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Posted by: fatlando Apr 24 2005, 02:20 PM

This just started happening. I'm cruising down the road, go to a stoplight...

step on the brakes...and nothing. start downshifting and pumping the brakes and they come back.

Where do i start? any experts who arent at the WCC??

Shane, don't answer, because i already know you know nothing!!

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 24 2005, 02:25 PM

when did you last bleed your brakes?

is there fluid by the pedal cluster? how old are your brake lines? rubber? SS?
are your calipers leaking???

Posted by: Eric_Shea Apr 24 2005, 02:30 PM

with what this guy said...

Posted by: fatlando Apr 24 2005, 02:40 PM

QUOTE (Aaron Cox @ Apr 24 2005, 12:25 PM)

when did you last bleed your brakes? is there fluid by the pedal cluster? how old are your brake lines? rubber? SS? are your calipers leaking???

AAron,

thanx for the feedback, i'm at work unfortunatley so i have to do this tomorrow.

I've had the car for two years and have done nothing to the brakes at all.

How was the WCC?

fat lando

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 24 2005, 02:42 PM

twas great....

i came home early to study....
yeah...like that is happeneing

Posted by: Eric_Shea Apr 24 2005, 02:54 PM

Posted by: ken914 Apr 24 2005, 02:55 PM

There are several things to check

1) Check the fluid level in the reservoir (I'm guessing that it is low or empty)

2) Pull up the carpet and look in the floor around the base of the pedal cluster. When the mastercylinder fails it often will leak up the shaft and you will have fluid puddled up here. If you do, then you need to pull the pedal cluster, clean it and replace the plastic bushings. The fluid will make them swell and the pedals will start to stick.

3) Start checking around all the flexible lines. Look for drips of brake fluid. I would take this time to replace all the flexible lines. They are not that expensive and probably need replacing.

4) Check all the hard brake lines for cracks, splits, etc.

5) If it is none of these things then you may have a failing caliper.

There is a definate problem and you should be able to find and fix it without too much of a problem. Good luck.

Oh, don't drive it until you get it fixed!

Posted by: fatlando Apr 24 2005, 03:00 PM

Ken and Aaron,

thanx for the feedback, that's what i like about this board. It's great knowing that after i type a new problem, i can get up, refill my coffee cup and have an answer already on screen!!

fat lando

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 24 2005, 03:04 PM

QUOTE (fatlando @ Apr 24 2005, 02:00 PM)

Ken and Aaron, thanx for the feedback, that's what i like about this board. It's great knowing that after i type a new problem, i can get up, refill my coffee cup and have an answer already on screen!! fat lando

that will be $19.95 or your membership will be revoked

Posted by: JB 914 Apr 24 2005, 06:47 PM

QUOTE (Aaron Cox @ Apr 24 2005, 01:04 PM)

that will be $19.95 or your membership will be revoked

Hey, you told me it was $29.95

Posted by: Rough_Rider Apr 25 2005, 09:26 AM

Check for warped rotors & make sure your lug bolts are torqued correctly.

If the rotors are wobbling they'll push the pads out thus you have to stomp on the pedal a few times to bring the pads back in contact.

Posted by: tat2dphreak Apr 25 2005, 09:50 AM

I would bleed, bleed and bleed some more first(include the prop. valve!)


if that don't help, get 4 calipers from Mr. shea!!!!

Posted by: fatlando Apr 25 2005, 12:11 PM

QUOTE (Rough_Rider @ Apr 25 2005, 07:26 AM)

Check for warped rotors & make sure your lug bolts are torqued correctly. If the rotors are wobbling they'll push the pads out thus you have to stomp on the pedal a few times to bring the pads back in contact.

Trev,

When I was getting my car inspected in Dec 04, the mechanic said my rotors might need rotating in 6 months...

me being new to this stuff, just blew it off......could that be it. if so, what does that entail?

fat lando

Posted by: Mueller Apr 25 2005, 12:36 PM

QUOTE

the mechanic said my rotors might need rotating in 6 months...

they rotate every time you drive

do you mean "turned down"???

there is also a good chance your master cylinder is going away or you have a leak in a fluid line.....I wouldn't drive the car until you get it fixed.......

