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Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 17 2023, 09:03 AM

About 18ish months ago I bought into a new engine program Eric and PMB were starting up. If you have seen me in person I've probably talked your ear off about it. Sorry about that, I've been pretty excited.

Mine is No2 off their line, and its crated up in Utah waiting for the shipper to pick it up.

So its really real time here in Dallastown, and I've started getting my 2056 ready to come out.

The new engine!



I *think* (and could be wrong) that Eric also used my motor as the promotional model for Facebook and his Web storefront - though that could have been Risdal's engine which was right behind mine.

Eric and Larry did a lot of testing on the #1 engine in Jim's car, got a lot of driving data at Red Rocks last fall, and then had to wait on components to come in that resulted from that real world testing.

My engine was crated last week. I asked Eric to include some other things (including his new brake lines and new pads), paid the final invoice for parts and shipping and the engine will hopefully be in my garage next week!

@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=27
@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=1110

Posted by: Craigers17 Mar 17 2023, 09:28 AM

That's a thing of beauty! Any dyno #'s available?

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 17 2023, 09:29 AM

Last night I started working on unhooking all the stuff that connects the engine to the car.


914 went up on the quickjacks. I have a lift in the other bay, but as you can see my Westy is taking that spot right now for its re-wiring job. The quickjacks will work fine for this.

I took off the 1.8 airbox, and all the MS2 EFI stuff that had been attached to the engine bay of the car. The airbox and it supports came out and got shelved, but the EFI parts just got layed on top of the engine and will drop out with the engine.

My current engine uses stock fuel runners. Do they need to come out before I drop the engine? I don't recall if I put those on once the engine was in the car or not.

Under the car I only had time to pull the heat exchangers off. Some of you may remember my exhaust issues last year that ended up with me breaking an exhaust stud about 1mm into the head. Ahh, good times. After I fixed that, there was still an exhaust leak. I figured I had cracked the exchanger just inside the heater jacket (where they are super prone to cracks anyway. Well, I was partially right. I HAD cracked the exchanger, just not where I thought.




That was the same ear as the broken stud. I don't remember it looking like that when I put the heat exchanger back on last spring, but it had to have started there and probably opened up when I torqued the heat exchangers back onto to the car. Amusingly once the car warmed up that big crack would close up and the leak would become inaudible. I had damn near torn the entire ear off! But the cracked primary was small enough that it would close up when it got hot. I have a new (used good) set of SSIs to go on, but these might be work getting fixed.

That's as far as I got last night before I got called in to help make pirogues and then grill up dinner for the family. If things go to plan I'll either have the engine out tonight or will be damn close to having that done. Goal is to have the car driving again by April 1.

Zach

Posted by: Cairo94507 Mar 17 2023, 09:29 AM

Wow! Very exciting news. What are the build specs? I know you can't wait to get that baby in and fired-up. Looking forward to seeing install photos and maybe even a video of the first fire-up in the car.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 17 2023, 09:33 AM

Aside from the engine swap, that other tasks to be done include mounting new tires, new SS brakelines from PMB, new porterfiled pads, new brake fluid, and hopefully not needing new rotors and bearings - as that will blow my time budget.

Zach

Posted by: 930cabman Mar 17 2023, 09:42 AM

Looks great, keep us informed of the progress and engine specs

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 17 2023, 09:44 AM

QUOTE(Craigers17 @ Mar 17 2023, 11:28 AM)

That's a thing of beauty! Any dyno #'s available?

Posted by: StratPlayer Mar 17 2023, 10:22 AM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 17 2023, 09:44 AM)

QUOTE(Craigers17 @ Mar 17 2023, 11:28 AM)

That's a thing of beauty! Any dyno #'s available?

Eric does not currently have an engine dyno, but that is the question we are all asking. The estimate is about 160, but we don't have real numbers. Jim's butt dyno rated the No1 engine as "Very Fun" at RRC.

QUOTE

Wow! Very exciting news. What are the build specs? I know you can't wait to get that baby in and fired-up. Looking forward to seeing install photos and maybe even a video of the first fire-up in the car

2258 CC, full fuel electronic fuel injection and spark. At one point I knew what cam was getting used, but I don't recall now, and I don't want to inadvertently give out Eric's secrets (thought I'm pretty damn positive he does not care). Eric is tagged and I'm sure he will chime in.

Zach

Posted by: 914werke Mar 17 2023, 10:26 AM

What is that shroud made out of?

Posted by: Dion Mar 17 2023, 10:30 AM

Congratulations Zach. Look forward to seeing this and running around PA!

Posted by: NARP74 Mar 17 2023, 11:39 AM

QUOTE(914werke @ Mar 17 2023, 10:26 AM)

Posted by: Superhawk996 Mar 17 2023, 11:42 AM

Sure looks nice!

You going to dyno it on Chassis dyno?

Posted by: Mueller Mar 17 2023, 11:54 AM

Wow, work of art...enjoy!

Posted by: nditiz1 Mar 17 2023, 12:04 PM

Looks excellent Zack, waiting in anticipation for the first fire up. Did Eric post up the numbers from the #1 test engine? Curious what it was pumping out.

Posted by: jim_hoyland Mar 17 2023, 12:35 PM

Looks great ! The PMB upgrade is a giant step up for the ‘4s

Posted by: rhodyguy Mar 17 2023, 01:33 PM

I think the stock tin is still used.

Posted by: NARP74 Mar 17 2023, 02:12 PM

QUOTE(rhodyguy @ Mar 17 2023, 01:33 PM)

Posted by: echocanyons Mar 17 2023, 02:49 PM

This engine is pretty incredible, my son has the first one and seat of the pants feels at least 150hp. The EFI and feel of this engine is hands down the finest air cooled 4 cylinder option that exists for the 914.

The thought and build that went into this whole project by PMB is representative of the next level work that they do for 914s.




Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: Craigers17 Mar 17 2023, 03:36 PM

Posted by: burton73 Mar 17 2023, 04:35 PM

Very excited for you guys to get these engines in your cars, it takes time but it will be well worth it.


Best Bob B

Posted by: mlindner Mar 18 2023, 08:56 AM

What a great new service to the 914 community. That engine looks sweet. Mark

Posted by: OrangeBones Mar 18 2023, 09:19 AM

Congrats - Can’t wait to see it at Carlisle.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 19 2023, 06:27 PM

Bit of a hiccup as I spent 12 hours Friday helping a friend who I initially thought had just attempted suicide. Cancer patient. Several setbacks over 2 years. Fully disabled and fairly crippled by the disease. When I got there I was assured this was not suicide, but help was still needed. Talked her down for a bit, got her dog to a kennel and got her to the ER. Stayed there to make sure she talked to the crisis counselors and learned about a program to get people talking with someone immediately and not the 4-8 months it usually takes.

When I got home at near 11pm Friday night I was physically and emotionally zapped, and pretty much did nothing Saturday. But today I was able to get some work done.

In the 2 hours I was able to work I got the shifter bar out, grounds off, axle bolts out, fuel lines separated, throttle unhooked, Speedo unhooked. At this point I have to dump the engine oil, and remove the AN fittings for the remote oil cooler, and pull the clutch cable off. Then it should be ready to drop, maybe tomorrow or Tuesday depending on my workload.

New engine could get here as early as Friday, but could take till the end of the month to show up. I have most of the things I need but realized today I need 2 new cone screws for the shifter bar when it goes back in.

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 19 2023, 06:33 PM

QUOTE(echocanyons @ Mar 17 2023, 04:49 PM)

Posted by: mate914 Mar 19 2023, 07:10 PM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 19 2023, 08:27 PM)

Posted by: infraredcalvin Mar 19 2023, 07:52 PM

Sorry to hear about your friend, cancer sucks!

