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Posted by: r_towle Dec 11 2014, 09:50 PM

What motors are you using?

Posted by: JRust Dec 11 2014, 10:38 PM

2000 2.5 SOHC with performance heads & cams. Normally aspirated putting 158hp to the rear wheels . With a suby tranny to for nice new shifting . That is a normally aspirated 4 cylinder

Posted by: Jake Raby Dec 11 2014, 10:42 PM

My favorite base engine is a 2007-2009 EJ25. These have DBW and VVT and we can really turn them up with port rebalance and symmetrical cams, coupled to a 2.8L bump with Nickies.

Posted by: d914 Dec 11 2014, 11:02 PM

Ej20k turbo 1997 , 275hp, 250 tq

Posted by: mgp4591 Dec 12 2014, 03:42 AM

EG33, modeled after the bulletproof EJ22. Forged steel crank and rods, forged aluminum pistons and 7 main bearings. Later on if you're so inclined you can fit EJ22 turbo pistons from JE or stock pieces and boost it past 400hp without working hard. Only 230hp stock but very restrictive intake and exhaust that when opened up will make lots more power with very little work. Longer and heavier than any other Subie engine, it will still work well in the 914. IMHO...

Posted by: effutuo101 Dec 12 2014, 09:43 AM

2004 2.5 16 valve with a G20 turbo.
Hope to have hp numbers in January.

Posted by: 76-914 Dec 12 2014, 09:54 AM

EZ30D. 1.5" longer than the 2.5 4cylinder. The lighter 6 of the Suby 6's. Whichever route you choose, and they're all an improvement, complete it with the Suby trans for the complete upgrade.

Posted by: 904svo Dec 12 2014, 12:01 PM

Stock 2007 WRX.

Posted by: r_towle Dec 12 2014, 12:28 PM

What car is this from?

Posted by: mepstein Dec 12 2014, 02:17 PM

And they're cheap to acquire

Posted by: Mueller Dec 12 2014, 08:45 PM

Are you running an EZ30D?

Anyone know how many of the Subaru conversions that are 6 cylinder versus 4 cylinder?

Posted by: 76-914 Dec 12 2014, 08:50 PM

Yeppers.

Posted by: scotty b Dec 12 2014, 08:58 PM

BRAT

Posted by: rnellums Dec 12 2014, 09:00 PM

+1 ez30. Not as much power potential as the 4s or the eg33 but modern fuel injection and boatloads of torque out of the box. Plus, how much more than 220 hp is really necessary...

Posted by: A&P Mech Dec 12 2014, 09:21 PM

Just joined the club. I picked up a ej253 today! I can't wait to get it installed!!!

Posted by: r_towle Dec 12 2014, 11:04 PM

Man, this subaru thing is full of all sorts of conflicting information.

From what i have read so far, there are no engine serial numbers on these motors.
The only way to identify a motor is based upon all the external bolt on parts, manifolds, coil packs etc...all of which can be changed.

So, walking into a junk yard, it's a gamble that you are buying a specific motor.

I am looking for an early ej20 turbo from a wrx sti.
How the heck am I supposed to be sure?
I want the forged Pistons, forged crank...
I won't be leaving this motor alone, that would defeat the whole purpose of this for me....so I want to start from a solid base.

Posted by: mgp4591 Dec 13 2014, 03:27 AM

If it's out of a WRX, it's got twin cam valve covers and it's a 2.0 unless it's been replaced which is doubtful but possible. 2.2 engines are in most Legacys and Imprezas up to 2002 with some being 2.5s, but everything 2003 and up will be 2.5. 3.3s are only available in the SVXs and are quite long where the 3.0s are only a tad longer than the 4 cyl engines. The STIs are all 2.5 and command premium prices and I'd definitely use a 6 speed STI tranny with it unless you like replacing transmissions regularly. Wish I could be more specific but hope this helps somewhat.

Posted by: DBCooper Dec 13 2014, 07:46 AM

Well, the U.S. STi's were all 2.5 liters, so that's a Japanese and Rest of World engine, meaning you're probably not going to find one in a junkyard. Try an importer, who'll also be able to certify what you're buying. You're right, though, the Subaru engines are a little like T4 cylnder heads, it's tough to tell them all apart without a program. And it's more complicated because there are a lot of engines used everywhere but the U.S., so the Wikipedia articles listing the engines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Subaru_engines and more interest to you http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Subaru_ej_engine) gets really complex, trying to point out what went where and what didn't. I've never seen a simple list of engine serial numbers, but maybe it exists and I just haven't seen it.

