Printable Version of Topic
Click here to view this topic in its original format
914World.com _ 914World Garage _ 914 heater
Posted by: STP Jan 30 2006, 10:19 PM
Has anyone improved upon the heating system of their 914?
Jc Whitney makes some heater blower kits for VWs Has anyone tried making these fit in their 914?
What about a higher torque motor?
Mine is on its way out and I've been searching for something like this and so far havn't come up with anything.
Thanks for your help
-Sean
Posted by: richardmosselman Jan 30 2006, 11:21 PM
OMG!...I've just been searching for the same thing! My engine heater fan is putting up a horrible racket. Pelican tech forum had 2 suggestions for alternatives:
1.VW Turbo boost fans in the front compartment
2.Adding a second fan in the back with the original
This is great for increasing the volume,but I'm having trouble just finding a replacement fan/motor for the original...PP and AA both didn't have it on their online catalogue-are they that hard to find?
Any suggestions?Thanks! 
Posted by: alpha434 Jan 30 2006, 11:27 PM
Ha.
I live in colorado and I had to think long and hard about this one.
Bilge blowers.
They're about twenty bucks a pop. And they push A LOT of air. Hmmmmm. So replace the stupid interior fan with two of these.... And maybe mount another two on the heater boxes. And wire them to a speed controller inside....
BLAMMO! Instant heat.
Posted by: Gint Jan 30 2006, 11:43 PM
An old web page entry I did on my first 914.
"I attempted to rebuild a heater blower motor without much success. Mechanically it was shot. You can see in the pictures that the choke coil from the power lead to the brush kept de-soldering itself when the windings smack the magnets due to the shoddy bushing in the bottom of the housing. Notice the grooves in the magnets. Replaced it with a motor from a 73 single blower unit. The mounting flange of the motor was too large to fit in the 74 double outlet housing. With a die grinder I removed approximately .050 all around the mounting hole in the housing. Sandblasted the mounting clamp. Works like a champ if not a tad weak. The motor is a smaller unit, but it beats freezing."
http://members.rennlist.com/gman/porsche/74_914_heater_motor/
Posted by: richardmosselman Jan 30 2006, 11:53 PM
Thanks,mine is a '72-different heater motor again? AA had some sort of upgrade for '73-'74's motors to the "better" '75-'76 motors. I e-mailed them to see if this would work on mine.
Posted by: rhodyguy Jan 31 2006, 10:41 AM
is aa's upgrade is the splitter that goes on the single outlet fan (it's shown in their old school paper catalog)? it just allows you to add a second hose that runs to the j-tube on the passenger side. the early fan is a dual outlet that mounts on the top of the fan shroud. if your passenger side j-tube has no fan hose, and is uncapped, a great portion of the heated air from the pass side he is pouring into the engine compartment.
k
Posted by: ClayPerrine Jan 31 2006, 10:55 AM
I remember someone in the past was putting in 2 12V hair dryers to increase the heat in the car.
Posted by: itsa914 Jan 31 2006, 10:59 AM
| QUOTE (STP @ Jan 30 2006, 08:19 PM) |
| Has anyone improved upon the heating system of their 914? Jc Whitney makes some heater blower kits for VWs Has anyone tried making these fit in their 914? What about a higher torque motor? Mine is on its way out and I've been searching for something like this and so far havn't come up with anything. Thanks for your help -Sean |
Is the problem volume of heat or just not hot enough? My 70 has no heater blower but everything else is hooked up. I get plenty of heat while I'm moving
During the winter here in Indiana when the roads are dry (and salt free) I drive all the time in 30 ish temps and I am plenty warm.I would check and make sure your heating system is functioning properly before looking at doing any mods. Things I have found in the past were the flapper box was stuck closed blocking the flow of heat. I also found a critter made a nice little nest in the passenger side heater tube area, again blocking flow.
Posted by: rhodyguy Jan 31 2006, 11:07 AM
after ensuring that the complete heating system on your car is up to snuff, and you think you need more, go to www.barneysimportparts.com and look at their system.
k
Posted by: Dave_Darling Jan 31 2006, 12:09 PM
| QUOTE (alpha434 @ Jan 30 2006, 09:27 PM) |
| Bilge blowers. |
They're loud as heck, and they do not deal with hot air very well. I have heard reports from two people who used them in-line (after the exchangers, before the dash) and both of them had failures and didn't replace the blowers. Very loud, and not reliable when pushing very warm air.
--DD
Posted by: ClayPerrine Jan 31 2006, 12:12 PM
| QUOTE (rhodyguy @ Jan 31 2006, 11:07 AM) |
| after ensuring that the complete heating system on your car is up to snuff, and you think you need more, go to www.barneysimportparts.com and look at their system. k |
The URL in your post is dead.......
Posted by: alpha434 Jan 31 2006, 12:13 PM
You have to get the ones that shield the motor. They make some like that. I've got two in position to augment the heater boxes, since the other fan works well. But I might change over the other fan too. I really need the window defrosters for those really cold mornings.
Posted by: Oliver Jan 31 2006, 12:17 PM
I want heat too...