As for your motor, I’ve been telling my friends that the 914 should’ve come stock with 150 horses at the wheels, they are exponentially more fun with the right tires and brakes to go with!

Posted by: jaredmcginness Mar 20 2023, 05:44 AM

Looks beautiful!

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 23 2023, 07:54 AM

The old engine is out.

I have to say I'm not 100% sold on the Quickjacks for dropping an engine. I needed about 3 inches more clearance then I had to get everything out cleanly. I made it work by angling the high spot so it cam out via the tail pipe cut out in the rear valence. I'll add some taller blocks when its time for the engine to go back in and it will be fine, but its kind of a PITA. Still better then jack stands, but I wish I had moved the Bus out of the way of my 2 post lift.


Engine and injection is out and resting on my Tangerine engine lifting cradle. Such a handy tool!


Some of you may remember me asking back in 2020 about when on earth an oil cap may have gone. My best guess at the time, after extensive (so I thought) searching all over the engine bay was that it had been torn up by the fan and the cylinders were now littered with bit of plastic oil cap. Well, I was partially right. It had been sucked up into the fan. And it has been on the spin cycle for the past 2.5 years. Thousands of miles later, there it is.


Its a little beat up, but nothing broke off it at all. The o-ring got displaced, but was easily pushed back into its groove. I could keep using it, if I had not replaced it and if the new engine didn't already have one. This will go on my trophy wall.

The crazy part of this is I searched and searched the entire nose of the engine. I looked with a flashlight. I felt around with my hands all throughout the tins under the fan and alternator nose. I thought I had felt inside the fan. I know pretty much exactly where and when the cap came off. It was during the drive to go check out a Bus that we did not end up buying. I noted my head temps were slightly higher on the way back and there was a new vibration in the engine at low idle speeds (like 700rpm). And then I noted the oil cap was missing as soon as I get home and popped the engine lid open.

The results of this were that I had head temps about 10-15 degrees higher then I used to have while on longer drives. All still within normal, just a little higher. Which also fit with my theory that the cap had been shredded by the fan and the debris were caught under the tins.

I have NO IDEA how the hell it stayed there. How it did not bounce out and get caught by the fan belt or chewed up by the alternator. But it clearly did not!

Anyway, my task for this afternoon is to split the engine and transmission. Inspect my motor mounts and make sure they are still good, and take off the stuff that I need (like the alternator) for the new motor when it comes in.

Zach

Posted by: Cairo94507 Mar 23 2023, 08:01 AM

That's amazing; 2.5 years of riding along in the fan housing and it never got kicked out. Glad it did not get shredded and cause damage.

Posted by: Geezer914 Mar 23 2023, 08:27 AM

Don't forget the ground strap connected to the trans!

Posted by: NARP74 Mar 23 2023, 08:34 AM

I call that hole the Abyss. I have lost many pieces of hardware down there never to be found again, at least until the engine is pulled. Gravity must be strong there, it seems to pull things in from all over.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 23 2023, 11:23 AM

QUOTE(NARP74 @ Mar 23 2023, 10:34 AM)

Posted by: JmuRiz Mar 23 2023, 12:14 PM

I guess that's why the VW version had a cage over the fan eh?

Posted by: SirAndy Mar 23 2023, 12:36 PM

QUOTE(JmuRiz @ Mar 23 2023, 11:14 AM)

Posted by: ClayPerrine Mar 23 2023, 12:41 PM

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Mar 23 2023, 01:36 PM)

QUOTE(JmuRiz @ Mar 23 2023, 11:14 AM)

I guess that's why the VW version had a cage over the fan eh?

I think that was more because of people sticking their fingers in there while the engine was running.

Posted by: 930cabman Mar 23 2023, 12:53 PM

Engine had to be running out of balance for the entire time!

I would purchase a screen if available and have thought several times of fabricating one.

Posted by: NARP74 Mar 23 2023, 01:11 PM

QUOTE(930cabman @ Mar 23 2023, 12:53 PM)

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 23 2023, 06:46 PM

QUOTE(NARP74 @ Mar 23 2023, 03:11 PM)

QUOTE(930cabman @ Mar 23 2023, 12:53 PM)

Engine had to be running out of balance for the entire time!

I would purchase a screen if available and have thought several times of fabricating one.

Business opportunity and group buy! I'm in.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 23 2023, 06:56 PM

Engine and transmission are now split. Alternator is off the engine. Engine bar is off. Until I get the new engine in I won't know what else I need - maybe nothing.

Started cleaning off all the grease and crap off the engine bar tonight. Made me wish I had DrEvil's new cleaning laser. There was a lot of fur on the engine bar - not sure if I smacked something or there have been critters in the garage.

New engine could show tomorrow. I'm really excited.

Zach

Posted by: SirAndy Mar 23 2023, 07:12 PM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 23 2023, 05:46 PM)

Posted by: Root_Werks Mar 24 2023, 10:43 AM

Very excited for your new engine!

The oil cap thing seems like something I would do. Yes, it deserves a spot on a trophy shelf or similar.

Posted by: bzettner Mar 24 2023, 11:22 AM

Whatcha going to do with your “old” engine?

Posted by: 930cabman Mar 24 2023, 11:44 AM

QUOTE(bzettner @ Mar 24 2023, 11:22 AM)

Whatcha going to do with your “old” engine?

Posted by: GBX0073 Mar 24 2023, 06:20 PM

I know Don on FB inquired and thought it should stay with a Green car


But The real reason I am here is excited for the New Engine !!!!!!

Posted by: GBX0073 Mar 24 2023, 06:21 PM

QUOTE(GBX0073 @ Mar 24 2023, 07:20 PM)

I know Don on FB inquired and thought it should stay with a Green car


But The real reason I am here is excited for the New Engine !!!!!!

Posted by: hot_shoe914 Mar 24 2023, 07:19 PM

QUOTE(GBX0073 @ Mar 24 2023, 07:20 PM)

I know Don on FB inquired and thought it should stay with a Green car


But The real reason I am here is excited for the New Engine !!!!!!

Posted by: hot_shoe914 Mar 24 2023, 07:20 PM

QUOTE(hot_shoe914 @ Mar 24 2023, 08:19 PM)

QUOTE(GBX0073 @ Mar 24 2023, 07:20 PM)

I know Don on FB inquired and thought it should stay with a Green car


But The real reason I am here is excited for the New Engine !!!!!!

I have a hunch what might happen to it.

Shoe

Posted by: echocanyons Mar 24 2023, 11:17 PM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 19 2023, 05:33 PM)

QUOTE(echocanyons @ Mar 17 2023, 04:49 PM)

This engine is pretty incredible, my son has the first one and seat of the pants feels at least 150hp. The EFI and feel of this engine is hands down the finest air cooled 4 cylinder option that exists for the 914..

Is your son using a remote oil cooler? I’d love to take this system out of my car, but wanted to talk with someone and see if it’s needed.

Zach

Posted by: JmuRiz Mar 25 2023, 08:27 AM

Nice! Aaron’s gonna run a front cooler too.

Posted by: r_towle Mar 25 2023, 12:42 PM

is it running yet?

Posted by: euro911 Mar 25 2023, 03:25 PM

QUOTE(SirAndy @ Mar 23 2023, 06:12 PM)

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 23 2023, 05:46 PM)

You can get them all day on ebay for $30. I'm not sure you could fabricate them much cheaper.

