Printable Version of Topic

Posted by: r_towle Aug 1 2006, 10:37 AM

Hi,
have you guy ever seen side draft carbs on a VW motor??

specifically, in the case of using atype 4 motor, and trying to retain the lower profile of the engine...side draft webers to keep it all under a floor (think pickup)

Rich

Posted by: Brad Roberts Aug 1 2006, 10:47 AM

I'm not "Dad Roberts", but I am from the same gene pool..

I think it would work great. Dual sidedraft 40's on 2.0 and up.

Most of the Turbo Bug racers ran a sidedraft Weber for years.


B

Posted by: Sammy Aug 1 2006, 10:58 AM

I had a 50 DCOE on a type 4, but it was hooked to a turbo.
One of the problems with a side draft is a length of the intake runners. If they are long they need to be heated for smooth partial throttle operation. Same scenario as a single two bbl.
If they are not heated you could have fuel puddling on the walls which results in lean conditions and stumbling.

They work great at idle and full throttle, but the transitions are challenging.
If you can keep the intake runners as short as possible you might have a winner.

Posted by: Dave_Darling Aug 1 2006, 11:32 AM

It will work better if you can heat up the runners, or the carb base. Or the intake charge--and a turbo is very good for that!

--DD

Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 1 2006, 12:46 PM

aimed toward the middle? (common airbox?)
or aimed outward (where do you find the room???)

are you doing a type 4 into a type 3 or something?

Posted by: r_towle Aug 1 2006, 04:33 PM

Not meaning to dis you...just Dad seems to have been thinking out of the box alot longer...lol...



The will aim out, away from the motor...to nice grills on the side..not a 914..so dont worry..think custom rat rod style...

So are there intakes out there for this in the buggy world ??

I figured, cut, flip, reweld a set of intakes for the normal webers...sort of...basically that is the idea...lots of porting to be done...but that is the basic idea..so short ones..

Rich

Posted by: jd74914 Aug 1 2006, 04:36 PM

They put side drafts on Rabbits all of the time

Are you doing a VW pickup?

Posted by: Dad Roberts Aug 2 2006, 10:32 AM

Toooooooo funny .....I think that was a nice way to say.......he's OLDER than you . Does kinda sound like you're doin a Type III, but it also sounds like you're really not ready to share yet . You have the right idea on your manifolds. You might want to check out "Volksrods.com", there's a LOT of "outside " the box thinking there. Nothing in particular related to your setup but ya never know?............Dad

Posted by: r_towle Aug 2 2006, 07:09 PM

it will be a type 4 motor...in a custom car..
Not completely fixed on the car yet..but bug/bus chopped with a low stance...I will be going for the for two door look...sort of...

I want the motor to remain under the rear deck/floor
Still have normal usable space in there...so I can haul stuff,
Bit I want a bigger motor, run off of carbs.

If I use webers IDF/IDA, which I have seen done, it raises the floor to high.
If I use side draft webers, I assume the same size, then I can keep the floor lower, provide fresh air to the webers out each side...and still ahve a big motor...

So, what to do about the intake manifolds..is there a place in the buggy world that makes something that is easier to make fit versus taking Type 4 IDF manifolds and cutting them, flipping them, rewelding them, and porting them...seems like there must be something out there already..these motors have been around for a while..somebody must ahve gone with side drafts...

Rich

PS,
DAD...
Not older,,,just seen more, BTDT kida compliment..

Could you please share that pic of the cool type 4 pickup that you posted here once...
If I use

Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 2 2006, 10:30 PM

never seen such a manifold....

its gonna be custom....

Posted by: Dad Roberts Aug 3 2006, 12:51 PM

I've never seen the manifolds you need. Here's a couple pics. Go to the Volksrods website for a full buildup. "Walts 34 pickup"



Attached image(s)

Posted by: Sammy Aug 3 2006, 02:00 PM

The linkage will be a bitch.
Generally you want your linkage to be as short as possible. Having the carbs pointing outwards will make them fairly long.

Shorty webbers with no air horns on short manifolds will be as low as side drafts. Just thinkin out lowd

Posted by: r_towle Aug 3 2006, 02:04 PM

How do I say this...

Though your suggestion is quite valid.....

to easy..

This will be a show car...and easy dont win...

rich

Posted by: Sammy Aug 3 2006, 03:54 PM

I gotcha.

Posted by: Dad Roberts Aug 3 2006, 07:06 PM

Been ponderin this for a bit...(sleepin ).....and wondered if you were thinkin about takin fuelie runners and basically reversin them outward? I know you would have to slice and dice a bit but you would have your base flanges and the tubing would be easy to work with. Main thing you would need is carb base flanges. As for linkage, you might be able to run cables (ala motorcycle). I seem to remember someone doing that. Single works fine on my setup, just split it. Okay......now I can eat.....and go back to ponderin ( sleep ) some more......Dad



Attached image(s)

Posted by: r_towle Aug 3 2006, 07:23 PM

Honestly I would hope that I can get some sort of intake for the side drafts..at least to get the flange...prefer aluminum..

then, take a set of intakes for a normal set of IDF's cut off both flanges...turn over the tubes (or make some cool tubes)
But,,my thoguhts are if I turn over a set of normal weber intakes, the curve may be perfect to just get over the heads,,and I can always shorten them..

then weld the head flange back on..and weld the new sidedraft flange on the other end...

Im not sure if that explains it correctly...
I was honestly hoping for an easier solution..Ill have to hunt around...there may be some british car intake setup that I could utilise...at least some of it...

You know how the old ford flatheads had the little reverse scoops over the carbs...when running three carbs ....

Think of those, sticking out the side of a car...cool huh...

Rich

Posted by: Dad Roberts Aug 4 2006, 04:34 PM

Well.........I would never stoop to anything so outrageous.......hell, I couldn't get back up .....Cool sounds like it should cover it . Not sure if you've seen my Caddy pics, but......it's sportin 3 dueces, from the factory . .Dad
PS......We will be goin down to Elsinore in the morning to see what may be the new headlights for the Caddy. Just haven't been able to get those SQUARE headlights to grow on me .Dad

Posted by: r_towle Aug 4 2006, 04:37 PM

Show us some pics..I have never seen it...

I love that blue one..quite cool and made me figure you were the guy who might have seen this before...

Rich

Posted by: Dad Roberts Aug 4 2006, 04:48 PM

Ask and ye shall receive..............Oh yea, there is some small photoshop on those pics....white on the front and back bumper...trim by headlights is actually painted


Attached thumbnail(s)


Attached image(s)

Posted by: r_towle Aug 4 2006, 06:54 PM

sweet...

Give the lights some time..I would even suggest getting shorter ones..that would look really cool, and there are so many new fangled lights out there...1.5 to 2 inch hight ones....oh keep working on those its really quite cool..

Rich