as "wind") to power his vertical wind turbine which is in-turn expected to power the vehicle. Since this "wind" is actually generated by the vehicle itself there is no energy to harness that is coming from outside of the vehicle's energy system - hence the 'perpetual motion' designation. At best the original poster may be able to recoup some of the energy used to propel the car when he wishes to slow down in a form very similar to regenerative braking, but second law losses will severely limit exactly how much of that is recouped. If it is being used to capture energy from actual wind (e.g. energy in the atmosphere) then certainly this is no perpetual motion device...but as was alluded to before there simply isn't enough there to capture to reach his goal of a cross country trek, even if he had a constant headwind the entire way! Same goes with solar power (PV). There simply isn't a high enough energy density of solar radiation to power a car of this nature - especially given the pathetic efficiency of PV panels.
All that said welcome back to the site 1jwalters and good luck with your project. We all need hobbies!
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 05:58 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
So what I am reading here is.....why should I try? Because some "law" ....."says" something.....
Listen guys - I am not going to pass the gravy here!
What I am doing would be considered "outside of the box." So when you guys start citing "laws of thermodynamics this, and laws of perpetual motion that" you are all way, way wrong.......on a total other planet even..But the REAL skinny is I am really not doing anything groundbreaking - I am just the one who was able to see the forest through the trees is all
All too many times people get bogged down with "data" and that alone is a stumbling block. When I have a question to something I do not "google" it...I research it...
You nay sayers are going to be sooooo upended when you discover my method of accomplishment it will be talked about for years to come.......
Glad to be back home, like I said before, it is as if I have never left! For over 5 years that is......
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
The difference here is that (I think) the original poster expects to use the relative difference between the vehicle speed and ambient air speed (termed here as "wind") to power his vertical wind turbine which is in-turn expected to power the vehicle. Since this "wind" is actually generated by the vehicle itself there is no energy to harness that is coming from outside of the vehicle's energy system - hence the 'perpetual motion' designation. At best the original poster may be able to recoup some of the energy used to propel the car when he wishes to slow down in a form very similar to regenerative braking, but second law losses will severely limit exactly how much of that is recouped. If it is being used to capture energy from actual wind (e.g. energy in the atmosphere) then certainly this is no perpetual motion device...but as was alluded to before there simply isn't enough there to capture to reach his goal of a cross country trek, even if he had a constant headwind the entire way! Same goes with solar power (PV). There simply isn't a high enough energy density of solar radiation to power a car of this nature - especially given the pathetic efficiency of PV panels.
All that said welcome back to the site 1jwalters and good luck with your project. We all need hobbies!
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 06:01 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
So what I am reading here is.....why should I try? Because some "law" ....."says" something.....
Listen guys - I am not going to pass the gravy here!
What I am doing would be considered "outside of the box." So when you guys start citing "laws of thermodynamics this, and laws of perpetual motion that" you are all way, way wrong.......on a total other planet even..But the REAL skinny is I am really not doing anything groundbreaking - I am just the one who was able to see the forest through the trees is all, traveling the planet contracting on all kinds of aircraft, related equipment, yada, yada. I have been blessed to had been side by side with ground breaking new equipment design, development, and manufacture since 2005.....it has been a great ride!
All too many times people get bogged down with "data" and that alone is a stumbling block. When I have a question to something I do not "google" it...I research it...
You nay sayers are going to be sooooo upended when you discover my method of accomplishment it will be talked about for years to come.......
Glad to be back home, like I said before, it is as if I have never left! For over 5 years that is......
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
The difference here is that (I think) the original poster expects to use the relative difference between the vehicle speed and ambient air speed (termed here as "wind") to power his vertical wind turbine which is in-turn expected to power the vehicle. Since this "wind" is actually generated by the vehicle itself there is no energy to harness that is coming from outside of the vehicle's energy system - hence the 'perpetual motion' designation. At best the original poster may be able to recoup some of the energy used to propel the car when he wishes to slow down in a form very similar to regenerative braking, but second law losses will severely limit exactly how much of that is recouped. If it is being used to capture energy from actual wind (e.g. energy in the atmosphere) then certainly this is no perpetual motion device...but as was alluded to before there simply isn't enough there to capture to reach his goal of a cross country trek, even if he had a constant headwind the entire way! Same goes with solar power (PV). There simply isn't a high enough energy density of solar radiation to power a car of this nature - especially given the pathetic efficiency of PV panels.
