Printable Version of Topic

Click here to view this topic in its original format

914World.com _ 914World Garage _ Suggestions please

Posted by: jwalters Mar 2 2005, 11:19 AM

Hi guys. Been slow with my car---the weather has not been co-operating with me very much and have not got allot done--car will be going to painters in about 2-3 weeks--

So as now to shift focus on my engine build:

The biggy is carb setup--herre are the motor stats:

*1.7 stock bore and stroke
*Webcam 86
*custom turbo exhaust
*Garrett Tb-03 turbo, 8-10 psi boost nominal--never, ever beyond 12
*short intake manifolds
*Weber 40's with dual blowthru induction ( Like on the buggies)
*Stock 1.7 heads --no porting--just angle cuts on the seats.
*max rpm of 6500--if it will do it....more like 6000 nominal
*stock domed pistons--compression reset to 8.0:1???

Now my delimma with the webers:

They are all stock, 28mm vents, 115 mains, 50 idles, 200 air correction, and F7 tubes.

What would be the collective knowledge on setting up these carbs for a good baseline:

Go to: larger vents? What size? 32-34mm?

what would be a good main size to start with?

keep the F7 tubes??

Idle jet change??

Air correction jet change???

What about those idf update kits I see--are they really any good???

I may as well as get started on this pig now while I am waiting for paint and reassembly.

TIA---

Posted by: jwalters Mar 2 2005, 05:00 PM

OK--so maybe someone on here who has a large engine--2270 or bigger--can tell me their carb setup--and I can extropolate a good starting base for which I can start with--
Anybody???? This would really help me out----

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 04:47 PM

What up dudes???

Is it some sort of super secret squirrel shit that yall do not want to share your carb setups???

I mean---jeeeeeeeeeeeeze.............

PM me if you like so your secrets do not get out---

Posted by: SGB Mar 3 2005, 05:23 PM

Sorry-
If I was home I could look at what my most recent combo is. I know I have f7 tubes, I think 32mm vents, 120 mains, 50 idles, and 215 correctors. I've got a 2 liter high compresion motor, webcam and 40ides. I recently replaced my short short intakes with some longer ones and added v stacks. Moved torque almost 1000 rpm lower which I like for daily use. I'll check my notes at home and let you know what I have tried.

Posted by: MecGen Mar 3 2005, 05:26 PM

Hey Dude
Turbo a 914... people are scared...I am.
I think there is just one other that I know about,
Your in uncharted waters.

Cheers
Joe

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 05:47 PM

Yea, I know-----but I am going to do this---so as I can offer a one stop shopping for anyone else who wants to turbo a 914---all I gotta do is get this done--and yes it is a mild combo---but once I finish it and prove it out on the chassis dyno I will be able to offer the correct components---just wait till I get it done---it sucks beiing on a very stringent budget--but at least others can see what is possible with a pretty bone stock 1.7 -----

It will be a drop in just like the rice tuner guys have access to---the most anyone will have to do is drop the front of the motor down about 8 inches to move the rear heat bulkhead---

Since I am using a TB-03 turbo---people can buy whatever trim turbo they want and still be able to hook it all up--as long as it is t3 flanged--Do not get me wrong--it is going to take me awhile yet--but by mid-summer it will be completed----

I just need a starting point so as I do not toast my motor on the first fire up---if someone would share thier setup for a large motor----+2200cc's--I can extropolate for my 1.7 setup----

So basically it will boil down to a prefabricated rear bulkhead tin---all the flanges and ducting--the exhaust--and the correct jetting combo which I will achieve on the dyno.--yes, single or dual carbs are a must--you all know the limitations to the stock FI system--but single carb systems are still good for 200+ HP if done right--

All anybody else would have to do is procure thier own turbo--I do this because the vast majority of us simply cannot afford a built big motor--and I got my turbo from a volvo in the raping yard for 50 bucks--

So hopefully for only a minimal investment, you can have 160HP+--

And more importantly--the BRAGGIN RIGHTS!!!

For 1/3---1/2--to 1/10th the cost of a built motor--

Posted by: scotty b Mar 3 2005, 05:58 PM

So where the hell are the pics??? Good to hear from you I thought you might have gone postal at work and then checked out How's the job hunt going? My dad just got the word from Verison and already has 20 guys in his shop filing suit against the company as well as the union and his lawyer. FUCH corporations!!!

