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Posted by: dr914@autoatlanta.com Sep 28 2022, 08:10 AM

LOL

Posted by: Garland Sep 28 2022, 08:23 AM

Posted by: Shivers Sep 28 2022, 08:33 AM

"The clutch and 5 speed transmission shifts smoothly. There is a lock out on gears 4/5 (it was fine 6 years ago when tires were fitted)."

"Riding on Fuchs but have OEM Mahle (4-bolt) cast aluminum wheels included in the sale "

Posted by: NARP74 Sep 28 2022, 08:45 AM

Share a link.

Posted by: bbrock Sep 28 2022, 08:56 AM

https://www.ebay.com/itm/155179988858?hash=item242172b77a:g:QP0AAOSwzXxjMeQH&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoCG44zqbO%2Fgg%2B%2BUDkJuKMQegt%2FqxcXiSGCtG7BtpuJNGntNJa2lxmiJ3knD%2BoKXbpIq3Wqs78nihHmV4nyMy%2F2i%2Bfo3vNxPCGSvZnvMQh%2B1SAACJohZpwxIP8ebWgmBB6x327FPZM7Z4fYNVcEZ%2BCNgfju7TQ884U426GSQ9rVWR5lTyIzJPXSW2XnAeasI5MOUZpqMRTYQJJfha6zbDz84%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5rhrsnwYA

It's been a HARD 20k miles

Posted by: Unobtanium-inc Sep 28 2022, 09:44 AM

I always wonder why people think showing obscure pics like the turn signal arm or the ashtray is important, when they neglect to show more than 1 pic of the outside of the car, and no pics of the underside or usual rust areas.
If it fails to sell at a decent price, it's the presentation that is to blame.

Posted by: JeffBowlsby Sep 28 2022, 10:54 AM

Someone should go put eyes on this car before forming too many armchair opinions. It could actually be the low mileage advertised. Looks like it could clean up nicely. Really bad photo presentation from the seller, doubt he knows these cars. Look at how clean the dashknob inserts are.

I have correspondence from the owner in 2011 that he had just inherited the car which had been in storage for 25 years and he noted very minor rust conditions at the time. Car was in HI at the time, must have come across the pond since then.

Also have correspondence from PCNA confirming that the car is an LE, despite the Targa vinyl, but I have no record of a COA.

Maybe an original LE spoiler? And a vintage photo from when it was in the islands.


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Posted by: scottsilvertt Sep 28 2022, 10:59 AM

I have a low mileage black 74. 2.0
Sure, the LE is not perfectly preserved, but I can really appreciate most of those detail shots. There seems to be very little wear.
I would rather have a car like this, than one that was restored.

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Sep 28 2022, 11:11 AM

Two things are certain, it needs a real cleaning and to be rephotographed

Posted by: bbrock Sep 28 2022, 12:00 PM

I would agree except how does one explain that engine? FI stripped and replaced by Webers, rust everywhere. Red overspray that looks suspiciously like the apparent rattle can treatment the Mahles received. All this in the first 20K miles

I'll repeat, if it is 20K original miles, those were some hard miles. I think it is a nice car and might very well have high value, I'm just skeptical of the low miles. Especially when someone not familiar with these cars might not notice that they roll over at 100k.

Posted by: Ravennut Sep 28 2022, 12:28 PM

How many of the bumblebees had vinyl/ trim on the sail panels? Kind of a weird thing to add to an authentic bumblebee

Posted by: Superhawk996 Sep 28 2022, 12:40 PM

Personally, I’m tired of seeing 5 digit ODOs represented as original miles “shown”

At what point does it become fair game to buy such an low miles car and then turn around and sue for misrepresentation and/or title fraud if signed off at 20k original miles? Maybe a way to get the car and a 50% refund

Obviously I’m being sarcastic but at some point doesn’t the seller bear some liability? I know, I know, buyer beware. It just seems like there is always someone trying to scam via 5 digit odo.

