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Posted by: bbrock Aug 14 2017, 05:32 PM

I have a couple decisions to make soon on my restoration that could affect resale value of the car. So I'd be interested to hear opinions.

The car is a numbers matching (I'm pretty sure - need COA) '73 2.0L so on paper, very desirable. But it is currently a rust basket case, but becoming less so every day. I'm trying to restore it to a very high standard but it seems silly to think such a Frankencar would ever be a concours contender. I certainly have no interest showing it. But I am kind of a fanatic about originality with a few exceptions. I'm keeping the car very near original with a few "bolt-on" mods that are easily reversible like euro signal lights, reproduction parts for budget (no thousand dollar OEM interior light going in here), etc. The biggest mod is that the engine has been converted to carbs, including cam. But I still have the original FI and may start working on restoring that down the road. I'm contemplating a couple of mods that won't be so easy to roll back but I don't want to sacrifice potential resale value of the car. Below are the mods and my twisted rationale for doing them:

Delete Fender Warts - this is the biggie. I hate them and the warts I have are in bad shape. I hate to think of spending money to replace something I think is ugly and Porsche didn't really intended to be on the car. My rationale is that no warts and euro lenses ARE original in European markets. But if I sold the car, would that kill the originality premium?

Late style fuel pump location A PO relocated the fuel pump to inside the steering rack and did a crap job of it. I recently picked up a 75-76 fuel pump blister with the intention of cutting the firewall to relocate the pump the way the factory did. Makes sense to me. It's a factory improvement, right? But what would a buyer looking for an original car think?

Black anodized trim My car is performance group, but not appearance group so it has black bumpers which I like. Decades ago, I lightly sanded the scratched up window and targa trim and painted it satin black. I really like the look and am thinking of having them black anodized as part of the restoration. Or would it be smarter to go back to bright anodized to preserve resale value? Seems like this would be an easy one to reverse if someone wanted to.

I have no plans to sell this car but never rule it out. Just curious how far a person can deviate from dealer delivered original before the car loses that "all original premium"... And realizing that such things are impossible to predict.

Posted by: Freezin 914 Aug 14 2017, 05:56 PM

I think the most important thing is to do what you like. It's your car (at this time). With that all being said in my personal opinion, any mods should be very well done. Well planned/ engineered. In the long run if everything is done to very high standards and none of the mods are to flashy/ loud (color). Most buyers will pay up for a well executed well sorted car. Good luck with your decision!

Posted by: Tom_T Aug 14 2017, 06:05 PM

The rustoration itself - if done properly, won't detract as a "resto-mod" - that's just what resto of older rust prone cars is about. Andy T./SoCalAndy resurrected a basket case 914-6 in a way that was period correct & he has the ability to put his original 2L -6 back in, so it hasn't suffered any value loss from being a rust bucket - more like amazement from folks who see the start point.

The key is to do nothing irreversible, if you want to be able to benefit from an original car value.

So things like ability to put it back to EFI, using those 914 logo cover plates instead of welding up the F-side marker holes, having the chrome/shiny aluminum/SS trim bits to put back on in the future, for the black you want - are all things that are reversible.

FYI - your PO didn't just "wing" that FP relo. That fuel pump relocation to up behind the steering rack cover on 70-74 914s 4/6 is the factory Service Bulletin location, so I'd say just clean it up, & use the 70-74 3-port pump with new hoses, clamps, mount ring, isolating rubbers & other bits (AA sells a FP relo kit with the parts originally supplied with the factory kit). It's less work for you, less cutting to create the access hole/cover, & less to change the plumbing from the original 3-line to later 2-line, etc. - & the 3 port pump was a better & more durable pump.

Many of us 70-74 owners have that factory relocation done - either back in the day (mine was done in 76), or in the time since. Being a FSB work, it won't detract from originality nor value, but will save you from vapor lock!

Dollars & percentages are all over the place on this now, as they will be in the future, for your "whenever" time comes - but the values across the board will be going up. So mistakes now, will cost more value then than now. When I did an informal survey on 914s color changed from OE with another 914 correct color, I found that the color changed ones seemed to sell at 25-50% of a correctly restored to original, & the other more serious mods which you're contemplating may be as much or more of a devaluation.