$26

https://www.ebay.com/itm/403181399848?hash=item5ddf7bef28:g:b6MAAOSwQwRhSrxP&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAA0Lw50gQES5BchUcsol5sgx9ckL5% 2FvYcSLq21Izqt0jRYDfUqZDoXprGxO5eRmlU410zAFQ9qkFsPPQsaLGmT1PVMZmUd4Wpb1wac0y69BU
zN%2FhPLDhfbkM3yv15gmpu7WExhLm%2BDEG5vosZTVY47qXMS%2BwxxerGfOO8ouT8L87zs%2F7KB49GIq7cmkDK1CC1GfEi5uytqoRrBOVuNtclHB9qU0gbGtmedzNe8GfFqv77n%2FMF5y%2B9H1%2Febpjpbuo8uUSylx07Sxefr3Kv%2Bcjcnk0o%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR5Cv4JLiYQ

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 29 2023, 01:37 PM

I got a delivery today!


I was still in the middle of my work day, so all I let myself do was take a little peak after signing for the crate.



My plan for the evening is to finish uncrating everything, take inventory, and mount things like the engine bar and the transmission. I also got some brake stuff from PMB that I want to do prior to mounting the engine. New soft lines, new pads, etc. get everything bled properly.

I'm really hoping to have a first start on Sunday sometime.

Zach

Posted by: mepstein Mar 29 2023, 01:57 PM

Don’t rush. Take your time and enjoy the process. People make mistakes with deadlines.

Posted by: rfinegan Mar 29 2023, 02:09 PM

WOW..that sure looks NICE
Congratulations on you new purchase

Posted by: rjames Mar 29 2023, 02:28 PM

That's a good looking crate right there!

Love that PMB is offering this service.

Congrats!

Posted by: Mayne Mar 29 2023, 03:17 PM

Awesome! Is that a 911 (or 914-6) style oil cooler? Sorry if I missed it, but is this engine dry sumped?

Posted by: Mayne Mar 29 2023, 03:18 PM

QUOTE(Mayne @ Mar 29 2023, 03:17 PM)

Posted by: Dion Mar 29 2023, 04:06 PM

Yea Zach! 6 oil tank. Hmmmm….

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 29 2023, 04:45 PM

QUOTE(Dion @ Mar 29 2023, 06:06 PM)

Posted by: aharder Mar 29 2023, 06:20 PM

QUOTE(mepstein @ Mar 29 2023, 02:57 PM)

Don’t rush. Take your time and enjoy the process. People make mistakes with deadlines.

Posted by: DRPHIL914 Mar 30 2023, 06:19 AM

QUOTE(mepstein @ Mar 29 2023, 03:57 PM)

Don’t rush. Take your time and enjoy the process. People make mistakes with deadlines.

QUOTE(rfinegan @ Mar 29 2023, 04:09 PM)

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Mar 29 2023, 06:45 PM)

QUOTE(Dion @ Mar 29 2023, 06:06 PM)

Yea Zach! 6 oil tank. Hmmmm….

Behind this crate is a /6 2.7 with CIS. Its going to eventually go into the bus, and the oil tank is from that.

Zach

Posted by: rhodyguy Mar 30 2023, 10:33 AM

Are ‘Nickies’ part of this build? Who’s heads did you use?

Posted by: VaccaRabite Mar 30 2023, 12:47 PM

QUOTE(DRPHIL914 @ Mar 30 2023, 08:19 AM)

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 2 2023, 08:38 PM

Lots of work this weekend.

Saturday:
Major tasks:
From the old engine:

• Oil remote hose
• A bunch of injection hose clamps
• pulling the hardware off the clutch and pressure plate.
• Fuel regulator

• Remove all electronics wiring
• Remove shroud, doghouse, right side throttle body and right side tins
• Reroute fuel hose, mount regulator, mark high pressure and low pressure ends.
• Cut a channel in the right side heads for CHT.
• Install oil remote
• Replace tins, doghouse, throttle body.
• Install new clutch, pressure plate, throw out bearing.
• Unbolt engine from the pallet and get it mounted on jackstands (this was a bit sketchy, but mostly just muscled it up.)

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 2 2023, 08:59 PM

Today was a shorter day. Took the GF out to brunch, and did not touch the engine till about noon. Had to start getting cleaned up to go get my kids at 4. I made the most of the time.


Engine and transmission got a little getting to know you time. Also the engine came off the jackstands and on to the jack and lifting plate.

Put the Ford solenoid on the rear engine tin.

And then it was time to get the new engine into the car.


UP she goes!


I got brunch and she helped getting the engine bolted into place. Winning!


There it is! All snugged up into place.

At this point, my alarm went off letting me know it was time to shower up and go get the boys. When I got home this evening I went back out and got the clutch and speedo cables into place.

I went to get the axles in place and realized I did not have new CV gaskets. GRRRR! I'll go see if Tony at Translog has some tomorrow, and if I strike out I'll order some and the will be here soon. But I need those before I get too much farther on the underside of the motor.

I still have a good bit of work to do.

I'm going to need to take the pass side throttle body off again to get the CHT ring into place. Not horrible.

And I'm trying to figure out how Eric designed the ECU plate to go on. I know its supposed to go in the stock location, but for the life of me I can't get the holes to line up. So I have a question in to PMB to figure out what I'm doing wrong. Its possible it was not designed to work with a firewall back pad in place. If so I may mount it to the firewall, as I like my back pad.

I may go camping next weekend with the boys. But I should have the engine close to first fire-up by Friday. And if we don't go camping (landowner may be using the cabin for turkey hunting) I should have the car driving next weekend.

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 3 2023, 01:09 PM

Picked up the CV gaskets at Translog at lunch. Hopefully I'll still have enough energy after scouts tonight to get the axles hooked up to the transmission this evening.

Zach

Posted by: skota23 Apr 3 2023, 02:23 PM

Oh cool,

I had seen a few pictures of this engine along with some hp figures. I think they where putting one in a 912 also. Can't wait to hear how it runs and sounds!

Steve

Posted by: Cairo94507 Apr 3 2023, 02:24 PM

That is coming along quite nicely.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 4 2023, 09:08 PM

Ticked a few more lines off the checklist.
Axles are attached. Clutch is adjusted. Shifter bar is back in and shifter is adjusted. Oil cooler is back in.


My 11 year old wanted to help tonight so I got the tools out he’d need to adjust the clutch cable, showed him how to set it up and the turned him loose while I sat in the drivers seat to test. About a million quarter turns later the clutch felt right. It was fun watching the clutch pedal move up a good bit in the cabin for such a tiny movement at the adjuster. This little voice callin up from under the car “hey how ‘bout now. Test it!”

There was about a pint of oil still in the remote cooler which promptly gravity fed itself on to the floor while I was reinstalling it. So now the garage also smells like fresh kitty litter. Could be worse!

Zach

Posted by: 930cabman Apr 5 2023, 02:03 PM

Teach 'em when they are young. That's the way, but you already know this. Great project and I like many can't wait to see the results. Thanks for the updates

Posted by: Root_Werks Apr 5 2023, 02:33 PM

Great progress! Can't wait to hear about driving impressions with the big 4.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 7 2023, 09:30 AM

My GF just had surgery so progress has been a little slower.

Since Tuesday I've gotten a bunch of stuff ticked off the project board.

• ECU board is mounted to the car.
• The new main harness is mounted.
• 02 bung is welded into the SSI exchangers
• Relay board harness WAS 90% done (now about 10% done)
• muffler is hung
• engine has oil in it again! 4 quarts now, but I'll need to add in another quart once it build pressure.

Posted by: Root_Werks Apr 7 2023, 10:36 AM

Good progress!

As for the wiring #@%!$, it happens. Can't recall the number of times a $5 part stopped work for days, sometimes a week +.

