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Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Mar 30 2020, 08:16 PM

I was on a drive with some other folks on Sunday (don't worry; we all kept 6 feet apart) and the guy behind me tells me that when I turn hard right the car leans more than when I turn hard left. Looks like the springs/shocks/suspension needs some attention. Where do I begin?

I have never replaced or adjusted any of the suspension on this car.

For replacement parts (if I need them), what are good shocks and springs and where is a good place to get them? I'm not looking for anything fancy; the "stock" ride is fine.

Are there any techniques or fancy tools I should know about?

Thanks!

Posted by: Jamie Mar 30 2020, 08:37 PM

QUOTE(914 RZ-1 @ Mar 30 2020, 06:16 PM)

Posted by: r_towle Mar 30 2020, 08:44 PM

Typical old sports car issue.
Replace springs, shocks and torsion bars.
One person, 40 years, wears out the suspension.

Posted by: mepstein Mar 30 2020, 09:16 PM

I've purchased at least a dozen 914's and they all have worn out shocks and springs.

Posted by: bdstone914 Mar 30 2020, 09:50 PM

@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=19 RZ-1
' date='Mar 30 2020, 07:16 PM' post='2799301']
I was on a drive with some other folks on Sunday (don't worry; we all kept 6 feet apart) and the guy behind me tells me that when I turn hard right the car leans more than when I turn hard left. Looks like the springs/shocks/suspension needs some attention. Where do I begin?

I have never replaced or adjusted any of the suspension on this car.

For replacement parts (if I need them), what are good shocks and springs and where is a good place to get them? I'm not looking for anything fancy; the "stock" ride is fine.

Are there any techniques or fancy tools I should know about?

Thanks!
[/quote]

I have good used shocks. Need to test the springs. Is the car level side to side when parked?

914World.com | FS Used
and Sachs- BOGE Rear
assemblies
http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=344379

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Mar 30 2020, 10:32 PM

1. I don't think I have any rear torsion springs (referred to as "rear stabilizer" in the Haynes manual). Do the front torsion bars ("transverse control arms" in the Haynes manual) need replacing? I don't have any front stabilizers; those were from 73 on and I have a 72.

2. All I see in the Haynes manual is a "shock absorber strut". The actual shock absorber doesn't seem to have a label! It also looks like a major process to take this apart and replace it.

3. Am I correct in that the steering geometry can be altered when I take off the pressure plates at the top of the front shocks?

4. Looks like there is a special tool that is used to get the nut at the top of the front strut off?

5. Looks like I need a spring compressor for the rear springs.

Can someone confirm/clarify this for me before I decide to get into this. Thanks!

Posted by: falcor75 Mar 30 2020, 10:49 PM

5. Yes you need spring compressors, dont cheap on safety.

4. If you have a welder you can make it yourself by welding a piece of tube to the right size socket and then using the right size allen wrench to the top of the strut to keep it from turning. The "lid" of the strut can be removed if you put the strut in a vice and use a soft metal drift on the teeth of the lid.

3. Yes a wheel alignment afterwards is usually needed (its cheaper than new tires)

2. Its not that hard to take apart aslong as you have a sturdy vice and access to some tools. For new inserts either go with Bilstein or Koni, they are the proven quality brands.

1. I dont know, I dont think the torsion bars are equally susceptible to wear and fatigue as coil springs but hopefully someone that knows better can chime in.

Posted by: thelogo Mar 30 2020, 11:47 PM

You fix it by moving the drivers seat to the middle

Have you seen a ( the ) mclaren f1 ?

Your 914 is a 2180 lbs car ? It s just plaful / twitchy thats all

Posted by: roblav1 Mar 31 2020, 10:33 AM

I would corner weight every wheel before doing anything, especially the fronts first. If the rear springs are original, they're sagged by now!

Posted by: bdstone914 Mar 31 2020, 11:31 AM

@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=19 RZ-1

1. I don't think I have any rear torsion springs (referred to as "rear stabilizer" in the Haynes manual). Do the front torsion bars ("transverse control arms" in the Haynes manual) need replacing? I don't have any front stabilizers; those were from 73 on and I have a 72.

reply to 1 You only have springs and shocks in the back. You probably need to replace them. I suggest 914 Rubber 100 lb.

2. All I see in the Haynes manual is a "shock absorber strut". The actual shock absorber doesn't seem to have a label! It also looks like a major process to take this apart and replace it.

reply to 2. It is fairly easy to replace front strut inserts. You do not need to remove the three bolts on the hold down plates. Only remove the 22nm nut on the strut shaft.Bent down the retaining tab. An impact works best to remove the nut. Alternate way tis grip the big keyed washer with channel lock plyers and remove the center nut. Ususally a two person job. Can be done one side at a time. After removing the 22mm nut compress the strut and carefully pull it outside of the fender. Use a large pipe wrench to remove the strut retaining nut. Test the insert for even compression and rebound. No realignment is needed.