Posted by: lapuwali Mar 3 2005, 06:01 PM

QUOTE (jwalters @ Mar 2 2005, 09:19 AM)
Hi guys. Been slow with my car---the weather has not been co-operating with me very much and have not got allot done--car will be going to painters in about 2-3 weeks--

So as now to shift focus on my engine build:

The biggy is carb setup--herre are the motor stats:

*1.7 stock bore and stroke
*Webcam 86
*custom turbo exhaust
*Garrett Tb-03 turbo, 8-10 psi boost nominal--never, ever beyond 12
*short intake manifolds
*Weber 40's with dual blowthru induction ( Like on the buggies)
*Stock 1.7 heads --no porting--just angle cuts on the seats.
*max rpm of 6500--if it will do it....more like 6000 nominal
*stock domed pistons--compression reset to 8.0:1???

Now my delimma with the webers:

They are all stock, 28mm vents, 115 mains, 50 idles, 200 air correction, and F7 tubes.

What would be the collective knowledge on setting up these carbs for a good baseline:

Go to: larger vents? What size? 32-34mm?

what would be a good main size to start with?

keep the F7 tubes??

Idle jet change??

Air correction jet change???

What about those idf update kits I see--are they really any good???

I may as well as get started on this pig now while I am waiting for paint and reassembly.

TIA---

I honestly have no clue what carb setup a blow-through carb requires. This question would probably be better answered on ShopTalk, since there are people there who've actually done a blow-through setup before. You might also ask airsix what his fuel curve looks like under boost on his programmable EFI 1.7 turbo.

If I really were starting completely from scratch, I'd probably try something like go up two sizes on the mains, down one size on the airs, and up one size on idles, then go from there. I'd expect to have to have a few sizes of jets on hand. If you know anyone with a wideband setup you could borrow, do it. I know Ben (airsix) was completely at sea on his turbo setup until he sprung for a wideband to get it set up.

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 06:10 PM

Yea--doing just that with the A/F monitors out there--really cheap and tells you exactly what is going on in the motor---

Hey Scott---yea man--I am going back to college--going to do it full time--money will be tight--but I went thru all the math the other day and it will all pan out well--

Always wanted to go to college--here I am with a 9th grade education and am licensed to work and sign off work, on any aircraft in the world,,period.

So I am going to take time off from the daily grind and do some edumacatin---looking fwd to it--I just hope that old adage--"cant teach an old dog....." Doesnt hold true..

There is a ton of aviation jobs down here--but I am just to a point that turning wrenches for the last 20 years is really old---ifn I do turn the wrench--it will be on MY terms--

Hows your project coming???

Posted by: scotty b Mar 3 2005, 06:16 PM

QUOTE (jwalters @ Mar 3 2005, 04:10 PM)

Hows your project coming???

WHICH ONE??? The 944 is on hold, I have all the parts for the tranny but no space to do it. I have my dads car in for a "quick 2 month turnaround" which suddenly became much more than that.Hell hole from hell. I am going to have to replace the clamshell and inner rocker, looked fine from the outside but when I took the engine mount out see pics in "progress pics of dads car" from Mon. It has gotten ALOT worse since. So uh where are YOUR PICS??

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 06:27 PM

Sorry to hear about the 944--my ex's boyfriend just picked up a 87 turbo---with allot of engine upgrades--full rollcage--all kinds of stuff--for--get this--2500.00!!!! Fucker

I saw it two weeks ago--and yea--it IS as advertised--rotten fucking luck-----I hope my ex chokes on that ...

Pics from me this weekend--putting the entire sus. on it--going to be kool----

My painter is on his way over right now to look at it--by 2 weeks it will be painted--ummm-----CORRECTLY---I don't paint--nuff said, tuck tail--

I was posting on my original thread--but nobody would look at it cause the admin wont let me change my topic title to reflect my upgrades--so nobody looks at it----sniff, sniff---oh well--such as it is

From now on I am just going to start a new thread so the newbies and old farts alike can comment, make suggestions, the like....

Posted by: scotty b Mar 3 2005, 06:36 PM

I THINK that's what the blog is actually supposed to be for. Posting your pics. But jack offs like me and Miles just fuch around with our mindless thoughts that only we get a kick out of. What color are you doing? While you're in scholl remember "the mind is a terrible thing to taste."

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 06:37 PM

Are the blogs up and running????

I havent been spending too much time here---

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 06:39 PM

Now I look down and see a blog button----

But I still do not see how adding to a post that people will think there is really nothing new will go blogging--

Can you only access a blog from a post???

Posted by: scotty b Mar 3 2005, 06:42 PM

That appears to be the only way unless I missed something, I keep forgetting to ask the most important ? Who are the gaggle of hotties in the avatar? got a bigger........pic?