So close!

Posted by: ClayPerrine Apr 7 2023, 11:21 AM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Apr 7 2023, 10:30 AM)

Posted by: nditiz1 Apr 7 2023, 11:47 AM

I also have one on hand if needed.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 11 2023, 09:03 PM

Progress slowed a little so I could go camping with my kids Easter weekend. Worth it!

Yesterday (Monday) I stopped by Aircooled Racing and got a new 12 pin plug. Then work and scouts so no further car stuff yesterday.

Tonight I put the full exhaust system on the car and hooked up the 02 sensor. I had bought a pigtail extender for the 02, but did not end up needing it. Yay! I also worked the backpad back into place.

I still need to:
Remake the 12 pin plug.
Attach the CHT sender.
Attach the injector plugs.
Pressurize the fuel and oil systems and look for leaks.
Start the car!
Set idle and drive!

Hopeful for first start before this weekends camping trip.

Zach

Posted by: JmuRiz Apr 12 2023, 07:25 AM

If anyone needs this for their 914, it's you

Posted by: Jamie Apr 12 2023, 07:48 AM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Apr 4 2023, 07:08 PM)

Ticked a few more lines off the checklist.
Axles are attached. Clutch is adjusted. Shifter bar is back in and shifter is adjusted. Oil cooler is back in.


My 11 year old wanted to help tonight so I got the tools out he’d need to adjust the clutch cable, showed him how to set it up and the turned him loose while I sat in the drivers seat to test. About a million quarter turns later the clutch felt right. It was fun watching the clutch pedal move up a good bit in the cabin for such a tiny movement at the adjuster. This little voice callin up from under the car “hey how ‘bout now. Test it!”

There was about a pint of oil still in the remote cooler which promptly gravity fed itself on to the floor while I was reinstalling it. So now the garage also smells like fresh kitty litter. Could be worse!

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 12 2023, 10:57 AM

QUOTE(JmuRiz @ Apr 12 2023, 09:25 AM)

If anyone needs this for their 914, it's you

Posted by: r_towle Apr 12 2023, 11:15 AM

teasing...and I should talk...but this feels like a movie series of Zach putting another engine in his car.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 12 2023, 11:24 AM

QUOTE(r_towle @ Apr 12 2023, 01:15 PM)

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 13 2023, 09:59 AM

I really thought I'd be starting it last night.
But after a 10 hour work day, running kids around, making dinner, etc... I got out to the shop around 9 and worked till I started fumbling with things like nuts and bolts. IE - an hour later then I should have been working.

But I got a good bit done before I realized I was basically asleep on my feet and went to bed.

CHT is in place. I had kinda been dreading this one, but its done. Its always the kinda stupid jobs that give me pause. But once I did it, it only took a few minutes.

Hooked up the last fuel connection. I'm not happy with how the fuel lines are set right now. Since the deadline I set for driving got deleted due to Amy's upcoming surgery, I may redo this. The engine side hard lines I have just don't work with the rubber hose routing and I want to remake them. So I think I will do that before I put gas back in the car again. More work.

I hooked up the injector connectors. Not to bad but they were not labeled so I had to be careful.

I also remade the 12pin connector harness. I reused my old harness, but cut back the old wires and remade them.

I'm kinda proud of this one. With custom wiring documentation is everything. 10 years from now I know I won't remember what I did. Instead of drawing the diagram and sticking it in my manual, I labeled the wires themselves by printing labels on heat-shrink tube.

I got the shroud back on and hooked up the throttle cable. There is one cheesehead screw that does not want to go back in as the standoff is slightly misaligned. I'll need to fix it tonight.

My main battery cable also needed some work. This is when how tired I was really started to show. I was fumbling with the battery connector and dropped the hold down nut. I probably just stood there looking into the engine bay for about 15 minutes. I was standing, but I wasn't really there. I tried to work for a little longer but gave it up and can't even recall what more i tried to do.

One last thing, that I realized pretty quick last night when I thought I was going to start the car - I don't have the hose I need to rig up the breather - and I can't find my breather can. I hope I still have mine - I may have given it away since I usually just close the vent lines. For this engine, PMB wants the breather vents run to a catch can during break in, so that's what I am going to do.

So, probably no start this week since I'm camping tomorrow though Sunday. I'm going to try and put a bow on the electrical stuff tonight and (if I have the energy) change the fuel hardline I don't like so my hose route is better.

Then the only things I have left to do is:
breather vents and catch can,
add gas, and check for leaks
Start it up!

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 13 2023, 07:22 PM

No work tonight. It’s my eldest’s 15th birthday.
But I did find my old Empi breather box.

No one local had hose, so I gave up and bought some off Amazon.

One more night of work, should be done next week.

Zach

Posted by: sixnotfour Apr 13 2023, 07:32 PM

oldest son 15... Now I am Old... Happy Birthday..

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 19 2023, 12:58 PM

Finally a little time to work today over lunch.
Fuel and Electric is done. Most of my time was spend reforming a SS fuel hardline so it came out where I wanted it to - cutting off a few inches and putting a new bubble flare on it. Damn, stainless tube is hard to form. I ended up heating up the end right before I put the flare in to get it to shape a little easier. I'm jealous of everyone with pneumatic flare tools.

Need to run the breather system, then I can get ready for pressure checks and first start. But first I have to get back to work for a bit. Maybe first start tonight? Maybe.

Zach

Posted by: Cairo94507 Apr 19 2023, 02:22 PM

Posted by: Root_Werks Apr 19 2023, 02:47 PM

Getting closer!

Posted by: nditiz1 Apr 19 2023, 04:36 PM

Video or it didn't happen

Posted by: Jamie Apr 19 2023, 05:22 PM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Apr 13 2023, 07:59 AM)

I really thought I'd be starting it last night.
But after a 10 hour work day, running kids around, making dinner, etc... I got out to the shop around 9 and worked till I started fumbling with things like nuts and bolts. IE - an hour later then I should have been working.

But I got a good bit done before I realized I was basically asleep on my feet and went to bed.

CHT is in place. I had kinda been dreading this one, but its done. Its always the kinda stupid jobs that give me pause. But once I did it, it only took a few minutes.

Hooked up the last fuel connection. I'm not happy with how the fuel lines are set right now. Since the deadline I set for driving got deleted due to Amy's upcoming surgery, I may redo this. The engine side hard lines I have just don't work with the rubber hose routing and I want to remake them. So I think I will do that before I put gas back in the car again. More work.

I hooked up the injector connectors. Not to bad but they were not labeled so I had to be careful.

I also remade the 12pin connector harness. I reused my old harness, but cut back the old wires and remade them.

I'm kinda proud of this one. With custom wiring documentation is everything. 10 years from now I know I won't remember what I did. Instead of drawing the diagram and sticking it in my manual, I labeled the wires themselves by printing labels on heat-shrink tube.

I got the shroud back on and hooked up the throttle cable. There is one cheesehead screw that does not want to go back in as the standoff is slightly misaligned. I'll need to fix it tonight.

My main battery cable also needed some work. This is when how tired I was really started to show. I was fumbling with the battery connector and dropped the hold down nut. I probably just stood there looking into the engine bay for about 15 minutes. I was standing, but I wasn't really there. I tried to work for a little longer but gave it up and can't even recall what more i tried to do.

One last thing, that I realized pretty quick last night when I thought I was going to start the car - I don't have the hose I need to rig up the breather - and I can't find my breather can. I hope I still have mine - I may have given it away since I usually just close the vent lines. For this engine, PMB wants the breather vents run to a catch can during break in, so that's what I am going to do.