Pics helpful my car is missing stuff....
Posted by: Dr Evil Jan 31 2006, 12:24 PM
| QUOTE (Dave_Darling @ Jan 31 2006, 11:09 AM) | ||
They're loud as heck, and they do not deal with hot air very well. I have heard reports from two people who used them in-line (after the exchangers, before the dash) and both of them had failures and didn't replace the blowers. Very loud, and not reliable when pushing very warm air. --DD |
Hey DD,
that is fundamentally flawed how hey installed them. The set up we have in our cars draws air from the top on purpose. That way you are PUSHing air through the system and thus not sucking any CO or exhaust nasties into your system. This also shields the motor from extra heat.
Deffineitly DO NOT install your blower motor in a sucking capacity AFTER the heat exchangers. This could have very bad circumstances.
Just my $.02.
Posted by: alpha434 Jan 31 2006, 12:35 PM
Right. Thats what I did. And if I redo the primary fan, then I'll mount the blowers right against the bulkhead in that corner, as far from the heat source as possible.
Posted by: degreeoff Jan 31 2006, 02:46 PM
I like this one......
http://barneysimportparts.qwestdex.com/barneysimportparts/Page7.html
Scroll to the oil heater...
thinking about it for my 6
Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Jan 31 2006, 03:02 PM
This whole discussion is bogus. Maintained and adjusted PROPERLY, a stock 914 heater system soon requires that you roll down the windows to keep the cabin temps in the "comfort zone". If it'll heat a VW bus, it'll sure heat a teener. I've driven in mid 30s weather with the top off, and not felt cold. You need to put your energies into fixing what you have, not throwing money at stuff you don't need ........................................... The Cap'n
Posted by: jhadler Jan 31 2006, 05:02 PM
If there's not enough -heat-, then you've got other problems. If there's not enough air flowing, then chances are that either your existing fan is not working, or there is a break or blockage in the either the heat exhanger or heater tubes. No need to bodge it, the stock system works pretty well.
The factory heater system was plenty good to heat my 914 for those frosty morning drives down from the mountains in the winter...
-Josh2
Posted by: Rand Jan 31 2006, 05:09 PM
Agreed. Mine will roast me out in freezing temperatures. The factory fan will put out plenty of airflow if it is in good working order. Fix what you have.
The only reason to go away from the stock heating system is if you run headers with no HEs. Then http://www.espar.com/htm/Specs/D3LCspec.htm makes sense to me since you have it on board and electric is not practical.
Posted by: rhodyguy Jan 31 2006, 05:25 PM
that URL was from an ad in an old hotvws. sorry i made ya type barney's import parts into a seach engine 
. i too think it's misspent money. got headers? wear goretex and gloves. my heat system is tight enough that i don't need the aux fan.
k
Posted by: kwales Jan 31 2006, 06:07 PM
Look at an aircooled type 4 engined VW van at a pic n pull. I bought a spare engine with a ton of spare parts at a VW swap meet and there, in a box with 4 carbs and manifolds was a hot air blower fan with the dual outlets.....
Looks like it will fit right onto the 914 blower bracket in the engine compartment. Van blower motor might have a little more umph as the air path in the van is longer.
Ken
Posted by: richardmosselman Jan 31 2006, 06:45 PM
Thanks for all the input guys! 
To reiterate (and not hijack STP's thread completely): It's not the amt of heat that's my problem-its the fan. Gone Kaput! When I pull up the red lever to actuate the fan a horrible screaching occurs-Banshee Heaven. I'm going to assume that a bearing has fried or s/thing. I'm quite new to the teener scene so I was just looking for a source for the blower motor-used part places are pretty rare up here. THANKS!-Richard.
(is the VW van blower motor compatible?)
Posted by: blabla914 Jan 31 2006, 07:01 PM
I ran twin stock post '73 blower fans on my car for years. Just tap into the existing electrical. The relay seems to deal with the second fan no problem.
I really liked this setup for a few reasons.
First, it gets rid of the fan mounted up on the fan shroud in the middle of the engine compartment on pre '73 cars. On post '73 cars it gets rid of that damn hose running across the engine compartment.
Second, if you modify a post '73 bracket you can weld it on the right side sqeezed down by the battery. This worked on my car since I did not have a fuel injection brain. I'm not sure it would fit with the brain in place. Using two stock fans it looks clean and factory with no addtional noise.
Third, my heat was always hot, but if you drive in town a lot the stock fan leaves a bit to be desired. The second fan really pumps the heat. I ran this setup in Potsdam, NY 12 miles south of Canada. Kept me toasty.
Unfortunately, my car no longer has heat and I don't have any pictures of this installation. I think you may have to modify the second bracket a lot or rotate the motor on the fan housing. I can't remember exactly how I got everything to fit. Get two fans and an extra bracket. It works.
Kelly
Posted by: jhadler Jan 31 2006, 07:04 PM
Not to hijack, but what are the differences in the heater fans over the years?
More to the point, was the a year (or years) where the fan was the smallest and lightest? The rules (in my class) do not allow me to -remove- the fan. But I can update/backdate to any fan that came in the 914-4...