Posted by: Jack Standz Sep 28 2022, 01:24 PM

If there was any available space in the garage, the car was closer, and I had $, it'd be worth a look before writing it off as a joke. It could be a "diamond in the rough" (or a turd).

It could be someone with limited experience or knowledge about 914s. For sure it's not wearing Fuchs as described in the listing (at least in the photos shown), not even 2 liter Fuchs. That and other signs leads me to think this might just be an inexperienced owner/seller.

Posted by: JeffBowlsby Sep 28 2022, 01:24 PM

The carbs are easy to explain. Car sits for years does not start. Someone unfamiliar with the FI bolts on carbs as a quick fix. Reversible.

No real LEs had targa vinyl originally, but some owners added it later.

What red overspray? i dont see any. Just the rattle can on the wheels

Posted by: 930cabman Sep 28 2022, 01:56 PM

It's also been close to a half century

Posted by: porschetub Sep 28 2022, 02:55 PM

why would someone try to present a car for the market as dirty as this one is ??,IMO tends to make people suspect of car and shows the seller gives a rats ass about how it looks .
I have sold SO many cars that looked better than when I owned them ,never has one buyer commented on presentation and for that reason I have always achieved close to my asking price or more than reserve with an auction.
Just a lazy seller really.

Posted by: bbrock Sep 28 2022, 03:21 PM

What's the red stuff here?


and the engine looks awfully rough for a car stored in a carport since 1987.

Again, I do not think this car is a joke and and not accusing the seller of anything shady. Just someone who isn't experienced with 914s which makes me skeptical about the mileage is all. Too many things that have me scratching my head wondering why someone would do these things to a 20K mile car in great condition. I would be happy to be wrong. Regardless, I'd for sure be taking a closer look if I were in the market. There is real potential there.

Posted by: JeffBowlsby Sep 28 2022, 03:36 PM

I saw that...not trying to justify the photo if it is indeed red paint, but its possible it could just be the lighting maybe a red tarp or light reflecting off somethoing red nearby. The red color tint is not on the overall engine photo.




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Posted by: bbrock Sep 28 2022, 03:45 PM

I wondered about that too. Could be. The timing cover looks the most paint like but agree it isn't noticeable in the wider shot.

Posted by: infraredcalvin Sep 28 2022, 04:50 PM

HI is HARD on cars, the fact that the battery tray isn't rusted out is amazing.

That red stuff almost looks like it could be the anti-corrosion crap sprayed on battery terminals... (i still have some on my 930 from a careless directional squirt after blowing up my battery with a bad voltage regulator)

I'm with Blowsby, this one could turn out to be a nice driver/survivor once polished out... although the yellow looks suspiciously rattlecan color - could just be the camera.

Posted by: rgalla9146 Sep 28 2022, 06:49 PM

I see nothing that says the car or the price is a joke.
The presentation is short on facts and the pics are not sufficent for sure.
Correspondence and a visit might make this a good deal.
If it has an OE front spoiler thats 2Gs right there.
People are paying 20 grand for silver 2.0s

Posted by: mepstein Sep 28 2022, 07:22 PM

Every BAT ad has the same guarded words. As shown, as stated, seller reports, blah blah blah. Like the guy who “allegedly” robs the bank in front of 20 witnesses and writes the demand on the back of his driver license.

On the other hand, when a buyer buys a car, sight unseen, because the seller said it’s a rust free car….well, you know.

Posted by: wonkipop Sep 29 2022, 04:40 AM

if i lived anywhere near townsend washington i'd be driving over to look at that car.

i'm with mr. b on it. its more than worth setting eyeballs on.

but since i live in north antarctica i can just offer "cheap" comment.
but i think it might be close to the real deal in some respects.
given half a century has passed since it was made.

Posted by: 914werke Sep 29 2022, 08:34 AM

We have members IN & around Port Townsend.