3. Am I correct in that the steering geometry can be altered when I take off the pressure plates at the top of the front shocks?

reply to 3. Yes but you do not need to, See above

4. Looks like there is a special tool that is used to get the nut at the top of the front strut off?

reply to 4. As stated above use an impact to remove and a big pipe wrench for the insert retaining nut.

5. Looks like I need a spring compressor for the rear springs.

relpy to 5. Yes. Local FLAPS rent them for free. You need to install the spring compressors with about 2 inches o thread extending out of the bottom so that you can uncompress the spring fully. Be careful and stay clear of the path the spring will take if the compressor slips.

Can someone confirm/clarify this for me before I decide to get into this. Thanks!
[/quote]

If you have other questions PM me for my phone number and I can walk you thru it.
You can not positivity tell if the shocks or inserts are bad without removing them. Best on car test is to go over speed bumps and see if them bottom out.


Bruce

Posted by: Mike D. Mar 31 2020, 02:59 PM

JF - has corner balance scales.
Shocks and springs in the back, shocks in the front and we can check the torsion bars settings.

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Mar 31 2020, 08:56 PM

After talking to Mike D., and reading your posts (thanks Bruce!) I think I'm confident I can do these.

Now I just need to find the parts.

My choices for the front seem to be KYB and Bilstein. I can't seem to find any Boge/Sachs. I've not heard anything good about KYB (did I get bad advice?) and Bilstein are pricey; about $200 each. Is this what I can expect to pay? That's $400 just for the front. Are there any other brands out there?

The rear shocks seem to be more readily available. These run about $156 each. The springs (100 lb) are $159/pair.

So total price is about $870. Is that right? I just want to make sure I'm getting value. If this is the cost, then fine, but I want to know my options so I thought I'd ask those who've done this before.

Posted by: porschetub Mar 31 2020, 11:08 PM

Replace the springs first you will find out what the shocks are like after that.

Posted by: Cairo94507 Apr 1 2020, 08:05 AM

KYB = "Kill Your Back". Great advise and the parts you need are readily available. Read up on this project and maybe see if one of our members is in your area to lend a hand when the time comes. Tackle the front and wrap it up and then tackle the rear to keep from getting overwhelmed. Take pictures, have a clean well lighted work space and take your time.

Posted by: Bleyseng Apr 1 2020, 08:55 AM

I thought George at AA has Boge front shocks now as anything is better than KYB.

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Apr 4 2020, 04:50 PM

For you kids following along at home, I have more info:

1. I bought rear shocks and springs. Gonna tackle that in a short while.

2. The front Boge/Sachs ones don't seem to be available anymore, just Bilstein. I'll wait until next month to get those to keep the CFO (wife) from freaking out.

3. I did the "bounce test" on all four corners. They all feel a bit soft and are not consistent.

4. I made some measurements:

a. I have 205/60 tires

b. Front axle height as defined in the Haynes manual (p. 108). Distance from hub cap center to ground is 295.5 mm on driver's side and 299 mm on passenger side. Distance from torsion bar adjuster lever to ground is 135.5 mm (driver)/133 mm (passenger).

The difference i supposed to be 90 mm +/- 5 mm. Do the math and you'll get 160.5 mm (driver)/166 mm (passenger). Seems my car has been lowered or the springs are really saggy.

c. I also measured from the ground to the bottom of the wheel well as shown in the sketch. The back is pretty consistent (different by 1 mm), but the fronts are different from each other by 25 mm.
I didn't think the difference in the front an back dimensions were an issue. In other words, do all 4 dimensions need to be the same?


What do I need to do to fix/adjust this? I am thinking I will replace the rear springs and shocks and see what happens. Then replace the front strut inserts and see what effect that has, then go from there. Thoughts?

Posted by: Jamie Apr 4 2020, 08:50 PM

QUOTE(914 RZ-1 @ Apr 4 2020, 02:50 PM)

For you kids following along at home, I have more info:

1. I bought rear shocks and springs. Gonna tackle that in a short while.

2. The front Boge/Sachs ones don't seem to be available anymore, just Bilstein. I'll wait until next month to get those to keep the CFO (wife) from freaking out.