All that said welcome back to the site 1jwalters and good luck with your project. We all need hobbies!
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 06:03 AM
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car/x/5342378
My latest project. Recently I designed a new generation wind turbine. I am going to miniaturize my design and work it into the front trunk area of a teener.
My goal is to drive coast to coast non-stop........
Ambitious? Yes!
Doable? Yes!
I will accept any help thrown my way!
By the way, it is great to be back here, I missed this place!
Dead down wind faster than the wind DDWFTTW It works, see the videos
Barefoot
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJpdWHFqHm0
The difference here is that (I think) the original poster expects to use the relative difference between the vehicle speed and ambient air speed (termed here as "wind") to power his vertical wind turbine which is in-turn expected to power the vehicle. Since this "wind" is actually generated by the vehicle itself there is no energy to harness that is coming from outside of the vehicle's energy system - hence the 'perpetual motion' designation. At best the original poster may be able to recoup some of the energy used to propel the car when he wishes to slow down in a form very similar to regenerative braking, but second law losses will severely limit exactly how much of that is recouped. If it is being used to capture energy from actual wind (e.g. energy in the atmosphere) then certainly this is no perpetual motion device...but as was alluded to before there simply isn't enough there to capture to reach his goal of a cross country trek, even if he had a constant headwind the entire way! Same goes with solar power (PV). There simply isn't a high enough energy density of solar radiation to power a car of this nature - especially given the pathetic efficiency of PV panels.
All that said welcome back to the site 1jwalters and good luck with your project. We all need hobbies!
So what I am reading here is.....why should I try? Because some "law" ....."says" something.....
Listen guys - I am not going to pass the gravy here for free!
What I am doing would be considered "outside of the box." So when you guys start citing "laws of thermodynamics this, and laws of perpetual motion that" you are all way, way wrong.......on a total other planet even..But the REAL skinny is I am really not doing anything groundbreaking - I am just the one who was able to see the forest through the trees is all, traveling the planet contracting on all kinds of aircraft, related equipment, yada, yada. I have been blessed to had been side by side with ground breaking new equipment design, development, and manufacture since 2005.....it has been a great ride!
All too many times people get bogged down with "data" and that alone is a stumbling block. When I have a question to something I do not "google" it...I research it...
You nay sayers are going to be sooooo upended when you discover my method of accomplishment it will be talked about for years to come.......
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 06:13 AM
Oh, you could definitely make it work.
Then put it in hurricane force winds for a week to charge a battery.
Then you might be able to drive for a couple hundred yards....
TNSTAAFL - Heinlein is my favorite
Quick sanity check:
~80hp = ~60 kw
60 kw wind turbine in 20 MPH winds:
http://masteringgreen.com/wipo-60-kw.html
So you need a windturbine bigger than a house and weighs thousands of pounds.
Check this out - in our Falcon jets we have a system known as the 20kva system. It is a 20KVA genset that measures appx 10 inches long and 6 inches in width. It drives our radar system requirements using hydraulic fluid under pressure turning a motor......And that hydraulic motor is tiny, tiny, tiny compared to the genset///
Not just for you, but for all others here - you all still think that more power cannot be generated than used? Coast Guard has been doing it for decades. Also next time you walk into a room and flip a switch . was more power instantly generated by the power station the very moment you flipped that switch? Or was it waiting there all the time waiting for you to flip the switch....
I know, I know the "know-all" eggheads are about to pounce, so i will just say one thing....take a breath and think before spouting off. I have a very, very strong history of making people look very bad, even on this board......
Listen guys, there are better mouse traps out there. Just because a person like Elon musk hasn't thought them up yet does not mean they are not present......
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 19 2013, 06:17 AM
Dont listen to Scooter, I am still here........for now
Evil.............(pinky finger next to mouth)
You a full fledged doctor now? If so congrats!!!
Posted by: 69telecaster Nov 19 2013, 07:15 AM
I don't want to know HOW it works...yet...but I do want to know IF it works. The video and photos show what I assume to be a prototype. A rotor on good bearings spinning by turning a fan on it doesn't impress me...we all made pinwheels when we were little kids. Someone earlier suggested you connect that spinning rotor to a generator to, in turn, run the fan, and see how long it goes. Have you done this? Have you connected the spinning rotor to ANYTHING to actually do work or generate power?
If you're looking for investors, or acceptance, you should consider demonstrating some kind of results...please.
cm
Posted by: mepstein Nov 19 2013, 07:34 AM
Guys - One of the internet 10 comandments is: Don't feed the trolls.
