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Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 12:43 PM

Last year a week before the Monterey car week I scheduled to have an oil cooler installed on my return form the Wreks Reunion Concourse. I took my recently restored 914 to have the oil cooler installed plus an oil leak repaired on my new 2056 stroker engine. When I arrived I paid him the $1837.15, I noted that no oil cooler was on the repair receipt plus a number of repairs were done that where never talked about
(he never gave me any kind of estimate written or otherwise) said he adjusted the carburetion, checked the valves adjustment and test drove the car, it was cooling fine now, well great! Now when I went to the car first noticed the car setting outside with a scratch to the paint on rear quarter panel, then the interior, the shop left the window open during a rain storm resulting in mold growing on the new carpets. When I spoke to the shop owner he replied he would take care of it so I left it with him, after returning as he said car cleaned up good, scratch buffed out and ready to pickup I found the new seats destroyed. He said he tried to clean them and he doesn't know what happened.
He also ruined one of the new door cards, the new consual, new dashboard and the aluminum floor pan scratched. He now told me to get an estimate so I trailer the car home. Next morning was excited to take her for a short test drive to the coast and after driving for a few minutes seeing the oil temperature was rising quickly now at 265 degrees stopping at first chance and shutting her down. When I went to open the engine compartment the lid won't open as it was binding on the trunk, (it was fine before but one fo the items he charged me for). I had to open the trunk for it to clear the now scratched trunk lid. Ok now after calling him he had me bring it back. Ok not smart on my account! So after taking the car back again he pulled the Weber carbs and sheet metal to see if it has a cooling problem, he said it looks good! I explained that I brought the car to him for a oil cooler and I already knew and had checked for a cause for it's over heating. I at that time even bought the parts needed for the oil cooler he then at that time tells me he's not sure he is qualified to install the oil cooler and charging me another $521.85.
I've reported the two charges on my BofA card totaling $2359 to the Bank of America and they're requesting an estimate by a shop with the shops name and I'd on the estimate. I'm looking for a shop that is qualified to give me the estimate needed plus installe an oil cooler. I live in Northern Ca. Ukiah about 60 miles north of Santa Rosa

Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 12:52 PM

The interior at the concourse before the shop worked on it?

Posted by: JmuRiz Jul 17 2017, 01:03 PM

Was the shop suggested to you? Also name the shop....stop these guys from working on any other members' cars (post here and Pelican).

That really sucks. We need to band together and stop the crummy shops and drive business to the good ones.

Posted by: mepstein Jul 17 2017, 01:06 PM

Wow! I'm really sorry this happened to you. Might need to call your insurance company and ask them how to proceed. Take lots of pictures. Find "before pics" Write out a very detailed description and timeline. Get a good estimate to repair and restore everything - have the prices available for the seats, etc to make it easier for the shop to estimate. Don't have anybody fix until it's resolved. Document, document, document.

Good luck.

Posted by: Mikey914 Jul 17 2017, 01:28 PM

Wes,
If I have the material, we could sew the base up for you with a new center section.

For you no charge
I'll check

Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 01:37 PM

Thanks Mark!

Posted by: Krieger Jul 17 2017, 01:50 PM

Holy crap! That is ridiculous. What shop?

Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 01:51 PM

I initially took the car to High Tech Automotive in San Rafael who I regard highly though he recommended Proshop Inc. just around the block as he was pretty well booked up plus he thought labor charges would be saved over his shop. Also Proshop is advertised in the Porsche club Redwood region monthly letter.

Posted by: sb914 Jul 17 2017, 02:00 PM

Sorry Wes , I'd have a hard time not strangling that guy.
Mark steps up again.! Good on ya 914 rubber

Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 02:06 PM

It has made so mad I've put her on jack stands with a cover in the garage trying to not think about! Over all he had the car for just a little over six months didn't answer phone calls or return messages and blamed it on the phone company.

Posted by: Frankvw Jul 17 2017, 02:17 PM

Hope this works out with that company. Too bad this happened to you and your car.
My 914 had a shipper that got it wet as well leaving a window open...all wet...mold!
Although they said we would work it out and come to a 'mutual solution' they left me and the 914 out in the cold in the end. The being mad will take some time I am afraid.
I used a steamclean company to remove stains and mold. I hope your 914 can be restored to how it was, it looks great. Take care....