The more desirable 914 sub-models will always be more valuable, & therefore more important to maintain the best value by staying with the originality. So the factory versions of: 914-6, 74 914-2.0 LE, 73-74 914-2.0, 75-76 914-2.0 are probably always going to be worth keeping as or easily back-dated to original. If yours is a factory 73 2L, then it falls in that group. And as time goes on, supply drops & interest increases, even the 1.7s & 1.8s will come up & be well worth saving as originals.

If that 2L motor is the original, then you could also do a carb swap into another core 2L engine, & put the OE motor back to original with EFI & proper cam etc. then store it, if you still want to run the carbed substitue motor - maybe at 2056 or something a tad more than stock HP/TQ.

That said - hey, it's your car, your time, effort & money - so you have to make you happy - then just swallow the consequences for changes.


Tom
///////

Posted by: Chris914n6 Aug 14 2017, 06:51 PM

If you want restoration value at the end, don't do anything that can't be undone or replaced easily.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 14 2017, 06:54 PM

I should clarify here. I wasn't complaining about the location of the pump. It was the quality of the work. It may have been a nice factory relocation job at one time, but by the time I got it, it was two rusty sheet metal screws barely holding the pump on and a rat's nest of crimped on butt splices and chaffing wire. My interest in relocating the pump to the 75 on location is just that I think Not that one location is better than the other from a vapor lock standpoint. I do like the idea of the little door to service pump and filter without getting under the car. It's also the kind of detail project that I like. But not at the expense of originality. The 3-port plumbing is something to think about too. I'll be stripping out all the fuel lines and replacing (this car still has plastic lines). And I'll be running a non-stock pump for the carbs for now. But... I might be going back to stock FI some day. Honestly, if I had started the engine rebuild today instead of 30 years ago, it wouldn't be a question, I'd be restoring the FI. But back then, all the cool kids were doing it..

Anyone have any pics of a reversible side marker delete? I'm having a hard time picturing anything I'd be satisfied with. I forgot to mention one of my twisted arguments for deleting. It IS reversible, you just need a hole saw and drill bit.

Lot's to think about.

Posted by: Perry Kiehl Aug 14 2017, 08:45 PM

Will your mods effect value, except for the fuel pump; yes. How much? That's the $64,000 question.

I personally don't think that the changes you propose will significantly impact a rusted out and welded up car, unless you plan to get it to a high level of restoration.

Your personal preference might eliminate some buyers at the time of sale, but I'd say that the main thing is that you have it the way you like it. If you foresee selling it two years after you get it done, that's another story, but if you are going to hang on to it forever, go for it.

Posted by: Larmo63 Aug 14 2017, 09:21 PM

The front "wart" lights ARE ugly, but they came on thousands of U.S. bound cars. I think the car looks much better without them, and down the road, mine will be deleted. They do give you a bit more light on the front of the car, so there is a safety factor. Many cars have been returned to Europe which sport the American side markers and many over there just leave them on. As for the black trim, I actually don't like it on a stock(ish) looking car. On a custom car it is okay, heck LEs came from the factory with it.

I'm doing a /6 911 conversion on my car which was a pretty original, fully optioned '73 2.0L. IDGAS what anybody thinks about me dropping in 190 HP of true Porsche grunt.

After I'm dead, somebody else can change it back if they like.

Go for what makes you happy.

Posted by: arne Aug 14 2017, 10:34 PM

I think this question is more appropriate for me as someone who is refreshing my car as a project, but plans to sell it not long after it is done. Not looking to make a profit, this is a retirement hobby for me. But I do need to break even so I can afford to do something else in the future. So resale is something I think about, both value and marketability. I don't want to do mods that might limit the car's audience, nor hurt its value. But since it is never going to be a concours car, some mods are probably ok.

In my case, I have done two of the three you mentioned. I deleted the warts and relocated the fuel pump. I don't think either of those mods will hurt me when time comes to sell. I thought about black trim, since the windshield trim that was on the car was damaged. But I decided that might make it either harder to sell or be a haggling point on price. So I bought new silver trim.

But if you are not looking to sell it soon, do what you personally like. Don't worry too much about "value", make the car your own.