Posted by: timothy_nd28 Nov 19 2013, 07:42 AM
I rode the short bus, I made no pinwheels
Posted by: stugray Nov 19 2013, 09:33 AM
Where does it get it's hydraulic pressure? A tiny little fraction of a watt windmill?
So the planet you are on is apparently not this one.
So you have either figured out how to drive a 914 down the road with a fraction of a watt of power, or you have figured out windturbine technology that multi-billion dollars worth of reasearch money has not. Good for you.
Posted by: messix Nov 19 2013, 07:00 PM
same thing probably happened when it was proposed that a very small amount of gasoline or diesel could power a engine that could move several tons back in the day when it took a ton of coal and water to move the same.
good luck
Posted by: flippa Nov 19 2013, 07:54 PM
same thing probably happened when it was proposed that a very small amount of gasoline or diesel could power a engine that could move several tons back in the day when it took a ton of coal and water to move the same.
good luck
People made fun of Michael Faraday, Nikola Tesla, Alexander Graham Bell, Thomas Edison, John Hays Hammond, Jr., etc., etc., etc. Nothing but a bunch of crackpots.
Good luck with your project.
Posted by: ruby914 Nov 19 2013, 09:03 PM
Welcome back J.
I have a question, or two.
How much load will be on that turbine shaft to produce the power to charge the batteries? Have you tested the turbine with the same load?
How much drag will the turbine inlet add to the front of the car? Have you accounted for that?
Good luck
Posted by: Rand Nov 19 2013, 09:07 PM
You place this among those? But I would love nothing more than him joining those ranks.
Posted by: mskala Nov 19 2013, 10:03 PM
I've been trying to stay out of this, but ...
People made fun of anybody doing something different, both nutjobs and
serious folks.
I knew our friend was in the former category when his video said "The first
attempt design works so incredibly efficiently I stopped developement (sic)"
Also there is a random guy in China who already built a car with a re-
generative turbine on the front (he probably already patented it ).
Bottom line is that if you can do the whole thing yourself, go ahead, it
will prove itself. If you can't do it all by yourself, you need a couple
pesky little things called physics and mathematics, used properly to get
somebody else's money. (Or dumb-ass celebrities without it). Only
the fraudsters and crackpots scream about their secret unique
math-free black box device and how they'll show the world.
Look at youtube and be surprised at how many idiots think they're
one step away from the perfect "magnet motor".
Posted by: boxsterfan Nov 19 2013, 11:17 PM
Posted by: Elliot Cannon Nov 19 2013, 11:57 PM
This looks pretty cool. I'm ready to invest. Who do I send my life savings to? 
Posted by: Rand Nov 20 2013, 02:55 AM
This looks pretty cool. I'm ready to invest. Who do I send my life savings to?
The button on his indiegogo site which he posted here for all of us to contribute to.. Since I am neutral and do not wish to promote ill will (or will of any sort), I will support OP and re-share the link from which he asks donations: Just click the big red button upon your arrival at the following link...
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car
Your support will help raise his bar above ZERO dollars.
Posted by: Rand Nov 20 2013, 03:16 AM
Oh. And Scotty, I forgot to acknowledge my appreciation for your: " 't "
The difference between would, and wouldn't changes everything. 
(Hi Troy)
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 07:52 AM
Where does it get it's hydraulic pressure? A tiny little fraction of a watt windmill?
So the planet you are on is apparently not this one.
So you have either figured out how to drive a 914 down the road with a fraction of a watt of power, or you have figured out windturbine technology that multi-billion dollars worth of reasearch money has not. Good for you.
No, the hydraulic pump is located on the accessory section of the Honeywell ATF3-6 turbo-fan engine. It is about 6 inches tall and on a 4 inch bolt circle. This pump feeds the hydraulic motor which operates the 20KVA genset.
Many, many aircraft utilize this type of apparatus. It is known as as a C.S.D. or Constant Speed Device...
Hey man, just because you apparently are not aware of aviation technology......well.......why are you so dismissive of what you do not know? It is your opinion but man, your coming off as a colossal jerk brother...
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 07:58 AM
Well just got great news - my invention has caught the eye of a National news affiliate! I am meeting with them tomorrow morning to do a story!
Yippie!
Just apply yourselves guys - just because a multi-million dollar conglomerate has not thought of it yet does not signify anything.........