Posted by: dr914@autoatlanta.com Sep 29 2022, 09:05 AM

you are being WAY too kind about this car Jeff (as you are usually always too kind!!!)

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Sep 29 2022, 09:16 AM

Holy are they really that expensive?

Posted by: KELTY360 Sep 29 2022, 11:00 AM

I live in Pt Townsend and have sent a message to the seller to see if I can take a look.

Posted by: scottsilvertt Sep 29 2022, 12:22 PM

Kelty,
If you can, take many more photos.
I’m intrigued by historical black 1974 & also LE photos.
Scott.

And, in a few places, it seems like marathon blue metallic under the black.
As seen in these photos.

Posted by: burton73 Sep 29 2022, 12:59 PM

My guess is that is por-15 in silver. Look at the brush stroke edge. Yes someone needs to put eyes on this car. I think this is a factory Bk car. Marathon blue metallic is my favorite color by the way

Bob B

Posted by: JamesM Sep 29 2022, 03:07 PM

I would guess 120k as well, but to Jeffs point, the interior looks pretty clean. Pulling of the FI for minor issues was common back in the day. based on the engine number of my LE and the engine number on this one I would assume the engine case to be original to the car, ie numbers matching.

The sail vinyl is odd but i am starting to suspect that not all bees rolled off the line exactly the same or that dealers made some mods before selling them.

For a 914, yeah it needs some cleanup, but for a bumblebee that might sell for 50k+ once sorted, it seems like a solid place to start.

Posted by: JamesM Sep 29 2022, 03:10 PM

Who knows, haven't seen one for sale in a long time.

If you had one for sale though I suspect you would have a bidding war on it in short order.

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 3 2022, 08:55 AM

Met up with Marc to look at this over the weekend. I do believe the 20k mileage claim is correct.

Most of the 914 is unmolested, the carb conversion being the main unoriginal part.

LF fender is a repaint, there is a little bit of bent metal around the left headlight bucket. Very minor.

Front spoiler is true LE.

It does run and drive, carbs need cleaned. Didn't smoke or smell. Suspension was nice and tight, no rattles or squeaks.

Marc took some pictures and might post them here.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 3 2022, 08:39 PM

The car is as described in the auction description. Dan and his much better half, Michelle, flew over to PT to check out the car with me. IMO it's sits on the fulcrum between preservation and restoration. The front of the car and LF fender are the most challenged cosmetically with some areas definitely needing respray. Beyond that a talented detailer may be able to preserve it's survivor status. From the fuel log, I'm convinced the mileage claim is accurate.

I took a few pics to highlight some areas. I did not extensively photograph the whole car.

Front end:






Mileage log:






Mahles:


Misc.:






Thanks to Dan and Michelle for coming over to lend additional eyes to the car.


In short, this appears to be an honest car that would be a satisfying project for an LE aficionado. Good luck to the winner.

Posted by: JeffBowlsby Oct 3 2022, 09:29 PM

Any engine bay, hell hole, rear trunk, Dr side long photos?

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 3 2022, 10:27 PM

No engine bay pic that shows more than in auction listing, same with rear trunk. Dan brought his horoscope to look at hell hole - it was solid with light surface rust. No pics of longs but jack receivers were clean and solid. Original rivets still in place on rockers.

Posted by: wonkipop Oct 4 2022, 02:01 AM

original paint (or mostly) and original drop out decals.
not too many of those.

def worth preservation rather than "restoration" .
for cosmetic items.
in a funny way the carb conversion is sort of legit, as a time piece and as an "in-era" mod?

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 4 2022, 10:00 AM

Marc and I kicked around ideas what someone might do with the car. Leaving most of it as preservation, maybe fixing the front fender and headlight covers.

Or do you take the whole thing apart for paint and remove the sail vinyl?

The interior is in amazing shape. Very dirty, I couldn't find a crack or popped seam anywhere. A solid detailing would go a long way on this 914.

