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Posted by: rush May 15 2015, 01:50 PM

Need badly some advice on parts to use for fun 2.0 engine build that will have a life expectancy of a few years, not a racing season

Posted by: somd914 May 15 2015, 02:07 PM

What's your budget?

carbs or D-Jet?

There really isn't all that much to be done to 2.0, life expectancy will be quite long. Most increases come through increased displacement, cam, and fuel induction, i.e. carbs or aftermarket FI.

Consider going to 96mm PCs to get up to 2056 cc, and go with flat top pistons. Head work is the big expense these days.

Posted by: Mblizzard May 15 2015, 02:53 PM

Others may disagree but I think you have to start with changing the stock cam to work with your choice of FI or carbs. I would also spend the money to balance the engine. Go with the 96s, and a good exhaust that flows. If that does not blow the budget then head work.

With those basics you should get a solid engine that will have a solid increase over stock power.

Posted by: rush May 15 2015, 03:40 PM

Thanks you both, I have had a barn full over the years and due old age, limited $, price of gas, and great wife...who keeps the 'true history' ledger on the checkbook...
So T4 into a left over 911 body...
Gas web 40's with already done 3 bolt heads. Non therm exhaust with good flow.
Mostly I want to figure camshaft to give me decent launch, good passing, and best mpg.
The 911 mid 70's, is mid way between 914 and the bus for weight...so need some torque to get two old folks and a large golden launched...
ps..will balance the fly/crank/fan thanks good advice...take the rods as well?

Posted by: rhodyguy May 15 2015, 03:59 PM

Welcome to 914 world. What part of the island?

Posted by: rush May 15 2015, 04:02 PM

Rosario right now. built house then got tired of quality and prices of produce and meat, so are moving to the middle and going to play in the dirt :-)

Posted by: somd914 May 15 2015, 04:18 PM

A Type IV in a 911 Almost a 912...

For cams you might want to look at:

http://www.webcamshafts.com/index_blank.html?pages/vehicle_search.html

I run an 86b in my 2056 with dual webers - though advertised for mid and high RPM power, she pulls out of the hole up to red line.

Also look at:

http://type4store.com/camshaft-kits.html

Great resources here on the World - I'm sure the more experienced engine builders will chime in and offer good advice.

Posted by: rush May 15 2015, 04:56 PM

Somd, tks and I know opinions among drivers varies. You could hide what I know of cams under a matchbook...so hope to find a ruff idea of lift, duration, exhaust & intake, and the timing of these does. Not a degree, but just a bit smarter. The cam I took out is not worn too badly, but is designed for a FI app...type4store was very nice but had no idea what original cam was...so I couldn't tell if their cam 'X' was the ticket. Webcam were obviously smart, but had no desire to help someone who knew shet about it...
web 86 423 270 234 @50
T4store 435 290 252
pel pts
scat 2 415 278
473 275

...all of these for gas mechanical T4 2.0 ordinary street engines

Posted by: Bleyseng May 15 2015, 07:39 PM

The OEM cam is the Webcam 142 as that's their stock 2.0L 914 cam grind. Type4store mods the grinds to their own cam grind specs but Webcam does the grinding last I heard but the lifters are ground too to their specs so they have a different face grind to last longer.
A mild carb cam is the way to go with dual carbs or stick FI on it with a FI cam (9590) and it will run great in all weather.

Posted by: euro911 May 16 2015, 02:26 AM

Absolutely - have the entire rotating assembly balanced, including your clutch kit. A well balanced motor is imperitive for longevity

A stock 2.0L T-4 would be fine and not too expensive to build, especially if you're providing most of the labor. You'd essentially have a 912E.

You'll want to get a cam designed for better breathing running the 40IDFs.

Next step up would be a 2056 and a little more aggressive cam grind, but the price will start climbing rapidly.

Because of the carbs, a new cam and lifters should already be on your list. Also, chromeoly pushrods are a nice simple upgrade that won't break the bank.

Posted by: rush May 16 2015, 12:50 PM

euro, why change the pushrods?...moving weight...tks steve

Posted by: somd914 May 16 2015, 01:07 PM

Chromoly pushrods don't expand thus can set them to zero lash.

Posted by: rush May 16 2015, 04:03 PM

In other words, I am less time on my back, with a feeler guage stuck somewhere I cannot see...?
If so where do I get these puppies?

Posted by: r_towle May 16 2015, 05:55 PM

Elgin Camshafts.

Call and talk to them, tell them what you want to do with the car, the fuel, ignition, heads, exhaust.....

They will steer you right.

Posted by: rush May 16 2015, 08:44 PM

thanks will call monday...and where do I get those contact lens?

Posted by: euro911 May 17 2015, 01:22 AM

What's a feeler gauge?

Zero-lash - we don't need no stinkin' feeler gauges

Posted by: 76-914 May 17 2015, 07:47 AM

If you go this route go the "whole 9 yards" and but the matching valve train kit components (911 rockers milled down w/ sleeved spacers). Peppy as Hell but tunable as mentioned by Bleseng. Keep your CR #'s down too. I'm not a big fan of high compression.


