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Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2015, 10:09 AM

Saw this over on Pelican....these guys seem to be very committed to RELIABLE swaps... love the passion! The Focus engine is only 130 HP stock but pretty cool. Which way does the Zetec spin?

http://www.bostig.com/

Just thought there are a lot of Vanagon fans here who might like to see this.

If you have never done a swap you might think the complete kit less engine, ECU and power steering pump is expensive @ $6k to which I say .

Posted by: 914forme Feb 18 2015, 10:32 AM

They have a rebate of $1000, if you met their list of demands.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 18 2015, 10:42 AM

Mixed results in the Vanagon world. I know two guys who did the Bostig swap and then switched to Subaru /4s. I know others who love them. The guys who switched weren't impressed with the torque of the Focus. I think those who are happy with their Bostigs are just glad to be done with the waterboxer.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2015, 10:48 AM

Could you (low pressure) turbo it...?

Posted by: Mark Henry Feb 18 2015, 11:11 AM

Yep I'd say the subi swap is still the most popular because it is still a boxer.
The VW 1.8T is likely 2nd place.

I have a buddy who does VW diesel swaps, he's done several syncros, but IMHO they are way too expensive for what you get.
But if you plan on doing 3rd world countries diesel is a good plan. He travels to central america most winters.

Most inline 4's sit too high, so many don't work well. For example the 1.8T you have to mod the pump P/U and lay it more on an angle.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 12:06 PM

EDIT:

Ha! So I found my Hannover VW Oldtimer Museum pix for the Vanagon foglights pix below, & here is the Porsche B32 from there.

So Chris - you're now officially WITH PC in this thread!

1985-87 (IIRC) PORSCHE B32 6 PASSENGER VAN ---v


Porsche apparently built 2 as "specials" to be support vehicles for the early `80's 959s offroad racing in Africa, etc., then in 1985 decided to try to build & sell a few to top end customers - most were this 6 passenger tin-top, with 1 of the 15+/- as a "California Joker" Westy Camper Van (in White). There's a lot of good info online about them.

Thanx for posting this! And here FYI & so you can change the NPC to SPC ....

Porsche B32 - the ultimate swap
- full Carrera 3.2L 6 + all suspension, brakes, Fuchs wheels, etc. done by the Porsche factory on 15-20 +/- Vanagons - including at least one camper - & sold by Porsche for about $70,000 DM in the early to mid 1980s!

Google for it, an interesting story & one B32 tin top resides in the Hanover VW Classic Oldtimer Works shop/museum.

If doing a semi-clone/tribute one today, I'd do it with the 986/996 or 987/997 -6 & more modern running gear. That would be my "if I win the Lotto" project for our 88 Westy!

Otherwise, from our perspective of being a few years away from retirement & then on a fixed income BS - the 48 month/48,000 mi warranty on a GoWesty 2.5L big bore/stroked flat 4 waterboxer would be our choice - just to have everything covered after popping down the cash for an engine swap if/when it's needed (the other swaps are only 6-12 month & 6-12k mi - if anything) - & after our spending lotsa $$$'s on the rolling resto 2012-14!

Cheers!
Tom
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Coupla Westy as 98% completed rolling resto pix....

Posted by: Jon H. Feb 18 2015, 12:10 PM

The Bostig set-up is a very complete kit but it is expensive as was mentioned! I did my vanagon/SVX swap for approx. $2500 and that included the engine, ecu and wiring harness.

Jon H.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2015, 12:49 PM

AWESOME Westy Tom. Love the look of those late Vanagons. Gotta have one.

Yeah for the more skilled you can certainly do it cheaper, but if not go for a complete kit. I have a huge box of stuff that looked like it would work for my conversion but did not. Probably several hundred $ worth.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 01:37 PM

Thanx Chris!

Yes on the kit or engine if you do it yourself, but in my case the GoWesty would be done by my long term 914/Westy/BMW mechanic (40 years later this year!), cuz he knows the car, & I get hammered with time required for my business & other BS.

The engine was replaced with a stock 2.1L rebuilt for thrown rod in the original at about 130k mi in `99 & top end done in 2006 for the typical reasons, so we're probably due soon now at 213k mi & almost 10 years later.

At least I'm right side up value wise, since these in this sort of like-new condition are valuing out now at $35-50+k & $50-100k +/- on the full GoWesty 2.4/2.5L engines or good Suby conversions.

I was surprised that it's post resto value would be more than the post-resto value on my 73 914-2.0 whenever it's done (at current values anyway). So that eased the pain of having to further postpone the 914 work to get the Westy done.



BTW - those are the Euro style fog light option as seen in that Hanover VW Oldtimer museum/shop pic below - but I used smaller & more powerful "modern" Hella MicroFF foglights (also available as driving lites) with the factory dash switch & an SS repop of the factory brackets from VW Bus Shop/Peter Gunzl in Germany.

BUS PARTS TIP:

Also as a Heads up for you Westy & other Vanagons & Buses out there - go to VW Bus Shop/Peter Gunzl in Germany FIRST for your parts - before you go to GoWesty, Bus Depot, Van Cafe, etc. - unless you need it right away & then only if it's in stock at those USA places.

http://www.vwbusshop.de/

They also carry Bus, & T1, T2, T4 7 T5 Van parts too - in addition to the T3 (T25 UK) Vanagon parts.

That's because GoWesty, Bus Depot, Van Cafe & most of the others are buying their stuff from them anyway & marking it up + making you wait for them to accumulate a shipping container of orders to ship to them, then to you. Gunzl will ship direct & it usually takes about 2-4 weeks (but still less than the US guys - unless they have the item in stock).

I didn't find out this until after spending a load for parts, & as 1 example I paid double for the window seals from Bus Depot when Gunzl still sold the kit (we wanted to keep the ones with the grooves for the plasti-chrome locking strips) ....

... PLUS - we had the dang Westy just sitting & waiting all painted for 8-9 months waiting for Bus Depot to get some of the seals etc. in a container - when the a-holes told me they had it all in stock & ready to ship!!!!

I would've waited to put the van in until I had parts in hand, if they'd just told me the truth!

I have a ton of other parts sources after all this tracking stuff down, so just shoot me an email or PM with what you need & I can suggest the source(s). I may be slow on answers now though, due to dealing with an elderly aunt back east in hospital, with me & the sibs as her only family for medical stuff etc., so be patient.

Cheers!
Tom
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Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2015, 02:29 PM

I WAAAAAANT THAAAAAAAAAAATTTTT



Thanks for all the Vanagon info Tom. Getting a serious itch for one (Unlikely a B32 but maybe a Subie clone ). I did see that the value for NICE Vanagons are way up there now just like the rest of the busses. Cool thing is you can USE them. Sorta like a 914.

Best wishes to your Aunt

EDIT: BTW We'll need Andy to help us order stuff from that site .

Posted by: rgalla9146 Feb 18 2015, 03:20 PM

We are real gluttons for punishment. We're interested in not one but two cars that need way too much to be the way we want.
Does anyone here know if a Boxster engine can be adapted to a 915 trans ?
Here's why I ask.
I'm not a fan of multi-national engine swaps.
Subagon, Fordagon not for me. No diesels either.
My only gripe with the orig. 2.1l is that it's too wound up on the highway.
Boxster engines are plentiful, and yes, I know about IMS probability. And I understand that the intake is a too tall, but maybe that can be remedied.
A water-cooled German boxer six in place of a water-cooled boxer four ? That's the ticket.
Any insight is appreciated.
Pictures of my '89 attached.




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Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 09:11 PM

I agree on the all German approach. IIRC the B32 used the 915 transmission + 3.2L 911 Carrera motor & all running gear, & they raised the rear deck about 3-4" - if you google for B32 pix online.

I said I'd opt for the waterboxer newer Boxter/Cayman/911 flavor 6's to keep it still all watercooled on the later Westies ..... IF I win the Lotto big!!

And get that dang snow off the Westy - the weight & ar resistance will just slow it down more!

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 09:32 PM

Nope - just click on the Brit flag at the top right & it switches to English like this ....
http://www.vwbusshop.de/epages/GuenzlClassicParts.sf/en_GB/?ViewObjectPath=%2FShops%2FGuenzlClassicParts

Thanx for the well wishes for my aunt, she's turned for the better today.

.

Here are some B32's that are more affordable.....

http://www.ebay.de/itm/VW-T3a-Porsche-B32-California-weiss-Modellauto-13030-Premium-Cl-1-43-/171680153409?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_77&hash=item27f8ef3f41



.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/VW-T3b-B32-Porsche-Bus-grau-Modellauto-13025-Premium-ClassiXXs-1-43-/181647557615?pt=Spielzeugautos&hash=item2a4b09c3ef



.

http://www.ebay.de/itm/1-43-Premium-Classixxs-Porsche-B32-Bus-blaugrau-metallic-13026-/381062291916?pt=Spielzeugautos&hash=item58b91521cc



Of course, they're a bit smaller than the "real" ones!

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 09:39 PM

And BTW Chris - you can safely change your topic title to SPC "Some Porsche Content" now!

The VW Bus Shop/Gunzl link I posted above in my last post above goes directly to the English version.

Cheers!
Tom
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Posted by: Mueller Feb 18 2015, 10:40 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=USBgPS7LE4M

I thought I saw another video years ago with an aircooled 3.6 in a Vanagon, it was blasting up some windy road and getting the rear end out a few feet here and there?

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2015, 10:51 PM

Fixed the title Tom! That parts site is a lot easier to read now! I'm liking the B32 Wasserboxer clone idea. Synchro might be cool too (or maybe not, you guys tell me).

This video is pretty popular Mike:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hCO4I4Am8x4



SVX engine...very tempting as well. Kelty360 has a very nice one... The in-car vid at the end is the best part. That guy is HAULING ASS in that Vanagon!

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2015, 11:18 PM

There are some good B32 engine bay videos on UTube too - cool to hear.

Apparently the 1980's Synchro was ahead of it's time & very good & reliable, but my wife wanted an automatic since the Westy was her DD & the Synchro Westy's were stick only (she's afraid to drive it to work & park in the hospital parking structure now that it's all purdy again).

If it were a modern Porsche waterboxer 6, then I'd say lean toward the 911 Carrera 4S setup for the AWD. Probably the way to go is to find a "donor" wrecked 996/997 4s for that, or any 986/987/996/997 - & all with the IMS fix done.

I think that the first chase car Vanagons used for the 959 Dakkar Races etc. may have been either Synchros or Porsche AWD, but it's been awhile since I read the articles about them & how they led to the B32.

Another Vano-6 to look at was the Oettenger -6 aftermarket conversion of the 1980's, which was the result of a joint VW-Porsche-Oettenger study on how VW could make the Vans more competitive with the V6 Dodge/Chryslers etc. of the time - & Porsche said put a H6 in it, & Oettenger/VW essentially a 2 cyl. add on to the 1.9L & then 2.1L VW waterboxer. There is also UTube & other info online for the Oettenger conversions, which oddly enough were about 70,000 DM on top of the Van too - so the B32 sounds like a bargain!

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=115681

I think the Subie H6 is the most cost effective conversion for more power & TQ, as compared to finding either a newer Porsche H6 or older Oettenger kit.

I don't know if the Subie AWD will stand up to the additional weight of the Vanagon/Westy, but would hope so - & the VW Synchro should too AFAIK.

Mark Henry &/or some others may know better on that detail & reliability question.

I say, why not spread out the traction & handling to 4WD or AWD to make the "brick on wheels" handle better on wet, snow, ice & dry pavement!

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 19 2015, 12:37 AM

We put about 25 of these Carrera powered Vanagons into service with our MSDS conversion kits, from 1990-2000.
This is my '86 awd Syncro, complete with dual zone AC, heat, power steering and diff-lock.
Marty

Posted by: 914forme Feb 19 2015, 12:01 PM

Marty,

You still have the Dual Cab Syncro around, that was my favorite conversion of yours. I need to get a Dual cab, replace my Chevy pickup. I would post likely do a SVX, as I have a few of them around right now. AWD is the Easy part.

Posted by: OU8AVW Feb 19 2015, 12:27 PM

Looking into a 2.5 Suby conversion now. Thanks for all the info!

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2015, 01:49 PM

Marty - so my wife's next question would be: "So would my cute little van be able to tow my cute little trailer with that motor?"

FYI - Her "cute little trailer" is a restored vintage 1960 Avion T20 (similar to Airstream) which weighs about 3000-3500# wet & loaded - maybe 4000# max., but I need to weigh it next trip (dry/empty excl. options factory is 2680#) & it's 21'-6" including the Hensley Cub WD/Anti-sway hitch, with electric drum brakes & I just weighed it with 535# hitch/tongue wt.

We're currently looking at 2006-10 Cayenne S with the V8's for a tow vehicle/3rd car - which looks like will run $18k - $30k, but a well done professional conversion to a "modern" waterboxer Porsche 6 AWD could be very interesting!

Is anyone doing them now?

Tom
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Posted by: Mark Henry Feb 19 2015, 02:02 PM

If you want to keep it "VW" and cheap-ish the 1.8/2.0T engine is the way to go.
The ABA engine can be made into a bolt in (well almost) using a bunch of Vanagon diesel kit.


This Google group has all the know how needed
https://sites.google.com/site/t2t3vaggasengineswaps/home

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2015, 02:56 PM

Thanx Mark,

But to keep it all OG - either VW or Porsche or otherwise - I'd do either a GoWesty 2.5L with their 48/48 warranty to keep it VW bored/stroked OE WBX4, or the "if I win the big Lotto" pipe dream go the Porsche WBX-6 B32/36 clone or Oettenger WBX6 conversion as the fun.

I doubt that either the Porsche & Oettenger WBX6 routs can be done for what I can get a good use V8 Cayenne S for, since it also involves upgrading the suspension, brakes, wheels/tires, etc. as well - which I'd guess would run more than the $18-30k that we'd spend on a good used `06-10 Cayenne S!

So the $5-8k GoWesty 2.5L + incidentals for cooling updates/etc. is our lower cost route - whenever the current 2.1L WBX4 needs done next.

We put less than 3k per year on it in the past 3 years, & maybe <20k miles since the top end was done in `05 or `06 - so it may last a while!

Cheers!
Tom
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Posted by: Chris H. Feb 19 2015, 03:19 PM

Love it Marty! What trans did you use in those conversions? The motor is a 3.2?

Posted by: Mueller Feb 19 2015, 04:09 PM

I had to google that!

http://www.corvair.org/chapters/lvcc/lvcc_newsletters/lvcc_2014_01_fifth_wheel.pdf


pretty neat! How rare and expensive are those motors?

Posted by: Mark Henry Feb 19 2015, 04:44 PM

They built kits based on VW engines, I've only ever seen one a VR6 kit.
Not cheap.

http://www.oettinger.com/

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 19 2015, 06:59 PM

Stephen,
I actually had such a good offer on the Dual cab syncro, I sold it. Then took a 2wd Dual cab and converted it to LT1 chev power, with a g50 5 speed.
Marty

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 19 2015, 08:18 PM

Tom, some of my customers do tow small pop-up camping rigs, nothing in the range of 3-4,000 lbs. though. The 3.2/3.6 Porsche engines are good rpm+hp engines, but lack reliable torque for a big haul...especially when the engine already sits in a 4,000 lb. Syncro !
If you are considering pulling that Airstream with a v8 Cayenne, read up on these over at Rennlist. TSB's galore and issues. My nephew owned an '05 v8 biturbo for 2 years, and the maintenance ate him alive. He sold it at a $10k loss.
For towing I have an F150 supercharged 5.4L with an intercooled magna charger at 7 psi boost. It can pull trailers all day !
Marty

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 19 2015, 08:30 PM

Transaxle used in these conversions were:
2wd = original 2wd 4 speed, or g50 5 speed.
4wd = original 4wd 4 speed. Syncros all had an extra 1st granny gear.
Most were 3.2 Carrera motronic, a few 3.6 c2 motronic engines.
My personal Syncro had a blueprint Trans rebuild, with a higher 4th (final) gear.

Posted by: pete000 Feb 19 2015, 10:46 PM

Cool, Vanagon thread ! Here is my 1990 Vanagon.

Too much to list done to this guy.




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Posted by: Chris H. Feb 20 2015, 07:14 AM

What the...it's raining Vanagons!

C'mon Pete don't tease us!

Posted by: a914622 Feb 20 2015, 08:06 AM

The 2.5 suby the is powering my vanagon was destiny for my 914! I had the down payment ready to go on the bosting Ztec engine, then i got the chance to drive one. less tork than the water boxer and "race cams" made it worse.

I just sold a rear cushion to a guy that had a porsche powered vanagon that came from SoCal . He had bought it from an estate. Store goes the guy that did the swap was big into racing and would run the vanagon as an officials track rig. Had the stock vw trans and a 3.2 with the muffler punched for 2 outlets.

Along with the 914svx engine I just picked up a 87 g50 and a spare svx engine. Now if I could only find a 78-79 vanagon and a year off from work!

