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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ 914 three speed automatic?

Posted by: MAK Dec 23 2005, 09:49 PM

When I wrote into the SAABnet forum, asking for advise on installing cool side-pipes on my '68 Sonett, I was stoned severly. I'm hoping the purists of you will please excuse the following "imagine if" question, as I seriously would like to know...
Could the entire engine + automatic trans. from an early '80s VW Van be easily fit to my 1970 914/4? "Easily" might not be the right word...maybe "possible"? I know there have been Subaru engine swaps onto Porsche 5 speed but could an Subaru automatic transmission + engine be adapted to Porsche axle? What-ever process and combination of parts...Does anyone know if there have been successful AUTOMATIC 914 projects? Thanks.

Posted by: r_towle Dec 23 2005, 10:04 PM

Well,
The 914 is mid engine, the van is rear engine.

The tranny for the 914 is unique to the 914.

The motor for the 914, the 1.7, the 1.8 are both bus motors...

The 2.0 liter porsche motor is for the 914.

So, the motor will fit, provided its not water cooled, it will fit right in.

The tranny is another story...

I have heard that an audi tranny from the audi 100 might fit, but no one has yet tried.

so, if you search here, look at the automatic tranny threads and you will find lots of information on that topic.

Welcome to the club!!!

Rich

Posted by: SirAndy Dec 23 2005, 10:06 PM

QUOTE (MAK @ Dec 23 2005, 08:49 PM)
Could the entire engine + automatic trans. from an early '80s VW Van be easily fit to my 1970 914/4?

you would have to flip the automatic transmission for use in a mid-engine car.

not sure how you would go about that ...
Andy

Posted by: SirAndy Dec 23 2005, 10:07 PM

QUOTE (r_towle @ Dec 23 2005, 09:04 PM)
the 1.7, the 1.8 are both bus motors...

well, that's not *exactly* true ...

Andy

Posted by: kwales Dec 23 2005, 10:09 PM

It might fit but the gearing would suck. Vans are made to haul large amounts of cargo and not go fast.

For example, my Vanagon tranny is made to work with an engine with max power from 2000-4000rpm. At 70, and in 4th the engine is whining along at 4000 BIG RPM.

Ken

Posted by: r_towle Dec 23 2005, 10:31 PM

QUOTE (SirAndy @ Dec 23 2005, 11:07 PM)

QUOTE (r_towle @ Dec 23 2005, 09:04 PM)
the 1.7, the 1.8 are both bus motors...

well, that's not *exactly* true ...

Andy

I stand corrected...

I believe the 1.7 and 1.8 have the oil dip stick in a different location...

Rich

Posted by: ClayPerrine Dec 23 2005, 10:40 PM

I have seen a 914 with an Audi 3 speed automatic in it. Guy loved his 914 but couldn't drive it due to the loss of his left leg to diabetes. So he had a shop install the automatic. They even used 911 sporto pedals so it looked stock.

It was a 1.7, and it was slow as a dog.

Tranny bolted up to the engine with a bus flex plate. Custom axles and a custom rear mount completed the conversion.

Posted by: Bleyseng Dec 23 2005, 10:41 PM

1.7 bus motors had dual Solexs as did some 1.8 bus motors. Really the 411/412 1.7 is the same as the 1.7 914

Find a Sporto tranny and use that to get a auto matic 914.

popcorn[1].gif

Posted by: boboli914@att.net Dec 24 2005, 07:48 AM

There was a 914 with a automatic in it on Ebay last year. I believe he used a tranny from a audi. It ended with no bids!

Posted by: rick 918-S Dec 24 2005, 08:27 AM

Do you need an auto? It's been done. Someone at one time even posted pics of the Audi conversion. It's a lot of work to convert. Because of the power an auto trans would rob, and the diffeculty in matching shift points to the engines torque curve, I think it would be less than a desirable match.

I would think it would be better to install a complete Suby and do the radiatior in the back like Scott Thatcher. I would think you could even run the turbo version for some added punch.

Posted by: Dr Evil Dec 24 2005, 08:54 AM

As mentioned, the direction of the tranny would be problematic as it is made to go infront of the engine. However, for more power and to go completely away from stock you could use a corvair engine as it will rotate in the direction you need and have more power. Can you say /6? I am not sure of the type of problems this would cause int he tranny, though. They are not used to being run backwards.

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 24 2005, 10:12 AM

I've had a late van auto trans apart...you can't flip the R&P.

Posted by: Brad Roberts Dec 24 2005, 02:45 PM

I'm thinking 411/412 auto tranny. Cheap and easy to find. I'm not sure if we can flip the diff or not? Good question.

B

Posted by: dmenche914 Dec 24 2005, 02:56 PM

If you can't flip the ring gear, it might be possible to turnt eh tranny upside down to get things turing the right way, oil drain ,a nd breather would need to be relocated, but I don't see why running it upside down would not work.

Posted by: ClayPerrine Dec 24 2005, 03:02 PM

QUOTE (dmenche914 @ Dec 24 2005, 02:56 PM)
If you can't flip the ring gear, it might be possible to turnt eh tranny upside down to get things turing the right way, oil drain ,a nd breather would need to be relocated, but I don't see why running it upside down would not work.

Automatics keep the tranny fluid in a pan on the bottom of the tranny. You can't flip them due to the location of the pan.

The Audi transmission is designed to go behind the motor. No modification of the tranny is required to work in a 914.

Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Dec 24 2005, 03:54 PM

So is it that there is no room in the case to flip the R+P? Is it such a big deal to simply cut the case where needed and weld on a cover? I realize its a special skill to weld aluminum (the T3-T4 cases are aluminum right?) but there are welders that know how to do it...

Posted by: Bleyseng Dec 24 2005, 04:24 PM

Should be alot of Fox/Dasher auto's in the junkyards to do this too. or the Passat tiptronic ?

Posted by: MAK Dec 26 2005, 11:40 AM

THANKS ! What great input...helpful and very generous. I'm going to look into that Fox / Dasher option.

While on subject...kinda' -- what's the "VW autostick"?

Posted by: tracks914 Dec 26 2005, 01:00 PM

Has anyone put a front wheel drive transaxle into the back of a 914?
I would have thought maybe using a V6/auto tranny combination would have some alure to non purists who just want to drive a cool car and have fun!!
Besides, a GM 3.8 could give you 200+hp and alot of wheel spin!!!

Posted by: dmenche914 Dec 26 2005, 01:18 PM

The old vw autostick used a vacuum boosted solinoid that was triggered by a switch in the shift knob. Bassically when you pressed the shift knob, the clutch would disengage,and you could shift, no need for the left foot. The later VW's had more of a true automatic tranny.

The vacuum boosted hand operated clutch might be the way to go,a nd that tranny i am sure can be run upside down, or if old enough I believe the ring and pinion can be swapped side to side (old swing axle style) which can be converted to IRS. The possibilities are endless.