Posted by: RickS Aug 15 2017, 12:04 AM

Took a 71 rust and accident free appearance group 1.7 and wanted it to be a sleeper with the following mods:

Conversion to 3.0 carbed 6
Front oil cooler
Full Elephant polybronze suspension
Widened rear fenders to accommodate 7" Fuchs
Full 5 lug conversion
911S front calipers
Euro front and rear turn signals
H4 100/80 relayed lights
Quad gauge
Hidden Engine cut-off switch
Solenoid operated trunk release with emergency manual release
Later model backpad
Vintage Seats Nurburgring driver seat and movable passenger seat
Side shift with bronze bushings
6" and 7" Fuchs
Porsche back panel (blacked out) with remote trunk open
Fogs replaced with driving lights rewired to use as daytime running lights
Tunnel mounted fire extinguisher
LED brake/running and strobing third brake light
Genuine 6 heat exchangers and oil tank
Warts changed from orange to clear to better blend with silver paint.
Console delete
Cup holder added to extinguisher mount
High torque starter
GT style engine grill/s
Fittipaldi stearing wheel
Coco mats

So how does my value now compare to stock with 65K miles?

Posted by: Perry Kiehl Aug 15 2017, 06:17 AM

73/4 2.0's are recognized as the highest value 4 cyl cars, so you did the right thing with your 71 Rick

Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Aug 15 2017, 07:39 AM

All mods effect value. Most are not upgrades and devalue the car because they are too personalized. Those that do add value usually cost more than the value they add.

The warts are a safety requirement for the USA cars, so that your front end can be seen from the side in the dark.

Not aware that the fuel pump relocation was a FSB upgrade...can I see documentation of that? The FSB was to insulate the fuel lines and redirect heat from the passenger side HE.

It's your car but they are not making them anymore. Buying a modified car is buying someone else's "improvements". Whether a future buyer wants them is anyone's guess and the value cannot be known until their money is in your pocket.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 15 2017, 08:46 AM

Great info guys. I'm not too worried about the trim since that's easy to roll back. I think I've decided not to do the pump relocate. I still think the FSB reloc to steering rack was a quickie solution to a problem, whereas the trunk reloc is the more polished solution. But it isn't worth sacrificing originality.

I think it is clear the majority of people prefer these cars without warts. So I can't imagine deleting them reduces the number of potential buyers. But it sounds like it will turn off the relatively few buyers who are willing to pay that extra premium for originality. But will they be willing to pay that premium anyway if there are a lot of easily reversible things like replacing repro lenses and domestic carpet to make it factory fresh? In other words, is the premium only for cars that are just a good detailing away from a concours competition, or does it include cars that need a fair amount of parts swapping to get to pure original? I am trying to restore this car to a very high level - restoring factory plating and finishes, stickers, etc. I just won't be including expensive OEM parts if there are 914rubber quality and priced items available.

Tom mentioned the engine. One other mod from original I've made was to install Mahle OEM euro spec pistons and cylinders. I would not think that would affect the originality value of the car at all, but maybe I'm wrong?

Rick, my car is also metallic silver and I'm digging your clear side marker treatment. I'd still prefer those markers be gone completely, but they do blend much better with the car. Might be a tolerable compromise. Did you ever have any luck shaving them to lower profile? And do you have amber bulbs inside them?

I think Ricks car is interesting. It seems to me that the market rewards for cars taht are original, and as one deviates from that originality, the value decreases. But at some point, the level of modification takes the car into a different market where value has little to do with originality and is driven by the quality and nature of the mods. I would think the value of the best of those cars could surpass the value if they were restored to original. Just my guess.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 15 2017, 01:17 PM

Okay, between the great info here, and what Tom posted on the other thread, I've made some decisions. No cutting the firewall for the pump, and the ugly-ass warts will stay, but I will copy Rick's clear lens idea.

Moving on. I'm shooting for a respectable #2 Hagerty condition car with this resto. Crossing my fingers I can pull it off. So some other questions as I move forward related to value:

Paint - my understanding is that 2-stage paint IS original for the metallic colors. Correct? Please be so

Dealer accessories - What about adding options like fog lights, rear window defrost, and tinted glass that don't show on on the COA? Any negative effect on value? Well, my windshield will be after market anyway because I live in Montana where windshields go to die (our '06 Honda is on its third windshield now). No point in spending $$ on OEM glass there. But my side curtains have some scratches so I may eventually change them out in the distant future.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Aug 16 2017, 08:02 AM

IMO -
unless you are making the car to sell (flipping) make the car what YOU want.