So, probably no start this week since I'm camping tomorrow though Sunday. I'm going to try and put a bow on the electrical stuff tonight and (if I have the energy) change the fuel hardline I don't like so my hose route is better.

Then the only things I have left to do is:
breather vents and catch can,
add gas, and check for leaks
Start it up!

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 19 2023, 05:35 PM

@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=2939
Any modern label maker can load cassettes of heat shrink tube to print on to.

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 19 2023, 08:28 PM

So close but no cigar tonight.


Got the breather hoses into place. Had to scrounge for a nut, but only found a wingnut. That will work.

Cranked over the engine with no fuel to build oil pressure. But that was going to take a minute and I did not want to wear down my battery. So after making sure I did not have any oil leaks, I added gas to the tank and let the pump build pressure.


But there was no fuel pressure. Despite the fact that I heard the pump freewheel, then labor. So I turned the key off, and let it go through the prime cycle again. This time I was getting bubbles in the tank letting me know excess fuel was going down the return line. Still no pressure at the gauge.

So, I have the feed and return lines miss-plumbed. Which actually means I have the feed and return lines wrong under the tank. Fuck that, I'll fix it in the engine bay.

I also found that I have a slight weep coming from what is supposed to be the return line (but which is currently the feed line). I need to undo those hoses and switch them anyway. I'm tired, and I need to let fuel pressure bleed away anyway. So this will be a tomorrow job - IF I have time tomorrow. I'm a little grumpy about this. I was pretty damn sure I'd be posting a first start video tonight. But that's okay.

Zach

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 20 2023, 06:04 AM

Thinking about this with a clearer head this morning.
I’m going to pump the gas back out of the tank today.
I’m going to remove the other hardline from the engine bay and do the same mod to it that I did to the other yesterday. Cutting those nice stainless lines is painful, but it will make for a cleaner run. Then I can get the two fuel lines run in properly.

At 9:30am I have to take the puppy to get his balls cut off, so I may be too busy today to do any of this. But I’d like to get it done today if possible.

Zach

Posted by: DRPHIL914 Apr 20 2023, 07:21 AM

sorry to hear that- i somehow mislabled my lines when i pulled my motor out last ime and in reinstalling it had the same issue, . but swap them around and hook it up , and get that thing roaring!! , it will happen soon enough, i know the feeling but one more day will is not a big deal but its like being a kid and having to wait an extra day to open your christmas presents, isnt it?

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 20 2023, 07:44 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=whtCGQ4mIVU


First start!

I let the 15 year old have the honor of starting it up.

I have a few issues to work out yet though.

Spec for this motor is 43psi of fuel. I can only get 40psi out of the stock regulator. Not sure if the regulator or the pump is the issue here. But the regulator is easiest to replace so that's what I will do.

I also think I have an exhaust leak on one of the cylinders. So I'll crank down a bit more on the nuts and see if I can't close that up.

Zach

Posted by: rhodyguy Apr 20 2023, 08:07 PM

A facet fuel pump is perfect for getting gas out of the tank thru the fill neck. I think in the long run you’ll be happier getting it right now than later. Enjoy that new power plant.

Posted by: nditiz1 Apr 20 2023, 08:21 PM

Huzzah!

Posted by: GBX0073 Apr 20 2023, 10:42 PM

Awesome !!!!!!

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 21 2023, 04:36 AM

Ordered a new Holley fuel pressure regulator, more clamps and some more sae 30r9 hose. Hopefully it will all get here Monday.
Will be a very busy weekend and Amy goes back under the knife Tuesday (round 3). So I’d love to have this done by then. It may be premature, but I may try to wash the car today juuuuust in case I can drive it before the surgery date.

Zach

Posted by: BeatNavy Apr 21 2023, 04:58 AM

Congrats, Zach! Lots of nice weather ahead so you can enjoy it.

Posted by: Cairo94507 Apr 21 2023, 07:51 AM

That started nice and easy. Congratulations to you and your son for having the honor of firing it the first time.

Posted by: rfinegan Apr 21 2023, 08:11 AM

Great Job Zach, looks and sounds GREAT...Let us know how she performs after break in!

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 22 2023, 10:09 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1lK-la8w0s

Balanced out the throttle bodies tonight, and got the idle roughed in.

Still waiting on the new fuel pressure regulator to come in, but at 40PSI I figured was close enough to balance and set idle.

When I started the balance the pass side was pulling 25 on the gauge and the driver side was only pulling 1. LOL! Only took about 15 minutes to get that resolved - I spent more time figuring out how to remove the tops of the air filters.

First drive -
I went out tonight for the first drive - even with and exhaust leak and low fuel pressure.
Weather was... well... It was raining, but not hard enough that I needed the top on - so topless I went into the night.

A good bit more torque in first gear. In fact, between the wet road and not expecting the throttle response, the rear got loose coming out of my driveway. FUN! This could be the engine that convinces me to get the fender flares I've been sitting on welded in, do the 5 lug conversion and get some bigger rubber.

But NOT until the Bus is on the road!

My car is back on the road! I was able to wipe off the last task on my project board tonight "DRIVE!"
From this point on its just maintenance.

Zach

Posted by: brubou Apr 23 2023, 07:24 AM

Posted by: mepstein Apr 23 2023, 08:22 AM

Posted by: Root_Werks Apr 23 2023, 09:38 AM

Yay! Always so gratifying to drive after putting in the work.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 25 2023, 08:03 AM

The Holley fuel pressure regulator came in yesterday but I had not time to work with it. Too much prep work for Amy's surgery today.

And Dillion from PMB reached out to let me know a trick for getting the last couple PSI out of the stock regulator - right now I'm at 40 of the 43psi the injectors are intended for. But I think its probably better to be in the middle of the range, instead of past the high end. The Holley unit is 15-60 psi range so its about perfect for this application! Just need to find time to plumb it in.

Before I drive the car again I also need to get it in the air and snug up the heat exchangers. I've found in the past that they tend to loosen up a little after the first couple heat cycles, and I know I have an exhaust leak anyway. Its possible that this second set of pipes is also cracked somewhere under the jacket, but I doubt it.

I'm going to be home while Amy is in surgery, which annoys me. But someone needs to be here when the kids come home from school and tend to the dogs. We tried giving that job to her mom for the first round of surgery and that did not go well (sigh), so her mom will go to the hospital with her today and take her home after while I continue to get the house prepped for a longer recuperation time with this round. But I will maybe have time to get the car back on the lift and poke at the exchangers before she is home. Will keep my mind off the surgery.

So much going on right now.

Zach

Posted by: ndfrigi Apr 25 2023, 08:24 AM

We will be praying for successful surgery and quick recovery for your wife Amy!
Congrats also for your new engine!

Posted by: rgolia Apr 25 2023, 08:27 AM

Very sweet. Cant wait to see and hear it at the NE Gathering.

Posted by: Dion Apr 25 2023, 08:37 AM

Congrats on the engine start ad drive, All the best wished for Amy.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Apr 30 2023, 09:54 AM

I made the mount for the Holley fuel pressure regulator.
I had to chuckle the entire time I as working on it as I knew how to make the stock pressure regulator work and it would have taken 15 minutes to make the change. Tje stock regulator tops out at 40PSI, but you can eek out the other 3 PSI by removing the lock nut. I decided I wanted something where my pressure was in the middle of the range of the regulator, not over the top of it.

Everything was made from stock I had laying around the garage, though I did have to buy a 1 1/8th inch hole saw.


This is a stock regulator in the stock location with a cheap gauge that you really can't see without doing gymnastics. We can do better.