People are always coming up with new ideas, processes, products, ..............again just because a company with all the money in the world at its disposal does not mean they already thought of it and then subsequently dismissed it!
I have seen some truly neat stuff people have done with respect to their Teeners here - apply what you have done to another segment of the market place - it just may work!
PEACE
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 08:02 AM
This looks pretty cool. I'm ready to invest. Who do I send my life savings to?
The button on his indiegogo site which he posted here for all of us to contribute to.. Since I am neutral and do not wish to promote ill will (or will of any sort), I will support OP and re-share the link from which he asks donations: Just click the big red button upon your arrival at the following link...
http://www.indiegogo.com/projects/self-sustaining-electric-car
Your support will help raise his bar above ZERO dollars.
It is more about exposure Rand - not the dollars. I am still going to do the project with outside funding or not, it will just take a bit longer - maybe not it really depends on a multitude of things. Obviously in some past life I have pissed you off and you intend to make good on your retribution.........a word of caution Rand
I did not ask anything from anybody on here...not one thing. What I included was a link to what I am doing project wise.
So let me make this fact clear right here and now: I am not "asking" anything from anybody. I am only sharing my project with a Porsche 914 enthusiast crowd.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 08:03 AM
This looks pretty cool. I'm ready to invest. Who do I send my life savings to?
It costs more than 10 cents to do the contribution itself........
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 08:05 AM
I've been trying to stay out of this, but ...
People made fun of anybody doing something different, both nutjobs and
serious folks.
I knew our friend was in the former category when his video said "The first
attempt design works so incredibly efficiently I stopped developement (sic)"
Also there is a random guy in China who already built a car with a re-
generative turbine on the front (he probably already patented it
).Bottom line is that if you can do the whole thing yourself, go ahead, it
will prove itself. If you can't do it all by yourself, you need a couple
pesky little things called physics and mathematics, used properly to get
somebody else's money. (Or dumb-ass celebrities without it). Only
the fraudsters and crackpots scream about their secret unique
math-free black box device and how they'll show the world.
Look at youtube and be surprised at how many idiots think they're
one step away from the perfect "magnet motor".
My design works and it works "right out of the box." Is it wrong for a person who has the experience and training that I possess to be able to design a "thing" so well that it works first time out? Seriously?
wow
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 08:08 AM
same thing probably happened when it was proposed that a very small amount of gasoline or diesel could power a engine that could move several tons back in the day when it took a ton of coal and water to move the same.
good luck
Thanks bro! All I am really doing is bringing the possibility of the everyday person to access wind power. There is not one single solitary national conglomerate that offers true access to free wind energy on the planet....
I will be providing plans, prints, and construction call-outs. this way a person could actually build their own in their own shop...be about 6 months till they are ready, but it could be sooner.
Posted by: stugray Nov 20 2013, 08:56 AM
Ummm hate to pull this card , but you dealt it, i am an aerospace engineer (and I slept at a holiday inn express last night) that turbofan engine is probably capable of delivering over 100 HP of hydraulic power to the genset. I fail to see how that is even relevant.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 09:52 AM
Welcome back J.
I have a question, or two.
How much load will be on that turbine shaft to produce the power to charge the batteries? Have you tested the turbine with the same load?
How much drag will the turbine inlet add to the front of the car? Have you accounted for that?
Good luck
Hi Ruby,
The load on the shaft is quite low, only torsional loads are being applied. The turbine for the vehicle install will be engineered shortly. Basically it will be a "scaled" down version of my current prototype with some enhancements, but minor ones at that.
The overall drag effect will be zero, this is based on the airflow properties which I have engineered into the overall design. Airflow management is the quintessential aspect of aircraft design: air in; air through; air exit; and air surrounding the object in question. So in this respect there is not going to be a problem with any associated rise in drag.
however it does impart a need to remain a respective amount of distance from the vehicle directly in front of the car. Hence why I will pay for the various state's Highway patrol for an escort. The other very real factor is having the escort will allow a quick exit and detour around problem areas such a wrecks, construction, etc.
Posted by: 1jwalters Nov 20 2013, 09:56 AM
Ummm hate to pull this card , but you dealt it, i am an aerospace engineer (and I slept at a holiday inn express last night) that turbofan engine is probably capable of delivering over 100 HP of hydraulic power to the genset. I fail to see how that is even relevant.