If you want to remove the warts, remove them.

If you want a superfly 80's paint job, 383 small block stroker, fibeglqass body, etc., make that shit happen.

If you want a concourse car, clean and buff to your hearts content.

Few to none of us who are not making the car with intent to flip it will ever see a positive net with a 914, not for a long time yet anyway. We have to get into black with smiles per mile.

Zach

Posted by: Mark Henry Aug 16 2017, 08:10 AM

If you're only after resale value then yes keep it original.
If you're after smiles on your face do whatever floats your boat.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 16 2017, 09:02 AM

I totally agree with what you guys are saying and I love modified cars. My problem is that I'm in a real PIA place for what floats my boat. I tore this car apart over 30 years ago with the intent of restoring it with several mods to my idea of how the cars might be if they were still being made (in the mid-'80s). These included completely de-chroming the car, modernized center console, leather interior, etc. The project went into deep hibernation and my priorities have changed.

Now I just want to experience a new and original 914. I've owned 3 of these cars but all had tired suspensions and tin worms in the bodies by the time I got them. Even so, there were miles of smiles. I just want a car that is like it was when it rolled off the dealer's lot. My problem is that I think the purest versions of the Porsche designers vision rolled off of European dealer's lots.

No plans to sell the car, but it might happen some day. And because the car I want will be very close to original, I'm just trying to figure out the cost:benefit of the mods I'd like. Is shaving the warts worth a $5K hit in value to me? Probably not. I don't hate them that much. Is it worth a $500 hit in value? You bet! And to my mind, this car with euro pistons and signals is more original without the warts. But because of where the car was originally sold, the market doesn't seem to agree.

One last thing on the history of this car. I bought it in 1985 for $500. Ran great but the car was sidelined by the hell hole. I spent $150 on a junkyard inner suspension console and bottle of welding gas, and put the car back on the road for a few years of the most enjoyable driving I've ever done. Rust, oil leaks, and chronic EFI trouble convinced me to tear it down for a complete rebuild. Got the bottom end of the engine done and then life happened. Now I'm bringing it back to life and only have about $3K total invested in it at this point, including the original purchase. If I don't F it up, it is looking like I can get through this resto under $10K. It could be a rare resto that doesn't go upside down on investment. Which is part of the reason I have resale value on my mind. But no, profit is not a motivation here. I want to be a little conscious of how my decisions will impact my ability to recoup expenses down the road though.

Posted by: Vacca Rabite Aug 16 2017, 10:10 AM

Just remember - (and this is only true when you start the restoration for real...)

Take the anticipated cost and the anticipated time to complete. Multiply both by Pi. This will get you into your ballpark if you follow the usual bell curve of completed restorations...

I really don't want to think about the money I have into my car over the years. Its way more then 10K. Probably close to 20K... for a car I'd probably be able to sell for $10K-14K.

Zach

Posted by: kgruen2 Aug 16 2017, 10:35 AM

Well said. I have a lot more in mine than I ever thought I would spend. Pi sounds about right.

Posted by: Larmo63 Aug 16 2017, 11:25 AM

Nobody really cares that much about the warts not being there as long as it's done right.

Posted by: mepstein Aug 16 2017, 11:45 AM

I agree. They were a USA add-on. Not part of the original design or used on ROW cars.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 16 2017, 11:51 AM

Noted! I'm actually well into the restoration for real (http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=307290). Only in the last couple days have I gotten to where I have cut enough of the rust out to estimate the cost with any confidence. In reality, it will probably go north of $10K but could potentially sneak under. I'm pretty confident I will stay under $15K though. What will really blow the budget is if I botch the DIY paint job and have to farm it out.

For time, my estimate is sometime before I die (hopefully). People keep asking when I think I will be done. I just say, "I'll be done when it is finished." For now, I'm enjoying the ride.

Posted by: Spoke Aug 16 2017, 12:16 PM

I'm not sure there are many buyers looking for an all original 914. Most of us want a dependable 914 that we can drive that really scoots. As long as you do tasteful modifications, you shouldn't lose perceived value.

