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Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 11:19 AM

Hey guys,

I posted this in my build thread, but I figured I might get some info here.

This is what is happening:
Car shifts into (I believe) every gear while the car is off. Clutch feels like it is engaging fine.
When I turn the car on, the clutch has no affect. Pretty gnarly grind sound if you move towards a gear.

The set up:
-Motor recently installed, fresh rebuild. I used my old trans, old clutch and old flywheel.
All matched originally.
-Fly wheel is true and the clutch has a lot of meat, (9.2mm, iirc)
-Clutch was never separated from the pressure plate.
-Fresh flush and trans fluid

What I've done so far:
-Read the Haynes set up, followed suit.

Chapter 5 faults calls this "Clutch Spring or Drag"
1.Too much pedal freeplay (several adjustments)
2. Splines on main shaft rusty (they are not)
3. Friction plate broken (it is not)
4. Pilot bearing worn maybe

-Adjusted cable end play. (3/4" EP, then more until it was a stiff feel.
-All new shift bushings
-Re aligned shifter. To what i THINK is in each gear. Following Dr. evils specs.


I have never driven a tail shift trans yet, so I am not used to the feel.


Any tips on anything else to check before I pull the trans and check things out inside. It was clean though, and I am pretty sure everything was aligned well and in the splines. It slid right onto the main shaft like butter.

If my throw-out bearing was too worn, I am pretty sure it would be telling me loud and clear.


Thanks! Happy Friday!




(I hope to receive the 2020 Most Questions Asked award this year )

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 4 2020, 11:30 AM

No chance the disc got flipped ?

Posted by: wndsrfr Dec 4 2020, 11:39 AM

Tighten the cable until you can just barely depress it with your hand grip at the spot between the pulley and the cable end....see if that releases the clutch... that's a starting point. After that, drive it some and then do final adjustment to engage at 25% from the floor and still have a bit of travel at the top ..

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 11:39 AM

I believe the clutch disc only goes on the pressure plate one way, could be mistaken.

If not, I suppose it could be wrong the whole time? I've never driven the car. So it may have never worked, haha.
I could provide a photo of the clutch on the plate, if someone could confirm.


Here it is:

Posted by: mb911 Dec 4 2020, 11:53 AM

I find the cable length to be a bit long.. I would suggest tightening a bit more before anything else.. Thats what I had to do

Posted by: mlindner Dec 4 2020, 11:54 AM

Any chance throw-out bearing is on backwards on fork.

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 12:09 PM

Here is a video of the actuation - for what it is worth. Not sure if this will help show the travel.

Eitherway, maybe helpful for someone who has not seen how it functions.

https://imgur.com/gallery/5KRPjyG


Here is a picture of the throw-out bearing from last year, before I cleaned it. If this helps determine if it is backwards.




I am glad I take photos of all this crap.

(<<< except this is not me)

Posted by: 914e Dec 4 2020, 12:19 PM

Can you crank the car over with it in gear and the clutch pushed in? You might want to disable spark, in case it would decide to start and you can't stop it.

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 12:25 PM

Yes, The car lurches forward or reverse if it is in gear when I crank it over.

Posted by: jd74914 Dec 4 2020, 12:43 PM

The clutch could be stuck to the pressure plate and not allowing disengagement. I've had this happen before when I did the same thing you did, reinstall without taking everything apart.

Do you have a driveway long enough to try breaking it free with starter and brakes?

Posted by: sixnotfour Dec 4 2020, 12:48 PM

Did the clutch arm hit the trans case ?? May be a pivot stud length issue, Was the flywheel resurfaced ?

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 01:06 PM

I don't think it is hitting the case, I'll have the old lady clutch in, while I take a peek under.

I do have a new cable I could try, if this is a stretching issue on the cable.
The fly wheel was not resurfaced, my machine had the pair (clutch and wheel) and said they are a match, and in great shape, so there is not a need to resurface.





Try to cut one corner and get shafted, ha.

My driveway would probably be long enough, I've barely really rolled it yet. This is a good idea. How would you recommend this, put it in first, start the car, let her fly and try to break it free?

Posted by: GregAmy Dec 4 2020, 01:34 PM

A number of times I thought I had WAG'd the clutch cable tension correclt,y only to find that I was nowhere close.