Jcl

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 20 2015, 09:14 AM

Here's a nice starting point... It's pretty far away from me or I would go look at it. For someone looking to totally re-do a Vannie to a driver it would be worth a look for sure. I THINK this car used to reside in Naperville and I looked at it several years ago.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1753533

Thanks for the Bostig feedback. I think my next step is finding another SVX or an EZ30 motor. Taking it slow this time...my 914 conversion was too hectic. Think I was afraid to keep it off the road too long.

Posted by: 914forme Feb 20 2015, 09:37 AM

Oh I wish I never entered the Samba, looks like I found a new project.





But then it is close enough to go and pickup.

I really need to stick with my good ole American Pickemuptruck for hauling and towing does it quite well.

Now if you want to talk Subbie Power in a Type 181 with AWD, a body lift, suspension lift, and a factory hard top, and a soff top, then maybe. I would love to build that for my wife. Convertible in the spring ./ Fall, A/C in the summer, traction in the winter. Makes al the sense in the world to me. Classic VW things looks, that crap grows on you. And 70s colors, Single Orange or Zambezi Green. Yeah this idea hasn't been bouncing around in my head for a while.

For PC it could be a Porsche 597 Jagdwagen also, though I am sure she would want 4 doors of the 181. And try to find a 597 then feel the ability to

Posted by: OU8AVW Feb 20 2015, 09:50 AM

I spoke to some folks from CCR Engines in Colorado. They pic and rebuild Suby motors. Say they can hook me up with a 2.5 with all the trimmings for around $9k. That includes the harness. Add a Go Westy or Kennedy kit and I should be good to go. I have an auto, but will probably switch to a rebuilt 4 speed, although the auto is pretty sweet....

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 20 2015, 10:46 AM

No such thing as a '78-79 Vanagon, it would still be a bay in those years. First Vanagon was 1980 and they were air cooled til halfway thru the '83 model year.

I'll weigh in on the SVX in a Vanagon. It absolutely transforms the vehicle! The useable torque is so satisfying for someone who spent years stirring gears in a Westy with a 2.1 waterboxer. Last summer I drove up to Mt. Rainier in my SVX Syncro Westy and was amazed at how pleasant it was to climb a steep, twisty mountain road in 3rd most of the time although I'd occasionally drop to 2nd on severe hairpins. I had 3rd & 4th regeared taller and it makes climbing hills effortless. On the highway it cruises easily at 80 with lots to spare. I don't think 100 is out of the question but the right situation hasn't come up for that attempt.

IMO VW got the Vanagon right....except for that crappy engine with jury-rigged exhaust and cooling systems to complement the screwy head seals. Weight distribution is near 50/50, rack and pinion steering, independent suspension, great visibility, good seating (later models). My Westy makes a great base of operations for local use and extended road trips.

In normal use, it's fun to frustrate other drivers who think they're next to, or behind, a plain old ordinary VW bus. It's part of our dna to want to get in front of a VW bus, right? Not so easy when that bus has 240hp. I love it when someone has to pull in behind me because they can't accelerate around without attracting attention. At some point I may tow the 914 behind it. That would be like the Enterprise with a separating battle bridge. The brakes were upgraded during the conversion and I'm sure the SVX would handle the towing fine.

All of that said, I'd probably go with the 2.5 if I was doing it again. HP/TQ is a little less but the mpg is dramatically improved. That eg33 is a beast of an engine but it does suck the gas; I get around 15 at highway cruising speeds. Reliable sources have told me 20+ is easily achievable with the 2.5. Whichever way you go, I don't think you can beat the Subies for reliable, powerful conversions that look like they belong in the Vanagon engine bay. Porsche power would be pretty sexy in one of these rigs but I'm doubtful they can pencil out anywhere close, especially in long term useage.

Here's a couple of gratuitous pics. They've been posted elsewhere but a cool Vanagon thread like this deserves the documentation.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 20 2015, 11:00 AM

Nice polished manifold Kelty...or is it ceramic coated? What was the process?

I love that thing.

Stephen that DOCA MIGHT be promising if the rust isn't too bad. It's a synchro too. I wouldn't pay $10k but for less...who knows. Wonder what "Subie power" it has. The "add-ons" are certainly distracting aren't they? Someone had some extra tractor trailer parts and a whole lot of diamond plate laying around.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1629542

Posted by: pete000 Feb 20 2015, 11:54 AM

Here is a crazy conversion I saw this year at the Bugorama.

Mid engine Vanagon with I think Audi power and transmission!

Crazy work in progress rig.


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Posted by: pete000 Feb 20 2015, 12:14 PM

Another crazy conversion, V8 twin turbo power this time also mid engine.


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Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 20 2015, 12:21 PM

Thanks Chris. It's polished. I did the initial smoothing of the rough casting and then had a polishing shop finish it off. The eg33 manifold is such a fine shape, it screams for polishing. I freely admit.....I'm fascinated by shiny things.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 20 2015, 12:24 PM

Where does the sink go?

Posted by: 914forme Feb 20 2015, 03:05 PM

LOL I would if it has on of these in it.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 20 2015, 06:06 PM

Thanx Marty!

That tracks with what I found out when my wife asked about towing with "her Van" & a V8 swap was just too big, as that other pic of one shows.

Where we live in an Old Towne area Orange 1921 Craftman Bungalow with the long narrow driveway & narrow streets. So aside from big & long trucks/SUVs being a royal PITA to manuever the rig into the driveway on our busy street - I can't open the full size trucks' door more than 1/4 - 1/3 open!

No Room!


So the choice was for the smallest SUV package with a V8 & good towing capacity for our Avion, & to also serve as an "extra" 3rd car when one of the others is in the shop. My wife won't even drive a full size pick-up/SUV - so that also killed anything big. The PO of the Avion also had a nice blue/tan `06 F150 V8 that they used as their TV for it & was also FS, but she nixed it right off!

I have checked a lot into the Cayenne S/Toureg V8 issues on Rennlist, AirForums, Pelican, etc. & Eric Shea on here - so know what to look for in them being fixed/updated on the TSBs.

For that reason are mostly looking at Series 2 (ser. 1.5?) 2008-10 CayS's ... or a 2006 (`07 carry-over) Titanium Edition - mainly for the 1 year Iceland Silver (bluish silver) paint color that we like.

The Porsche route filled those needs well plus something else to do with the Porsche club events & drives + I can tow the 914 after the resto is done to concours if needed (at first anyway, but then I'll drive the 914 regualrly), since the 914 resto keeps getting pushed aside.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 20 2015, 06:11 PM

Exactly!

Love your Subie-Westy Marc! Very nicely done!

BTW for the V8 folks - IIRC it was this or last week that evil-bay had a V8 Westy conversion FS.

EDIT - here>
http://www.ebay.com/itm/171688402437?forcerRptr=true&item=171688402437&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME:SS:SS:US:1120

No Affill, just part of the discussion here.

And there was also a video of a fully blown V8 drag Vanagon video on UTube dragging out the the desert somewhere, that I saw last year sometime, but have lost the bookmarks when my HDD drive died. Crazy fast!!

.... but not a practical idea for most on this thread.

Cheers!
Tom
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Posted by: anderssj Feb 20 2015, 07:20 PM

at "Classics on the Green," 9-14-14

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 21 2015, 05:18 PM

Yeah good point. No need for a heater though! And you can roast marshmallows right there in the van!

Maybe they aren't done with it but if so, how LOUD is in in there? WOW. An empty metal box with a twin turbo V8 in the middle of it sucking air through two big cone filters?

Does that barn door have a 4-cam in it???? I see two distributors...

Posted by: rgalla9146 Feb 21 2015, 05:45 PM

Later air cooled 911 (993, 3.6) engines had a twin distributor to make it a 12 plug.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 21 2015, 06:57 PM

Tom T.
I travel daily through Craftsman Central in Glendale, Atwater, Silverlake...I hear what you are sayin about the driveways. But the restored homes are a step back into the '20s, Way Cool !
The 400hp small block that I built for the 2cab, was built from a vintage iron '69 4bolt main LT1. Later model angle plug heads, 8.5:1 cr for today's low octane unleaded, Holly pro-jection, Isky cam with PJ gear drive, Milodon 7 qt. baffle oil pan, MSD ignition and an Edelbrock air gap manifold...and some of my shorty v8 block hugger ceramic coated headers. All way under budget too....I'll use the savings for a nice White/pearl paint job !

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 22 2015, 05:09 PM

Hot motor Marty, it reminds me of the one I helped my uncle build as a teen in the 1960's for his 32 Deuce Roadster with the rumble seat hot rod!

Good thing about the Dokas etc. is that the working deck/floor is higher to be able to put in a taller block/manifold/etc. & you can steal some space for it from that underfloor storage compartment.

However, I always thought that they cast those Edlebrock valve covers such that the read right side up when mounted on the motor, unless something has changed since the 60's-70's!!??

Right now the 90+ year old house is an added list of projects to do on the honey do list that get in the way of my 914 - in addition to competition from our 88 Westy, 85 BMW & Avion trailer & probably a Cayenne S soon too - but we really like it here!

Now & for several years I'm suffering from serious case of too many projects, too little time - itis!

I always thought that a 928 S4 motor & trans or G50 or ?? with all the brake & suspension upgrades from same would make for an awesome Vanagon or Westy & one that could tow a bigger trailer, whicle keeping it all OG. I figure if Rick can jamb one into a 914, then a Vanagon might be doable too - if the engine & drivetrain can be reversed reliably.

And a Big Thanx to all on here for some "sanity time" distractoin talking about fun cars over the past week+, away from the serial calls from doctors, hospitals, family members, etc. while my aunt is in hospital back east & I'm her designated decision maker!

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Dr Evil Feb 22 2015, 08:02 PM

If I didnt already have my bay conversion.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 23 2015, 08:05 AM

C'mon Doc you have plenty of room! That bay is appreciating in value! It can just sit around now all purty.

Seriously...the one without the motor.... If someone could buy it with the trailer it would be a nice deal (IF it's as rust-free and decent as described). Maybe get it for a bit less and clean it up, slap a motor in it, make it safe, drive it.

Tom, your Aunt is lucky to have you. She must be a great person.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Feb 23 2015, 12:47 PM

Tom, the way that Edelbrock casts their valve covers is for the breathers to be staggered. I wanted both of the breathers to face forward...so you wind up with one of his signatures reading "Creatively"
A late model 928 32v engine would be awesome in the Vanagon engine bay. Simple procedure: torch/ hammer/ machine shop
Marty

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 23 2015, 03:18 PM

So you're really just saying that you wanted to read both sides right side up from the one side when you're working on the motor!

I also meant to say the my uncle's 32 Deuce eventually had a bored & stroked Chevy 327 Holly 850 & Edlebrock hi-rise, but only after he gave up on tweaking the Ford Flat Head (239ci IIRC) & then a later Merc V8.

His 58 Vette also eventually had a similar OE stock 327 setup (IIRC it was triple-deuce from the factory), but was eventually punched/stroked & ran the Holly 1250 & E-brock Hi-rise, when he held the class for a couple of years at the old OC Dragstip off I-5 during the early 60's (IIRC 64-65-ish).

Then he & his partner on a fuely rail put an aviation supercharger on a Chev big block (partner was an AV mechanic at USMCAS El Toro & had "access"), which had way too much boost & blew the engine about every other run, so they had 2-3 motors. They probably would've held that class too, if the motors weren't always blowing.

He was an interesting guy who owned the only bindery in OC, so he did all the 60's surfer & hot rod magazines & gave me the discards free to read (I was into body surfing though). Great stuff for a 10 year old in `63 thru high school & college during the 60's & 70's!

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 24 2015, 09:38 AM

This one looks pretty good too if you want a Westy. I'm not a camper myself...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1756413

The body isn't perfect but check that interior...would guess it's hard to find one with the inside in that condition. And the price is "obo"... Could make a nice driver for someone out west. You guys have all the good cars.

Posted by: 914forme Feb 24 2015, 09:43 AM

That would be a perfect candidate for a conversion.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 24 2015, 10:09 AM

Even comes with a bumper upgrade. I'll bet it doesn't last long.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Mar 1 2015, 02:25 AM

Nothing to it, just bring the Syncro 4wd
Marty

Posted by: JRust Mar 1 2015, 07:36 PM

I should have taken a picture. Jonathon at Integrity Auto in Bend. Had 3 westy's. One 4x4 1 4x4 pickup thing (not sure what they are called). The 3rd he just painted & it's getting a NA 2.5 suby installed. I believe the first 2 both had suby 6's

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 1 2015, 08:38 PM

A Syncro Doublecab you mean? Jamie! Pics!

Doc, this one is south of you...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1756902

Says "very good" condition...might be a nice tranny hauler/mobile workshop but you'd have to look at it to be sure. Guessing the back seats are no longer there.

Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 1 2015, 09:23 PM

Stop it, Chris H.! I am trying to cut back. That last one had me tempted. I will buy just about any project that is <$3K.

Jerk

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 1 2015, 09:41 PM

HAHA! Hey I can't go through this addiction alone man.

Cool thing is there probably isn't a huge market for that one.... It has great bones, but it's got no rear seats and someone else's business logo on it. Call it a "delivery van" all you want...it's just a van with no rear seats. Let's see if it sits a while...maybe the price will go down EVEN MORE!

Posted by: 914forme Mar 2 2015, 08:19 PM

That's just south of me, no no no, I don't need it

Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 2 2015, 08:29 PM

If it were a synchro I would buy it now. I am holding out. I have a local friend that me be interested.

Stephen, when you coming over for a visit? I am less than 1hr away.

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 3 2015, 09:19 AM

Another possible nice one posted in the wrong place on The Samba...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1759851

Disclaimer: I know NOTHING about these Samba Vanagons for sale...just throwing them out there.

BTW what are we looking for rust-wise? Front door step plates? Underside?

Posted by: JRust Mar 3 2015, 10:06 PM

Okay Jonathon sent me a few Pics


Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 3 2015, 10:23 PM

WANT!

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 3 2015, 11:54 PM

Decent looking van, but it's an automatic. Many of these get named 'Turtle'....which is an insult to turtles everywhere.

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 4 2015, 08:02 AM

Well that's good info Marc...'cause I thought I wanted an auto. Are people swapping to Subie auto or what?

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 4 2015, 09:03 AM

I'm not sure Chris. I would think it could be done with some research and creative machining. I have no idea how much hp that tranny can handle.

I've driven one AT Vanagon and that was a Westy with a 1.9 so it was really underpowered; almost to the point of being unsafe IMO. I'll ask my conversion mechanic whether he's done any automatics.

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 4 2015, 01:50 PM

Cool, thanks. When I look at one of these I'm assuming the stock engine is coming out, but you do bring up a good point.... how much can the Vanagon auto trans handle? Probably not designed for high hp...wonder how many engine/trans swaps are out there and what they are?

Wow those synchros are bad a$$ Jamie. The silver one .

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 6 2015, 10:37 PM

According to my conversion specialist, the VW a/t works very well with Subies. They 'do it all the time'. He even has a custom made adapter plate he sells and will be offering a complete conversion kit within the next month - you supply the engine. http://www.north-westy.com

Posted by: euro911 Mar 7 2015, 02:00 AM

Did someone say Vanagon?

Still sitting on the sidelines since a recent evaluation on my 1.9L was good

Would love an H6, except for the fuel economy

Posted by: strawman Mar 7 2015, 12:45 PM

I've done a couple of Vanagon conversions (Westy Diesel to GTI engine in 1997, and Westy Syncro to Suby 2.2 in 2002), and the Suby conversion was by far the best of the two. I'd get 25mpg at 6k feet elevation and would cruise up over Donner Pass at 55mph loaded. I wish I never sold it in 2005 for $9900, even though I sold it to Warren Chapman (God rest his sole -- he was one of the Suby conversion pioneers). That vehicle would be worth twice that today!

My latest is a recently-completed TDI swap into a '93 Eurovan Weekender. I'll bring it to the West Coast Ramble because my Suby-914 isn't done yet (!!). I just got the EV running a few weeks ago and I'm still working through a few small issues. The Eurovan is not as well-loved as the Vanagon, but IMHO it is worlds better in terms of driveability -- the air conditioning system is vastly superior, it is quieter inside, the suspension is cushy, and the cooling and exhaust systems don't seem like an afterthought. YMMV.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 7 2015, 12:49 PM

IIRC the stock AT was also used on the 1980's Oettenger H-6 conversion too with no problems, & maybe on that Porsche B32 3.2 Carerra when not the G50 stick too.

My brain is jelly now with all my other family stuff, so I don't remember the HP/TQ nos. on either Oettenger nor the B32, but they're probably not far off the modern Subie H-6s.

Nice Westy Mark - I see you did the solar set-up for boon-docking too!

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 7 2015, 12:54 PM

I think the hot ticket in the Eurovan T5 era was the Winnebago full camper conversion, which was also was a step more refined than the Vanagon T3/T25 ones.