For opinions, here's my list of things to do:

o Repair rust, fix dents, paint (color of your choice or original)
o Delete or keep front side warts. Doesn't matter to me although removing safety lamps doesn't feel right.
o 5-lug upgrade: 911 front suspension with under- or through-body sway bar, re-drilled rear hubs with sway bar.
o 7x17 Euromeister Fuchs-look wheels all round with 205/50/17 tires.
o 96mm P & C with either carbs or FI
o Stainless Steel Heat Exchangers
o Bursch or equivalent performance muffler
o Rebuild transmission.
o Drive it like you stole it!

Posted by: TM_Corey Aug 17 2017, 01:43 PM

I had my warts removed during restoration, but made sure the shop made me a perfect template so if a future owner ever wants to put them back on it will be easy to do so.

I can scan it if anyone ever wants it.


Attached image(s)

Posted by: bbrock Aug 17 2017, 02:29 PM

Ha! Perfect timing. I was just getting ready to post that after staring at that hole in the fender for way too long and waffling back and forth on this, I've decided to apply wart remover and do exactly the same thing. I'll just make good templates beforehand and store them with what I have of the marker assemblies. After all the cutting and welding I've done, and still have to do to make this car solid again, re-drilling those holes will be minor surgery if there is ever a need to do it.

Let's face it, a car with euro signals and warts is just wrong. I also have an idea for using waterproof amber LED strips to replace the safety function of the warts without modifying the chassis and in a way where you would have to look hard to notice them. Playing with that is WAY down the road though.

Gorgeous car BTW!

Posted by: ConeDodger Aug 18 2017, 04:13 PM

The infamous George once said that flares and six conversion added the most value. Those modifications will cost much more value than they add unless your uncle left you a 3.2 and a bunch of conversion parts.
I have stuck faithfully with what the factory GT cars had. It makes me happy. In another 10 years, cars like Dr. Bizaglou's in Michigan will be untouchable price wise. Totally original and in preservation condition.

Posted by: Coondog Aug 18 2017, 04:36 PM

I always laugh when people talk about 914 resale value. Where not talking real money here. 914-6 are the exception. OMG, maybe on your lucky day your bone stock 914 will bring a extra 5 grand. It's the stock low mile cars that are getting a higher price but those are far and few between.

Mod the crap out of your car I say and enjoy.

Now in 25 years when stock 914s are bringing 60K then you can call me out. Of course 60K Will be chump change in 2042.

Posted by: bbrock Aug 18 2017, 06:35 PM

I agree with that to a point. Profit is not a motivation for me and I wish I could say I don't care about resale. But I do for two reasons. One is that because I originally bought my car for practically nothing, and did most of the engine work back when parts and labor were cheap, I have a very realistic chance of completing a major rustoration without going upside down. That alone, is a fun challenge - to go where few have gone before. I also have to be realistic. I am self-employed with a wildly fluctuating and unpredictable income. I've done well-enough so far, but I always have to consider the possibility of a string of bad years. If I still own this car when I die, it means fortune has smiled upon me. But for prudence's sake, it behooves me to at least consider the monetary consequences of any decisions I make now. Resale is a lower priority for me, but not trivial. It's important to me to have reasonable assurance that if my financial fortunes should turn, I could get back out of this car what I put in. No delusions of getting rich here, I just want to be able to refill the piggy bank.

Also, I don't want to mod the crap out of my car. That's just not what floats my boat. Even if resale value had zero importance to me, I'd still be pondering these decisions. Believe it or not, it's part of the fun of it.

Posted by: somd914 Aug 18 2017, 07:13 PM

So how many of us live in an unmodified house?

My boat and every boat I've sailed (race or cruise) have been modified.

My DD's get mods to make them more fun and/or practical.

If you are looking to make money, cut your losses and walk away now. You will not recoup your restoration costs, at least anytime soon. Both of my 914s were bought for pennies on the dollar.

Do what makes you happy and what brings a smile to your face when you are driving or admiring your project. And remember, the average depreciation of a new car in its first year or two will likely far exceed any gains you will see between stock or mods, but how many of us have bought or will buy new cars despite thoughts to keep a 914 stock for value sake?

Ultimately it is your decision, opinions vary widely...

Posted by: Coondog Aug 18 2017, 07:44 PM

When it's not 100% original then I will take a Resto Mod any day...........

Posted by: mgp4591 Aug 18 2017, 08:05 PM

Tasteful bolt-ons can make a BIG difference...