Posted by: toolguy Jul 17 2017, 02:32 PM

If he won't make it as it was when you left it on his own I'd call your insurance company. . if that works, then take him to small claims court for your deductible.. . .. At the least he should give you his insurance company info. .
You can also check and see if he has a 'YELP" account and leave him negative, but honest' feedback. .
There is also the bureau of automotive repair.

Posted by: Tom_T Jul 17 2017, 02:43 PM

Wes,

Unlike many other states - you're not alone in this. CA has the DMV/Dept. of Consumer Affairs 800 number to report shops like this (every shop is required to post it & it's online), & they will step in, at least as far as disciplinary action, but they can also advise you how to proceed. You may also have to go to small claims court if your insurance won't cover you, then go after him.

They guy is at fault for both the interior/exterior damage while in their care, so his insurance should cover it, if he has proper coverage. And he should've stepped up right away to do so, so do report both the interior/exterior damage & his charging you for work not on the estimate + not repairing the problem for which it was brought in.

DMV/DCA should take action on both, but not necessarily get the money on both - as I'm not sure on how it works in this type of complicated case.

I'd suggest getting an estimate for the actual work requested & a separate one for the work "claimed" to have been done - both from the shop that referred you (High Tech - or at least let them know that their referral had problems), &/or from Rich Bontempi (HPH Redwood City) &/or Marty Yeoman - since they both know 914s & won't fell "unqualified" like your ProShop guy did.

If you don't have a Porsche interior shop whom you can trust for the work near to you or Bay Area, then get one from Autos International in Fallbrook CA, cuz they're a known quantity who does great work on 914s & other P-cars. Ditto on any needed body/paint work from a good body shop up near you or in the Bay Area - if there is anything still amiss that didn't "buff out" by the shop guy.

Also, let Redwood Region PCA know too, so they're on notice about an advertiser/shop whop they implicitly recommend.

You should be able to both get your money back for the faulty & non-estimated work done on your 914 (in CA they MUST have an owner approved estimate for ALL work before doing it), as well as for the damaged interior/exterior repairs due to the shop's negligence. I don't know if they will make any "off-sets" from the former refund as legit &/or owner approved work, against the latter damages.

If they still have your oil cooler parts, then get those back immediately before he gets wind of the complaints & holds them on you.

I don't know either of those shops (referring & work), but you got hosed for non-approved extra work (unless you approved any over the phone/in person orally), as well as taken by a negligent shop.

What reputable shop leaves any car windows open in the rain, then lets it sit & mold? .... & lets a car get banged up? .... & then won't fully repair it - rather than using harsh chemicals/processes to completely destroy it!!??


Aside from Mark's very generous offer - you should be able to get everything repaired properly & completely, & not have to piecemeal it together, the way that CA law & DCA/DMV, etc. works here. You won't know if the seat foam is wet & molding & need replacing, rusting/molding floor panels under the carpet & floor crossmember vinyl, electrical &/or instrument problems due to the interior flooding, etc., etc. - so it's going to be a deeper repair that just replacing the seat inserts IMHO, & you should not have to do the labor yourself.

So go the DCA route, see what they say to do, check with your insurance, get full work estimates, get with your car insurance co. for "Comprehensive" coverage, & maybe get a referral to a good lawyer up there on these types of matters, & get a 30 min. free consultation to see what they think (even "consulting a lawyer" may break the shop owner's "tight-fisted grip on his wallet" hearing that), & see what you need to do for CA small claims court (you don't need a lawyer to do small claims) but their maximum claim is something like $7500+/- & neither parties can use legal counsel there.

For all of this stuff, refer to it as an interior flooding problem, so they know the full extent of what to look for, beyond just surface damage.

PS - I'm sure you realize now, that the reason he never contacted you for 6 months & claims his phone had problems, was he didn't want to face the music, but also take that as a possible red flag that he's got financial problems & may be close to BK, not have full insurance himself, etc. So move quickly on this.

Good Luck!
Tom
///////

Posted by: Dion Jul 17 2017, 02:44 PM

Wes, that is terrible! Sorry man.
I had an incident like this with my wife's daily driver (regarding interior damage).
Agree with Mark 100%. Document, get the insurance co. Involved.
Don't fix anything. Get all the numbers first.
Totally aggravating but you'll be glad ya did later.
And by all means negative feedback to where it counts if he doesn't cooperate and drop a line to the BBB.
Good luck Wes.