Posted by: tat2dphreak Apr 25 2005, 12:37 PM

QUOTE (fatlando @ Apr 25 2005, 01:11 PM)

QUOTE (Rough_Rider @ Apr 25 2005, 07:26 AM) Check for warped rotors & make sure your lug bolts are torqued correctly. If the rotors are wobbling they'll push the pads out thus you have to stomp on the pedal a few times to bring the pads back in contact. Trev, When I was getting my car inspected in Dec 04, the mechanic said my rotors might need rotating in 6 months... me being new to this stuff, just blew it off......could that be it. if so, what does that entail? fat lando

that could be it...

as far as what it entails: they resurface them, much like what is done with the flywheel on a clutch change... they shave a little off, to remove any high spots... if they are still in spec, thickness wise, this is a good move... if they are getting thin, I would replace them all with new ones... they run about $50 each...

Posted by: Rough_Rider Apr 25 2005, 12:56 PM

Honestly don't know what rotating rotors means. Like rotors rotate all the time when your moving????

All the suggestions for bleeding & checking lines are spot on, definitly the first stuff to check.

If that all fails then try these checks.

Jack the car up, leave her out of gear. Pump brake pedal so its firm. Got to each wheel individually & give it a few turns.
after each spin of the wheel, Return to brake pedal & re-pump.
When the brake pedal get noticably longer you've found the problem corner.

how to fix, IMO if your rotors are old buy some new ones. If there newer or have plenty of life left have them re-surfaced, machine shop should be able to sort you out.

Posted by: airsix Apr 25 2005, 01:14 PM

I might be in the minority (what's new?) but I'm with Mueller and a couple of others - I think the master cylinder is failing. Don't be fooled if it's not leaking. They don't always leak when they fail.

-Ben M.

Posted by: tat2dphreak Apr 25 2005, 01:18 PM

QUOTE (airsix @ Apr 25 2005, 02:14 PM)

I might be in the minority (what's new?) but I'm with Mueller and a couple of others - I think the master cylinder is failing. Don't be fooled if it's not leaking. They don't always leak when they fail. -Ben M.

it definately COULD be the M/C, all I was saying was try the simple and easy first... have I mentioned I hated replacing my M/C when I did it?!

but I still did it, simply because the car had been sitting for a year... brakes are the most important aspect of these, or any cars... what's the good in GOING, if you can't stop? on our cars, the Brakes are the only safety equipment... why take any chances?

Posted by: Eric_Shea Apr 25 2005, 01:31 PM

Fat, or Lando, Or Mr. Lando...

Do this:

1. Open you hood and check your fluid level. Reservour is on the drivers side by the side of the fender. If it's low, it went somewhere. If it's not, then you need to rebleed your brakes. Keeping fresh fluid in your brake system makes a "WORLD" of difference. Trust me on this one... I've seen the insides of more calipers than you or I want to know. If it's low move on...

2. Check underneath your car. Specifically, your hard lines to the calipers and your soft lines. Check all thoose unions for signs of where the fluid went to.

3. Next, if you can't see anything obvious then it's time to dig a little deeper. Jack up the rear. Check the hard lines to the Proportioning valve. Check the proportioning valve itself (on the firewall about where you would imagine Z's right ass cheek if you could see through to the drivers seat).

-so far we haven't turned a wrench-

4. Jack up the front and remove the suspension pan. Here's where the wrnching comes in. You'll need a 13mm for the two front bolts and a 17mm for the two rear. Take the pan off and look at the hard lines going into the master cylinder. Look at the master cylinder itself and where it attaches to the front bulkhead. Any weeping?

5. Go inside the car and pull the carpet back. Notice any fluid around the base of the accelerator pedal? Keep going. You'll need a 5mm hex (I think) to remove the pedalboard surrounding the pedals. Now. Take a look at the "pan" the pedal assembly sits in... is it loaded with fluid? If so, you've lost your master cylinder.

Check the accelerator pedal while your down there. Does it wobble? You'll probably need a new one. Check the pedals, are the bushings still good. Is the paint all flaked from the brake fluid? Now's the time to rebuild that.

Dig in and you "will" find the problem. If you're lucky you'll just need to bleed the brakes but... I tend to agree with the masses, it sounds like a M/C on the way out. Fluid in the pedal pan is "usually" the best tell tale.

Good luck.