Posted by: oakdalecurtis Aug 18 2017, 09:39 PM

Here's a list of the mods I have done on my car in the last 20 years. Most of them are not that noticeable. If it makes it easier or more fun for me to drive though, it's a done deal.
Engine, Original 2.0 Liter, Fuel Injected
- Monza exhaust system
- Crane electronic ignition system

Chassis and Suspension
- Empi rims

Exterior
- Dual Hella horns
- Cloth lined front trunk
- Engine lid restraint cable
- Porsche stripes on doors
- Black Widow security alarm
- External main battery charger port
- LED front signal and running lights
- Front fender parking lights removed
- High mounted LED 3rd brake strobe light
- Porsche rear reflector lens with LED illumination
- Porsche front bumper plate with LED illumination
- BlazeCut automatic engine fire suppression system

Interior
- Short shift kit
- HD Mirror Camera
- Porsche dash light
- Passenger cupholder
- LED dash gauge lighting
- Heater On dash indicator light
- Solenoid activated rear trunk release
- Momo steering wheel with eccentric lift spacer
- Fog lights wired for use as Daytime Running Lights
- Tartan cloth seats with driver’s side cushion thigh lift
- Raised center console armrest with driver cupholder
- Repositioned brake pedal to increase gas pedal foot room
- Blaupunkt six speaker stereo system with electric antenna

Posted by: bbrock Aug 18 2017, 11:40 PM

That's a nice list of mods and the sort of things I like too. In my original post, I said there were a few bolt-on mods I have planned (some already done). I just wanted some information on the more permanent ones to decide if they were worth it to me. But here is a list of mods cone or planned for this car.

Already done:

- Dual Weber 40 IDF carbs with Bosch 050 dizzy
- mild street grind carb cam
- Mahle 94mm 8.0:1 (euro spec) P/C
- Porsche crest shift knob
- European lenses front and rear
- Black window and roll bar trim
- Bursch exhaust
- SS heat exchangers

Planned:
- SVA dizzy with Pertronix ignition and high output coil
- Custom hand throttle to operate cold start circuit on carbs
- Subwoofer in passenger foot well
- Ash tray modified as cupholder
- Modern (Blaupunkt) stereo head unit
- Side marker delete
- Upgraded headlamps (not sure what yet)
- Rear window defrost (OEM switch with non-OEM element)
- LED lamps where ever I can plug and play
- Tinted windshield
- Intermittent wiper relay
- Starter relay
- Main battery circuit breaker
- Dual Hella horns

In the maybe pile:
- Evan0's relay and fuse panel update
- Fog or driving lights
- Fuel pump relocate to trunk
- Replacement center cushion with cup holders
- Replace clock with oil pressure gauge (probably will since I already have the gauge and dual sending unit)
- Modified combo gauge with CHT and Oil pressure (so I can put my clock back in the center console)
- Quieter exhaust

I drove this car a number of years and know how fast (or slow) it is. It is just dandy for me. I especially enjoyed getting up to 37 mpg highway. The carb conversion is just because the EFI kept leaving me stranded and, back in 1988 or '89 when I pulled the engine, carbs were just what you did when you got sick of the EFI crapping on you. I want to run these carbs for awhile. But I might spend a winter refurbing the EFI and go back to that. One thing I won't be changing is the tire pressurized washer bottle. I love that quirky bastard and found it provided the perfect excuse if I peed myself after going into a curve a bit too fast. "Oh that? My damn windshield washer tube sprung a leak again."

These are all mods to make the car more reliable, comfortable, or safe without significantly altering the stock appearance or ride. All but the two I originally asked about will be done without altering the original part, which will be stored. And all but those two are easily reversible.

I have nothing against mods - obviously. But I find it curious that so many people have told me it is MY car and I should do what I want. Yet, make fun of the idea of wanting to keep a car original.

Posted by: forrestkhaag Aug 19 2017, 11:42 AM

I had warts when I was a kid. I still have two of them....

Posted by: Dominic Aug 20 2017, 12:20 PM

I actually asked this question at a Valuation seminar that I attended during the Porsche Parade in Spokane. The presenter was a very well versed in Porsche's new and old. Since I have a steel flared 914-6, I was curious as to the overall effect on the value.
The term he used was "Acceptable Modifications". If you have a car with what the Porsche community considers "Acceptable Modifications" you probably didn't hurt the value too much. For our 914's, steel flares and -6 conversions (for example) are welcomed with open arms. When you stray from the "Acceptable Modifications" rule of thumb and start to cut/chop/personalize, etc. you now have a hard time placing a resale value on a car that others may not appreciate.