Once they got the VR6 & some VW quality issues resolved - the Winnegao Rialta was a sweet rig too, but too big to double as your DD.

We almost switched to both of those at different points of the 1990's, but I'm glad we kept the Vano-Westy.

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 7 2015, 01:53 PM

Best I've gotten under any circumstances is 16mpg. My right foot does have a weight problem.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 7 2015, 02:15 PM

I'll be driving 'Eileen' up to the Seattle area sometime this summer to pick up one of my Honda Mini Trails I left up there. I'd like to check out your conversion, Marc.

But then again, maybe I shouldn't ... the 1200 mile trip home with an anemic 1.9L would probably be pretty miserable

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 7 2015, 02:36 PM

I'll even let you drive Tintipi, Mark....see how you'll feel about the drive home then.

BTW, you're welcome to camp in my back 40.

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Mar 8 2015, 01:42 AM

My 1985 doka; the German8r
400 hp Lt1 350", cruises in 5th (g50/5 speed) at 75 mph about 2800 rpm.
Real smooth freeway truck.
Marty

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 8 2015, 09:06 AM

Have you got any pictures of it doing wheelies?

Posted by: messix Mar 11 2015, 12:00 AM

wow $$$$$
http://seattle.craigslist.org/see/cto/4925768432.html

Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 11 2015, 07:25 AM

The price is not a misprint, they want what they put into it, not any profit. Good luck with that.

However, I see a few advertized in the $70K side. It doesnt mean they are getting it, but that is the face people see in this niche market. I saw a synchro just south of me last weekend. I was surprised....and envious. It was worn, but that is cool.

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 11 2015, 07:56 AM

You saw the ad right?

"This Van is really special. "

It's SPECIAL. C'mon!

Yeah for $109k....hmmmm...I'm not buying a Vanagon. No question it's a nice one though. Love the color and '80's graphics.

I'll take a worn one too...for 1/10th the price.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 11 2015, 11:46 AM

These are getting to be as good of an investment as early Porsche 911s

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Mar 11 2015, 12:26 PM

No pics of Wheelies. ..but I do have the two halves of one axle that snapped (sway-away). These make excellent workbench tools in the welding shop
Marty

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 11 2015, 12:48 PM

Yeah Mark can you make me a list of the cars you own and send it over? So far you've done REALLY well. I'll just buy what you have and park 'em.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 11 2015, 02:25 PM

He'll get close to it I'll bet!

Go to the GoWesty website & look at their current & past sales history on restored Vano's & Westies. Although prices dipped during the "Great Recession" 2008-13-ish, they're back on track again, & Syncro Westies typically were selling for nearly $100k before the crash! .... & will again soon IMHO.

So all the other 2WD & AT Westies, Weekenders, etc. will also go up respectively.

Don't believe what you see for prices on NADA, KBB, Edmunds, etc. for the Vano Westies, Dokas, Synchros, etc. - cuz they're only covering the non-restored ones which are mostly POS's, DDs or project cars!

That's why I wasn't too unhappy when I had to move our Westy's resto up in front of my 914 when my wife got clipped in the Westy & the original paint clear coat was failing & the spot repair wouldn't adhere or last properly. The Westy is worth more done than my `73 914-2.0 when done & until 914 prices come up a bit more than already.

I still need to get an "official" appriasal on our Westy, but several value estimates are that it's easily in the $35-50k+ range now, & could go to $50-70k-ish when we get the GoWesty 2.5L in there (waiting for it's next need to rebuild the heads or whatever for that).

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 11 2015, 02:35 PM

A Westy Vanagon is also one of the very few vehicles that can be worth more with a well done engine conversion than a stock one.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 12 2015, 04:14 AM

I'd really like to stuff a 2.2L Subi in Eileen. I think it would be a good trade-off - more HP and good fuel economy. There are times when I could use a bit more poop under the pedal

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 16 2015, 10:43 AM

Samba deals du jour:

Logovan down $300...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1756902

These are what I'd like to have (but have too much on my plate to buy right now):

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1763890

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1764999

Nice Synchro for someone :

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1765048

Posted by: euro911 Mar 16 2015, 02:10 PM

I should buy that Syncro and stick the Westy pop-top on it ...






... except my wife would probably beat me to a bloody pulp

Posted by: euro911 Mar 16 2015, 09:06 PM

OK, here's another VW product who's market value is higher than our little 914s

https://autos.yahoo.com/blogs/motoramic/you-ll-never-believe-what-this-vw-thing-just-sold-for-145031709.html

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Mar 16 2015, 09:50 PM

Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: colingreene Mar 16 2015, 10:09 PM

Mark,

If you ever decide to make that dream a reality ill be there for you to help with the heavy lifting. could be fun.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 16 2015, 10:36 PM

Which dream? ... that Syncro, or stuffing a Suby 2.2L into Eileen?

Posted by: blabla914 Mar 17 2015, 10:05 AM

I'm just going to leave this here.........

Porsche 991 wheelbase 96.5" (96.7" for GT3)

Vanagon wheelbase 96.9"

discuss......

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 17 2015, 10:21 AM

991 weight distribution: 39/61

Vanagon weight distribution: ~ 51/49 (depending on model http://www.roadhaus.com/tires/load.html)

914 weight distribution: 46/54

914 wheelbase: 96.5

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 18 2015, 06:26 AM

Sale pending on the Synchro... Mark ?

Interesting stats on the Vanagon F/R balance and dimensions... What do you do for suspension when you double or triple the power? Is there an aftermarket for that stuff to stiffen it up and get it lower ?

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 18 2015, 08:37 AM

The stock Syncro suspension is pretty beefy as it stands. My eg33 probably adds 150-200# which probably means my weight distribution flips to ~49/51. The Syncro comes stock with a stout front sway bar but none in the rear. I've upgraded to the larger Audi brake package in the front while the rears are stock drums. I've had a couple of instances of 'panic braking' due to careless drivers and the brakes were superb, helping to maintain precise control. Handling is surprisingly nimble, no doubt enhanced by the additional power. Instead of relying on momentum driving, the pedal under the right foot is actually functional. This is especially satisfying on mountain roads with uphill hairpins.

For my rig, lowering is not desirable and I am aware of a higher cg; but it's not uncomfortable by any means. I think the Vanagon suspension is over-engineered for the stock engine and doubling the power serves to unlock attributes hidden by weak performance. I really like driving Tintipi.

Posted by: dcheek Mar 18 2015, 11:40 AM

Here is my 1982 Vanagon Diesel
1.6 liter
48 HP
109 lb.ft. of torque
I have to laugh at those specs.
And yes, it's slower than whale shit off the line.
A buzz box at 60 MPH.

I paid $1500 for it 10 years ago. It was a deal even back then. The PO replaced the motor with a VW factory rebuilt long block so, the motor is essentially new. Also, there is zero rust do to the "Rusty Jones" treatment.

Hauls 7 people in total comfort with room to spare and does not affect the performance (it couldn't get much slower).
27 cranks to open the dining table size sunroof.
I didn't buy it to go fast - obviously.


If I was going to do a conversion, I would go with the Suby boxer Diesel. Here is a YouTube vid. of one in action.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=so6raO3UTWA

Dave

Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 18 2015, 11:55 AM

There was a synchro that was not running for sale in my town back in 2006-7 when I was in med school for $2000.....but I was in med school and had no storage or money. I knew I would regret that

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 18 2015, 01:00 PM

Mark/911euro - tell your wife the "cute Westy" is for her, to avoid the

Mark/Kelty - From 27 years of loading experience for both trips to Home Depot/Lowes/etc. & family long XC trips with our 88 Westy, that F/R balance can vary widely!

I've put in way over max of paving stones on the center floor for 1.5 miles Home Depot to home, but am in limits for trips - but then it was still down to 35 mph, then 30, then 25 on the 3 successive big I-70 WB grades over the Rockies with me + 2 kids & our stuff!!!! It's an Auto, so that robs some of the meager 95 HP!

95 HP - another thing in common with the 73-74 914-2.0's! ....at about 1/2 the wt.!
... + F & R sway bars too!

When I take the Westy on mountain twisties (without my wife, who doesn't like it too fast), I'm amazed at how well it handles for such a tall & skinny wheelbase (relative to ht.) vehicle!

After all 48 months during the factory warranty of complaining about the left lean on our Westy from new & them saying no problem, when I changed out the springs & shocks F & R in 2013 - it turned out the factory put in the std. duty tin top springs instead of the HD Westy ones.

New proper HD factory springs & shocks - NO MORE LEAN!! Dang dealership idiots & factory mis-assembly cost me several $100s 25 years later, & the proper HD springs would not have sagged in all probability!

As to cost of ownership, the `88 Westy has cost 3-4x as much as for my `85 BMW 325e over the years per my Quicken Reports I do every so foten. So quality was not a high point at VW in the 1980s!!

Anyone else in the east or southeast with an AC Vanagon or Westy have trouble with cold condensate water dripping down on the rear seat & stowage are in back??

Every trip when we got into the Texas Panhandle & on east we had a frigid rain forest from our AC dripping! I finally rigged up a gutter & drain spout with a wallpaper glue trough & some clear fridge water hose to catch & drain it. In SoCal & Southwest it's dry enough to not be a problem.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 19 2015, 03:14 PM

Speaking of Synchros...what about this Quantum? There IS a big dent up front. Don't see many of these.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1756391

Audi engine/drive train? Seems like it would be easy to upgrade that to something newer/better/faster. 1.8T or something?

Posted by: tumamilhem Mar 19 2015, 07:48 PM

I was fascinated with the B32 when I first discovered it (I was looking for a Type 2 T2b Westfalia). The other VW-Porsche!

https://youtu.be/1owcYlYoFhc

http://oppositelock.jalopnik.com/porsche-b32-the-porsche-camper-van-that-almost-was-1453489406

Posted by: messix Mar 19 2015, 08:32 PM

real 4x4 has a 2 speed transfer case, anything else is just all wheel drive.

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 19 2015, 09:43 PM

So what do I call it when I have a lockable diff on the rear wheels and a decoupler on my drive shaft to disengage from the front axle?

Posted by: messix Mar 19 2015, 09:48 PM

a selectable all wheel drive with a locking diff.

do you have a high/low range transfer case......

granny low 1st gear doesn't count, i have that and the high low on the jeep.... a real 4x4

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 19 2015, 11:11 PM

Well....can you fix omelettes and capuccinos for breakfast in your kitchen after a good nights sleep in your comfy bed when you get to the end of the trail?



Can you find the Westy in this picture?

Posted by: euro911 Mar 23 2015, 12:17 AM

Eileen got a lot of attention at the desert event I went to this past week.




One gentleman there said he looked at a nice SYNCRO the previous week, and the seller was only asking $8k for it

I figured it was probably already gone, so I didn't bother to get the seller's contact info


P.S. Just going through a week of email(s) ... got a notification that my new Yokohama Geolander ATS 215/65-16 tires should be delivered here tomorrow - I guess I'd better get to cleaning up and painting the one remaining unfinished MBZ CLK wheel

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 23 2015, 09:13 AM

Awesome Mark. Looks like fun.

Here's one for $8k...but it's got some rust. Probably better to pay more locally than import this one... Looks like it's covered in salt too.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1768105


Good deal though given what these are going for.

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 23 2015, 10:26 AM

Seems to be a real diversity of attitudes in this crowd.

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 23 2015, 10:30 AM

I went on The Samba and local Craig's List and it seems the market has exploded. I don't think I saw a Westy below 12k and that was an air-cooled Vanagon. Anything below 10k is probably going to need a lot of work. Whew.

Posted by: euro911 Mar 23 2015, 12:33 PM

Ham Radio people ... a lot of us are musicians too. Had some good jam sessions


This is the creation I came up with this year. Several people helped - by dumping a pile of junk at my camp site




It's a fun gig ...

Posted by: d914 Mar 23 2015, 03:33 PM

http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/cto/4889094251.html


http://oklahomacity.craigslist.org/cto/4874857448.html

no relation

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 24 2015, 09:46 AM

So there's just one strange thing about this Vanagon...totally fixable, but hilariously odd...

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1768696

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 24 2015, 10:22 AM

The bondo looks like the state of Texas in reverse. Maybe he should just paint it like a relief map.

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 24 2015, 10:30 AM

LOL! GRIND THAT DOWN DUDE!!!!

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 24 2015, 10:42 AM

And here's a version you can actually see without a magnifying glass.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 24 2015, 11:27 AM

Well, we ended up getting into a trailer/RV space for the Ocean Mesa Vintage Trailer Rally this past weekend, so our Westy got bumped for our 1960 Avion T20 TT instead. We were taking the Westy if staying in the tent camping spaces.

So no chance yet to do some nice post resto pix at the beach, plus it turned out El Capitan State Beach campground below where we were was closed up due to a water well problem anyway, so we couldn't have gotten down there for the beach front pix anyway.

On another note, I had a jackass come by on his bicycle & ask if I wanted to sell the Westy when it was parked on the street during the auto-musical chairs we have to do to get the Avion back in the driveway.

What was insulting was he offered me a whole $4500! ... that's right - no zeros missing !!!!

He knew about Westies too, so it's not like he could've even thought it was a reasonable price for one even not knowing how much resto we've done!

He came by the house about a year ago & offered $6500 telling me that his uncle restores & sells them up in San Ferd Valley, but he doesn't remember that.

My answer was the same both times: "Get out of here fool!"

I just hate those rip off a-holes like him! Geesh!

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 24 2015, 11:33 AM

You're missing the point Chris..... That's Modern Art! ... not a repair!

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 24 2015, 01:08 PM

To be fair he actually explains it very well. He had some extra bondo every once in a while and just smeared it there every time instead of throwing it away...never planning to actually fix the dent that way, just temporarily.

$6500 offer for your Westy? The really nice blue one ????

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 24 2015, 01:22 PM

I've actually seen artwork like that with bondo on canvas for sale in galleries in Laguna Beach!

Yes - the nice blue restored one owner of ours (we only have the one, unlike some on here), but he only offered $4500 on Sunday!

The guy is a goofball looking for a steal!

I told him he should try a guy around the corner with a terminal project pre-87 non-Westfalia pop-top conversion (American - blanking on the name now) & he may sell it for 4500, but he said no, he wants a real westy only - so he knows them.

I suggested that he look at NADA, KBB & GoWesty for REAL prices/values, before he insults anyone else with a Westy.

We used to call guys like that a Doofus!

Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 25 2015, 06:19 AM

This looks very nice....

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1769058

Not many pics...but a full re-spray couldn't have been cheap.

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 2 2015, 01:49 PM

What ....?



http://www.ebay.com/itm/Volkswagen-Bus-Vanagon-Vanagon-L-/271821805186?forcerrptr=true&hash=item3f49d79682&item=271821805186

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 4 2015, 01:54 PM

Dudes...here's a synchro and it comes with a Subie 6 with wiring harness/computer...$7500... the rust situation would need to be investigated,

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1773326

Posted by: KELTY360 Apr 4 2015, 10:52 PM

I kinda like it.....in a perverted sort of way. At least it's air cooled.

Posted by: Chris H. Jul 6 2015, 08:10 PM

Ummmm.....this is interesting....Syncro with an SVX engine partially installed...just needs to be finished. Wiring harness, intake, exhaust not done (wiring IS one of the sucky parts). No affiliation, just pointing it out. $7k seems like a decent deal depending on the overall condition.

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1810256

Posted by: Dr Evil Jul 7 2015, 06:45 AM

Oh man, if I had $7K to blow I would snatch that up in a heart beat. Has most of all the things I would want. Dang I bet it sells fast, even to one of the restoration places that get $75K for restored versions.

Posted by: Mueller Jul 7 2015, 11:07 AM

Seems like a decent deal...heck it even comes with an extra Subie 6 for your 914!

Posted by: Chris H. Jul 8 2015, 07:09 AM

It's gone...anyone here? The $7000 syncro is still in play.

Posted by: euro911 Jul 8 2015, 10:43 AM

Yeah, I bought it - and my wife came unglued




... JK ...

Posted by: Chris H. Jul 8 2015, 11:37 AM

But you sold some stuff Mark ! Net zero gain right ?! What's one more Vanagon in the scheme of your collection? You could get to Arizona really fast too. "Hang on honey, little short cut here...be there in a jif..."

Posted by: euro911 Jul 8 2015, 12:24 PM

If the Westy sells, I may keep the 'BB' - when Dianne's '71 is done, we'll have a 914 here and one in AZ

Posted by: 914forme Jul 9 2015, 09:33 AM

Good the ad says sale pending...

Posted by: Chris H. Jul 9 2015, 10:09 AM

Yeah probably a good thing for those of us mid-project (all of us ). Great deal though. The man hours it takes to pull that engine and install it in the Vanagon...big PITA already done. It does need an intake and exhaust fabbed and the wiring isn't done, and you know how fun that is. But it's a syncro...with an engine...for $7500...