Well, hate to tell you Mr. aerospace engineer, but the accessory pad on the engine in question is rated for 110 inch pounds of torque. -OR- 9.16 foot pounds of torque.
Again, Mr. engineer, you are talking to a person who has maintained, modified, and flown in this aircraft for almost a decade...........just so you know, maybe I have not made this fact glaringly obvious before..
Cheers!
Posted by: 69telecaster Nov 20 2013, 10:28 AM
Fluff and bragging...talk, talk, talk.
Let's see it work.
cm
Posted by: Mikey914 Nov 20 2013, 10:35 AM
I just though of something.
Say this thing works.
But as a practical application -
You could have no other cars in front of you ( now when a car cuts you off it would literally cut you off), but passing a Semi would disrupt your airflow also.
This would definately affect the driavability of the vehicle.
Posted by: stugray Nov 20 2013, 11:15 AM
Again, Mr. engineer, you are talking to a person who has maintained, modified, and flown in this aircraft for almost a decade...........just so you know, maybe I have not made this fact glaringly obvious before..
You still have not said one thing relevant to this discussion.
You state that an aircraft power system (that you might have actually touched once) is powerful enough to drive a radar.
What radar, what power level?
There are cars that have radar that tell you if you are going to hit something that draws about a quarter of a watt...
What has that possibly got to do with powering a 914 with the wind?
Even remotely?
A small powerplant can provide a megawatt of electricity over a 1 inch cable.
So I can drive a submarine with a windmill powered by my grandchild blowing on a pinwheel.
See not one single (relevant) unit in that statement, but it must be true....
You have not made one single claim about your design that actually uses physics, units, or even MATH yet you expect us all to believe you "just because"????
- 
And I love the part where you can make the claim that I know nothing about "Aerospace Technology" after 20 years in aerospace, but now I am "Mr Engineer". Hey - dont throw stones in glass houses... (or shall I say do not light fires while supported by strawmen?)
The last "vehicle" I was in charge of cost more than 1 Billion dollars....
Posted by: skeates Nov 20 2013, 11:41 AM
So looking at the video of this design and re-reading through the posts it seems to me that I've found the one glaring reason this won't work.
It seems that this turbine thing is basically a turbo charger for an electric 914...and I seem to remember something about turbos and 914s...
Posted by: skeates Nov 20 2013, 11:43 AM
But seriously can we get Dr. Evil to take the vitals on this thread? 
Posted by: stugray Nov 20 2013, 11:54 AM
Ok, lets put this in perspective using some physics.
If you had a air intake of one square meter (3.3 feet by 3.3 feet)
If you had air moving through this intake at 25meter/second ( ~55 Miles per hour).
Air weighs 1.205 kilograms/cubic-meter
The total kinetic energy of of one cubic meter of air at 25 m/s is:
E = 1/2*m*v^2 = 1/2*1.204*25^2 = 376.25 joules
So one cubic meter of air moving at 25 meters per second has a total kinetic energy of 376.25 joules.
so an air stream moving through your intake at 25m/s has a total energy of 25*376.25 joules = 9406.25 joules/second = 9406.25 watts.
9406.25 watts = 12.61 horsepower.
That is the TOTAL amount of energy in the moving air.
So IF:
You have a 3.3 foot by 3.3 foot intake
The car is moving ~55MPH
You slow the exit air to ZERO velocity (not possible or you just made a vacuum behind the car)
Your turbine extracts 100% of the energy from the moving air
Your energy conversion system is 100% efficient
THEN you theoretically can extract 12 horsepower.
In reality you cannot hope to get better than 20% efficiency in the whole system ( and THAT is generous)
for a whopping 2.4 hp.
Now sorry but that is just plain "physics".
The above assumes a stationary car in a wind tunnel for simplicity.
A car moving through stationary air is even less "efficient"
Care to share any of your calculations?
"Mr. Engineer"
Posted by: Rand Nov 20 2013, 12:09 PM
That's the second time you've threatened me. What do you have in mind?
I'm just calling it as I see it. Only this, only here. I don't have anything personal against you.
Posted by: jd74914 Nov 20 2013, 12:28 PM
Well, hate to tell you Mr. aerospace engineer, but the accessory pad on the engine in question is rated for 110 inch pounds of torque. -OR- 9.16 foot pounds of torque.
You mean you torque the bolts to 9 ft*lbs?
Posted by: stugray Nov 20 2013, 01:11 PM
He means that his 20KVA (26.82 hp) genset has to rotate at ~15000 RPM at 9.17 ft-lbs torque.