The first and second drafts looked like this. The plan was that they would raise the regulator up to the level of the fuel rail, but still bolt to the stock location. the first effort was flat, and the reg was the right height but the wrong plane. So I heated it up and put a twist in the base (you can see the in the picture). This would have worked, but it looked ugly as sin in the car, and it made the return line shunt off towards the center of the engine. I did not like it, so back to the drafting board.


This was attempt 3. I found some M5 socket bolts and so I just tapped some bar stock, and bent it to fit and welded it to what was left of the Mk1/Mk2 mounts. It lives on the rear bulkhead.


And there is it. I can even easily read the gage! This was just the fit up - no hose clamps or anything.

It came out again, and got painted. Once that dried (which took forever with all the rain we have had this weekend) I put it on for real and got the pressure dialed in. 43PSI - perfect! Got back inside before 11PM!

This took hours to make (compared to the 15 minute mod I could have made tot he stock regulator), but that's including breaks to check on and tend to Amy.

I want to drive the car but its just POURING right now. Hopefully this week.

Zach

Posted by: r_towle Apr 30 2023, 10:25 AM

Very cool!

Posted by: VaccaRabite May 12 2023, 05:42 AM

More bracket fabrication last night.

The engine shipped with an idle control valve that was not perfect. The housing did not allow the plunger of the ICV to actuate all the way.

@http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=1110 called me about this after the engine shipped, but before I had time to install it. They had found the issue when testing Aarons engine. Remember mine is only engine #2 for them in this configuration. He said they had noted the problem, and would ship me the solution when it was available. Totally 100% excellent customer service as always!

The solution came some weeks later. After I had done my install and taken the first drive. I texted back and forth with PMB Performance about where best to put it. They had designed a simple bracket for this that attached to the place on the doghouse where the coil would live on a stock or carbed engine. Since this engine has no coil, that's usually free.

But that's the location where I had my oil pressure gauge sender remote switch. And since I already had all the wires run, I wanted to be able to use the location the "old" ICV had been. PMB had put crimp-nuts in the tins on the pass side and I liked the ICV there. So I decided to toss the well thought out PMB bracket provided and make my own.


This time the 1st try worked beautifully and I did not need to try other things like I had to do with the fuel pressure regulator bracket.


All plugged in and ready to go.


The view from the other side.

I started the car and immediately the car jumped to about a 1000 rpm idle. Exactly where I like it! From cold (it was about 68*F) the car started like a modern car and sat at idle quite happily. It was a marked improvement over the other valve.

It was late, so I did not go on a drive. I'm planning to drive over to see a friend on the MD Eastern Shore Saturday, so the car will get about 300 miles. I've put about 60 miles on the new engine so far.


I took Josh (my youngest) out on Tuesday after work and school. He agrees. Every 914 needs this engine. As Ferris said - "If you have the means, I highly recommend it!"

There is one more change that needs to get made to this motor, and it something that Eric and also talked about after I got it delivered but before I was able to install. The ECU uses the oil temperature sensor, so there is not a place for the cabin mounted gauge to attach. Eric found a plate with two sender mounts, so that is what I'm going to do. But that has not arrived yet, and its NOT critical. I'm going to wait for the end of the driving season and install it when I do the next oil change, since the engine has to be dry of oil before changing out that plate. I have a large oil cooler and a Manly dipstick gauge for spot checks, its just not ideal as I have to get out of the car and open the engine bay to read it. But I'm super not worried about it. I monitor engine temps via head temp anyway and by the way, this engine runs COOL! Under 330* pulling the looooong fast hills on 83, in 5th, doing 90.

Zach

Posted by: BeatNavy May 12 2023, 06:49 AM

Very cool, Zach (and PMB!)

What IAC is that? One that came with my engine was a Hyundai valve that seemed too small. I have since changed it to a BMW IAC that did work somewhat better, but I certainly don't get 1000 RPM on a cold start.

Posted by: VaccaRabite May 12 2023, 07:41 AM

QUOTE(BeatNavy @ May 12 2023, 08:49 AM)

Very cool, Zach (and PMB!)

What IAC is that? One that came with my engine was a Hyundai valve that seemed too small. I have since changed it to a BMW IAC that did work somewhat better, but I certainly don't get 1000 RPM on a cold start.

Posted by: Superhawk996 May 12 2023, 07:49 AM

Posted by: 76-914 May 12 2023, 08:11 AM

Congrats on a long overdue upgrade to your Type 4. And also to @http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=1110 I know he went to Hell and back on this journey to improve the Type 4. Hopefully there is a mile long queue forming outside his door with these favorable reports. It's nice to have a reliable power plant, eh?

Posted by: Root_Werks May 12 2023, 02:42 PM

Awesome to see this come together!

Very tidy install of all the parts Zach, well done!

Posted by: Freezin 914 May 12 2023, 04:31 PM

Nicely done! Congratulations!

Posted by: JamesM May 12 2023, 04:49 PM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ Apr 21 2023, 02:36 AM)

Posted by: VaccaRabite May 31 2023, 08:42 PM

I've been driving the car, and learning the new engine and new tuning system.

I did a 180 mile drive to Philly and back when I needed some stuff from Bus Depot for my bus project. And last weekend I did a 300 miles drive on Saturday and showed the car at Bug Out VA. I was the only 914, and got lots of questions about the engine.

I did datalogging for the entire 300 mile trip. I'm just scratching the surface of the Terminator X ECU. The engine comes with what they call a "hand terminal" that plugs into the canbus jack. This is a super handy tool that I ignored for most of my break in.

Right now I don't have it run through the tunnel - and that's something I intend to do! Its just too handy a tool not to. Its a data logger, but it also has a gauge cluster so you can see what the ECU is seeing.

I also bought a canbus splitter so that I can plug my laptop into the ECU and leave the hand unit plugged in.

With a little over 600 miles on the engine, its time for and oil change and valve adjustment. And I need to get the data logs back to @http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showuser=1110 for evaluation (which I will do when the CANBUS to USB cable I ordered comes in).

There are a couple things that I think can be improved. the gas mileage is about 18 mpg with me cruising during break in. That MAY improve on its own as the engine tightens up. But I bet there is improvements to be made at idle and off throttle.

There has also been some rev-hang, where the engine will stay around 2000 rpm for a moment when I push in the clutch instead of dropping immediately back to idle. At first I suspected the IAC was adding air - and I think that was Eric's opinion too. But driving with the hand unit in the cabin with me, I could see that the IAC was fully closed. The hand unit is REALLY handy! Playing with the car tonight (and watching the TPS data on the hand unit) I suspect the issue is mechanical and not part of the tune. On throttle close, the TPS was showing the throttle sticking at ~22% open instead of closing. I'm almost sure that is the cause of my rev hang.

The difference between fully closed and 20ish% is under 1mm of travel. It may need a helper spring, or there may be some slight bind in the throttle body sync.

Closing the throttle at idle will hopefully cure the rev hang, and give me a little boost to mileage. I fully expect that this motor should be able to get at least 25mpg when cruising down the freeway.

As to driving impressions - this motor is a beast! I was accelerating up hill in 5th on the freeway, doing well over 90, with head temps that never got over 350 and the throttle was never wide open. You don't need to drop a gear to pass traffic. And you CAN pass traffic.

I've still not done any 2nd or 3rd gear pulls at WOT yet. That will happen after the oil change and adjustment.

There is NO drama starting the car. Either cold or hot, it starts right up.

If you are thinking about getting one. STOP THINKING. Call PMB and get the ball rolling.