Posted by: gumbajv Aug 23 2015, 08:36 PM

What did the MSDS 3.2 conversion kit consist of? I recently pickup a '86 Doka. I prefer the old school 911 in a bus approach. I've run a few different 911 motors in my '68 d/c 911 2.4E, stock 3.2, slightly modded 3.2, and currently a modded 3.3 930 turbo.

Posted by: Chris H. Sep 4 2015, 06:01 PM

Do you LOVE this or HATE it?

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1832667



It'll be one or the other most likely.

Posted by: euro911 Sep 5 2015, 12:24 AM

I think 'Limogon' would be a better name for it

Looks like it was done nicely, but just not my cup of tea. The turning radius must suck.

I'd like to see pix of the interior.

Posted by: 914forme Sep 5 2015, 06:29 AM

Hate it,

Now if it was a Westy, and a Single cab bed on back. I would trade my 914 out, and go SCCA Pro Solo tour with a nice Forumla V, or modified rail setup. Nothing like a tube frame car, with a Subaru engine, and lots of huge wings to make for a fun less than 60 seconds.

Thats just me, the wife might have different ideas

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Sep 6 2015, 05:12 PM

Hi Gumba,
I've checked out your 930 powered bus in the conversion section of Pelican...it's over the top !
I could email you a pic of the entire kit (not in production at this time), just pm me your email.
Basically the customer just needed the; vehicle, engine, harness, transaxle , 911 L+R outer motor mounts (or Elephant racing), flywheel ,disc, fuel delivery system, converted tach, DME /other mgmt. with mgmt. harness.
1999 prices were approx.
$2,400 2wd kit
$2,600 4wd kit
$3,300 2wd kit for g50
Marty

Posted by: Tom_T Sep 7 2015, 09:52 PM

....1000 words....






Tom
///////

Posted by: euro911 Sep 8 2015, 05:36 PM

Egads ... there's more than one of those on the loose?

Actually, after looking at both pix more, I think it's the same one (note the slightly discolored sliding door mechanism panel at the rear), just with a different set of wheels and window decals ...

Posted by: Tom_T Sep 9 2015, 10:09 AM

Could be Mark!?

There was a build thread link to another site with that one too .... but more like a cut-n-paste or weld thread!

IIRC it was Dave K who posted it a few years back on my topic, when I had said my wife wanted to know if she could pull her "new to us" vintage Avion trailer (sim. to old Airstream) with "her cute little van" ... as an option for her with her van.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Sep 9 2015, 10:29 AM

Years ago I did see a stretched camper van at the VW Classic, in the OC (held every June) that was pretty rough.
The windshield banner read;
"Westfailure"

Posted by: KELTY360 Sep 9 2015, 10:52 AM

My Westy's license is Tintipi. This one could be Twintintipi.

There is a member here by the name of Otmar who has an EV 914 that also has a duplex Westy that is two different colors with a zipper painted at the junction. Last I heard he was going to mate a Tesla power train chassis to a Westy.

Edit: turns out he's putting the Tesla power under his stretched Westy. Here's his blog: http://cafeelectric.com/stretchla/

Posted by: euro911 Sep 9 2015, 11:08 AM

Love it

Posted by: Chris H. Sep 9 2015, 11:21 AM

The good news is that the pic at the top IS the same van as the one for sale on the previous page. Looking at the pics there's not a LOT more room in there than a regular Westy. Would be fun to drop that off at the valet though .

Posted by: Tom_T Sep 10 2015, 11:15 AM

Mark - I think I saw that Westfailure there too! .... Hilarious!!

Frankly, I think that one of those little lightweight Euro trailers like an Eriba Puck in tow with a Westy is a better solution for added camping space, than a 2x Westy.

They're <1000 lbs. & within the limited towing capacity of a Splitty, Bay or WBX/Vano Westy, cuz they were designed for Bugs & other small Euro cars of the 50's-80's (& are still out there today). They occasionally show up FS on evil-bay & trailer sites, & we've seen a few here in SoCal at vintage trailer events, one pulled by a 2002 Cab (Euro), & a couple of others behind a Splitty & a Bay Window Van (tin-top non-Westies).

That way you can leave the trailer unhitched, if you want to run off somewhere else in the van while camping, but still have the extra bed space for the kids, another couple, etc. Screened-in side awnings, rear hatch & side tents work well too to expand the enclosed space.


Tom
///////

Posted by: bigkensteele Sep 10 2015, 10:11 PM

http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2015/09/10/new-volkswagen-microbus-in-works/?intcmp=hpffo&intcmp=obnetwork

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Sep 10 2015, 11:07 PM

I'll take this little g63 6x6 from Sindelfingen.
Just a few clicks down the road from Wolfsburg

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Oct 19 2015, 06:55 PM

Found this pic in my archives;
My 3.2 Carrera syncro cutting it up in Whittier Narrows
Photo credit: Les Bidrawn / European Car

Posted by: Chris H. Oct 19 2015, 09:28 PM

Awesome. Can only imagine the great noise it was making out back.

Posted by: Chris H. Oct 20 2015, 09:52 AM

Don't click this link Doc....after reading your thread in the sandbox I wish I could buy this for you. Congratulations Daddy-O .

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1847424

The price of these is going nowhere but up.

Posted by: euro911 Oct 20 2015, 01:39 PM

Nooooooooooooooooooo

Posted by: Dr Evil Oct 20 2015, 08:15 PM

Ya, nicer than one I saw go a few months ago. By the time I am up for another project like that, the costs will all be through the roof :/

Posted by: veltror Oct 25 2015, 11:41 AM

Oettinger WBX

https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=20&ved=0CGYQFjAJOApqFQoTCNHHiomV3sgCFcNMFAodwRMAnw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.corvair.org%2Fchapters%2Flvcc%2Flvcc_newsletters%2Flvcc_2014_01_fifth_wheel.pdf&usg=AFQjCNE9aY7iMks7O8gHNqtkc_YAYPGsxQ

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 25 2015, 10:30 PM

Really interesting information. I had no idea that the waterboxer had a six cylinder version. Just shows how anxious VW was to pull the plug on the rear engine van when they wouldn't even adopt an engine that would let the Vanagon get out of it's own way. You would have still have had an antiquated design, but at least you could climb a hill without having to resort to downshifting into second.

I can't help but think about the EG33 which was designed in a comparable period that had dohc, coil over plug ignition, 4 valves per cylinder, no pushrods, proper head sealing, an exhaust system that didn't look like a bed of snakes and 230 hp with gobs of torque. There must have been a paper shortage in Wolfsburg and nobody was allowed to use a clean sheet.

Thanks for posting that.

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 1 2015, 04:13 PM

That's why Porsche did the Vanagon B32 Carrera with the flat-6 3.2L Carrera motor & all running gear, & they also told VW to put in a 6 when VW asked how they could stay competitive with the Dodge/Chrysler Caravan line & other competitors offering better 6's!

It's fun to google for both the Oettenget WBX-6 & Porsche B32 just to see what could've been, if VW wasn't so blind back then! ....as if they're not now, with that stooopid TDI cheater stunt!


Tom
///////

Posted by: OU8AVW Nov 1 2015, 06:40 PM

I've been under my Westy this weekend installing the Gowesty stainless coolant line kit and a new gas tank. That means all of the fuel system is new and the major coolant stuff has been handled. I'm doing everything forward of the firewall so she's ready for a Suby when the Water Boxer poops the bed....
This has been one of the bigest PITA jobs I've done on any car!

Posted by: Maltese Falcon Nov 1 2015, 06:50 PM

MSDS 1.625" race headers into a 2 in / 2 out SS muffler. Even had custom rock guard skid plates under the exhaust system.
Sounded like the Hollywood Bowl L.A. Phil

Posted by: euro911 Nov 1 2015, 07:06 PM

I replaced the starter and bell-housing bushing on Eileen yesterday. Geezus, what a job. I had to remove the air-box, snorkel a bunch of hoses and the throttle body to get the nut off of the top starter bolt

Good thing though, there was a 90° rubber elbow down in the mess that had some real bad splits in it, so I crazy-glued it, clamped it, and when it was dry, hit the exterior with liquid tape, then finished it off with heat-shrink tubing.

Also cleaned the throttle body and installed a new cone-gasket

Gave her a bath this morning and a guy and his son came down from Santa Barbara to check it out this afternoon This would be for the son, who just turned 16.

They liked it, but have a couple others they're going to look at before making a decision. Pops said it had more pep than some others they looked at. The son doesn't know how to shift a stick, but pops said he's willing to learn.

Posted by: euro911 Nov 1 2015, 07:39 PM

Mike, if you haven't already done so, think about getting the metal fuel line pass-through for the rear firewall bulkhead




... the OEM plastic ones are a potential fire hazard

Posted by: rhodyguy Nov 2 2015, 12:49 PM

What a crappy design with the factory part.

Posted by: euro911 Nov 2 2015, 01:06 PM

You mean, like plastic fuel tubing in the 914 tunnel?

Ya, ya, und plastik tubink ist vunderbar

Posted by: Chris H. Nov 2 2015, 03:13 PM

Wow the metal fuel thing is a work of art. Nice looking part! Where do you get that?

Hey Mark (or anyone ), how is a manual Vanagon to drive? Is it kind of a beast to wrestle with or not so bad? The pedals are pretty far apart which looks challenging...maybe being in a seated position it's fine. Not sure. Drove a bay window a few times but that was LONG ago and it was pretty whipped.

Posted by: KELTY360 Nov 2 2015, 11:09 PM

I've always liked driving a manual Vanagon, whether wbx or EG33. Handling is easy with near 50/50 weight distribution. For a time I was driving mine without the p/s belt on and barely noticed a difference. Never noticed any issues with pedal position although I've had my foot slip off the clutch when my boots were wet.

Posted by: euro911 Nov 3 2015, 01:01 AM

Chris, the part is called a fuel spigot, available from Foreign Auto Supply for $60. - http://www.foreignautosupply.com/parts-accessories/53-fastt-replacement-fuel-spigot/#.VjhdM6TW1hC

The manual trans shifts fine - smooth and easy. I can only say how a well running 1.9L performs though ... maybe some day I'll drive one with real power

Posted by: Chris H. Nov 3 2015, 07:52 AM

Cool thanks guys. Was initially thinking about an auto but reading about them they shift around 2500 RPM max unless you take it apart and modify it. Hmmm...not the best project for me to do.

This layout just looks "different" but again, you're in a fully seated position. Probably works better.

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 3 2015, 10:31 AM

PS - less chance of pedal confusion too with the wider set clutch & brake, vs. the typical Euro car layout (& domestic compacts), but close to the old school 1950-80's Detroit full & mid-size car pedal spacing.

PSS - In re-reading your post, there are shift point adjustments for the auto without tearing the auto apart, as you'd been told/read - that's just BS or over-kill or lack of knowledge. We did go thru a couple of rounds of those adjustments with my long time mechanic (40 yrs.) after the trans rebuild, just to get it shifting when & how we liked it. So that also is not a valid reason to shy away from the autos. They're pretty bulletproof & generally longer lasting than manuals to needing a rebuild (the manuals' synchros often need replaced at 120-150k), & the mph & mpg losses are only a couple of miles for each. It's really NOT an issue for a qualified & knowledgeable mechanic! Get an auto if you prefer, or a manual, or whichever example is best condition - auto or stick.

PSSS - Also somebody did a very nice job on the Wheelskins on that steering wheel in your pic!

Chris,

You probably had heard about autos which were due for a rebuild due to age & mileage, since they do lose performance then.

We've had our `88 Westy since new 4/88 & have loved it as an auto, which we got because it was my wife's DD & she wanted an auto, plus it then served as both kids' learning car when they started driving ... in addition to annual long XC trips & local camping etc. It runs fine & has close to manual performance & mpg, but it did get a bit weaker & started to have that 2500 rpm shifting issue when it got about 190-200k, so we had it rebuilt & it is running like new since.

The bigger issues with auto or manual is it being a 4000+ lb (45-5000 loaded & wet Westy) "brick on wheels" which is severely under powered. So you either learn to go with the flow, or up-engine!

The choice should really be based on which tranny you & the other household drivers want - & being used cars only now, what the best available car is - i.e.: I would not pass up a really nice auto for a lesser manual.

Also, the Synchro only came manual, so that limits your choices for that variant if you need AWD, & it's proven to be a very good AWD/4WD system. We had to pass on a same color Synchro Westy at the dealership & ask for a dealer swap, due to my wife's needing the auto.

So don't back away from auto's due to some bad examples & bad raps by owners who don't bother to maintain or rebuild them when they get old & worn. That's like a manual owner complaining about hard shifting when the synchros are worn & that trans needs rebuilt. They all wear out!

Good Luck in your search!
Tom
///////

Posted by: OU8AVW Nov 3 2015, 03:06 PM

My kit omitted the pass though and used a grommet.

Posted by: OU8AVW Nov 3 2015, 03:09 PM

The Vanagon auto has a good reputation. I'm actually impressed with mine. I bought everything but the trans to convert it over to a 4 speed, still debating.

Posted by: pete000 Nov 3 2015, 03:14 PM

Lots of plastic in the Vanagon. Check out the fuel rails. I am going to replace mine with 914 metal ones. Although I have never heard of a failure.

Also the cooling system thermostat housing is plastic and fails. Billet versions are available.

The main coolant lines are all plastic and fail. SS ones are available.

I like this billet fuel line part. Has anyone heard of the plastic part failing?

Posted by: Chris H. Nov 3 2015, 03:52 PM

Great info. Finally found where I read the info on the automatic trans with conversions. It was on the Kennedy Site:

http://www.kennedyenginc.com/Pages/SubaruVanagonGen.aspx

AUTOMATIC TRANS. The Vanagon automatic transaxle can handle these engines just fine except it shifts too soon for high RPM engines. Grinding about half the weight off the governor weights (‘84 and newer) raised the full throttle shift to high gear from 2500 RPM to a practical 5000 RPM. This is a very simple operation. The high pressure produced at this RPM tends to blow up the trans cooler so replace it with a simple bypass block or an aftermarket cooler.

Smallcar makes a trans cooler upgrade to replace the stock one that might blow up at high rpm.

https://smallcar.com/vanagon/transmission-upgrade/

Posted by: euro911 Nov 3 2015, 04:00 PM

Percentage-wise ... but why take a chance?

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 3 2015, 08:38 PM

Chris - that info is out of context for stock 1.9/2.1L Westies/Vanos - since they're talking about mods to make on a non-stock Subie or other higher powered & higher revving motor - not about the stock motor.

My comments & experience are with the stock 2.1 - & the AT works fine with the "built" GoWesty 2.2 - 2.7 WBX motors too.

Oettenger did some AT mods with their WBX-6 too, & Porsche used the G50 5 spd. Carrera transaxle for their B32 Vanagons. So mods would be advisable for upengined Vanos/Westies.

If you're looking at stock Westies, then you don't need to shy away from the Autos.

And the shift points are far from 2500 on ours, as I can hold pedal to the metal & redline ours! If you're lollygagging in traffic, then maybe it'll shift at 2500-3500, but again the shift point can be adjusted without doing the mod noted above.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Nov 4 2015, 07:33 AM

Thanks Tom. Yeah I would probably put an EZ30 in. EG33 if I found a good one but Subaru guys are getting wise to the value now and are harvesting SVXs. Would only convert one that had a dead/dying engine. Can't hurt to try the auto trans as is but I'd definitely change the trans cooler setup. Not planning any drag races, just like to surprise the occasional stickered Honda Civic driver .

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 4 2015, 09:56 AM

Chris,

If you're doing the swap, then I'd say do the mods as they suggested, &/or as Oettenger did for their WBX6 (I think they're specs are probably still available from them or online).

Also, if I were to do a Subie swap, I'd say damn the torpedoes, full speed ahead & go with their best 6 (I don't know their engine codes to say which it is).

Heck, if I won the big lottery, then I'd probably send ours off to RUF in Germany to do a proper up-to-date "B32" with a new era 991 6 & all running gear!

But since I'm not stupid rich & close to retirement, the next engine whenever that is needed will be a GoWesty 2.5/2.45/2.7L upbuild, since I can get a 48 mo/48,000 warranty on it - which is 2x the original VW warranty!

As with 914s - look for the best Vanagon you can find, & note that the pop-tops have better long term value than the tin tops (both Weekender & full Camper). I think our 88 Camper's value report by GoWesty & any appraisal will come in at $35-50-70+K, which is 2-3x what my 73 914-2.0 will be worth when I get it's resto done.

Good Luck!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 17 2017, 05:10 PM

Well, I had to look a long time to find a really homely example but here it is!





BTW that stuff above the wheel arch is MOSS! SERIOUSLY!