Still have no idea how that is relevant.
Posted by: bandjoey Nov 20 2013, 02:33 PM
The all laughted at Edison. I'm watching and can't wait to see the results. Someone someday will come up with Warp Drive. How bout you?
Posted by: ruby914 Nov 20 2013, 02:49 PM
Elliot,
If we put a 2nd prop in front of the 1st prop on that V-tail... That is, to make the 1st prop go faster 
The faster we went, the faster we would go
Dude, 188,000 MPS here we come.
This looks pretty cool. I'm ready to invest. Who do I send my life savings to?
Posted by: Java2570 Nov 20 2013, 03:28 PM
I'm not an engineer, I'm just an idiot that likes my 914.....but one thing sticks in my mind, whether
this idea works or not, not many people give development money to projects without seeing the
concept work for real. Start hitting up all those big corporate sponsors. Good luck with your project though!
Posted by: mepstein Nov 20 2013, 09:34 PM
word of the day:
attention whore
Label given to any person who craves attention to such an extent that they will do anything to receive it. The type of attention (negative or positive) does not matter.
Posted by: mskala Nov 20 2013, 10:09 PM
My design works and it works "right out of the box." Is it wrong for a person who has the experience and training that I possess to be able to design a "thing" so well that it works first time out? Seriously?
wow
Two different things. Yes, it is ridiculous to have a first design and have it
so great that development stops. However, if you are talking about just
doing something slightly different from your years of 'experience and training'
then sure, make your slightly different new gadget; but don't call it 'first
attempt design'.
Posted by: Dr Evil Nov 21 2013, 08:58 AM
Hence why I will pay for the various state's Highway patrol for an escort. The other very real factor is having the escort will allow a quick exit and detour around problem areas such a wrecks, construction, etc.
Ok, now this is the part I have a problem with believing. No way
On a more serious note, if the OP has no interest (as stated several times) in pandering for money here, is only wishing to share their thoughts and build on a concept, then why is there such vitriol towards him here? What does it matter if he is off of his rocker or not. He is going to try, why not cheer him on? Is it because there is want to be in the front row of the "I told you so" crowd if it fails? Would it not be better to back a brother up even if you think they are a crack pot? He is not hurting anyone, is applying himself in a way that makes him happy, and has been pretty tolerant of the less than courteous comments here. Like putting a diesel in a 914
I choose to support your endeavor with well wishes. Good luck, keep up the updates.
Posted by: timothy_nd28 Nov 21 2013, 09:49 AM
Here's a quick dirty little test you could do to prove or disprove this concept. Figure out what power this device would generate at 50 mph. Now with the car sitting still, back feed that same power into the wind turbine. Essentially it should work backwards and start blowing air. Does the car move at all with this thing shooting air out?
Posted by: JRust Nov 21 2013, 11:58 AM
On a more serious note, if the OP has no interest (as stated several times) in pandering for money here, is only wishing to share their thoughts and build on a concept, then why is there such vitriol towards him here? What does it matter if he is off of his rocker or not. He is going to try, why not cheer him on? Is it because there is want to be in the front row of the "I told you so" crowd if it fails? Would it not be better to back a brother up even if you think they are a crack pot? He is not hurting anyone, is applying himself in a way that makes him happy, and has been pretty tolerant of the less than courteous comments here. Like putting a diesel in a 914
I choose to support your endeavor with well wishes. Good luck, keep up the updates.
. If he isn't here asking for money. How is it any different than any other build thread. It's intruiging & I'll be watching the thread. Assuming the rest of the bullshit blasting goes away. How about we move away from disproving it will work . Wish the guy luck & sit back to watch
Posted by: ruby914 Nov 21 2013, 12:16 PM
I do agree, we should should be more supportive and less critical of any miscalculations. My car is a petri dish of thoughts. Some worked out better than others. I myself started my 914 project thinking of generating on-board hydrogen.
Reality set in. That Idea moved to the in home natural gas fill stations. That Thought died with the Pickens Plan.
I remember in the OP, "I will accept any help thrown my way!" Help was the key word not throw.
Seems like he has been sailing into the wind from the start. Please forgive my sarcasm.
So, is this a build thread?
I suggest you start with a pickup truck. Put the turbine in the back and record real
power generated at what speed. I am still not convinced on little to no drag. Unless you limit your intake within the size of the front bumper.
