Printable Version of Topic

Posted by: stephen7 Apr 25 2006, 10:23 PM

I was reading the Excellence article about the budget 912 racer and the owner claims 140hp out of the engine. They didn't talk the about the price of getting that kind of output from 2 liters except that there was alot of head work and special pistons were used. ($$$$) Anybody have an idea of what it costs to get a reliable race motor with that kind of power? And, if you can do it, is it only a track motor or could you autocross it also?

Posted by: Dave_Darling Apr 25 2006, 10:38 PM

All it takes is time, money, blood, sweat, and tears. Mostly tears at looking at how much money you spent...

All you have to do to get power out of a motor is spin it fast enough. The real $$$ comes in making sure that it can use that RPM effectively (that's money spent on flowing the heads, etc.) and on making sure it can stay together for a little while at your target RPM.

A "race motor" can run on race gas. I believe 105 octane is available, and I know that 100 is. So the compression will go up--and up--and up! Couple that with a very lumpy cam and heads that flow very well (and more compression because the cam "bleeds it off"), and it's not hard to get to 140 HP. The EP guys used to get 140-160 HP routinely out of 1.8 liters, so getting it from 2.0 liters should be a little easier!

It will cost cubic dollars, though. And don't expect to put too many hours on it before you need to "freshen" it up.

SWAG? $10K development, $5K+ build, a couple grand for every "freshening".

--DD

Posted by: Jake Raby Apr 25 2006, 10:52 PM

Not even a challenge...

The smallest engine I build is 145 HP- Dyno proven

Posted by: sean_v8_914 Apr 25 2006, 11:23 PM

Jake, I liked the last avatar better

Posted by: trekkor Apr 25 2006, 11:33 PM

You forgot to include the price tag and build time.

Oooh oooh...Let me guess, $10k and 9 months...

That was the question in the first post, right?


KT

Posted by: Mueller Apr 26 2006, 12:15 AM

I see you've been hanging out with Grant

actually, his question was a little vague, is he talking a true 912 motor or is he asking about building a Type IV?

Does he need a "race" motor or is he just using the term loosly?

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 26 2006, 12:20 AM

gee all knowing trek - whats it cost to rebuild a 2L six to 140 hp?

humm....

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 26 2006, 12:22 AM

shit, ill even go one step further. i have a 1969 2.0 T motor core (of same shape you start with a type 4 core) I wil DONATE to you if you can rebuild to 140 HP cheaper than a raby kit.

Posted by: Hammy Apr 26 2006, 12:24 AM

Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

Posted by: redshift Apr 26 2006, 12:26 AM

Uhoh! Aaron wants a FREE rebuild.




M

Posted by: Aaron Cox Apr 26 2006, 12:28 AM

freaking ruining my master plan here!

Posted by: Brando Apr 26 2006, 02:08 AM

Aaron,
I think if you took that core all the way to stuttgart and asked Porsche to rebuild it, they'd smelt it down and build you up a new one with the metal rather than refurb it

Posted by: TimT Apr 26 2006, 03:27 AM

Its available,we run 116 or 112 octane mostly in the 935

Posted by: VegasRacer Apr 26 2006, 04:07 AM

Posted by: rhodyguy Apr 26 2006, 06:26 AM

i bet 10k is on the low side. that was as trick a "budget" race car as i've seen. wdik.

k

Posted by: Jake Raby Apr 26 2006, 06:34 AM

No time line or price was mentioned by the original poster.

Yes, I am backlogged-

No, I'm not cheap.

Posted by: trekkor Apr 26 2006, 09:48 AM

Look at the question in the original post.

Very specific.

"Anybody have an idea of what it costs to get a reliable race motor with that kind of power? "

that was all...


KT

Posted by: Jake Raby Apr 26 2006, 10:23 AM

Damn, cost is so "unimportant" here that I suppose I looked right over the word!

Posted by: Mueller Apr 26 2006, 11:54 AM

yea sorta specific but could be asking the wrong question..."why" a "race" motor when one can get that power from a street engine??

"race" engine is too broad of a term and is often misused

Posted by: Brett W Apr 26 2006, 11:58 AM

140hp is a well tuned street 2.0. It could be built for less than 5K if you watch where you spend your money.

Posted by: Jake Raby Apr 26 2006, 08:52 PM

Fresh meat always tastes best, its better when the blood is still warm! I

On a more serious note, a 2056 can easily get you 140 ponies with the right cam and heads, especially if running on race gas..
I honestly seldom ever look at the poster's info when making a post, it doesn't really matter because if its about HP on this forum it's going to turn into a pissing match....

Posted by: Joe Ricard Apr 27 2006, 05:38 AM

Get a six, get a big 4
Either way you will spend money, those that just dropped huge coin on a six conversion to obtain 140 HP. should be proud of thier car.
those that entered the Massive Type IV club equally should be proud of thier car.

Both recipes require more money than I have. wanna go fast? buy some better tires and learn how to drive.

Posted by: Racer Chris Apr 27 2006, 06:13 AM

Posted by: nocones Apr 27 2006, 08:27 AM

I'm with Joe on this one.

HP is the last thing you need to go fast. Better tires and suspension, and a lot of work on the nut behind the wheel. That's the way to get faster without breaking the bank.