So I almost bought one recently that was repainted and needed to be put back together but just couldn't spend the dough. For some reason this one kept poking at me. It had been sitting and needed attention but was allegedly "rust free". So...I pinged Garold and traded some stuff out of my parts stash for a few hours ride out and home with this little piggy. It really has almost NO significant rust. In addition to the usual exterior areas, even the battery area is like new. The odometer says it has 400 THOUSAND miles on it. Have to think it was towed or something. I'll post more pics later. The inside is not bad at all. Outside is a little crusty. It's from south Texas apparently. It needs a water jacket but I plugged a battery in to it and it turned over. As much as I would like to convert it, I might just try to get it running and drive it for a year.

BTW these things are heavy as &(*&! I'm used to cars that weigh 2000+ lbs. We had to get pretty creative to get it off the trailer. And we swore a lot which helped.

Have to say I really enjoyed the journey more than usual. Garold is a great guy to hang out with. As usual he had many cars to gawk at and tons of parts.





Thanks again Garold for a fun couple of days. I admire your commitment to Mom Shaffer, of Moms Service Covers fame.

BTW it's an '84. So I'm learning it will likely need new coolant tubes. Has the lowly 1.9L with 4 speed manual. Interestingly it has a hydraulic clutch. Didn't expect that for some reason. Also interestingly the pedal doesn't move at all . The brake pedal moves plenty though. Like...effortlessly. Doesn't DO anything but it's easy to push. That's OK. I would have gone through everything anyway.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 17 2017, 06:13 PM

Way to go Chris! Unless the leak is really bad, you can drive quite awhile on that head seal. It won't take you long before you want to convert though. Even a 2.0 Subie at 140-160 hp is a big improvement. Better gas mileage too.

How are you going to use it? I may have some wbx parts laying around; exhaust pipes, etc. I'll take a look. Let me know if there's anything in particular you need.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 17 2017, 08:48 PM

Hey thanks Marc! Here are some more pics and then I'll tell you my thoughts, plans, etc. Would love some input.

Battery area (which is under the passenger seat)



Front



Steering wheel is larger in real life



yes, that is 402XXX



This knob has been pilfered:



Rear seat nice, middle seat is missing.



The lock pin for the sliding door is missing on the inside



And the outer door handle is snapped off. Pot metal.



The wheel covers have to go pretty quick. Would like to go 16X7 rims



If I was in to the patina look...this would be an easy one to just shine up

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 17 2017, 08:52 PM

The "Wayfaring Croat" badge



I couldn't figure out what the pink shower curtain rod was for...until I opened the rear hatch...and it closed on me.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 17 2017, 09:14 PM

16x7s would be a good choice. Lots of tire choices at that size, but be aware that you'll not be able to store the spare in the clamshell under the cab. Rear door struts are readily available at the usual sources...I prefer Van Cafe (think 914Rubber type support) and stay away from GoWesty (although not in an AA category). TheSamba has great Vanagon forums as you probably know.

Don't know what your plans are, but Weekender type builds are highly functional and flexible.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 17 2017, 09:20 PM

So Marc this van has been sitting for a while. The clutch is frozen and the brakes are totally dead so I will have to go through everything. Looks like a new fuel tank is like $90. Tempting to just go that way. I smell that sweet funk of old fuel. Did you see the dust on the engine?

The more I think about it the more I realize the engine must have gotten to the point where it was not driveable. The guy is sure it was the water jacket on the drivers side so maybe it was overheating. Is the 1.9L even worth pulling apart and resealing and then getting it running or would you sell it as a core or part it out? The reseal kit is only about $65 but I don't know if it's worth the time and energy if the engine is not worth much. I suppose I could take it apart and see if the heads are cracked. That way I could test the trans at least if it was OK.

I'd like to make it a nice driver and yes, I would add the weekender table and rear facing seats. It's fairly heavy so I was thinking I might pick up an EZ30 or a EJ25 for it. Would like it to have enough power to pass on a hill. Initially I thought I could put the EG33 that was in my 914 in it but I've done too many mods to the engine and the 914 to change that. I contacted Subaru Gears and they ARE working on a flipped automatic Subaru trans R&P. It would work with either the 4EAT or 5EAT. They have not had the time to complete the prototype. I am trying to get the time frame out of them. If it won't be soon I guess I will roll with the 4 speed that's in there with an adapter.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 17 2017, 10:50 PM

The tank in my syncro is plastic. Not sure about the 2wd tank but if it's also plastic I'd keep it and flush it out. I don't think I'd reseal that head. It's a pain to do with the engine in the van; cooling and exhaust have to be disconnected and set away from the head for access and once you get it all buttoned back up you may have other issues. Pull the 1.9 and sell as a core. If your exhaust pipes are solid you may get something for them on TheSamba; they're notorious for rusting. With 420k on the van, I'll bet the tranny has been rebuilt. They're a good tranny but the 3-4 slider is the weak point. Small Car has a bell housing for the conversion that's very nice. Rocky Mountain Westy also has some impressive conversion parts and accessories. I got custom bumpers and a spare tire carrier from them that are works of art. I've been in their shop and the fabrication jigs they make are incredible.

No way would I swap your EG33 out of the 914. I drool about the thought of that combo. My own opinion is that the 2.5 Subie is the sweet spot for a Vanagon, especially a non-Westy. You get 190-200 hp and way better mpg than the six. The guy who did the majority of my conversion has a 2.5 in a syncro that gets 21+ on the road. I get around 15 with the svx...granted that's at 70-75 mph. You'll definitely enjoy driving the Vanagon with a Subie. They are very will balanced with near 50/50 weight distribution.

Keep your eyes open for some Westy front seats. They have nice adjustable arm rests and swivel bases; well worth the upgrade. BTW, do you have a Bentley manual? I've got an extra if you need it.

Posted by: JRust Feb 17 2017, 11:47 PM

ooh I have a motor that would be sweet in that

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2017, 12:19 AM

Ha! Yeah Jamie this is NOT the one I was looking at originally. I'd be afraid to put that kind of hp into this old girl. I bet there would be a lot of takers if you posted that 2.5T for sale. That is a hell of an engine. Great power curve for a 914 with matching trans as well.

Marc thank you for the offer of the Bentley manual. I'm learning that is the Bible of Vanagon DIY books. Believe it or not there was one in the van so I got lucky there. Wow that thing is very thick and detailed.

I think you may be right on just getting rid of the motor now. I saw that nice bell housing Smallcar has. Seems like a great setup.

BTW what are these?







Look like engine tins or shields. Found them in the back area.

On the mileage the thing is just too solid to have that many miles. I have to think it was towed behind a motor home or something. Maybe it's not the original speedo.

It is amazing the amount of aftermarket support there is. And the stuff is not too pricey!

Thanks for the input! I welcome any and all.

Posted by: rgalla9146 Feb 18 2017, 09:26 AM

2WD gas tank is steel.
You're in for some real fun getting all the vapor plumbing tucked in as you raise the tank back into the chassis.
Them there are covers for the bottom of the heads.
And muffler support and strap.

Update picture on my '89 Westy.
Added Audi V8 BBS 15" X 7" with Continentals


Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: Garold Shaffer Feb 18 2017, 09:37 AM

You're welcome Chris. It was interesting, that thing is HEAVY! Looking forward to seeing it back on the road.

Posted by: 76-914 Feb 18 2017, 10:45 AM

So you pulled the trigger; cool. This will take a couple of years out of your schedule. You'll have the fastest van on the block.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2017, 11:36 AM

Thanks guys. It's nice to have another project. I AM working on the 914 today BTW. Will have some pics of my new heater core setup as soon as I find the windshield wiper seal things from 914rubber so I can reinstall the wipers.

rgalla those are really nice wheels! I haven't dropped the tank yet and amazingly it looks very clean externally and does not seem to be the source of the rancid gas smell. Might just drain it and see what comes out.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 18 2017, 01:35 PM

Vanagon Parts Resources:

Chris, Marc & all,

Let me share with y'all the findings & sources for my too many parts, often for too much dough - which I could've saved on by going to the 1st place in Germany below, had I known about them beforehand. For example: I could've saved $500 from them for the window seals kit with the grooves for the plasti-chrome trim which we wanted to keep that look, over the per piece pricing from Bus Depot in PA.

The hot ticket on Vano parts (& Bay/Splitty Bus, Bug, etc. too) is to first look for parts at the German place where GW, VC, Bus Depot, etc. all get their parts - that way you'll save $100s if not $1000s over the USA guys, depending upon the extent of your buy - VW Bus Shop - aka Peter Gunzl.

Note that the time for parts directly from Germany will only take a week or so, whereas the GW, Bus Depot, Van Cafe, etc. may make you wait for a full container-load of their parts (including your order), & the worst for this was Bus Depot - who help me up with our Westy sitting in the paint shop for 6+ months waiting on their parts, with NO disclosure to me as to why), plus you may pay extra to ship to them + them to ship to you.

http://www.vwbusshop.de/en_GB

.

Then also go to VW Classic for the OE VW/OEM parts, then I agree to go to Steve at Van Cafe to order them, since you'll need a USA approved vendor to order any not sold at the German place above. GoWesty is also aan approved vendor, but I've found Steve more helpful & responsive, since GW has become a victim of their own fame, & since they've closed their store at their shop for only online sales.

http://www.volkswagen-classic-parts.de/en/spare-parts/bus-transporter.html
> Also use this to price check the above & below vendors vs. what VW is charging for the parts, to avoid excessive mark-ups.

http://www.van-cafe.com

.

Then there is the group below in the UK for a few hard to find parts, such as the black gutter trim end pieces for the gutter rails, & the rubber tubes for the wiring in back from body to hatch (at the top).

https://www.vwheritage.com

.

Also check at Fanchers before the others below, for any of the window shades, insulators, canopies & side tents, pop-top insulation & rain fly, etc. sold by the other usual suspects, since Fanchers is making & selling much of it to them, so you can price check all sources.

http://www.fanchers.com/

.

Lastly, you go to the USA vendors in the order below:

http://www.van-cafe.com

http://www.busdepot.com/
> Note that if you order a minimum value with BD, they automatically give you a 10% discount, which I think is still in effect.

http://www.gowesty.com
> I mainly put them after the others because their pricing tends to be higher than the above, & it's all the same parts which they're selling.

http://www.eurocampers.com
> These guys have 16 gal Euro Aux water/Gray water tanks for Westies, & 110v AC kits for camping, & other interesting stuff.

http://www2.cip1.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=2041&model=vanagon

http://www.justkampers.com/

.

Be aware that many of the Van Cafe Parts are GoWesty parts, so you'll want to price check both sources on both - & see if either/both have anything on their monthly sales. Get on all of their email lists for notices of monthly & special sales, etc.

.

Then there are also some vendors on TheSamba who have parts for Vanos, one of the better ones in Terry Kay in MI (??), so just look in the Vanagon Parts Classifieds for his stuff, & that of others. Some stuff you just need to go with the best used that you can find.

Terry Kay:
http://vanagonnewandusedparts.com/
http://vanagonwestfaliaaccessories.com/
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/search.php?type=&stype=all&keywords=&username=Terry+Kay&sort=date&sort_order=DESC

.
TheSamba Classifieds on Vanagons & Eurovans:
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/cat.php?id=55

.

If you need good repro/aftermarket interior stuff, my buddy with a `90 Carat has used these Sewfine guys & had his interior reupholstered by a shop in San Diego which used their materials, & he did a sliding curtain rails set-up using my old OE Westfalia Werke curtains (I got a new Westy set from the German Gunzl guys for my resto), & IIRC they also supply the stuff which GW & the others sell as their own.

http://www.sewfineproducts.com/

.

I'm also looking at putting in a good quality Stereo unit with a 7" pop-up screen with back-up camera in our Westy, & this Pioneer looks to be a likely suspect, but I need to figure a way to mount the rear camera high enough to see over our Yakima Swing Daddy bike rack, without hacking the sheet metal or FG pop-top (maybe inside the back hatch window, if I can solve the glare problem with a film).

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Car/DVD+Receivers/AVH-X7800BT

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Car/Accessories/Rear-View-Cameras/ND-BC8

> but shop around & google shop, since I see them for much less that their $500 & $100 list prices respectively!

.

Want a COA for your VW? .... 1/2 the Price of the Porsche COA, & they get it right the 1st time!

http://volkswagen-automuseum.de/zertifikate-datenblaetter.html

.

Lastly, if you're looking for tires which will fit their stock 14" steel &/or factory alloy wheels, I can highly recommend the Maxxis tires below, which far exceed the quality & life of the OEM Michelins which were specifically designed for Vanagons, & the Maxxis have a 14/32" tread depth that is almost an all season M+S depth tire. I've had their LT205/70R15C on my alloys for about 2 years now, & they're the most stable in crosswinds & 18-wheelers passing of any I've had on our `88 Westy since new, including the Michelins. So you might also consider them for other wheel/tire sizes as well, due to their Load capacity & sidewall stiffness.

Bravo Series UE-168(N) | Maxxis Tires USA:
http://www.maxxis.com/catalog/tire-227-104-bravo-series-ue-168-n

.

And just for the fun of it, I got one of these decals for the back window with "0-60: 30 mins." & they have tin-top Vanagon decals too.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/272172276992?item=272172276992&viewitem=&vxp=mtr

.

I've purchased from them all, & was satisfied with the parts & services, but agree with Marc above about how GoWesty has become less helpful over the years, & their prices tend to be the highest - but they too are still very useful sources, & will get back to you on questions & help on their parts, & will stand behind them (e.g.: they returned a bad set of the LED exterior light kit right away & helped with the install over several emails).

Hope this info helps the Vanagon lovers on here!


Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2017, 04:14 PM

Wow thank you Tom! Very helpful!

Posted by: 914forme Feb 18 2017, 06:07 PM

So you need an EG33 I happen to have a spare long block. You have all my sensors, you would just need to find an intake manifold and other bits. Heck I would even toss in your cam covers. I also have an early MT5, if your not going to beat the crap out of it, it would be fine 4.11 gears.




Do It

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 18 2017, 11:31 PM

Well this is a real game changer... . So you're saying if I have an intake manifold...like the one in my rafters right there...and maybe the runners, fuel injectors, etc, like the ones in the box next to it, along with your sensors and stuff...



I definitely have everything to stick on a long block. Let's talk!

As much as I wish I could use a 5MT it takes a special flipped R&P from SubaruGears to use one. The cost for everything to do that shipped is like $2k. It's pointed the wrong way in the Vanagon, so the only other trans option out of the box is a 911 unless i wanted to use a 90's Honda 4 cylinder that rotates counter clockwise. Would love to do a tiptronic 996 trans but I'd imagine it to be a wiring nightmare since it requires the key immobilizer module, key, etc. I think I'd just use the Vanagon 4 speed until SubaruGears does the Subaru auto flipped diff trans.

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 19 2017, 12:03 AM

Posted by: veltror Feb 19 2017, 06:56 AM

Another good parts supplier


https://www.tk-carparts.de

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2017, 11:59 AM

Thanx for adding this resource, but I wish they had an English version to their website.

It's still handy to price check others, once you find a part you need.

Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2017, 02:17 PM

I forgot to add info on swing-away bike racks, which allow you to swing the rack with bikes mounted out of the way over to the curbside for access to the rear hatch or trunk- as well as for loading/unloading of the bikes on the parkway-grass/sidewalk area, of which there are more manufacturers' options today.

I got the the only game in town around 2012, which was Yakima SwingDaddy 4-bike rack, & have used it with great success on our Westy, & really like it. Yakima now also has a 2nd FullSwing rack rated to 160 lbs. (SwingDaddy is 150#). The design of the lower arms of my SwingDaddy is more rectangular in section, but it's basically the same deal in looks & function, also in silver (the FullSwing is black).

You can also search for other makers' swing-out or swing-away bike racks to compare their products too.

Either way, this is a long overdue way to carry bikes on your Vanagon or any other vehicle, & still get easy access to the rear hatch or trunk without dismounting the bikes, or without hoisting up a heavy loaded hatch with a hatch mounted rack (e.g.: Fiamma's), or without dropping & raising a heavy loaded tilt-down bike rack (dumb idea IMHO).

The SwingDaddy works great for us!

As always, google & shop around for the best pricing since they can vary by $100-200+ - but here's the Yakima website links to both racks.

https://www.yakima.com/swingdaddy

https://www.yakima.com/fullswing

.

I got the GoWesty Vanagon 2" receiver hitch for ours, because it's the cleanest & least protruding design of the Vanagon hitches out there. That saves on skinned & bruised shins with some of the other designs! I recco you wait until it's on sale to save 10-15% though.

http://www.gowesty.com/product-details.php?v=&id=2582

.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2017, 02:46 PM

Anti-glare Film Help Please

So now a question for the experts out there on mounting a back-up camera high & inside the rear hatch glass - in order to see over the bikes/rack when backing, but without drilling nor cutting into the body/hatch or pop-top.

Any camera on the license plate frame or up under the lower hatch lip next to the license plate lights will be blocked by the bike rack &/or bikes on the rack - so it has to go high, & I don't want some goofy looking surface mounted solution .... but it needs to work visibility-wise.

Is there any type of anti-glare film which can be put on the Vanagon rear hatch glass, so that the rear camera can be mounted next to my GW 3rd brake light on the inside of the glass, which will allow the camera to "see" properly??