That said, it's a project.

I didn't see any dirt piled up around jackstand posts. Ran a borescope as far as I could down the pass long. Everything looked very solid

Fun trip and good to see Marc.

Posted by: scallyk9 Oct 6 2022, 08:08 PM

eBay bidding ended early this evening at around 6:30 PDT and listing says "Sold" with a final bid of $21,000.00 and only 4 bids made. Did anyone on this forum manage to win it at a great price?

Correction: $20,100.00 Thanks, Root Werks.

Posted by: kerensky Oct 7 2022, 08:03 AM

Since we had a couple of members look it over, perhaps a quick message to the seller giving them the forum information to pass along to the new owner would be appropriate.

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 7 2022, 09:58 AM

I think it sold for $20,100.

Yes, would be curious myself to know if SOMEONE from here bought it.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2022, 10:30 AM

Well, it looks like I'm the lucky winner...somewhat accidentally. In the last hour of the auction I put in a minimum bid just to throw my hat in the ring and see what action there was. Turned out nobody had set a higher automatic bid and I was the winner!
Next Tuesday the seller is flying in from Hawaii and we'll complete the deal. There are a lot of issues with this car and questions to be answered but it has lots of strong points also. Not really sure what path I'll take on this rare piece but it will be an adventure. I'll start another thread to document what I discover as the 'bee is resurrected.

Posted by: bbrock Oct 9 2022, 10:39 AM

Woohoo! That's awesome Marc!

Posted by: Jett Oct 9 2022, 11:00 AM

That’s great!

Rich is about to start helping me with ours, but a lot more miles

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2022, 11:03 AM

I'll be talking to him soon myself.

Posted by: 914werke Oct 9 2022, 12:48 PM

...

Posted by: Jett Oct 9 2022, 01:08 PM

just more work for you !

Posted by: Beach914 Oct 9 2022, 01:45 PM

Congrats! Welcome to the group. Looking forward to seeing what you discover as you restore the car.

Posted by: scallyk9 Oct 9 2022, 02:13 PM

Congratulations! And another Pacific Northwest Bumble Bee stays in the PNW!

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2022, 02:35 PM

I don’t expect to restore it. I think it will be more along the lines of a resurrection. There is so much original/survivor about it that I don’t want to disturb. A lot will depend on how the cosmetics come out after some detailing.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 9 2022, 02:38 PM

It’s actually a Hawaiian ‘Bee. It only arrived in the PNW about two weeks ago.

Posted by: 930cabman Oct 10 2022, 04:53 AM

Congrats

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 10 2022, 09:25 AM

This will be neat to see what Marc can do for this LE. Excited to see how the interior looks after a bit of elbow grease.

Posted by: TonyA Oct 10 2022, 09:41 AM

Good luck and welcome to the LE world. It was tempting to bid but I held off, having three would have been to much at the moment.

Posted by: 930cabman Oct 11 2022, 12:13 PM

many of us have a life outside of the world of 914, it appears she fell into good hands

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 11 2022, 08:50 PM

The deal is done and I drive the 'Bee home tomorrow (fingers crossed).

Posted by: Jett Oct 12 2022, 12:06 AM

That’s great!

Please let me know if you end up driving to the Seattle area… would love to see the car.

Cheers

Posted by: jhynesrockmtn Oct 12 2022, 08:53 AM

Congrats on the purchase! I bought mine somewhat accidentally as well. After getting my hands on it and talking to some former owners and the guy who restored it a million years ago I'm quite pleased. It will interesting to see what you find and end up doing to it. I hope to meet other LE owners in the PNW at some point. Shout out to the folks here who engaged with the seller and took a look at the car!

Posted by: Root_Werks Oct 12 2022, 09:18 AM

Looks like I need to take the 914-6 on a ferry ride for a visit.

Posted by: KELTY360 Oct 12 2022, 01:40 PM

I've got a guest room if you want to extend your stay.