Zach

Posted by: DRPHIL914 Jun 1 2023, 06:18 AM

QUOTE(VaccaRabite @ May 31 2023, 10:42 PM)

Posted by: VaccaRabite Jun 1 2023, 07:12 AM

QUOTE(DRPHIL914 @ Jun 1 2023, 08:18 AM)

Posted by: JmuRiz Jun 1 2023, 08:00 AM

Very nice, I'm sure Aaron's guy (Bergman) will be picking your brain when he starts the install next week.

Engine is delivered and the car is now ready to meet the drivetrain

Posted by: Root_Werks Jun 1 2023, 09:47 AM

Some great driving impressions and thoughts!

I've found over the years I'd rather have an engine with the torque equivalant to the side profile of a kitchen table thank a peaky high-hp gotta rev-it engine.

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 1 2023, 04:06 PM

Thanks Zach for the real-(914)world feedback. Kelly reported in that Orion's car is tearing up the mountain roads in CA and is pretty phenomenal. We're happy to hear the results and, as Ken's stated... we've been through a ton of development model$ We're super happy with this platform.

To answer a few lingering questions; Holley is having a fun time keeping up with the demand on these new ECU's. Self learning has been what everyone's been asking and waiting for it appears. This comes down to the various components as well. The IAC's were on BO for "months" and I finally gave up and ordered a Haltech unit for these builds. The Haltech systems had a design flaw that didn't allow them to work well at all. The remote housing only allowed the IAC plunger to move about 1/8". This was probably good for 30-40 RPM not the 300-400 we were looking for. OF COURSE, the minute we send them off with the Haltechs we a ) find the issue and b ) the Holley units came back in stock.

ITB's - We absolutely love the Jenvey stuff. Initially, they seemed to be more expensive but, when we learned they came with most everything needed and, the machining and their customer service is second to none... it became a more obvious choice than the gaggle of poorly cast import options. The first 5 systems were built with the Jenvey IDF platform. The only issue I've found with these ITB's is the "base" is an IDF bolt on but the top is not. We use the Vintage Speed Knecht style filter to bring a little "Porsche Vibe" back into the engine compartment and, adapters had to be made to have them fit. The following 6 builds currently in-house will have the Heritage series that Zach mentions. These are straight up IDF copies with injectors hiding in the float bowls and the TPS hidden in the bodies. Problem = Solution.

Back to IAC's a bit... we have an IAC, a MAP and 4 individual throats to deal with. Getting these modern components to operate with a vintage style ITB setup was another challenge. We prototyped many base plates. Some for the bottom of the ITB's and some for the base of the manifolds. We came up with a perfect solution all contained within the manifolds. The IAC isn't picky as to where it delivers the goods. The MAP likes to draw a more even signal. The IAC is ported up top and the MAP is ported at the base and yes... the prototyping with the base plates showed major differences in signal stability within that 4-5" on the manifold. The manifolds went on the mill and ports were added.

We knew there would be a few minor items to tick off on Zach's build as both of the previous installs were done in-house here at the shop. We weren't that concerned about the tune because we ported over the aforementioned "Orion Thorson" tune that we used as our test vehicle with mountain and city driving here in the valley and (as many of you saw) to rave reviews all around Red Rocks Classic 2022. Aside from the IAC issue and what we think is a mechanical hold up on the throttle cable or linkage somewhere (?), the Holley system should self tune to his altitude and he should be a happy camper.

Perhaps Kelly can weigh in here as I know he has some seat time in Orion's car. That engine is fully broken in and they're out there taking names.

We're off tomorrow to dyno Jimmy's motor and we may have another tune to send to Zach and Aaron. We'll see though... again, Orion's tune is extremely stable.

I hope that answers a few questions.

E.

Posted by: DRPHIL914 Jun 2 2023, 05:49 AM

lots of great information for those of us considering this system, motor or both, i have one question, ; where is the new MAP sensor located? On the stealth D-jet systems using the holly ECU is it mounted in the plenum at the old Cold start valve? - and on the new Jenvey if you go that way is it built into the new manifolds?
- also , what is the status of the distributor developement with the guys you said were making this a plug in play with self contained trigger for the cam and crank sensors? i assume this then would otherwise require the installation of crank sensor for timing like with Haltec,


Phil

QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ Jun 1 2023, 06:06 PM)

Thanks Zach for the real-(914)world feedback. Kelly reported in that Orion's car is tearing up the mountain roads in CA and is pretty phenomenal. We're happy to hear the results and, as Ken's stated... we've been through a ton of development model$ We're super happy with this platform.

To answer a few lingering questions; Holley is having a fun time keeping up with the demand on these new ECU's. Self learning has been what everyone's been asking and waiting for it appears. This comes down to the various components as well. The IAC's were on BO for "months" and I finally gave up and ordered a Haltech unit for these builds. The Haltech systems had a design flaw that didn't allow them to work well at all. The remote housing only allowed the IAC plunger to move about 1/8". This was probably good for 30-40 RPM not the 300-400 we were looking for. OF COURSE, the minute we send them off with the Haltechs we a ) find the issue and b ) the Holley units came back in stock.

ITB's - We absolutely love the Jenvey stuff. Initially, they seemed to be more expensive but, when we learned they came with most everything needed and, the machining and their customer service is second to none... it became a more obvious choice than the gaggle of poorly cast import options. The first 5 systems were built with the Jenvey IDF platform. The only issue I've found with these ITB's is the "base" is an IDF bolt on but the top is not. We use the Vintage Speed Knecht style filter to bring a little "Porsche Vibe" back into the engine compartment and, adapters had to be made to have them fit. The following 6 builds currently in-house will have the Heritage series that Zach mentions. These are straight up IDF copies with injectors hiding in the float bowls and the TPS hidden in the bodies. Problem = Solution.

Back to IAC's a bit... we have an IAC, a MAP and 4 individual throats to deal with. Getting these modern components to operate with a vintage style ITB setup was another challenge. We prototyped many base plates. Some for the bottom of the ITB's and some for the base of the manifolds. We came up with a perfect solution all contained within the manifolds. The IAC isn't picky as to where it delivers the goods. The MAP likes to draw a more even signal. The IAC is ported up top and the MAP is ported at the base and yes... the prototyping with the base plates showed major differences in signal stability within that 4-5" on the manifold. The manifolds went on the mill and ports were added.

We knew there would be a few minor items to tick off on Zach's build as both of the previous installs were done in-house here at the shop. We weren't that concerned about the tune because we ported over the aforementioned "Orion Thorson" tune that we used as our test vehicle with mountain and city driving here in the valley and (as many of you saw) to rave reviews all around Red Rocks Classic 2022. Aside from the IAC issue and what we think is a mechanical hold up on the throttle cable or linkage somewhere (?), the Holley system should self tune to his altitude and he should be a happy camper.

Perhaps Kelly can weigh in here as I know he has some seat time in Orion's car. That engine is fully broken in and they're out there taking names.

We're off tomorrow to dyno Jimmy's motor and we may have another tune to send to Zach and Aaron. We'll see though... again, Orion's tune is extremely stable.

I hope that answers a few questions.

E.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Jun 2 2023, 06:17 AM

I'll tell you how impressed I am with this fuel injection system.

Eric is planning (or has already made) a similar system for the Porsche 6. I'm seriously thinking of saving my (thousands of) pennies and buying it for my 6 cylinder bus project. The CIS is just way too tall to fit into the bus engine compartment without lowering the engine more then I want, and I'd prefer not to have carbs. Jenvey makes ITBs for the 6, and I'm loving the Terminator X ECU.

Zach

Posted by: JmuRiz Jun 2 2023, 07:19 AM

Same here, my /6 engine is getting built with good carbs, but EFI is sooooo much nicer once it's setup for a car that's not driven every day (or year, haha).