In the end, it's your car. Have fun with it!

Posted by: Coondog Aug 20 2017, 12:55 PM

because no one else wants to spend the money it takes to do these conversions......

Posted by: larryM Aug 20 2017, 09:28 PM

well said - that covers it completely

Posted by: Dave_Darling Aug 20 2017, 11:18 PM

There is an $85,000 1.8 liter 914 that would beg to disagree with you... (With the buyer's premium, it's just about a six-figure 75 1.8! With some repaired/replaced body panels!!)

--DD

Posted by: mepstein Aug 21 2017, 05:28 AM

It was a unicorn. At least for now. Not to mention the amount of fraud at auctions is staggering.

Posted by: horizontally-opposed Aug 21 2017, 10:59 AM

Older Porsches, unlike Ferraris in general and vintage Corvettes, seem to do just fine when modified—*if* modified tastefully with broad appeal. Translation, with rare exception: In a way that looks like something the factory might have done in a way it might have done it. A really well done 914-6 GT like Eric Shea's. Or a six conversion or real 914-6 hot rod done to a very high level. Or a 914-4 hot rod that's simply done really, really well. There are others out there who would rather have those cars than a perfect stock example, and will pay up for them. Some R Gruppe 911s and some 356 Outlaws meet this standard, as do certain modified 964s and 993s. There are other examples—and in some cases the cars can go for more than a stock example in similar condition with similar mileage. Pickled cars (ultra low mileage, as new condition) are another matter, and are generally king of the hill—save certain celebrity cars (McQueen 911S or 930).

So, to your question about the warts, I'd get rid of them with zero regrets (and did on my car). Porsche certainly did not view them as a visual upgrade, else it would have included them on all RoW cars. Those side markers were a compromise to meet US laws, and have never looked good to these eyes. Now, I wouldn't get rid of them on a perfect, all-original 914, but I have no interest in owning a perfect, all-original 914 (unless it's a 914-6 GT!).

Posted by: Keyser Sose Aug 21 2017, 02:32 PM

Amen to that, especially the "...I have no interest in owning a perfect, all-original 914 (unless it's a 914-6 GT!)."

Posted by: worn Aug 21 2017, 02:54 PM

[quote name='bbrock' date='Aug 14 2017, 04:54 PM' post='2517014']
[quote name='Tom_T' post='2516993' date='Aug 14 2017, 06:05 PM']

Anyone have any pics of a reversible side marker delete? I'm having a hard time picturing anything I'd be satisfied with. I forgot to mention one of my twisted arguments for deleting. It IS reversible, you just need a hole saw and drill bit.

Lot's to think about.
[/quote]

I am gonna say it again. I lived through the side marker transition and it saved a lot of lives. If the car is driven at night they make a huge difference in visibility from right angles. Consider that you will be driving through intersections inhabited by very large cars and distracted drivers who may not even recognize a 914 as an automobile. If you only drive by day it makes less difference. I am amazed by how tough the 914s are but consider that even a Macan is twice as massive as the 914.

When I did the six conversion I cut off the motor mounts and sent them to Cary for a restoration of his. No turning back...

Posted by: bbrock Aug 21 2017, 11:46 PM

It's definitely a concern. I'm thinking of experimenting with something like https://ledconceptslighting.com/accessories-parts/led-accessories/uber-flex-led-headlight-strip-switchback-whiteamber/ mounted to the lip of the wheel well or may the rear edge of the bumper where it wraps around the side. Seems like there should be a way to use these to provide safety in a less obtrusive way than the warts.

Posted by: iamchappy Aug 22 2017, 03:09 PM

I have Euro blinkers on mine


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Posted by: bbrock Aug 22 2017, 03:45 PM

Those are cool. I looked at some variations on that theme and if I had a wide body, it would be a no-brainer. I'm hoping to avoid putting new holes in the body though. Push comes to shove, I could re-drill the original side marker holes without have to repaint. No question those markers are way better than the stock issue, and to me, they period-correct too. If Porsche had only done that, I doubt we'd ever have this wart debate.