Keep tightening, see what happens. Won't hurt anything to over-tighten in the garage, just don't hammer the clutch pedal to the floor.

Posted by: fixer34 Dec 4 2020, 04:21 PM

I think the key is this statement in the original post.

"Clutch was never separated from the pressure plate."

If the pressure plate is removed, the clutch disc will fall out. It does not attach to the pressure plate. I think one of his pictures also showed the disc firmly 'stuck' to it.

Pull the engine or trans, remove the pressure plate and separate the disc.

Posted by: mjrrti Dec 4 2020, 05:06 PM

I have heard that some aftermarket cables are up to an inch too long. If your cable is too long and you are out of threads to adjust you may need some spacers like a stack of flat washers or a short piece of steel tubing between the clutch arm and adjust nut to gain a little more adjustment. In your video it is hard to tell but I think you have a little more room for fork travel before it hits the tranny case. If you still have more threads tighten it up a little, jack up the right rear tire and have someone push the pedal to the floor while in gear and see if you can spin the wheel. You could always use the axle nut and a socket and big breaker bar with a length of pipe for extra leverage and apply a lot of torque to it to see if the clutch is stuck. My guess is you just need more adjustment.

Posted by: ndfrigi Dec 4 2020, 05:15 PM

Hope just a minor fix.

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 4 2020, 06:04 PM

Any odd noises in the tunnel when pushing the clutch to the floor ?
.........possible detached guide tube ?

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 4 2020, 06:07 PM

If you try to free the disc while driving keep the pedal on the floor as you jerk on and off the gas pedal.
Plan a path around the neighborhood before hand. BTDT

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 4 2020, 08:06 PM

No noises. Guide tube brazing is is great shape. When I replaced the floors I noticed that. - for the heck of it I even strengthened it with some new weld so I won’t have to deal with it ever.

I 100% thought the clutch attached the the pressure plate. I bet this is my problem!

I will try to start it in first tomorrow and break it free ... see if it gets me anywhere.


If not I feel that I will be pulling the transmission and prying the clutch off.

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 4 2020, 08:56 PM

Before removing the trans remove the starter.
Prop the pedal against the floor. Rotate the flywheel so that you can reach
through spaces in the pressure plate to push or pull on the disc.
Give it a try.
Removing the starter first is not wasted effort in any event.
Good luck.
Rory

Posted by: iankarr Dec 5 2020, 07:24 AM

Is it possibled your clutch tube has broken free? Are you able to tighten the cable and have it stay tight?

Posted by: JOEPROPER Dec 5 2020, 07:48 AM

Make sure you exhaust every possible way to disengage the clutch. You may need to use a pry bar against the clutch fork to make sure the clutch is disengaged. Be careful!!

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 5 2020, 09:39 AM

Yes, the second sentence here is probably the key
The PP and disc were 'attached' ? ....never seperated ?
and the trans slid right on............no clutch alignment tool ? or tool slid right in ?
the disc is likely 'bonded' to the PP

Posted by: Steve Dec 5 2020, 11:01 AM

It definitely sounds like a clutch problem. If you do take it apart, check the part numbers on the disk and pressure plate. Some clown sold me mismatched parts and I had the same problem. 911T/914-4 2.0 pressure plate and 911S disk.

Posted by: mlindner Dec 5 2020, 11:59 AM

Borrow a large pipe bar clamp, clamp from fork to back of clutch cable wheel housing. screw clamp to pull fork back releasing pressure plate to disk.

Posted by: jaredmcginness Dec 5 2020, 03:50 PM

Rory, you glorious SOB! @http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=5176 I followed this. Pulled starter, pry bar to turn fly wheel, inserted bar into each of the 6 different spaces to evenly apply pressure against the clutch.

On the 6th pry, the clutch broke free.

All in all this took about 20 minutes. I realigned the shifter. Put it on the ground and it goes into every gear like it has been waiting to!

You guys are the best! Thanks for all this advice!!!

Posted by: rgalla9146 Dec 5 2020, 05:15 PM

Glorious SOB is correct but credit goes to all who provided input.
Between your last name, my first name and an Irish green car how could we miss ?
Great result.

Posted by: type2man Dec 5 2020, 06:43 PM

I have had this issue a few times. Here is what I do. I start the car in first gear with the clutch pressed and then rev it a few times and it breaks free.