Mounting inside the glass to the L or R or the 3rd Brake Light at the top, & then adjusting the angle of the camera to both look down the backing lane 7 compensate for the angle sloping back of the glass - see pic below:



.

BTW - that's a GW adhesive mounted 3rd Brake Light, so I'm hoping to do a similar adhesive mount for the camera's mount-frame, then run the wires to the driver's side cable boot between the hatch & body at the top left of the frame/opening, then forward to the stereo unit.

3rd Brake Light FYI - These can also be used easily in our 914s too!
http://www.gowesty.com/product-details.php?v=&id=23669

.

This is the Pioneer unit with 7" fold-out screen & their compatible camera which I'm considering for this application. Note that the fold-out screen comes out 1-5/8" to clear the dash top bolster on Vanagons, & it's been installed in a Synchro in the U-tube link below....

Pioneer AVH-X7800BT radio installed in a Volkswagen Vanagon Syncro 1990 -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x_vDaRmySrs

Pioneer AVH-X7800BT radio -
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Car...ers/AVH-X7800BT

Pioneer Back-up Camera ND-BC8 -
http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PUSA/Car...-Cameras/ND-BC8

> but shop around & google shop, since I see them for much less that their $500 & $100 list prices respectively! I think they can be had for about $400+/- for both with shipping + tax by state.

.

TIA!
Tom
///////

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 19 2017, 03:10 PM

Rocky Mountain Westy integrates a 2" receiver into their bumper that doesn't protrude.

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 19 2017, 04:05 PM

As you can see from my pic above Marc, I've kept our Westy stock with the FG Bumpers, so the GW hitch was the best option for me.

If someone is switching to steel bumpers, then that one is a good option. IIRC with the GW steel bumpers, you'd have to add a receiver to it.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 19 2017, 08:51 PM

Well the more I look at this thing the more I like it. The undercoating did a great job of protecting the metal underneath. It's flaking off in big chunks now. There's NO rust under there.





The engine, however, is getting less promising. Definitely not going to try to get it running.

This is fine. right?



Couple of holes in the muffler and pipes, and there seem to be bolts missing, as if someone started working on it but then just gave up.









Took the back bumper off since it had a wrinkle in it, and got rid of the cheap FLAPS wheel covers. They DID NOT go quietly.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 20 2017, 11:16 PM

Do these mounts look like they would really work?

http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1903380

Posted by: sechszylinder Feb 23 2017, 06:34 AM

Here is my Vanagon.

Currently at the painter. Unfortunately the roof needs to be resprayed in darkblue

The car will get a 2.0L GTI Engine, which is a popular swap in Germany, since no modification of the engine mount (originally 50HP Diesel) is needed.

BR

Benno

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 23 2017, 07:41 AM

Very nice Benno! I was thinking about doing a color change but that looks great! I think I'm going with a 4 cylinder Subaru but we'll see what happens. Lots of work to do before it's time for that.

Posted by: 76-914 Feb 23 2017, 08:45 AM

Posted by: KELTY360 Feb 23 2017, 09:09 AM

I think it's missing some pieces. BTW, I've got the SmallCar mount but if i was doing it again I'd go with the Rocky Mountain Westy system.

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 23 2017, 11:11 AM

Yeah I figured Marc...thanks for the feedback on the RMW mount.

Hey Benno, what year GTI engine are you using?

Posted by: 914forme Feb 23 2017, 11:17 AM

Uses the stock factory bar mount for the engine cross bar, and looks like the stock rear engine mounts on the EG. The part I am having trouble picturing in my mind is the angle of the mounts.

If the plates mount flat on the bar, then the angle will be off on the mounts and the EG mounts will fail. If the plates are angled on the bar, then it would work, I am just not a big fan of the brakes tilted and being held in place by one bolt.

Will it work :confused:more than likely. Will it be an elegant solution compared to the ubber heavy Small Car Mount, no. You will still need to fabricate an exhaust hanger also. The small car exhaust hanger is built from the same steel as the engine most. To say it is over kill is an understatement.

Posted by: 914forme Feb 23 2017, 11:20 AM

It was a common swap over here also, very easy, you do want to get a diesel engine oil pan and oil pump. The rest if I remember correctly was a matching period engine and the bolt pattern was the same.

Reason for the diesel pan, and pump is it allows the engine to be titled over to fit in the space. Otherwise it a no go.

Posted by: sechszylinder Feb 24 2017, 05:01 AM

Its a 1993 engine, which has been used in Golf MK3 GTI and Corrados with engine code 2E. I've completely rebuild the engine featuring new pistons, rebuild cylinder head and new crankshaft bearings. Overall HP will be in the range of 120 HP.
Besides that, I think those subaru engines are a perfect fit for Vanagons, but it needs much more effort for the adaptation.

BR

Benno

Posted by: Chris H. Feb 24 2017, 11:50 AM

Very interesting. That paint looks so good Benno. I can't stop looking at it! Do you have any other pics? Mine is so dull and faded it you'd never imagine it would look like that . What size are your Toyo tires?

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 25 2017, 11:57 AM

FYI - 15% Off SALE at VWHertiage, for any of those odds-n-ends your VW needs.

<snipped from my email>
Sorry we forgot Valentine’s Day... Technical website issues meant we couldn’t run the promotion as planned... Cupid was furious! But we still love you though. To make up for it we’d like to give you 15% off until the end of the month. Place an order over £100 and enjoy our biggest ever Flash Sale discount. We could have bought you flowers, but to be honest, this is much better!
Use the code BIG15 at the checkout
<end snip>

https://www.vwheritage.com/

Don't forget to check their pricing vs dollars with google search Pound to Dollar, & to consider the PayPal &/or Credit Card Exchange Rates, shipping (if any more from UK), etc. - in comparison with our USA vendors.

However, they have some parts not available here, such as those rubber wiring hose grommets at the top of the Vanagon rear hatch & others.


Tom
///////

Posted by: sechszylinder Feb 28 2017, 07:34 AM

o.k. on popular demand, some more pictures of my vanagon ->





This is my new instrument cluster, which I've build using gauges from speedhut and porsche (unfortunately the only porsche part in this car).



These will be the rims , with Halloween decoration from my kids. BTW. The same rims before restoration that you will see in the last picture of this post.


This is a picture after all chassis repair and welding was done, ready for the painter. That car was a real rust bucket. Lots of work ...


If you have questions regarding rust repair, I think I grew up to an real expert in this field regarding Vanagons

BR

Benno

Posted by: sechszylinder Feb 28 2017, 07:41 AM

And finally, to bring in some Porsche content, a side by side shot of my Vanagon and my 914/6 GT tribute car project some years before .



BR

Benno

Posted by: Front yard mechanic Feb 28 2017, 10:46 AM

A box is a box is a box

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 28 2017, 11:45 AM

Nobody forced you to look at this thread Mr. Killjoy!

Maybe this V8 Middie Van will float your boat!?

http://www.engineswapdepot.com/?p=10823





One dang fast BOX!!!!


Tom
///////

Posted by: Front yard mechanic Feb 28 2017, 12:01 PM

My kind of box indeed

Posted by: Tom_T Feb 28 2017, 03:30 PM

Even on the basic 4-bangers - what other car of the <1990s can you camp out in weekends/vacations, drive it as your DD the rest of the time, & live in permanently as your home if need be - than a Westy van!?

FYI I've seen another Vanagon online from SoCal with a Porsche 928 V8 transplanted into it - imagine a "box" version of Rick's "Alien" 928 V8 powered 914 on here!

And then there are the Subie flat-6s & Porsche's own B32 Carrera Vanagons with great power & handling .... for a brick on wheels!

So sometimes a a box just isn't a box - or at least not an ordinary one!

PS - I'd suggest that you clean & sanitize the seat really well on the car in your avatar!!!!


Tom
///////

Posted by: sechszylinder Mar 1 2017, 01:44 AM

That is quite interesting! Can you post a link?
br
Benno

Posted by: strawman Mar 1 2017, 01:21 PM

I bought a 1981 Diesel Vanagon Westfalia off flEaBAY in 1997 . The drive back from Ft. Collins, CO to Logan, UT was verrrrry sloooowwww -- I was passed by big rigs and everything else on the road. It was a very easy swap to a gasser MkII Golf engine even back in 1998 before the expansive lore of the Internet got in the way, although you definitely want to regear the transmission -- otherwise it'll be a stump-puller that screams as highway speeds. It's maiden trip (pun intended) was Burning Man in 1999...

I followed up that swap with a Suby EJ22 into a 1986 Westy Syncro in 2002. I wish I kept it because the price of these rigs is now astronomical; did I REALLY sell it for less than $10k in 2007 (to Warren Chapman, RIP)?!?!?. But my current TDI-swapped 1993 Eurovan Westy is the best yet. A/C that actually works, great ergonomics, more "substantial" overall feel, and 30mpg make it a great combo.

Posted by: Front yard mechanic Mar 1 2017, 01:56 PM

Van guys are sensitive


Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 1 2017, 08:08 PM

Not a finished project, I don't think, so it's not pretty from the backside, as compared to Porsche's own "B32 Carrera" Vanagons.

http://www.2040-cars.com/Volkswagen/Bus-Vanagon/1986-volkswagen-vanagon-syncro-w-porsche-v8-292757/



.

vs. the `85 Porsche B32 Carrera's clean resolution of the design mods -
http://www.carbuildindex.com/24024/porsche-vw-t3-bus-the-b32/




Tom
///////

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 1 2017, 08:16 PM

Just because you can...doesn't mean you should.

Even worse, they hacked up a Syncro to do it.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 1 2017, 08:22 PM

If they'd done it well Marc, then it would've been a screaming syncro, which also looked good!

The hack job was in the lack of quality & professionality in the execution of the resto-mod project, & with the engine hanging out the back without a legal bumper substitute on there - & not whether it passes smog - was probably why the guy couldn't get DMV to approve his half-fast project!! ... as he complains about in his write-up at the link I gave.

I'd modify your comment to be:
"Just because you can, is no reason to do a half-fast hack job!"

If you're going to do something resto-mod, then do it right - dammit!

Besides, there are a ton of Subie-Synchro conversions out there too!


Tom
///////

Posted by: KELTY360 Mar 1 2017, 08:45 PM

There is no way to do that conversion well. The dimensions of that engine means you have to cut the firewall and impinge on the rear seats. Which also means you have no room for the fuel tank. Even at that you still have an engine sitting about 4" off the ground. Senseless.

The proliferation of Subie conversions is a result of horizontally opposed engines designed with a clean sheet instead of obsolete technology hodge-podged together for water cooling. VW had everything right on the Vanagon, except the engine. It's a great box.

Posted by: sechszylinder Mar 2 2017, 03:29 AM

Hey Tom, thanks for the link and the pictures, but thats, what I have feared ...

It looks ugly and is a quite bad technical solution

Besides that, I know that particular B32 in the pictures. It has been owned by a private owner for a long time and is now in a museum in Hannover Germany.

BR

Benno

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 2 2017, 01:50 PM

Benno,

I saw that one in the Hanover Museum on their website first too, when I was googling for the Oettenger WBX6. I'd love to research & write a rare Porsche article for our PCA Panorama or Excellence magazines sometime when I have time after retirement.

I cringe at hack jobs of any type on any car/truck!

If you're going to do something, then do it right!

I think one could do a nice clean & well designed Vanagon mod with the late '86-95 928 V8's & 928 running gear (suspension/brakes/etc.), or with a newer donor AWD V8 Cayenne S or Panamera 4S, & have a great Vanagon/Westy!

Then my wife could be happy to be able to tow our restored vintage 1960 Avion T20 (similar to Airstream - but better - +/- 3000-3500 lbs wet & loaded) in style with our `88 Westy!


Tom
///////

Posted by: JmuRiz Mar 2 2017, 01:55 PM

A B32 would be so cool to have/drive.

About the only minivan I'd ever want to own.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 2 2017, 02:05 PM

Also about the only minivan eligible for PCA Concours, AX, DE & Track events (sorry for the typo!).

As rare as the B32s are, I'd think that they'd be wildly expensive.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 2 2017, 02:35 PM

My first inclination was to do a B32 clone. Maybe it will morph into that over time.

BTW that 928 conversion van looks like a gutted fish. Innards are just spilling out of the open wound .

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 2 2017, 03:15 PM

If you do a B32 clone, then I'd suggest that you do an updated clone with a watercooled 2000-10's Boxster/Cayman (896/897/891) or 911 (996/997/991) with a good driveline from an otherwise totaled one - do the IMS Bearing fix if the earlier *86/*87 engines, & you can also do it AWD if you got it from a 4S/4 AWD 911 donor.

That way you'll have a newer WBX which can run cooler, & you'll not have to do all the water to air cooled mods on a later Vano, which involved some complex air ducting for those rear mid-high side ducts & other stuff - most of which would be NLA & hard to reproduce repros.

RUF has also done one or some Porsche 6 Vanagons (not sure how many), which also would be "legal" under PCA rules BTW. IIRC this has an aircooled 3.6.

http://www.brick-yard.co.uk/forum/youll-love-this-ruf-porsche-built-t3-twin-turb_topic46463.html




Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 2 2017, 03:35 PM

that they had it all right, & should've followed thru with Porsche's advice & finished out their WBX6 JV project with Oettenger as a production model.

It always P.O's me when Iacocca claims he/Dodge-Chrysler "invented" the mini-van - at a time when VW had already been building them for for over 3 decades. IMHO, VW has made nice & appealing design progress on their vans with every generation - except perhaps when the rebadged the "Chrysler-Rutan" for the US/Canada.

However, & I disagree that there is no way to design & engineer something with a Porsche V8 driveline/suspension/brakes as 2WD or 4WD/AWD. So what if you need to move the rear seats forward, or relocate the Synchro's rear fuel tank.

Any good designer/engineer can accomplish a solution which works & looks good. It may take some time, research & loads of cash - compared to a Subie 4/6 or maybe even compared to a Porsche flat-6 conversion. But then, this would be a one-off dream -build sort of thing.

Just think if they said that Porsche couldn't put the 908 engine in the 914-8 bec ause they had to cut the firewall!?

Where there is a will - coupled with the skill - there is a way IMHO!


Tom
///////

Posted by: sechszylinder Mar 3 2017, 12:07 AM

The company Claer is well known in Germany for their Porsche conversions of Vanagons and other VW vans.

Have a look http://www.claer-automobile.de/

BR
Benno

Posted by: 914forme Mar 3 2017, 05:12 AM

How about an S33 van.

EG33, and then do all the suspension and brake work. I need to quit looking at this thread. Always wanted one of the dual cab pickups, and well........

Posted by: Chris H. Mar 3 2017, 08:01 AM

Yes Stephen, that's what I'm thinking. Not an exact copy but a "B33", maybe with the look but a little less stiff. Something I could drive comfortably but with a little extra power. The nice thing is I can start with a 4 and work my way up if I want to.

I clicked the Claer link and saw this right away...don't go in there Stephen...you'll get side-tracked on your Dad's 6 resto .



Wow there are some pretty cool conversions out there for this old box! Tom/Benno, I spent a LOT of time looking at the 996 tiptronic trans since there are literally no other options outside of the Vanagon automatic. It requires the key immobilizer module as well, and the wiring is pretty scary looking. Lots of sensors and inputs that would not be used, some of which would likely have to have their voltage simulated. LOTS of them. I suppose a Boxster engine would pretty much connect to it. Can't do a Boxster trans since it spins the wrong way. Definitely an option.

Bottom line is cost really. There are a couple of low mileage/bad transmission SVX's on Craigslist now. Tempting to harvest one of those. But then what do I use for a trans...? That's where I'm stuck. Seems like it's almost the same money to do a Subaru trans but I'd really like (or at least I think I would like) an automatic so everyone can drive it in the fam. SubaruGears IS working on an auto trans reverse R&P but won't give a time frame.

BTW did anyone see this?

SubaruGears now makes adapters for mating Subaru transmissions to a LOT of different engines:

The Type 1! The Type 4! Ecotec, Zetec, all VW engines, 1.8t, All the way to the LS1 and the REALLY GOOD Lexus 4.0 V8. I know KEP will make these too but it's interesting that they are making a trans plate to mate to VW air cooled engines. Pretty cool actually. And the quality will be very good.

http://subarugears.com/Adaptors/Adaptors.html

Also, has anyone heard of this guy?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VA0deR7P6E


He REVERSED the 1.8T engine direction so you can use an Audi/VW trans. The company does not sell kits. Only the full conversion which is about $10-$12k including the engine. Really not a bad deal actually but I want to do it myself.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 3 2017, 11:07 AM

Thanx Benno,

I've seen 1 or 2 of the Claers come up for sale online in Europe over the years.

There are also several USA shops which specialize in dropping a Porsche 6 into T3 Vanagons too, including one of our LA area members on here (but I'm spacing on his name right now), who has posted in this thread.