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 2 2023, 12:52 PM

QUOTE(DRPHIL914 @ Jun 2 2023, 05:49 AM)

lots of great information for those of us considering this system, motor or both, i have one question, ; where is the new MAP sensor located? On the stealth D-jet systems using the holly ECU is it mounted in the plenum at the old Cold start valve? - and on the new Jenvey if you go that way is it built into the new manifolds?
- also , what is the status of the distributor developement with the guys you said were making this a plug in play with self contained trigger for the cam and crank sensors? i assume this then would otherwise require the installation of crank sensor for timing like with Haltec,


Phil

QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ Jun 1 2023, 06:06 PM)

Thanks Zach for the real-(914)world feedback. Kelly reported in that Orion's car is tearing up the mountain roads in CA and is pretty phenomenal. We're happy to hear the results and, as Ken's stated... we've been through a ton of development model$ We're super happy with this platform.

To answer a few lingering questions; Holley is having a fun time keeping up with the demand on these new ECU's. Self learning has been what everyone's been asking and waiting for it appears. This comes down to the various components as well. The IAC's were on BO for "months" and I finally gave up and ordered a Haltech unit for these builds. The Haltech systems had a design flaw that didn't allow them to work well at all. The remote housing only allowed the IAC plunger to move about 1/8". This was probably good for 30-40 RPM not the 300-400 we were looking for. OF COURSE, the minute we send them off with the Haltechs we a ) find the issue and b ) the Holley units came back in stock.

ITB's - We absolutely love the Jenvey stuff. Initially, they seemed to be more expensive but, when we learned they came with most everything needed and, the machining and their customer service is second to none... it became a more obvious choice than the gaggle of poorly cast import options. The first 5 systems were built with the Jenvey IDF platform. The only issue I've found with these ITB's is the "base" is an IDF bolt on but the top is not. We use the Vintage Speed Knecht style filter to bring a little "Porsche Vibe" back into the engine compartment and, adapters had to be made to have them fit. The following 6 builds currently in-house will have the Heritage series that Zach mentions. These are straight up IDF copies with injectors hiding in the float bowls and the TPS hidden in the bodies. Problem = Solution.

Back to IAC's a bit... we have an IAC, a MAP and 4 individual throats to deal with. Getting these modern components to operate with a vintage style ITB setup was another challenge. We prototyped many base plates. Some for the bottom of the ITB's and some for the base of the manifolds. We came up with a perfect solution all contained within the manifolds. The IAC isn't picky as to where it delivers the goods. The MAP likes to draw a more even signal. The IAC is ported up top and the MAP is ported at the base and yes... the prototyping with the base plates showed major differences in signal stability within that 4-5" on the manifold. The manifolds went on the mill and ports were added.

We knew there would be a few minor items to tick off on Zach's build as both of the previous installs were done in-house here at the shop. We weren't that concerned about the tune because we ported over the aforementioned "Orion Thorson" tune that we used as our test vehicle with mountain and city driving here in the valley and (as many of you saw) to rave reviews all around Red Rocks Classic 2022. Aside from the IAC issue and what we think is a mechanical hold up on the throttle cable or linkage somewhere (?), the Holley system should self tune to his altitude and he should be a happy camper.

Perhaps Kelly can weigh in here as I know he has some seat time in Orion's car. That engine is fully broken in and they're out there taking names.

We're off tomorrow to dyno Jimmy's motor and we may have another tune to send to Zach and Aaron. We'll see though... again, Orion's tune is extremely stable.

I hope that answers a few questions.

E.

Posted by: rick 918-S Jun 2 2023, 03:37 PM

Are you saying in addition to the Jenvey's you need a management system like the Holley? Excuse my question I just took a speed read and skipped too many pages.

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 2 2023, 04:31 PM

QUOTE(rick 918-S @ Jun 2 2023, 03:37 PM)

Are you saying in addition to the Jenvey's you need a management system like the Holley? Excuse my question I just took a speed read and skipped too many pages.

Posted by: echocanyons Jun 2 2023, 05:33 PM

Orion has been driving his car all week and I was lucky enough to put some miles on it too.
It is really a fantastic build and the EFI really wakes the large displacement engine up.
We haven’t had really any issues with the EFI aside from one errant starting issue when Eric dropped it off to us. I think that was related to the ignition switch, which we replaced.

I do think the tuning is good and a lot of the auto tuning is reasonable. There does seem to be some advantages to fine tuning it beyond this using the Holley software. That is our next step, after some reading and learning.

I am really glad that Eric and the team took on these projects and builds. It really is an easy choice to move from old equipment to this and so far is super reliable.


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Posted by: rick 918-S Jun 2 2023, 06:41 PM

QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ Jun 2 2023, 05:31 PM)

QUOTE(rick 918-S @ Jun 2 2023, 03:37 PM)

Are you saying in addition to the Jenvey's you need a management system like the Holley? Excuse my question I just took a speed read and skipped too many pages.

Yes, this would be an entirely new EFI system. Stem to stern.

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 3 2023, 09:20 AM

We delivered Orions car to LA and (of course!!) it didn’t start off the trailer. It went from 4300 ft to 0 that day. I finally jumped in and got it started by performing a flood clear maneuver with the pedal and slowly getting a fire. This is again the beauty of the ECU. Once it got its bearings straight it took over with self learning.

Both Zach and Jim’s motors have Orions DNA tuned into them. We recently dyno’d Jim’s car here and we attempted to get a little more out of it with timing. Again, the beauty of the system. We added 2° and lost 2hp. Back to baseline. We then took out 2° and lost 2hp so we know where we are there. We then had our dyno engineer (another Eric who holds records on the Salt) look at the tune and play with a few of the top end cruising targets in an attempt to get Zach better fuel economy. I was able to email the tune to Zach that afternoon for him to try (another benefit of the system)

Here’s a few pics of the beast;

Posted by: VaccaRabite Jun 3 2023, 10:13 PM

This is cool!

PMBs system uses the stock location for the oil temp sensor to cue the ECU. Meaning you can’t use it for your cabin gauge. But they have a solution!

This sandwich adapter from CSP has a bung for the sender in it! I have a working oil temp gauge in the car again. Added bonus, it’s shorter then the Empi adapter I had been using, so the filter is better protected by the engine bar.

I was worried about grounding. But that ended up not being an issue at all.

Zach

Posted by: StratPlayer Jun 4 2023, 03:26 PM

Same sandwich plate that I have on my car, works like a charm.

Posted by: VaccaRabite Dec 11 2023, 12:38 PM

You may notice that the car is SOAKED.

This weekend I put around 250 miles on the car for what may end up being the last drive of the year, as they are now putting salt down. It was a very busy summer and I did not get to drive the 914 as much as I had wanted, but I did put a little over 1000 miles on the new engine this year.

On the drive home yesterday, nearly the entire 80% of a 100 mile drive was an all out downpour. The car didn't seem to notice. It started right up Sunday morning without drama, and I beat feet home throwing twin rooster tails of water off the back tires the entire time.

I can't say it was the most fun I've had driving a 914 (with no heat, and using a wadded up paper towel to keep the windshield defogged got OLD.) but I wish I had a go-pro on the car for the drive. Cutting through the water like that would have made cool as hell footage.

This morning all the rain we had yesterday was replaced by some snow and slushy ice, so I'm glad the car is tucked away. I'm hopeful to get another drive before Christmas, but that will depend on the roads.

As usual, lots of folks were curious about the engine at the party. And as long as folks were sober they were free to take it for a spin Saturday. The camp out was mostly folks in Bay Windows and Vanagons, so having the weird 914 was cool as hell.



Zach