Hence why I will pay for the various state's Highway patrol for an escort. The other very real factor is having the escort will allow a quick exit and detour around problem areas such a wrecks, construction, etc.
Ok, now this is the part I have a problem with believing. No way
On a more serious note, if the OP has no interest (as stated several times) in pandering for money here, is only wishing to share their thoughts and build on a concept, then why is there such vitriol towards him here? What does it matter if he is off of his rocker or not. He is going to try, why not cheer him on? Is it because there is want to be in the front row of the "I told you so" crowd if it fails? Would it not be better to back a brother up even if you think they are a crack pot? He is not hurting anyone, is applying himself in a way that makes him happy, and has been pretty tolerant of the less than courteous comments here. Like putting a diesel in a 914
I choose to support your endeavor with well wishes. Good luck, keep up the updates.
Posted by: Steve Pratel Nov 21 2013, 01:51 PM
Funny stuff............. I think a couple of these guys need to get a room.... 
geeze............. Nothing like 
in public huh? really??
Will be interesting to see how this develops. The main issue I have with the perpetual motion idea is the ability (or lack of) to generate and store power quicker than it is consumed. Modern lithium batteries and superconductor technogies makes this far more accessable than in the past i.e you can carge a lithium battery to full in 1 hour and will discharge at a much slower rate.
Bottom line is even if when the vehicle is in motion it can maintain and recharge the batteries, there will need to be a substantial reserve. I imagine given conditions and open highway roads, etc, this might be doable, but the headroom will quickly evaporate in any stop and go traffic or if clear flow of air to turbine is blocked... or....
I'm also guessing this will have to have plug capability in for the initial charge.
OK< I actually just watched the video and read the comments, and I have to say I got quite a laugh..... The killer is this last comment....
The successful completion of this project will allow the gathering of data to be able to manufacturer retrofit units! These retrofit units will be primarily for 18 wheelers and other large over-the-road commercial vehicles. These vehicles currently attain a mileage rate of not better than 3 MPG. With the retrofit unit installed and operating the free energy processed by the Wind Engines will drive high torque electric motors attached to the trucks drive line. These units can quite possible increase a typical 18 wheeler MPG by 200% or better.
All, I'm going to say is OK.................. lol.
Posted by: Elliot Cannon Nov 21 2013, 10:21 PM
The all laughted at Edison. I'm watching and can't wait to see the results. Someone someday will come up with Warp Drive. How bout you?
Nobody laughed at Edison. He invented stuff. Proved it would work. Patented it. Then announced it and got funding.
Posted by: Mike Bellis Nov 21 2013, 11:13 PM
The all laughted at Edison. I'm watching and can't wait to see the results. Someone someday will come up with Warp Drive. How bout you?
Nobody laughed at Edison. He invented stuff. Proved it would work. Patented it. Then announced it and got funding.
They laughed at Tesla, Edison's apprentice. Now Edison's stuff is obsolete, except the light bulb. Tesla's stuff is still in use around the world... Tesla, father of Alternating Current...
Posted by: Tom Nov 22 2013, 02:41 AM
Tesla was on a different flight plan than most of his generation. Edison was on the ground in comparison in my opinion. They were both great inventors and thinkers. Tesla died alone and ridiculed, but his notes have proved most valuable.
Then there was Floyd "Sparky" Sweet and his VTA. VERY interesting!!! his experiments have been repeated by others including noted physicist Tom Bearden, who some say is a fraud.
Sparky had his life threatened by some strange folks that wanted him to cease his experiments. Magnetics and magnetic fields are a very complex subject and he spent his life learning more about it. He had multiple degrees in magnetics and worked with them for many years. Worth the time to google and read about him.
I say, good luck with your project.
Tom
Posted by: Elliot Cannon Nov 22 2013, 11:22 AM
The all laughted at Edison. I'm watching and can't wait to see the results. Someone someday will come up with Warp Drive. How bout you?
Nobody laughed at Edison. He invented stuff. Proved it would work. Patented it. Then announced it and got funding.
They laughed at Tesla, Edison's apprentice. Now Edison's stuff is obsolete, except the light bulb. Tesla's stuff is still in use around the world... Tesla, father of Alternating Current...
Edison offered Tesla $50,000 to come to the US and work with him. A huge sum of money back then. When Tesla got here (not easy for him), Edison told him, "What, you believed that"?
Edison insisted on DC power which was unworkable, Tesla's AC power has been used ever since. Kudos to Elon Musk for naming the car after him.