I had mentioned RUF because the main US/Canada Porsche Club PCA rules treat RUF cars as if a factory Porsche, due to their relationship with the factory I suppose. So members can enter them in any PCA event, but the others aren't regarded that privilege.

However, I disagree with that approach myself in principal. I think any Porsche running gear conversion, re-body, etc. should be allowed, since PCA has a "Special" division for such unique cars, & there are a lot of car conversions out there which would be interesting for members to see in AX, DE/Race, Concours & other driving events.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 3 2017, 11:10 AM

Oew-Oew .... Mr. Kottah!

How 'bout an aircooled 908 flat 8 in a Vano!?


Tom
///////

Posted by: 914forme Mar 3 2017, 04:27 PM

Marty of MSDS Fame? He has done a few of them including a very http://www.msdsinc.com/ProjectSyncro.html.

http://www.msdsinc.com/ProjectGerman8er.html

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 3 2017, 04:44 PM

I think so - does he go by MalteseFalcon or something similar on here?

.... sorry for the halfzymer moment hon this, but I'm doing about 5 things at the same time today!

The Doka & Single Cab's higher rear deck really opens up space & options for some radical mods, doesn't it!


Tom
///////

Posted by: 914forme Mar 3 2017, 05:29 PM

Yep that would be him.

LS7 and C2 trans

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 4 2017, 01:22 PM

BTW - ALL cars/etc. are "Boxes" - & designers refer to them as either 1, 2 or 3 Box design .... if not obvious -

> most cars & pick-ups are "3 Box" design - including our 914s,

> SUV/CUVs, station wagons/Touring/Shooting Brake (who the F*** came up with that last one!? ), Hatches & some Vans/Mini-Vans are "2 Box" design,

> & most Vans/Mini-Vans & some cars like the Scion B/etc. are "1 Box" design.

So any way your cut it - all vehicles are "Boxes" are "Boxes" are "Boxes"!


Tom
///////

Posted by: sechszylinder Mar 4 2017, 01:44 PM

From my point of view, besides the 914,I always liked the Golf GTI (Rabbit) MK1 style, which is really kind of a box.

So I think of my Vanagon as of a bulky mutated Golf GTI MK1, perfect suited as a Porsche parts- / family- hauler

BR

Benno

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 4 2017, 01:57 PM

No Benno, the GTI is a "2 Box" design by automotive convention!

I like the reference to our Vanagons as "A Brick on Wheels" - heavy & square!

Although, the Vanagon broke ground with sleeker design & better aerodynamics, long before Chrysler/Dodge's entry!


Tom
///////

Posted by: mepstein Mar 4 2017, 03:33 PM

Marty used to sell a kit to do the 3.2 conversion. He has a 935 engine in his 914.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 11 2017, 05:36 PM

Required equipment for any stock Vanagon ....



Various styles & vehicles can be found at the link below & not expensive - I used the one to add your own text -

http://stores.ebay.com/sundownstickers/


Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 11 2017, 05:49 PM

A photo of our now Classic Westy in front of our vintage 1960 Avion T20 (#2 off the line) last October at the "Ride the Wild Surf" vintage trailer rally at the Newport Dunes Resort in Newport Beach CA - 1960's era doodads on the left & 1980's era doodads on the right .... just for the halibut!




Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 11 2017, 05:52 PM

Another photo of our now Classic 1988 Westy in front of our vintage 1960 Avion T20 (#2 off the line) last October at the "Ride the Wild Surf" vintage trailer rally at the Newport Dunes Resort in Newport Beach CA - 1960's era doodads on the left & 1980's era doodads on the right .... just for the halibut!




Tom
///////

Posted by: rgalla9146 Mar 12 2017, 10:58 AM

I worked in the eighties for a VW, Porsche, Audi independent shop.
It was located near the US headquarters of VW +Porsche Audi and the owner had strong connections to the firm and many friends there.
On occasion unusual cars would drop in on their way from JFK airfreight to the
headquarters in Englewood Cliffs.
Once a Vanagon showed up with a 3.2 installed by Porsche in Germany.
It was white with a beautiful navy blue all leather 6 seat interior and Bose sound system.
It also had 911 steel wheels and flat hubcaps. And a 930 4 speed.
The cast 3.2 intake manifolds had aluminum tape covering the cast Porsche logo.
All factory done. It was on it's way to a Ca.dealer....Fuller... Porsche ?
AND .... I got to drive it.
My '89 Westy could really use some of that zip.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 11:26 AM

Very Interesting - I didn't realize that they sent any of their B32's over to the US - officially or unofficially.

If I ever won the Power Ball big, I'd get some Vanagon +/-85 & see if Porsche Classics could be talked into building an "original continuation" B32.

Of course for that I'd actually have to buy lotto tickets!


Tom
///////

Posted by: rgalla9146 Mar 12 2017, 12:50 PM

Oh! the Vanagon I drove was not a B32.
It was very 'plain Jane from the outside.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 02:42 PM

I wonder if it could've been one of the factory B32 prototypes which they fitted out? The 6 blue leather seats were pretty unique to the final "Exec Limo" version of the production B32.

IIRC the blue & white versions of the B32 which I've seen in the pix had the blue seats, but they looked like these in the Anthracite Grey Metallic B32 from the VW Museum in Hamburg (??) below.



Does that interior shot look familiar - other than not blue & leather?


Tom
///////

Posted by: rgalla9146 Mar 12 2017, 03:51 PM

Don't forget this was ~30 years ago !
My recollection is the seats were smooth solid leather.
The seating was the two front seats plus two rear facing optional and the rear
bench..... so could actually be a seven seater.
I clearly remember the steel 911 wheels with the flat hubcaps without Porsche
crests.
When was the last air cooled Vanagon ....1982 - 83 ?

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 04:34 PM

I hear ya, at 64 some things are foggy for me too!

I saw some pix of one of the prototype B32 airboxer/6 T3/Vanagons, & it had the 911 steel wheels. I'll try to find that later on. The article may have said something about it being sent to the US.

Yes, up to mid-83 MY was the 2L aircooled motor, but the Vanagon/T3 were specifically design for water boxers, but the engines weren't ready for mainstream until well after the mid-1979 release of the T3-Vano.

Some would question whether they were really ready for prime time then - what with coolant eating thru dissimilar metals in the heads/gaskets/cases in 20K miles!

But the B32s were built in 85 MY from waterboxer/4 T3s, & essentially backdated to aircooled - since Porsche's 3.2 Carreras were still airboxer/6s.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 04:44 PM

This photo of a magazine article is hard to read (I suggest enlarging it), but goes thru the history of how they came up with the B32 - NOT as a chase/support vehicle for the Paris-Dakkar Race, but as a test vehicle/support vehicle for other Porsche engineering programs being tested in Africa, & then they decided to produce them.

What I like about it, is that it interviewed some of the actual Porsche engineers, rather than hearsay & "alternative facts."




I'd like to find a better copy of that article, but I don't even know the originating auto magazine's name, since that info was cropped off of the pix.


Tom
///////

Posted by: veltror Mar 12 2017, 06:07 PM

Why not fit an Audi 5 cylinder, this was factory fitment in south africa

http://www.lekkercamper.co.za/travel-article/south-african-vw-t3-big-window-big-personality.html

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 06:18 PM

I never was a fan of the Audi 5-banger in the T4/Eurovans, which vans alsways seemed equally underpowered until they put the VR6 in them.

Not to mention ....

What's more sexy - a Porsche Carrera 3.2L flat-6 with the Fuchs wheels, 4-wheel disc brakes & all of the other 911 Carrera suspension bits ....

.... or an Audi I-5?

I'd be keen to see a Merlin 16 cylinder amidships (from the P51 Mustang, Spitfire, Hydro-boats, at least one NHRA Dragster "Rail", etc.) - sans interior (sim. to the dragster a few pages back) - just to see what that could blast like!!

Realistically for a modern hot Vanagon/T3, probably pulling the flat 6 WBX drivetrain & running gear from a post 2000's Porsche is the hot set-up with most sex appeal which will fit the space reasonably well, IMHO.


Tom
///////

Posted by: mepstein Mar 12 2017, 07:52 PM

My cousin said he had close to 2000hp in his P-51 so that might be a bit much for a VW van.

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 12 2017, 08:23 PM

It would be a dragster "Rail" posing as a VW Van Mark.

A buddy of my uncle had a straight Rail with the 16 cyl. Merlin in it & ran at OCR & other dragstrips here in SoCal back in the 1960's, & he had more than 2k HP & it ripped!

It had this teenage boy's eyes like saucers when we saw it run!

They were more available back in the 1960's in the days when you could still get WWII surplus stuff cheap, & used in Hydroplane raceboats mostly.

My uncle got a perfect crated WWII Jeep 100% new for $200 back then.


Tom
///////

Posted by: veltror Mar 13 2017, 01:40 PM

% cykinder in a T3 rear enguned Audi 5

Posted by: Tom_T Mar 13 2017, 01:44 PM

Sorry Mate, but I have no idea what you're getting at here!?

I do know what you meant by the SA Audi 5 cyl. fitment, just not thrilled by it.

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 11 2017, 09:31 PM

I FINALLY got lucky on a car part purchase! Not that I haven't been given stuff by many people here, etc, but I ACCIDENTALLY found the exact wheels I wanted:







Was just looking for a set of stock wheels to clean up and put new tires on after a lot of back-and-forth since the stock steel wheels are 14's. I asked about these and the guy said "wait...these aren't stock...they are...15x7. You sure you want 'em?" Ahhh....YEAH! WRAP THOSE UP! Perfect size for a Vanagon. I can add a nice fat 215/70 tire for a smooth ride but still have a decent contact patch and slightly more aggressive look.

Posted by: KELTY360 Apr 11 2017, 10:31 PM

Nice! Those 15s will also reduce the effects of crosswinds and oncoming 18 wheelers.

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 12 2017, 12:22 PM

Yeah I hope so! The 14's look so small! I have small tires on the 14's too so that may be part of it. On the new ones it's obvious the centers were cut out and welded to 15" hoops. Can't wait to get them on the beast.

Posted by: Tom_T Apr 12 2017, 12:41 PM

These Maxxis Tires exceed the factory spec & are super stable in winds & 18-wheeler passes - even in the stock 14" size.

I highly recommend them!

http://www.maxxis.com/catalog/tire-227-104-bravo-series-ue-168-n


Tom
///////

Posted by: 76-914 Apr 12 2017, 05:26 PM

Easy; %=5 depending on shift key function. U is next to I and K is next to L on the keyboard. Typing w/o eyeglasses would be a kind description, don't you think?

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 13 2017, 12:06 PM

Thanks for the tire tip Tom (say that 10 times fast).

BTW I'm surprised/bummed about how hard it is to find good VW dog dish hubcaps any more! Sheesh I used to have a dozen of them just for decoration. The new ones apparently rust very easily so it's either used or $$$ OEM if you can find them. The bus/vanagon caps are thicker to accommodate the wheel hub which sticks out a bit so Beetle/Type 3 caps won't work.

Posted by: 76-914 Apr 13 2017, 12:16 PM

I may have one or two from my Ghia restoration years back. The new ones I purchased in 2001 were thin compared to the factory OEM's. LMK, it's yours for the asking Chris. Kent

Posted by: Tom_T Apr 13 2017, 12:31 PM

Chris -

Those Maxxis are better than the OE Michelins for the Vanagon when new, & the tread is deeper - so more of an all weather M+S depth (15/32" IIRC).

For the caps, try the VW Bus Shop - Peter Gunzl - either in their regular or VW Classic parts sections, & you may have to look at other T1-T2 or Bugs/Ghias for what you want, since that 15" wheel was more common on those, than Vanagons/T3s.

https://www.vwbusshop.de/

That's where GoWesty, Van Cafe, Bus Depot, etc. gets many of their parts anyway - but adding their own mark-up, &/or not offering kits that are available from Gunzl!

Another source for repro caps might be Hubcap Mike's here in Orange CA, but do a good thick 90-=100% Carnuba wax on them before mounting (both/all sides) cuz their chrome isn't as thick as OE - as I found out with the 57 Plymouth caps used on our 1960 Avion T20 trailer.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris H. Apr 13 2017, 03:57 PM

Wow thanks Kent! I'll let you know for sure. OEM NEW is $260 for the set shipped. Not terrible. Not great...but not terrible. 3X the cost of the cheaper ones.

Posted by: Chris H. May 1 2018, 08:21 PM

Very interesting....anyone want to make a B36???

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1991-Volkswagen-Bus-Vanagon/112966423432?_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D50687%26meid%3D40d3fefd66c5495385e1ffbd60422605%26pid%3D100033%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D8%26sd%3D112966423432%26itm%3D112966423432&_trksid=p2045573.c100033.m2042

Posted by: Mueller May 1 2018, 08:25 PM

There has to be a good story here with that sale.... no wheels or suspension for either vehicle and not even close to being finished?

Posted by: Chris H. May 1 2018, 09:29 PM

It looks like they have suspension for at least the van but it's not installed. I agree there must be a reason why the conversion just stopped one day. You could use a 996 trans in a Vanagon but the AWD setup would be pretty hard to transfer over.

Posted by: euro911 May 2 2018, 04:30 AM

'Eileen' is at a friend's shop - the old 1.9L sucked a valve back in December, so it'll be coming home with a 2.1L in it soon

Posted by: Chris H. May 2 2018, 06:58 AM

Sticking with the waterboxer eh Mark? 2.1 should give it more pep.

I'm stalled at a crossroads on mine...I have a line on a 2.2L Subaru engine with less than 80k...guy wants $600. Or I could rebuild my 1.9 which looks very good inside. I could just re-ring it and re-seal it, but then you start thinking about "while I'm in there.." and it starts adding up.

Posted by: KELTY360 May 2 2018, 08:59 AM

Mark - Do you need any 2.1 wiring harness pieces? I've got a complete, uncut (I think), harness without a van to go into.

Posted by: KELTY360 May 2 2018, 09:06 AM

Rebuilding that 1.9 is a great idea......

If you can get the engine harness and ecu with the Subie why would you even hesitate. MPG alone will probably make up the cost difference.

Posted by: euro911 May 2 2018, 11:17 AM

I'll shoot you a PM, Marc.

Posted by: Chris H. May 2 2018, 03:48 PM

Yeah I can't explain it Marc. It's like I want to finish it for the engineering challenge. The parts are worth more than the whole engine running I bet. And the zero to 60 time BRAND NEW per Motorweek was 18 seconds. I'd like to go 2.5 but it's so hard to find a low mileage one fairly cheaply.

Probably posted this before, but here's the Motorweek review...handled pretty well for a big metal box.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GnnVFB3628g

Posted by: Tom_T May 2 2018, 05:12 PM

I have it on good authority that it's much longer than that!




Tom
///////

Posted by: 914forme May 2 2018, 07:56 PM

https://www.copart.com/quickpick/subaru/?displayStr=Subaru&from=%2F&searchCriteria=%7B%22query%22:%5B%22*%22%5D,%22filter%22:%7B%22MISC%22:%5B%22lot_make_desc:SUBARU%22%5D,%22ODM%22:%5B%22odometer_reading_received:%5B25000%20TO%2050000%5D%22,%22odometer_reading_received:%5B*%20TO%2025000%5D%22%5D,%22ENGN%22:%5B%22engine:%5C%222.5L%20%204%5C%22%22%5D,%22TMTP%22:%5B%22transmission_type:%5C%22MANUAL%5C%22%22%5D%7D,%22sort%22:%5B%22auction_date_type%20desc%22,%22auction_date_utc%20asc%22%5D,%22searchName%22:%22%22,%22watchListOnly%22:false,%22freeFormSearch%22:false%7D

Posted by: 914forme May 2 2018, 07:58 PM

https://www.copart.com/lot/24836078 Make that van fly

Posted by: 914forme May 2 2018, 08:00 PM

To go AWD you must flip the ring gear in the trans and then the front you rotate the front diff on its top. Move the vent to its bottom which is now its top, and drive it like a really fast Synchro

Posted by: KELTY360 May 2 2018, 08:15 PM

Next week I'll be cruising my EG33 Syncro Westy through Montana, trying my best to hold it under 85......just sayin'.

Posted by: Chris H. May 2 2018, 09:05 PM

You're both getting to me for sure. When I REALLY consider it I can't imagine going anywhere with a 3600 lb van that has 83HP. That is 43 pounds per HP.

Are the Vanagon Subaru guys starting to use the later engines now? I was seeing a cutoff point at 2004ish for quite a while. The later ones seem to be somewhat cheaper but I haven't come across a conversion using one yet. An H6 would be really sweet too. Need to find me an EZ30D for decent $ maybe.