Posted by: Krieger Jul 17 2017, 03:31 PM

Crap! I know who that is. I have bought parts from him, but never had any service done. Vots is getting up there in age. Not an excuse, but. Too bad Hi Tech wouldn't do it.

Posted by: wes Jul 17 2017, 05:59 PM

First thanks for all the very helpfull response!
Well I spoke with Pots the owner at Proshop and it turns out he has no insurance!
I let him know of the things that have been suggested by people here and let him know that I have absolutely no interest in defacing him or his business and certainly don't want to involve lawyers. I just want it like it was when I left it with him.
So he has agreed to take another look at it after I get estimates to bring it back to what it was when I dropped it off with him.
Now estimates I've spoken to Richt B. at HighPerformance House and he is booked up with too many cars so he said to call back next Tuesday and see if he can squeeze me in.

Posted by: Larmo63 Jul 17 2017, 06:05 PM

Moral of the story:

Don't leave your car with someone you don't know for six months.

I have been through this with ROB JOY in Oceanside, who is a TOTAL RIP-OFF.

We need a "Don't Deal With These People List"

Sorry this happened to your bitchin car.

Posted by: Cairo94507 Jul 17 2017, 06:07 PM

Hi Wes- Very sorry to hear about this. I have to agree with Mark, call your insurance company and turn it over to them with all of the pictures and information. I would not return the car to that shop unless your insurance company asks you too (doubtful). The cap on Small Claims, last I checked, was $7K in California. Seems like a pretty easy win to me. Best of luck. Michael

Posted by: ConeDodger Jul 17 2017, 06:32 PM

File a claim with your insurance and let them go after the guy... At least I think that would be the way. Ouch! That is awful! That car is so beautiful!

Posted by: steuspeed Jul 17 2017, 07:50 PM

Man that is terrible! I think I have found a new use for my old torn seat cushions though. I'll pop those in for any service work I have done. I'll take anything that is not bolted down out too.

Posted by: thelogo Jul 17 2017, 08:47 PM

You really would expect more common sense from a shop

But you have to know that before the customer comes for
The car the shop must have realized the damage was done .


If it was a surprise to them then that's just negligence
And my mechanic always puts my car inside .

" because its a 914 " he always tells me .


I recently had a engine swap done and it took a week
Car came out almost perfect 3k$ later .

But when i picked the car up, the clutch was not allowing engagement of reverse gear . Not a huge deal but it went in
Reverse when i dropped it off , so it left me a little bitter
But the guy said just bring it back and he will fix it free .

The point is i had to tell him about the problem.
This should never happen if you ask me .

He said since it was such a hi perfomance car
No one but him " the owner "
Test drove it .

And he obviously never even thought to engage reverse.
But if i had found paint and seat damage when i went to pick up the car , i would have never paid him .

Simple , make sure its right before you pay a dime


.

Posted by: euro911 Jul 17 2017, 09:20 PM

Sorry to hear Wes.

Interesting ... I looked them up and they have 13 reviews with a 4.5 of 5 rating. A business that works on high end German autos, but doesn't carry insurance?

Posted by: whitetwinturbo Jul 17 2017, 09:22 PM

Posted by: Coondog Jul 17 2017, 10:22 PM

Small claims court and don't forget to add in monies for your time.

Posted by: 76-914 Jul 18 2017, 07:47 AM

If you advertise via the internet you quickly learn there are some "terrible" companies with good ratings. How do they do it? They call the "complaining customer" and negotiate a "deal" whereby the customer changes or retracts their "poor rating". Yelp "encourages" vendors "to work it out" with customers and provides you with their contact information. It's a two headed snake. It's a great idea on paper but there are companies that can work around it and use it to their advantage by having people in place to "charm" there way out of a situation.
Sorry for what's going on with your car Wes.

Posted by: rhodyguy Jul 18 2017, 09:06 AM

Both seats? How the doors cards could have been damaged is beyond explanation. I would have to chat with the tech that worked on the car. Good biz to stay away from.

Posted by: JRust Jul 18 2017, 11:57 AM

The only shop I have complete trust in is Mark at Original customs. I would drive the 9 hours from my home to his shop because of this. My LE restoration I got completely hosed with a shop & it was there over a year to get running. When I got it back I had rust in my floors & rear trunk because it had sat outside in the rain most of that year. This is after a fresh paint job. I ended up having to strip my interior & rear trunk to repaint. Worst shop experience of my life but it taught me something. I do not just leave my car with any shop & just trust it will get done when they say. With the exception of Mark anyway. I do have a good suby guy I am using for my current car who I also trust. I still am on him every week that it is there. He only wants my car there when he can work on it. Limited space keeps him from having cars that live there.