3. I did the "bounce test" on all four corners. They all feel a bit soft and are not consistent.

4. I made some measurements:

a. I have 205/60 tires

b. Front axle height as defined in the Haynes manual (p. 108). Distance from hub cap center to ground is 295.5 mm on driver's side and 299 mm on passenger side. Distance from torsion bar adjuster lever to ground is 135.5 mm (driver)/133 mm (passenger).

The difference i supposed to be 90 mm +/- 5 mm. Do the math and you'll get 160.5 mm (driver)/166 mm (passenger). Seems my car has been lowered or the springs are really saggy.

c. I also measured from the ground to the bottom of the wheel well as shown in the sketch. The back is pretty consistent (different by 1 mm), but the fronts are different from each other by 25 mm.
I didn't think the difference in the front an back dimensions were an issue. In other words, do all 4 dimensions need to be the same?


What do I need to do to fix/adjust this? I am thinking I will replace the rear springs and shocks and see what happens. Then replace the front strut inserts and see what effect that has, then go from there. Thoughts?

Posted by: bkrantz Apr 4 2020, 09:06 PM

QUOTE(Jamie @ Apr 4 2020, 08:50 PM)

Posted by: roblav1 Apr 4 2020, 10:22 PM

I suspect someone lowered the car without doing it properly. Cornerweights should have been taken, with ARBs disconnected, to match left to right. Then set camber, check caster, then do toe. Otherwise, the car will handle unpredictably and tires will wear quickly.

QUOTE(914 RZ-1 @ Apr 4 2020, 06:50 PM)

For you kids following along at home, I have more info:

1. I bought rear shocks and springs. Gonna tackle that in a short while.

2. The front Boge/Sachs ones don't seem to be available anymore, just Bilstein. I'll wait until next month to get those to keep the CFO (wife) from freaking out.

3. I did the "bounce test" on all four corners. They all feel a bit soft and are not consistent.

4. I made some measurements:

a. I have 205/60 tires

b. Front axle height as defined in the Haynes manual (p. 108). Distance from hub cap center to ground is 295.5 mm on driver's side and 299 mm on passenger side. Distance from torsion bar adjuster lever to ground is 135.5 mm (driver)/133 mm (passenger).

The difference i supposed to be 90 mm +/- 5 mm. Do the math and you'll get 160.5 mm (driver)/166 mm (passenger). Seems my car has been lowered or the springs are really saggy.

c. I also measured from the ground to the bottom of the wheel well as shown in the sketch. The back is pretty consistent (different by 1 mm), but the fronts are different from each other by 25 mm.
I didn't think the difference in the front an back dimensions were an issue. In other words, do all 4 dimensions need to be the same?


What do I need to do to fix/adjust this? I am thinking I will replace the rear springs and shocks and see what happens. Then replace the front strut inserts and see what effect that has, then go from there. Thoughts?

Posted by: ndfrigi Apr 4 2020, 10:40 PM

For sure you can replace the rear shocks in an hour or Two as long you have spring compresser. Not really hard. And if the shocks is bad, after removal from the spring, you will notice the shock will not go up after pushing it in. Front a little tricky when you remove the insert from the strut but doable for 1 man job also.

Front height adjustment just a bolt one each side.

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Apr 5 2020, 12:48 PM

QUOTE(bkrantz @ Apr 4 2020, 08:06 PM)

QUOTE(Jamie @ Apr 4 2020, 08:50 PM)

Original saggy rear springs almost always need #100 replacements, and variation in front may be due to different torsion bar adjustments.

Or to opening geometry if a fender has ever been repaired or replaced.

Posted by: 914Toy Apr 5 2020, 01:13 PM

Are these measurements with your weight in the drivers seat?

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Apr 5 2020, 10:52 PM

QUOTE(914Toy @ Apr 5 2020, 12:13 PM)

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Apr 5 2020, 10:55 PM

I replaced the original back springs with 100 lb ones from Pelican and Koni shocks with Bilsteins. The car rides about 58 mm higher in back now. No test drive yet; it's late and supposed to rain.

Posted by: ndfrigi Apr 5 2020, 11:02 PM

I believed the basic height is to follow the side body line aligned to the center wheel. But most now they want the front lower than the center wheel. Sorry my white marker line is not perfect.

Posted by: mepstein Apr 6 2020, 07:29 AM

QUOTE(914 RZ-1 @ Apr 6 2020, 12:55 AM)

Posted by: 914 RZ-1 Apr 7 2020, 12:41 PM

QUOTE(ndfrigi @ Apr 5 2020, 10:02 PM)

I believed the basic height is to follow the side body line aligned to the center wheel. But most now they want the front lower than the center wheel. Sorry my white marker line is not perfect.