Posted by: porschetub May 2 2018, 10:53 PM

Always loved these vans,had my fair share of buses in the earlier times...7 bay windows and 2 splitties,unfortunately before any number of T25's came into my country there was the Japanese vans were coming in and cheaper due to Euro import duties.
The few that came in were personal imports and cost the owners dearly.
Engine conversions ,they did all sorts out of SA the Audi 5L wasn't that great success ,not because of the engine just the weight it was moving,I understand some folks put mk2 GTI motors in them...same issue as the Audi.
If I could find one I would go for the 16V ABF (9A usa) a very good motor that easily can achieve 300K with out an problems and 150hp,easily tuned to 170hp and great on fuel,less complicated than the 20v 1.8t conversions.
The Vr6 motor is a lump in 12v form and not totally worth the effort ,can drink like a sailor if pushed in this application,however not the worse choice due to being 2.8l.

Posted by: euro911 May 2 2018, 10:59 PM

I've had Eileen up to 96 mph (GPS verified) ...












... going downhill

Posted by: Tom_T May 3 2018, 12:15 PM

Me too in our `88 Westy's 2.1L with AT .... radar warning sign verified.

Downhill, so I can still keep 60-65 uphill on the other side!

Plenty of time to "imagine" at stock Vanagon speeds Chris!
... or daydream, check out fields & livestock, Rock to the Beach Boys & Beatles, etc.!


Tom
///////

Posted by: KELTY360 May 3 2018, 12:33 PM

I said cruisin' ......not listening for rod knock

BTW, I've seen triple digits on the speedo, but that was also downhill.

Posted by: 914forme May 3 2018, 04:50 PM

I have an extra 3.3 long block here just saying

LS swap keeps making it siren calls, I have myself tied to the mast but it would not take much for me to cut the ropes and jump ship.

Posted by: Dr Evil May 3 2018, 07:25 PM

Over 100mph confirmed on a flat highway in the vair powered 74.

Posted by: Chris H. May 3 2018, 07:40 PM

Oh I remember Steve...any idea how the internals are? Great engine but I would not want to rebuild one. Most of the time they are good for 200k or so. I have a spare intake manifold and most of the accessories to make it complete. I hear ya on the LS...it's really one of the best swaps for a 914.

Doc I bet 100 in a bay window is pretty intense. Wrestling with that big ole steering wheel...

Posted by: 914forme May 3 2018, 08:03 PM

Ran great when pulled. Has the normal leaks, comes with all the parts to fix them. Including the rear metal piece instead of the plastic version. Hate them things.

Posted by: Chris H. May 3 2018, 08:24 PM

yeah maybe we should revisit this! I will PM you in the next few days. Currently unpacking all our cars...kid just came home from college. I have no idea how she fit all this stuff in a 10X14 room.

Posted by: Dr Evil May 4 2018, 12:33 PM

It was terrifying. Its lifted which only caused it to wander more with any slight gust.

Posted by: KELTY360 May 13 2018, 06:12 PM

Doncha just hate it when you look down at the speedo and you’re doing almost 90 without realizing it? Happened frequently going thru Montana with their 80 mph speed limit. Smoooooth. I know there are reasons for keeping a waterboxer, but they escape me at the moment.

Posted by: Chris H. May 14 2018, 07:56 AM

It does creep up on you doesn't it? I picked up a Stage 1 ecutune chip last week for my 914 and MAN does it make a difference.

I'm on the hunt for an EG33 or EZ30. Steve has some big HP Plans so he should hang on to that spare motor for now. I'll find one soon I'm sure.

Posted by: flmont May 14 2018, 07:18 PM

Is that stage 1 from subiechips.com by chance,..??

Posted by: Chris H. May 14 2018, 08:07 PM

Yes it is. Car was running great before...it's amazing now.

Posted by: flmont May 14 2018, 09:06 PM

Sweet,..is that with the Z32 and larger Injectors,.or just the chip ....Thanks Frank

Posted by: Chris H. May 15 2018, 07:29 AM

Chip only.

Posted by: flmont May 15 2018, 02:59 PM

oh,..good Thanks

Posted by: KELTY360 May 16 2018, 08:16 AM

I'm curious what specific benefits you've gotten from the chip. I've got a Stage 1 v 5 chip that was never installed when we did the conversion because we wanted to see how the engine worked without it. I kind of forgot about the chip but you've jogged my memory. At the time, it was purported that it would allow use of regular grade gas instead of premium. That would be a great savings by itself, especially with the crap that's out there now.

Posted by: Chris H. May 16 2018, 08:47 AM

Marc,

The "seat of your pants" difference is that it's more responsive and has fewer parameters to monitor so the minor hesitation that you might find occasionally with the stock ECU is gone. Seems like the power curve has been slightly altered. It does allow the use of regular gas if you want. You install a switch that you can toggle back and forth between. I bought the ECU with the chip so it has a switch installed if you want pics of it. Very simple on/off that is powered by a keyed source. The regular/premium switch was apparently also designed alternatively to be used in conjunction with nitrous so it must retard the timing slightly. Might be nice for highway trips. Regular gas is almost $1 cheaper around here.

Posted by: KELTY360 May 16 2018, 08:49 PM

Does the chip benefit mpg or is the savings vs. higher octane the benefit?

Also, I didn’t realize the hesitation was ecu related.

Posted by: Chris H. May 16 2018, 09:18 PM

I haven’t driven it long enough to assess MPG but will let you know. Most people on the SVX board say they got a heavier right foot after installing the chip so MPG went down a bit. It was designed to increase performance and smooth out the power curve but in 87 octane mode the timing would be slightly retarded which may also increase MPG. And the gas is cheaper of course.

Posted by: 76-914 Jul 12 2018, 08:39 AM

I doubt that anyone here will be able to assist you with that, Everyone at this site is s "Petro Head"! Now if you had a 914 model this would be your place. Good luck with your search.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2018, 03:44 PM

Just to report back, I've just had some upgrades done prior to moving to a small town. Had my ECUTune v.5 (now called Subiechips) chip installed with a switch for regular gas. Haven't tried reg. yet but the difference is noticeable. As mentioned, the hesitation is now gone and the 'seat of the pants' power band is noticeably improved. I also had my exhaust modified with a longer path to reduce backpressure in order to prevent backfiring. I thought the EG33 was great before, but now it's an order of magnitude better. Can't wait for a road trip!

The s/s headers which I got from Smallcar developed many small cracks which were undoubtedly causing vacuum leaks so I can't attribute all improvements to the chip, but overall it performs like a new van. I'll post some pics of the exhaust when I get a chance.

Posted by: flmont Oct 9 2018, 05:23 PM

Is that the same chip that if you go to bigger 300 ZX injector's (370's I think ) and the 300ZX MAF that it is suppose to increase your HP/TQ up to Claims of 30 HP.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2018, 05:34 PM

I don't know. Maybe one of these other H6 guys will know.

Posted by: flmont Oct 9 2018, 05:56 PM

OK,..Thanks..I know that performance chip does come from Subiechips in Fla.But Iam not sure how many versions there are.

Posted by: Chris H. Oct 10 2018, 08:49 AM

Awesome news Marc! It's a lot more responsive, right?

As I understand it the stock ECU was programmed with a few too many parameters, so it was constantly trying to learn and improve itself, considering altitude, driving style, fuel economy, emissions, etc. This is why the stock ECU can make the engine feel just a little different every time you drive it. That chip gives it a fairly static map based on the JDM tune and tells it "just keep the air/fuel mix at X".

Frank, there are a couple of versions of the chip. The one we have is for stock injectors.

Here is a link to the site for the chips (both versions)

http://subiechips.com/chips.htm

The guy is also active on the subaru-svx.net forums under the screen name longassname.

Posted by: flmont Oct 10 2018, 08:33 PM

Thank You,...Sir Chris

Posted by: Tom_T Oct 28 2018, 08:36 PM

Well .... we picked up another toy yesterday!

I know, I know .... it's "Repetitively Redundant" towed with a Westy full camper, but think of it as a guest house for the grandkids!

Also, since it's a 1970, it's eligible for the vintage trailer events which we go to (the Westy is too young!), we can go with this, & since it's small car towable, we can tow it with the Westy, & with the 85 325e & 914-2.0 - if I put hitches on them.

1970 Eriba Puck (German made Export model & appliances/water/LP/electrical gear finished fitting-out in CA with the CA-HCD RV/Trailer Approval Plate), 12' L (10' L box) x 5.5' W, 660 lbs empty, 70 lbs hitch wt. - sleeps 2-3 at dinette made into bed, 2 burner LP stove, Icebox (some had the optional 3-way fridge), sink & +/-10 gal. fresh water tank, center pop-top lifts for standing room & down to fit in a normal ht. garage.




Wife is happy now!

Cheers!
Tom
///////

Posted by: 76-914 Oct 28 2018, 09:11 PM

That is soo sweet. Congrats on your acquisition.

Posted by: burton73 Oct 28 2018, 09:56 PM

Tom,

Congratulation. Super nice. Enjoy in good health!

Bob B

Posted by: euro911 Oct 28 2018, 11:13 PM

That's really cool, Tom. In my case, the only issue is that it would need a bathroom/shower to make it 'wife friendly'

I got my '84 Westy back a couple months ago - with a new 2.1L, so it should be able to pull a small trailer - slowly

Posted by: Tom_T Oct 29 2018, 01:12 PM

Yes Mark - slowly! Plus you need more room to stop the little rig. Our Westy is also the stock 2.1L.

Eriba does make the newer Pucks with a tiny bathroom, as well as in bigger models with baths up to the Trolls & Tritons, & a San Diego company makes a Puck copy with a bath option IIRC. You just need to watch the trailer wt. & hitch wt. with small cars!

We'll get a Thetford porta-potty for the Westy & Puck, & I already have a solar shower for it - both of which can be used with the Lil Pucker, but don't know if that will satisfy your wife.

We already have a bigger restored 1960 Avion T20 trailer with a full bath (which we're using for facilities at home right now during our home resto), but it requires a larger tow vehicle. The Avion is for full on "Glamping"!

We've been showing our Westy with the Avion T20 at the Newport Dunes Vintage Trailer/RV Rally since 2013:


.


Now the Lil' Pucker gives us an option to tow a small camper with our 325e & Westy (& maybe 914?). Note that - while the Puck names offers endless puns that both my wife & I use - that isn't the name which she's given "her cute little trailer"!

.

Thanx for all of the great comments everybody!

Posted by: euro911 Oct 29 2018, 05:28 PM

We have a Thetford porta-potty. Need to concoct some sort of shower though ...

Posted by: Tom_T Oct 29 2018, 07:32 PM

Mark,

Zodi has a pop-up / fold up shower enclosure, & propane powered intstate water heaters -

http://zodi.com/hot-showers


GoWesty used to carry them both, but they also have a couple of PVC Solar Heated Bag for shower heated water, which we got one -

http://www.gowesty.com/product/portable-showers-hygiene/23645/pvc-free-solar-shower?v=

http://www.gowesty.com/product/portable-showers-hygiene/3491/advanced-elements-solar-shower-5-gallon-?v=

http://www.gowesty.com/search-results.php?search_phrase=Shower

.

I got a rear hatch tent enclosure which slips over the rear hatch while up, which we can use for "outside facilities" of porta-potty & shower when camping. IIRC it was from Bus Depot in PA.

PS - VW Bus Shop / Perter Gunzl in Germany is another parts & accessories source to check first, because you get your order within a week or so, they have loads of parts, their prices are better than GoWesty, Bus Depot, Van Cafe, etc. - & those guys buy them from him & mark it up to sell to us!

http://www.vwbusshop.de/en_GB

.

GoWesty also makes a repro of the Euro Option Storage box for Westy's behind the passenger seat, which will hold the porta-potty, & they sell the Thetford (but Walmart, Amazon etc may be cheaper).

http://www.gowesty.com/product/storage-organization/23278/storage-toilet-box-westfalia-style-reproduction?v=

http://www.gowesty.com/product/portable-toilets/4388/thetford-portable-toilet?v=

.

I'm still on the fence about getting the box myself.

Cheers!
Tom
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Posted by: Tom_T Oct 30 2018, 02:38 PM

PS - Note different floor plans with baths Mark -



It may be easier to find the other models & plans/options in the UK/EU, & export them here, & then convert the electrical to our standards, & the stove (& optional fridge &/or heater) from Butane to LP (I know a few owners who did so for about the same as finding a USA model).


Tom
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Posted by: Tom_T Oct 30 2018, 03:56 PM

I think that something like this hitch which our Puck's PO made for his `68 Bug, might work with some adaptation on a 914 -



.

I haven't found a pic of a 914 towing a Puck nor other Eriba yet, but FYI here are some other Porsche & interesting tow vehicles with Pucks -

IIRC - This Combo sold for about $189K at Barrett a few years back -


.

Mit Porsche 911 Cabrio -


.

Mit BMW/Isetta 600 3-Door -


.

Mit VWs - Thing (131), Squareback, Fastback & Baywindow Doka -



.

Mit 2L T4 Powered Trike & Bike w/ Sidecar -


.

Mit MBZs & Smart Half-a-Car -


.

Sans Citroen DM Sedan & Wagon/Touring -


.

Mit Opel Kadett & Rekord, & With UK Ford Escort & Green?? -



.

With UK Mini, & Mit New Mini & BMW 3-Cabrio -



.

With Off-Road 4-Wheeler -


.

With "Overkill"!! -

.


Tom
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Posted by: Tom_T Nov 27 2019, 11:52 AM

We went camping with some of our vintage trailer buddies last weekend in our `88 Westy up at Cachuma Lake County Park near Solvang & Santa Ynez CA (northwestern Santa Barbara County - where the last LA Olympics held the rowing/crewing competitions).

On Friday morning we were visited by "The Crew" - the total flock was at least 50+ & cruised the park on their daily feeding tour, as taken by one of our buddies walking her dog early am while we were asleep.

.

.

They were obviously oblivious to what tomorrow is about!

Happy Turkey Day!
Tom
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Posted by: Chris H. Nov 27 2019, 12:06 PM

Looks like a lot of fun Tom. I'm about to rebuild the old 1.9l engine in mine...for some reason I can't help myself. Will post pics soon.

Happy Thanksgiving to all!

Posted by: preach Nov 27 2019, 02:47 PM

My dream is a Suby EZ30 with a 5MT. REALLY REALLY want to do big brakes and be able to tow my 914 on an aluminum trailer with the Westy.

Posted by: euro911 Nov 27 2019, 06:09 PM

Chris, have you thought about tossing a longer throw crank (2.1L) 'while you're in there' ?

We did that on 'Eileen's rebuild, and what a difference it made

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 27 2019, 06:34 PM

FWIW -

Ours is an `88 with the 2.1L which we've owned since new - but we had to replace the original 2.1L in 1999 due to rod thrown thru the top of the case, with a rebuilt one from my guy Hans Imports (he uses Tuttles in LA for VW engines since the early 1970's, & my `73 914 2L was done by them on the original motor), then we had the top end of that rebuilt in 2005.

We're now at almost 230K mi - so another full or top end rebuild for it may be in our future soon, judging by typical life spans.

While I wish we had a bit more HP & TQ, we'll either stay with a 2.1L or slightly up-built factory WBX4. Not interested in all the changes to go to the dark side of Subie.

It does okay loaded for a trip - if a bit slow on hills/mountains .... or a lot slow! It's also done well towing our Eriba Puck in my pix posted in the prior posts - which is about 700-750 lbs wet & loaded (70-75 lbs. hitch wt.).


Tom
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Posted by: 914forme Nov 27 2019, 06:38 PM

EG33 with your name on it

Posted by: Chris H. Nov 27 2019, 07:52 PM

Wow I didn't expect all this great feedback so soon!

Interesting idea on the 2.1 crank Mark! I have the engine completely disassembled...just cleaning it up now. Do you happen to know if I need anything else besides the crank?

Thanks for the reliability feedback Tom. The inside of mine looked great other than the fact that it had been sitting for a long while and a had broken head stud. The bearings look fine but they're so cheap I just can't not replace them. I de glazed the cylinders with a dingle ball hone (240 grit). Brought the cross hatch pattern right back without removing any material.

Dan, the EZ30/5MT is a great combo for a Vanagon/Bus. Would make a really nice hauler. I picked up a set of rear disc brake adapters to swap out the drums.

Stephen, you know I love the EG33...I figure the 1.9L is literally worth NOTHING in pieces, or as a "ran when parked" motor. I can rebuild it for a couple hundred bucks all in and sell it much easier as a fresh runner. I'm strangely intrigued by the WBX though...just can't stop myself from working on it. Such a simple motor...the cam and rod bearings are the same ones used all the way back to the 1200cc air cooled engine. We'll see how it goes.

Pics to follow very soon!

Posted by: Tom_T Nov 28 2019, 06:37 PM

Hey Chris - please post your info on the rear drum to disc conversion parts/setup.

I know that GoWesty & others sell a front bib disc brake kit to upgrade the front, but haven't seen anything to change the rears to discs, which seems like a natural swap to get better braking for the "brick on wheels".

Hope All Y'all Ate Yersefs Silly today!


Tom
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Posted by: 76-914 Nov 29 2019, 07:23 PM

We'll expect lots of pics.