-Josh2
Posted by: Dave_Darling Jan 31 2006, 07:13 PM
Fans: 70-72 == dual-outlet fan, mounted above the engine cooling fan shroud toward the middle of the engine bay.
73-74 == single-outlet fan, mounted on a pedastal on the left-side engine shelf. The right-side "J-tube" is capped off.
75-76 == single-outlet fan with a splitter on the outlet.
I would doubt that there is much weight difference at all between them. The 73-74 setup has one less hose, so that might be a little lighter. But I'm not sure you have to keep the hoses.
--DD
Posted by: richardmosselman Jan 31 2006, 07:17 PM
DD-am I just not negotiating the PP site correctly? I tried looking for a blower motor,but nada. Any part #'s ? Thanks.
Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Jan 31 2006, 07:50 PM
A lot of heat can be dumped through leaks in the system. Verify the air tightness of all the gaskets at the S-tubes to fan housing, at the flapper valves and any other place where leaks could occur and if everything is up to snuff, you will be roasted. Guaranteed. I occasionally drive in winter temps here (30-40s) with the top off and only the heat pumpin'...its very comfy... 
Posted by: richardmosselman Jan 31 2006, 08:25 PM
I...needs.....a.......fan........motor. 
Posted by: jim_hoyland Jan 31 2006, 08:48 PM
I mounted two 3" marine in-line turbo fans on top of the two flanges behind the speakers. These suckers really pull the heat up and in. I usuall only run them for 15-20 minutes and then just use the 914 heater fan. The fit is perfect, the heat is faster, and that 4:00am drive is very confy.
I have posted pics before; will see if they are on "other" computer.
Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Jan 31 2006, 08:52 PM
Heat is no problemo in a 914 if the stock system is working correctly.
What I have always had a problem with is the fresh air system. Not only is it loud, but it hardly blows air at all.
Anyone else?
Posted by: Rand Jan 31 2006, 08:55 PM
For grins I http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/74-Porsche-914-Engine-Cooling-Fan-RUNS_W0QQitemZ4607855126QQcategoryZ10076QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem.
The seller says it's an "engine cooling fan!" 
But at least it "runs!" Good thing, otherwise your engine might overheat! 
Posted by: SGB Jan 31 2006, 11:28 PM
| QUOTE (bowlsby @ Jan 31 2006, 09:52 PM) |
| Heat is no problemo in a 914 if the stock system is working correctly. What I have always had a problem with is the fresh air system. Not only is it loud, but it hardly blows air at all. Anyone else? |
Since getting SS heat exchangers, I have to run the fresh air fan to balence the heat load. It has pathetic output, especially for that much noise. I blasted mine with WD-40 and it did seem to help. Seems like a computer fan would work alot better....
Posted by: STP Feb 1 2006, 12:27 AM
Wow, great info from everyone!
There seems to be some dispute over whether the stock motor even needs to be replaced.
This may be so for those of you whose heaters actually blow air. Mine just makes alot of noise.
Those Barney's Import kits are the same type we put on my mom's Karmann Ghia. They work great!
So based on all this new information I have some more questions.
Has anyone tried adapting the Barney kits to their 914?
When you do install this do you completely eliminate the stock motor?
And is this the right choice, a new motor of a different type, or am I better off buying a new stock replacement, or rebuilding the one that's in there now?
I humbly await your replies.
BTW, this is mine. Just bought it last week.
Thanks again for all your help,
-Sean
Posted by: Rand Feb 1 2006, 12:41 AM
I think things spun off a bit because of other people adding to the thread about heater problems. In your case, you need a new blower motor, or maybe it could be rebuilt. For those whose motors are running fine, the problem is likely to be an air leak in the system. Bottom line is a 914 heating system in good working order is very adequate and does not need improvement.... but that didn't help you find a blower motor!
Put a WTB ad in the classifieds here. Check Ebay. Etc. Heck, I'll sell you the one off my car if nothing else turns up!
Posted by: Dave_Darling Feb 1 2006, 12:51 AM
| QUOTE (richardmosselman @ Jan 31 2006, 05:17 PM) |
| DD-am I just not negotiating the PP site correctly? I tried looking for a blower motor,but nada. Any part #'s ? Thanks. |
This one appears to be the early blower (though it may be the later one superceding the early one?) --
473 261 193 BLOWER 914-4
No other one listed in my parts listing.
--DD
Posted by: richardmosselman Feb 1 2006, 08:25 AM
Thanks DD! Will look it up after work.
Posted by: bd1308 Feb 1 2006, 08:29 AM
i have the later single output one.
10 clams plus shipping and its yours.
b
Posted by: richardmosselman Feb 1 2006, 04:15 PM
Thanks BD 1308,have a lead on a correct dual outlet-if that doesn't pan out I'll contact u.
Posted by: bd1308 Feb 1 2006, 04:16 PM
cool.
b
Powered by Invision Power Board (http://www.invisionboard.com)
© Invision Power Services (http://www.invisionpower.com)