Posted by: Dr Evil Nov 22 2013, 01:52 PM
Edison electrocuted animals, including an elephant, to show that AC was dangerous.
Posted by: scotty b Nov 22 2013, 02:32 PM
Edison electrocuted animals, including an elephant, to show that AC was dangerous.
and you used Ac to weld up that intake no ?
I see your point
Posted by: ChrisNPDrider Nov 22 2013, 03:01 PM
Remember Ottmar's electric 914? He used that project to launch a career in EVs and is still going, I think. He had dual DC motors connected via a belt, and from what I heard, it was a fast 914!
I say, jwalters, build an EV 914. Then put the wind thingy in there. If it don't work, at least you have an EV 914
I want to build an EV 914. I'd like to do a DC motor direct into the 901 (modified to have only 2 or 3 gears) and then an AC motor connected so it could "take over" during cruising and generate power on deceleration. Attach PV cells to the targa roof, then take it off and angle it while parked to get a trickle charge...etc etc
It's still at the stage...
Posted by: biosurfer1 Nov 22 2013, 03:07 PM
Edison offered Tesla $50,000 to come to the US and work with him. A huge sum of money back then. When Tesla got here (not easy for him), Edison told him, "What, you believed that"?
Edison insisted on DC power which was unworkable, Tesla's AC power has been used ever since. Kudos to Elon Musk for naming the car after him.That's not what happened at all:
The Bet. Tesla insisted that he could increase the efficiency of Edison’s prototypical dynamos, and eventually wore down Edison enough to let him try. Edison, Tesla later claimed, even promised him $50,000 if he succeeded. Tesla worked around the clock for several months and made a great deal of progress. When he demanded his reward, Edison claimed the offer was a joke, saying, “When you become a full-fledged American, you will appreciate an American joke.” Edison offered a $10/week raise, instead. Ever prideful, Tesla quit, and spent the next few months picking up odd jobs across New York City. Nikola Tesla: ditch digger.
Read the full text here: http://mentalfloss.com/article/30140/acdc-tesla%E2%80%93edison-feud#ixzz2lPWwcaud
Posted by: ruby914 Nov 22 2013, 03:17 PM
The all laughted at Edison. I'm watching and can't wait to see the results. Someone someday will come up with Warp Drive. How bout you?
Nobody laughed at Edison. He invented stuff. Proved it would work. Patented it. Then announced it and got funding.
They laughed at Tesla, Edison's apprentice. Now Edison's stuff is obsolete, except the light bulb. Tesla's stuff is still in use around the world... Tesla, father of Alternating Current...
No more of Edison's light bulbs in my house, obsolete. Fluorescent and LED.
Posted by: PThompson509 Nov 22 2013, 09:27 PM
Personally I think the 914 is an excellent platform for EVs - after all, I've converted one.
That said, this link from a VERY reputable EV site might shed a bit of light on the subject:
http://www.diyelectriccar.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13644
So even with that link, I with the original poster best of luck, and hope that his project does indeed produce more energy than is used to move the car - that would indeed change the world.
Cheers!
Posted by: stugray Nov 27 2013, 03:25 PM
Posted by: euro911 Nov 28 2013, 02:18 AM
Having an open mind eliminates half the battle ... well, maybe not precisely 'half', but great discoveries and inventions that many of us take for granted today, simply would not have come into existence without those certain individuals, who brought them to light, thinking outside the box.
Back in the early '80's, I sat down with a blank sheet of paper and block diagrammed an electric hybrid automotive propulsion system. I received valuable input from several of my associates who possessed vast knowledge relating to the individual components in the design. It was only an idea, but the conclusion was that it was feasible, and that some day in the future, it was bound to happen on a large scale.
It is interesting to see that the basic design elements I had in my head are currently being utilized by a few hybrid automobile manufacturers.
I've witnessed major technological advancements in data processing, aerodynamics and exotic composites within the aerospace industry during my 32 year tenure. We've also seen the efficiency of photo-voltaic increase by more than 100% within the past decade, not to mention the major advancement in battery chemistry. I can only imagine what new technologies will be uncovered over the next 30 years
I'll be watching the developments and outcome of your endeavor with interest, Johnathan. Stay the course ...
Posted by: Rand Nov 29 2013, 06:56 PM
I was harsh on a couple points. Truth now will be in the telling. We've had all this fun with speculation. I sincerely wish best of luck.
Just prove it. Simple.
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