I am sorry for your troubles Wes. I absolutely feel your pain

Posted by: 914dave Jul 18 2017, 01:11 PM

Sorry for your troubles. Especially a newly restored car. Don't make it easy by doing what you can to fix it. You shouldn't have too. Document and follow thru with insurance or litigation. Must be disappointing to not have what you've asked for done. Have friends who have had similar experiences. Hang in there.

Posted by: Racer Chris Jul 18 2017, 02:21 PM

I bet he would lose his repair license if the state found that out.

Posted by: ConeDodger Jul 18 2017, 03:36 PM

Not so sure. The agency is called BAR or Bureau of Automotive Repair. They inspect all licensed automotive businesses and I have never had them ask for proof of insurance. Although, you're right, it would be stupid not to have the insurance. Knock on wood, I've had one almost claim when my tech backed a customer car into a landscape rock. Turned out the part was prefinished and available new from the dealership for $125. I put it on for her...

Posted by: mepstein Jul 18 2017, 03:45 PM

call your insurance company and get prepped for small claims court.
My attorney always says; The person who documents the best, wins.

Posted by: ConeDodger Jul 18 2017, 03:47 PM

Mark is right. He'd be dealing with my insurance company by now. Quit being so nice...

Posted by: Racer Chris Jul 18 2017, 03:52 PM

Check with the Department of Consumer Protection.

Posted by: ConeDodger Jul 18 2017, 04:14 PM

No such animal Chris. Automotive shops and practitioners are licensed through BAR. Medical and barbers and beauticians are licensed through DCA or Department of Consumer Affairs. I'd guess you could call BAR and complain, but if he calls his insurance company and files a claim, they handle the legal part if needed. I'd go that way.

Posted by: carr914 Jul 18 2017, 07:37 PM

I have a 1/2 Bolt of Houndstooth that I will probably never use - enough to do do at least two seats & maybe your door panels

Posted by: StratPlayer Jul 18 2017, 07:42 PM

What a shame, I'd be one pissed off mofo. Make the bastards pay for what they did to your car.

Posted by: Marty Yeoman Jul 18 2017, 08:25 PM

Wow, Sorry to read about this Wes. I hope you get set right.

Posted by: euro911 Jul 19 2017, 02:22 AM

Hey TC, if Wes doesn't go for it, shoot me a PM with what you'd want for it. That would look good in my wife ivory car

Posted by: Mike Fitton Jul 19 2017, 06:46 AM

I am guessing the interior was ruined by the shop when they tried to clean it.

Posted by: wes Jul 19 2017, 01:10 PM

Well apparently he had grease stained both seats (I can sorta understand one dirty pants ass on a test drive though two seats, no work to be done inside?) I can't figure what he thought or used to clean them, and once you've damaged one why would you go to the second one, never having the guts to say something! The rest of the interior damage was do to heat the glue parted in the heat, he left the car seating outside against a two story wall that gets full sun during a hot spell, 4 days of record heat and yes I'm guessing the windows were up tight plus I have one of the Saratoga tops wich magnifies-heating in the sun and it was on for the Werks Reunion at cloudy Monterey car week. As far as scratching the rear trunk lid some from his engine lid adjustment, was fine before he received the car and the rest looks like no protection wile doing engine work. I understood that the car would be inside and would only take a week or so.
I'm getting estimates on the damage and he says he's going too pay for all the damage done so hopefully it will work out with no extra problems.
The guy really seems to be a very nice guy though he's older than me, I'm about to turn 71 and retired as I'm thinking he also should be, just a guess!

Posted by: carr914 Jul 20 2017, 04:53 AM

Wes, here are some pictures of the Houndstooth Material I have - it was the closest I could find to Porsche Material

Posted by: 87m491 Jul 20 2017, 05:35 AM

Hmmm, I have never seen a shop set up where you could get the car in, on a lift, off a lift and out the door and test drive it all in foward gears....maybe if you pushed but....

Posted by: My 914 Jul 20 2017, 10:05 AM

Probably worth talking to an attorney as well. Just in case.