Back to your original question, I have a 2004 WRX engine, which I think is an EJ207 two liter. No modifications, especially, just cleaned up intake (removal of the emissions tumblers), exhaust (stock STi and no cats) and tuning (aftermarket ECU), which made 206 hp at the wheels. WRX 5MT transmission, so matched to the engine and a lot less expensive and simpler to install than the STi six speed.

Posted by: r_towle Dec 13 2014, 08:17 AM

I will refine what I am looking for....cause I still can't get the name or number right.

Late 90,s wrx turbo.
Sounds like the first high powered turbo.
It should be around in the junk yards.

Still boggles my mind....no serial numbers on these motors to help identify what is inside the case.

I will see what my local guy has already pulled today, see if i can make heads or tails of it....
I keep looking for a rusty old subaru because I would rather have a complete car to start with.

Posted by: 76-914 Dec 13 2014, 08:41 AM

The 6 speed is longer than the 5 speed. You'd probably have to remove the rear valance. If you couple that to an eg33 you might be into the firewall.

Rich, if it's a 4 banger you want you'll need to spend some time a Nasioc with the REAL brats. There is a ton of info on the FrankenMotors there.

If your on the fence re: a Suby 4 vs a 6 ask yourself what you want out of it:

Stock 4's = 165hp/torque, great economy and smooth, smooth Suby reliabilty.

STI/Turbo's/FrankenMotors = Ass stomping drag cars that are going to require some SS exhaust work, tuning and a drivetrain equal to the task. Probably not an AX car for the novice with the turbo.

Stock 6's = Loads of power, torque and reliability.

Turbo 6 = Demonic

I STRONGLY recommend purchasing a Suby donor car whichever route you choose.

Posted by: 76-914 Dec 13 2014, 08:50 AM

I keep looking for a rusty old subaru because I would rather have a complete car to start with.
[/quote]
Rich, go to CoPart and find the car you want in an area you want to shop e.g the Northeast to cut shipping costs. Look for a car with rear end damage. Stay away from rollovers. The $300 that you shell out for commission is chicken feed when you consider that you get just what you want and that it was just running a few weeks ago. If you look closely you will see that some will start and can be "driven" on and off the cargo carrier. Those, if low mileage are my first choice.

Posted by: R_u_dd Dec 13 2014, 08:52 AM

Here are two great links for engine specifics:

Ian's site http://www.coldwater914.com/category/conversion-info/ See Engine Options:

http://www.renegadehybrids.com/ Look under 914 > Subaru Kits

Posted by: r_towle Dec 13 2014, 08:54 AM

Why would I bother if it was not with demonic as the end goal....
For me, it would be pointless to learn otherwise.

I would rather get a whole car, and we are friends with the owner of the local yard....so he may let me borrow a car for a while....strip out what I want, then send it back.

It's all new to me.

I have spent quite a bit of time on the Nasioc site.....need to spend more time learning.
Thankfully there is a local shop that specializes in these Frankenstein cars, so I may reach out, may not...
Seems to be loads of information online about how to modify them, but loads of it is conflicting with many younger guys just bolting on parts to see what happens....which is actually cool in my opinion.
I would like to start with the forged Pistons, so I will see what the local guy has today.
My price point would be under 2k for a motor, but it needs to be turbo, with the harness and ECU.

Field trip today, after we put the clutch in the mini ....which currently is all apart, laying all over my shop, and my daughter is coming home today to use her car....so we will get it done today, hopefully.
Next time anyone whines about the price of parts, or the restricted amount of space to work on our cars, go do a clutch job on a Mini Cooper, then let me know how you feel about it......

Posted by: rnellums Dec 13 2014, 09:06 AM

Perrin did a truly demonic build on an EZ30, I believe it was turbo'd with NOS. Dyno'd at upwards of 600hp but I suspect longevity was poor, because I haven't heard of it since (and it was running 23psi of boost).

http://blog.perrinperformance.com/perrin-h6-build-up/

Posted by: a914622 Dec 13 2014, 09:39 AM

And the misinformation continues. All the motors have the series number cast right in the block, just behind the oil pressure sender. Also in the center top the bearing size is engraved. The number on the back top above starter is also very informative . The drivers side strut tower has the engine number on it as well.

The cable shift 6 speeds are the exact same size. The sti is a truck tranny and is larger.

The eg33 has the same fireing order as a 911 engine, so pipe it and it should have a simaler exhaust note.

Long tube headers make way more bottom end tork in all the ej,eg motor family.

Jcl

Posted by: rnellums Dec 13 2014, 09:48 AM

What years were the cable shift 6 speeds out of?

