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Posted by: Brando Jun 26 2005, 02:17 AM

Today I finished the installation of my 22mm swaybar. Compared to having no swaybard it was a difference of night and day. The wheels don't judder around uncontrollably on roads or the freeway. The front end is stabalized and balanced and incredibly hard to deflect. All in all the total for extra parts and the swaybar(s), this was a $210 job. Pretty good deal and now I should shave 3 or 4 seconds off my track times. There is a bit of oversteer with a bar this big, but that should go away with my stock rear bar.

My car is now fun, all over again. It is 100% Mo-Betta™ certifiable. I have to re-learn how to drive the car and re-learn the limitations of my abilities in a car that handles better. This should be awesome

And most importantly, I want to give a couple of big thank-yous to scott kline, Aaron and Thomas. Without you guys it never would have happened.

Posted by: ArtechnikA Jun 26 2005, 03:02 AM

QUOTE (Brando @ Jun 26 2005, 04:17 AM)
...There is a bit of oversteer with a bar this big...

understeer...

Posted by: SirAndy Jun 26 2005, 03:13 AM

QUOTE (ArtechnikA @ Jun 26 2005, 02:02 AM)
understeer...

Posted by: Brando Jun 26 2005, 11:17 AM

I thought...
Oversteer = when the front end turns in quicker than the rear end and you lose traction.
Understeer = when the rear end overtakes the front end and you lose traction.

It's the other way around?

Posted by: redshift Jun 26 2005, 11:19 AM

Over is when it's tail happy, and Under is when it plows.

M

Posted by: Headrage Jun 26 2005, 11:45 AM

Does adding the rear bar help correct the under steer?

Posted by: Mueller Jun 26 2005, 11:50 AM

QUOTE (Headrage @ Jun 26 2005, 10:45 AM)
Does adding the rear bar help correct the under steer?

yes.....so does changing spring rates in the rear (heavier)

Posted by: Headrage Jun 26 2005, 11:55 AM

Cool, I'm doing both...

Posted by: redshift Jun 26 2005, 11:57 AM

Heavy springs, and an adjustable rear bar.

M

Posted by: Aaron Cox Jun 26 2005, 11:57 AM

QUOTE (Headrage @ Jun 26 2005, 10:55 AM)
Cool, I'm doing both...

allan.... drive my car

23 mm front bar,
stock rear bar with 180's

Posted by: Mueller Jun 26 2005, 11:58 AM

QUOTE (Headrage @ Jun 26 2005, 10:55 AM)
Cool, I'm doing both...

it's all about balance...you cannot stiffen one end without doing the same to the other

i will say it's always safer to make the front end stiffer than the just rear....you never want to run just a rear bar and no front bar or heavy rear springs without a front bar or upgraded front torsion bars....you want the front stiffer one way or another at least even with the rear...

Posted by: lapuwali Jun 26 2005, 11:59 AM

What you've described, Brando, is basically oversteer in both cases.

Understeer is when you turn and the car keeps going straight, so you have to turn more (and slow down). Front-drivers tend to understeer badly, and most cars understeer at least some.

Oversteer is when the back starts to "come around", and you have to back off on the steering, or perhaps even steer the opposite way ("opposite lock"). Powerful rear-drive cars often oversteer off-corner under power, and tail draggers tend to oversteer in mid-corner when you go in too hot and lift off.

Posted by: Headrage Jun 26 2005, 12:30 PM

QUOTE (Aaron Cox @ Jun 26 2005, 10:57 AM)

QUOTE (Headrage @ Jun 26 2005, 10:55 AM)
Cool, I'm doing both...

allan.... drive my car

23 mm front bar,
stock rear bar with 180's

I'll end up with 23mm front, stock rear and 140 lb. springs. I wonder if the springs are gonna be stiff enough...