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 06:45 PM

Those are the brides maids for my roommates wifes-friends-wedding--good times--

Posted by: scotty b Mar 3 2005, 06:51 PM

QUOTE (jwalters @ Mar 3 2005, 04:45 PM)
Those are the brides maids for my roommates wifes-friends-wedding--good times--

Damn I've gotta move to Fla. Nothing but dumb ass, clubbin, priss-pot, sorority, skank ass, nose in the air, wanna be goddesses around here. Oh yeah and the white trash, trailer park livin, Marlboro suckin, Milwaukees beast swillin, 300 lbs havin skank ass wanna be goddesses

Posted by: jwalters Mar 3 2005, 09:47 PM

awwww--cmon man---your holding back arent you---

Posted by: Brett W Mar 3 2005, 11:37 PM

In order to do blow through Webers you will need to have throttle shaft seals installed. They leak when under boost.

Posted by: jwalters Mar 4 2005, 04:55 PM

Hi Brett--how involved is that???

Posted by: scotty b Mar 4 2005, 05:02 PM

QUOTE (jwalters @ Mar 4 2005, 02:55 PM)
Hi Brett--how involved is that???

"just put your lips together and blow." Duh

Posted by: David Mueller Mar 4 2005, 05:09 PM

QUOTE (SGB @ Mar 3 2005, 03:23 PM)
Sorry-
If I was home I could look at what my most recent combo is. I know I have f7 tubes, I think 32mm vents, 120 mains, 50 idles, and 215 correctors. I've got a 2 liter high compresion motor, webcam and 40ides. I recently replaced my short short intakes with some longer ones and added v stacks. Moved torque almost 1000 rpm lower which I like for daily use. I'll check my notes at home and let you know what I have tried.

When you say short intake with velocity stacks ? What would short...I have a 2.0L with 44's on it..2" velocity stacks K&N filters and my set-up fits under the rain tray...the intakes are about 6" tall

Would polishing the inside of the intake do anything..they look like cast aluminum and have casting marks which might disrupt air flow..

Any thoughts

Posted by: jwalters Mar 4 2005, 05:10 PM

QUOTE (scotty b @ Mar 4 2005, 06:02 PM)

QUOTE (jwalters @ Mar 4 2005, 02:55 PM)
Hi Brett--how involved is that???

"just put your lips together and blow." Duh

Hey Scott- -give me some info--I am putting alum wheel adapters on my ride and do not have a clue as to a good torque for them--would you, if you have one, look in your 944 manual and see what the factory torques are for the front hub adapters, where they bolt to the disc and the tq for your wheel bolts--I cannot remember what mine were--THX

Pix of the car with sus. and wheels sittin on the ground by tomorrow night or sunday--

I just got back my cookie cutters from the wheel repair place--they straightened them, blasted, polished the lip back and painted the centers a charcoal grey---way kool looking!! no center caps tho--you would not have a spare set laying around would you???

And I got my new fuzion hri's mounted and balanced about an hour ago--they are bad ass!!

Posted by: scotty b Mar 4 2005, 05:17 PM

I'm going to my friends tomorrow who is THE 944 guru and I'll check with him I have never actually gotten a book since I had a better source in him. 25 years of doing nothing but Porsche and specialized in 944 & 928. He's freekin scary sometimes with his knowledge.

Posted by: jwalters Mar 4 2005, 05:23 PM

Thanks Scott---

David--I would not polish the intake tract at all--that roughness actually helps to keep the fuel in a suspended atomized state--the only grinding I would do is match the holes up to even---like where it bolts to the head and where the carbs bolt to them--so as there are no lips of metal actually sticking out and fouling the flow--

The short intake manifolds are really short--the carbs base area is almost even with the engine tin

Posted by: David Mueller Mar 4 2005, 05:29 PM

Thanks for the info. I guess my intakes are just going to have to do...

Posted by: jwalters Mar 4 2005, 05:30 PM

QUOTE (David Mueller @ Mar 4 2005, 06:29 PM)
Thanks for the info. I guess my intakes are just going to have to do...

What were you wanting to do specifically???

Posted by: Brett W Mar 4 2005, 11:29 PM

You must press the throttle shafts out and then press out the bearings. A seal housing must be machined into the carb body around the throttle shafts holes. Then a seal must be installed and re-install the carbs.

I would call Art Thrasen @ AirCooled Engineering. He is the carb man. Dellortos have can take boost out right though so might be a thought.

Why not just megasquirt it and then run a regular custom plenum.