Posted by: Mueller Dec 13 2014, 09:53 AM

Are all the transmissions forward and backward compatible among all the 4 cylinders and 6 cylinders?

Posted by: rnellums Dec 13 2014, 09:58 AM

Unless you get something really Old I think so. You may not have the same bolt holes lining up, but they'll go together.
(Based on a 97 and a 2003 5mt both fitting on a 2001 H-6 that never was equipped with a manual)

Posted by: DBCooper Dec 13 2014, 12:52 PM

That's true, but the question is how to identify engine configurations by using those serial numbers. Are you aware of an index anywhere?


Yes, that transmission is an upgraded 5MT so should fit the same, except maybe the axles. But definitely in the recyclers by now.


Actually no, the Subaru SVX firing order is 1-6-3-2-5-4 and the Porsche sixes are 1-6-2-4-3-5. I don't know if that would make much difference in the sound, though considering that the Subaru sixes only cost about five hundred bucks I already know the sound's definitely close enough for me.

Posted by: a914622 Dec 13 2014, 10:40 PM

Dbcooper
Actually Yes the numbering is off but the jap engine starts the numbering on the oppeset side. So if you draw 2 flat 6 engines and number them you will see the cylinders fire in the exact same order as a 911.

The cable shift trannys started late 09 with the spec B. In late 12 I think all went to them.

Decoding the engine with out the plack on the drivers side strut can get tricky. But about the only one I would stay away from is the 96 doc engines, easy to spot by the square hole around the spark plug at the valve cover.

Jcl

Posted by: r_towle Dec 13 2014, 11:21 PM

So, it was not mis information.
There is no way to tell what motor I am looking at outside of a car except a large amount of bolt on parts, which can be swapped?

Rich

Posted by: DBCooper Dec 14 2014, 08:58 AM

Well I'll be go to hell, that's right. I never really thought about different layout, just saw the numbers were a different order. Cool, learn something new every day... thanks.


The interest here in the six speed is really the STi "truck" transmission because it's stronger than the 5MT (though no one's found a way to make the bigger/longer STi six speed fit into our cars). The newer cable-shift six speed is just a 5MT with an extra gear, no stronger, so the only advantage is that extra gear. Maybe also because we're converting the 5MT's to cable shift and that later transmission is already a cable. I don't know, never saw that myself because that transmission came out after my car was done, but could be interesting for anyone thinking of converting today. As long as it can be converted to the older female style inner CV's, anyway.

If you do run across an index that uses the engine serial numbers to identify configuration please let us know... would be very handy.

Posted by: DBCooper Dec 14 2014, 09:18 AM

Gonna look right into the teeth of the Demon, huh Rich? Sorry, not gonna be able to help you with that, you're scaring me. Should be viable for $2000 though, check any one of the dozens of Japanese engine importers for a JDM STi motor, 2.0 with forged internals. Think Megasquirt, though, you'll "learn" more relevant stuff with it, and won't need to spend so many late nights searching through a bunch of nearly indecipherable Japanese wiring diagrams and sensor spec sheets and learning otherwise useless information. Even better would be a harness and aftermarket ECU from Outfront, but if you're choosing to look straight into the teeth of the Demon you're definitely not interested in the Easy Way.

Posted by: JRust Dec 14 2014, 10:37 AM

There is a complete SVX in WA that was rear ended. Guy is selling it for $550 & still runs great. I'm probably lucky I have no trailer or truck right now. I'd totally go get that & bring it home

Posted by: abnrdo Dec 14 2014, 04:47 PM

2003 EZ30 and Subaru 5sp transmission. I am also going to run heat and air.

Posted by: mgp4591 Dec 14 2014, 06:35 PM

I want to see your heat and air system when you get it figured out- that's gonna be a comfy ride!

Posted by: abnrdo Dec 14 2014, 06:50 PM

Transmissions vary on gearing and either a push or pull type clutch. Some have hydraulic.

http://www.gearhack.com/myink/ViewPage.php?file=docs/Subaru+Transmission+Chart

Mine is: TY755VC4AA

Posted by: abnrdo Dec 14 2014, 06:51 PM

If you havent already, check out one of the best builds around. Jamie will tell you its awesome! (so will I)

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=87326&st=0&p=1070554&#entry1070554

Posted by: mgp4591 Dec 14 2014, 06:52 PM

You should FIND a truck and trailer, then bring it home! Another foray into the madness...

Posted by: mepstein Dec 14 2014, 06:56 PM

That link made my head hurt. I will probably get a trans from Ian at Coldwater and have him check it over and do the mods to make it work for my application.