Adjustment intervals are the same. Just won't need the feeler gage.

Posted by: rush May 17 2015, 10:56 AM

Thanks is there the 'right' ratio for the rockers for a mild motor?
Live on an island, so unless out at the airport, I am paying a third
more for gas and just getting regular shell.. so the 'needy CR's' would
starve here.

Posted by: larryM May 17 2015, 10:45 PM

#73 webcam,works fine with D-jet
Ed mazula oversize throttle body
euro P&c's
stock rocker arm ratios - don't F with what works
improved oil pump
rebuilt heads - 3-angle valve job & back-cut seats

- ain't cheap

this is a $3500 engine rebuild by the time you are done

add 40 hrs labor at $100 per hour if you are not handy with the wrenches

you will get great midrange boost and seat of pants improvement

- it's a no drama - no hassles engine - and it will run fine on sketchy "island gas"

- i've done several of these -

Posted by: Bleyseng May 18 2015, 08:18 AM

At Sea level 9 to 1 is no problem with Premium gas which you will have to run with any CR of 8 to 1 or higher.
I get 25mpg with my Djet 2056 engine.

Posted by: Dave_Darling May 18 2015, 09:11 AM

Stock. Which is 1.3 to 1.4; they vary and there has been discussion on this in the past. Other "ratio rockers" are not suitable for a street motor, as they do not get oiled properly for long life. (They are mostly intended for drag motors which only have to live a few 1/4 mile passes before they get refreshed.)

--DD

Posted by: rush May 18 2015, 12:20 PM

thanks, do I need the swing foot adjuster on the rockers?

I have always run just 30 wt oil in 'air' motors...do I add life with syn or blend or multi weight ?...the neighbor runs bikes and quads...and over the BBQ we were talking lubes....I said I would put it out to the brain trust

Also just got my heads back and shop installed double springs on valves..had them and thought I would like..no charge. Drag race vw buddy said they make the engine work harder so he does not use...any thoughts?

Posted by: euro911 May 18 2015, 08:06 PM

911 swivel-foot adjusters are nice to have, but not required. The real ones can get a bit pricey, have heard of failures with the imitations.


20/50 'dino' seems to be a good all around lube, but you'll find many answers as to which brand and viscosities people prefer. I've always ran Brad Penn 20/50 in my 2056. I run Castrol 20/50 in all my other vehicles.


I don't run double springs. They do place more pressure on the rest of the valve train.

Posted by: saigon71 May 19 2015, 05:51 AM

With regard to your oil question, most run Brad Penn 20w-50.

The key thing to look for is the ingredients in the oil, specifically zinc. It is required on flat tappet camshafts to prevent premature wear.

There are a lot of oil threads on this site, here is one of them:

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=191853

Posted by: stugray May 19 2015, 07:01 AM

If you are made of cash, Brad Penn Racing Oil ("The Green Stuff") or Joe Gibbs racing oil are supposedly the best.
If you do lots of oil changes and dont want to spring for the best, Valvoline VR1 Racing Oil (with High ZDDP) is what I use.



Dual springs will make the drivetrain work harder and will wear the cam & lifters faster.
The only reason I know of for having dual springs is High Revs.
With my stock heads I can only rev to ~5.8k before I can hear the "valve float" while other 914s (with dual springs) at the track can rev to 7k before that happens.

Posted by: somd914 May 19 2015, 03:05 PM

Concur about VR1 20-50, but if you are curious take a look here or google for other tests:

http://bestmotoroil.weebly.com/car-oil-testing.html#.VVujEGCd6JU

Oil is definitely one of those topics like religion and politics.

My original 2.0 lasted well over 100k on original heads using unleaded most of its life and low zinc oils for a significant portion. Oil consumption was within spec and so was compression, albeit on the low end of the spec, when I swapped engines. Have to believe our Type IVs are more durable than many believe...

Posted by: rush Jun 1 2015, 09:57 AM

Thanks for all, am getting a bit smarter with the help and not making the mistakes I would have on my own.

Posted by: yeahmag Jun 1 2015, 06:02 PM

Something to consider is that floating the valves is reportedly harder on the valve train than a properly spec'ed valve train along with good oil. With my 86A Raby variant I went with dual valve springs so I can control the valves even if I'm out of the power band. Sometimes it's faster to not take a shift - especially in autocross...

-Aaron

Posted by: euro911 Jun 1 2015, 07:31 PM

Probably one of the last components to deal with. Once you have the engine together and measuring your geometry, the rods are cut to size and the end caps are pressed into the rods. Available from several vendors - got mine from European Motorworks (EMW) in Hawthorne California.

Note, EMW is one of the major suppliers to a lot of the other major retailers around the country

Posted by: rush Jun 5 2015, 06:44 PM

Thanks, I am getting a bit brighter due to most of you having been down this path...thanks, steve