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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ Throw out bearing failure
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 15 2019, 06:12 PM
40000 miles since 2013. My 1st tow today.....
I don't consider the time I got a Uhaul car hauler as a tow, but technically I guess it is. ALT failure that time.
Posted by: SirAndy Apr 15 2019, 06:24 PM
Horrible noise from the clutch when you (are trying to) use it ...
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 15 2019, 06:37 PM
Horrible noise from the clutch when you (are trying to) use it ...
Sounds familiar..... and for the good of the group. The noise lasts about 60 miles, then the clutch does nothing.
I guess that is, or was my problem. Is that all I should expect when I open her up? Excessive Pressure plate wear.... Isn't that the gizmo with the spring fingers?
I plan on a new seal, I think this one has been leaking since day one. Maybe just do an every-damn-thing-replacement.....
Tranny removal only? I have done that about 5 times.
Posted by: ericoneal Apr 15 2019, 10:00 PM
Sounds like this:
https://youtu.be/fC7TrgfN50k
Took two tries to get this noise to go away. Dont replace the bearing with one that the previous owner gave you in a box of stuff with the car, buy a new one. 
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 15 2019, 10:30 PM
not as good a video as yours. But this one is about 20 minutes before failure.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tTiSD_fCtic
Posted by: Mark Henry Apr 16 2019, 03:37 AM
Not saying this is the case, 40K is pretty good, but #1 reason for TOB failure is drivers who rest their foot on the clutch pedal. They press on the pedal enough that the bearing is always spinning, causing premature failure.
The cutch should be used sparingly, I produces a lot of pressure on the crank (bearing) thrust surface. I've seen two 996 engine failures from thrust bearings failure directly related to clutch overuse. Starting in neutral and even shifting to neutral and letting your foot off the clutch at stop lights is a good habit to get into.
Posted by: Spoke Apr 16 2019, 05:12 AM
Could a mis-adjusted clutch cable also lead to TOB failure? It would seem if the cable is too tight it would be the same as resting a foot on the clutch pedal.
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 16 2019, 05:16 AM
Good info Mark. I pretty much have always waited on traffic in front to move or watch the light before i engage.
About 3 weeks ago i needed to adjust the clutch. Pedal friction point was low. Even at half pedal friction point, i felt like i could hear the TO at idle and driving. But could not adjust the cable to make the whirring go away.
Then Saturday, at times, the whirring would get pretty loud while driving, even louder at shifting.
Posted by: Mark Henry Apr 16 2019, 06:18 AM
Could a mis-adjusted clutch cable also lead to TOB failure? It would seem if the cable is too tight it would be the same as resting a foot on the clutch pedal.
Yes it definitely can, the pedal must fully return to the rest position and there must be 1/2"-3/4" play.
If there's no play or the the pedal isn't returning all the way the bearing is still engaged and spinning just as fast as the engine. This also would wear on the pressure plate fingers.
Posted by: tejon007 Apr 16 2019, 04:53 PM
Not saying this is the case, 40K is pretty good, but #1 reason for TOB failure is drivers who rest their foot on the clutch pedal. They press on the pedal enough that the bearing is always spinning, causing premature failure.
The cutch should be used sparingly, I produces a lot of pressure on the crank (bearing) thrust surface. I've seen two 996 engine failures from thrust bearings failure directly related to clutch overuse. Starting in neutral and even shifting to neutral and letting your foot off the clutch at stop lights is a good habit to get into.
TOB is easier to replace than thrust bearing failure., so I agree with Mark... Easy on the clutch, especially if you have a high pressure one.
Also, this is why it's a good idea to install a double thrust bearing on the cam because of the side loads on the camshaft (buy two cam bearing sets, it's cheaper than buying a double thrust bearing cam set - they just combine two sets anyway).
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 04:36 PM
Burnt up bearing. I found a Sachs branch for 118 on FCPeuro.com. Cool thing is everythingvthey sell has a lifetime warranty. 
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 04:37 PM
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 04:39 PM
I suppose my phone takes pix that are too big. I wish 914would could just auto size every. Come facebook does it. 
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 04:42 PM
Washer under the ball pivot question.
So the washer raises the pivot point, correct?
Remind me why we add the washer. Does it add pressure? Or distance the TOB can travel?
Posted by: dlee6204 Apr 18 2019, 04:45 PM
Washer inder the ball pivot question.
So the washer raises the pivot point, correct?
Remind me why we add the washer. Does it add pressure? Or distance the TOB can travel?
To compensate if you'd had your flywheel machined down. If your flywheel hasn't been surfaced, you shouldn't need it
Posted by: porschetub Apr 18 2019, 05:05 PM
Washer inder the ball pivot question.
So the washer raises the pivot point, correct?
Remind me why we add the washer. Does it add pressure? Or distance the TOB can travel?
No you shouldn't need the washer but do replace the nylon ball cup anyway,is that a Sach's pressure plate or aftermarket...don't see the usual markings to indicate it is ?.
IMO I wouldn't use that pressure plate again as the spring fingers appear to be pretty chewed out ,most likely caused by the bearing seizing up and collapsing .
If you do replace the pressure plate only buy a Saches ZF no aftermarket ones cut the the mustard again IMO.
Good luck.
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 06:02 PM
Washer inder the ball pivot question.
So the washer raises the pivot point, correct?
Remind me why we add the washer. Does it add pressure? Or distance the TOB can travel?
To compensate if you'd had your flywheel machined down. If your flywheel hasn't been surfaced, you shouldn't need it
Plan is to buy a new PP and clutch. Clutch looks ok, but what the hell. The flywheel was machined in 2012. I figured i would take it back to Tennessee Clutch. What are the tolerances, how to measure? I wonder if TN Clutch would know or even measure. I always got there at 4 and they were all drinking Busch.
Posted by: Spoke Apr 18 2019, 07:34 PM
...Plan is to buy a new PP and clutch.
While it's opened up might as well put a new clutch in unless the existing one is brand new. Maybe also the main shaft seal into the transmission. Flywheel needle bearing too?
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 08:42 PM
...Plan is to buy a new PP and clutch.
While it's opened up might as well put a new clutch in unless the existing one is brand new. Maybe also the main shaft seal into the transmission. Flywheel needle bearing too?
Tranz main seal looks good. But a PO used j b weld. Bought an ez lok kit today to fix that.
Posted by: malcolm2 Apr 18 2019, 08:46 PM
Washer inder the ball pivot question.
So the washer raises the pivot point, correct?
Remind me why we add the washer. Does it add pressure? Or distance the TOB can travel?
No you shouldn't need the washer but do replace the nylon ball cup anyway,is that a Sach's pressure plate or aftermarket...don't see the usual markings to indicate it is ?.
IMO I wouldn't use that pressure plate again as the spring fingers appear to be pretty chewed out ,most likely caused by the bearing seizing up and collapsing .
If you do replace the pressure plate only buy a Saches ZF no aftermarket ones cut the the mustard again IMO.
Good luck.
The PP was re built locally. I am going with new. the TOB ate the fingers.
Posted by: malcolm2 May 13 2019, 04:25 PM
So many good things came out of this project.
Clutch is easier to press
Clutch seems to be operating better. Don’t have an occaisional “tuff to get in 1st” syndrome.
Hell it even seems to idle better, more consistent.
But my fav is the fact that i have been driving for 4 days and my oil drip pad is CLEAN. Changed the main seal too. 
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