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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ Light Mechanisms
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 05:01 PM
I decided to take a light mechanism in to the platers with the last batch. I really like the way it came out. I polished up the ring and mounted the Carello's. Then I stuck the trim piece on there for good measure.
These, the Pilots and the Hella's and Aaron and I should be lighting up the night. I hope that 911 alternator can keep up!
Attached image(s)
Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2006, 06:00 PM
i got the shitty (understatement) h4 bargains of ebay... they suck ass. the dont sit tight and flop around.....
where can i get some real h4 housings???
btw - hella's + pilots are scary amount of light...
my alt cannot run all 3.... (330 watts = 30 amps or so...... with all accessories.. my alt is hosed)
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:06 PM
http://www.danielsternlighting.com/products/products.html
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:09 PM
I think I'll throw some of these loom melters in there:
130/100W Narva: $19/ea
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:14 PM
Any electrical geniuses out there know what is involved in wiring all of these properly and what the alternator needs to be?
I have a couple 911 alternators out of the car now that I could have rebuilt if that's what it takes. Maybe a late model 911 alternator would be able to keep up in a stipped down racer (no radio etc.)
Aaron, can your pops weigh in?
I think it's the same set up you'd be using:
Pilots
Hellas
H4's 130/100
No wires run yet... need advice.
Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2006, 06:16 PM
LOL 130/100 bulbs? im using 55/60 for streetabilty....
you will need to run dedicated 12 or 10 gauge wires to the front of the car with relays for that kinda current draw!
lemme ask pops...
55 x 6 = 330 watt draw in my application
Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2006, 06:19 PM
LOL 130/100 bulbs? im using 55/60 for streetabilty....
lemme ask pops...
55 x 6 = 330 watt draw in my application
http://www.angelfire.com/pa/baconbacon/page2.html
330 watts at 12v is 27.5 amp current draw....
a CDI (msd type) pullsa bout 9 amps i hear
fuel pump = 3 or 4?
various sidemarker and brakelight etc lamps = X amps
27.5 + 9 = 36.5 amp draw, plus ligths fuel pump etc...
dont think a stock 55 amp type 4 alt will handle it
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:19 PM
Alright... maybe the 100/55W Narva's and I'll flick the switch when I want to melt deer at 50 paces. I'm gonna miss that 30 watts though! 
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:21 PM
http://www.angelfire.com/pa/baconbacon/page2.html
That page gives me the hives... tell me what to do
Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2006, 06:23 PM
enter 12v, and expected total wattage draw of your lights in the watts...
2 x 55w hella = 110
2 x 55w pilots = 110
2 x INSERT H4 WATT DRAW HERE = x
add em up....
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:26 PM
VOLTS 12
AMPS 33.33333333333333333333333
OHMS .36
WATTS 400
Posted by: Aaron Cox Aug 20 2006, 06:29 PM
ok.. so 34 amps are dedicated to night lighting.
how much do all the other systems on the car draw?
wipers?
fuel pump?
ignition (BIG DRAW)
turn signals/brake lights/running lights?
etc...
then i would leave at least 10 amp for safety
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:34 PM
Would I be right in assuming it would probably need to be around 90 amps? (55+30+??)
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 06:39 PM
Looks like this would do the trick...
911 603 120 05
Valeo 90 Amp for an 84-89 car.
Posted by: draperjojo Aug 20 2006, 06:59 PM
Good ole Ohm's Law E=I X R E= voltage, I= current, and R= resistence. Add up all known wattage loads and divide by voltage and you get your current requirement. Then you want to service factor it by some percentage for safety and inrush current. #10 Cu wire is good for 30-35 amps depending on the insulation, #8 Cu is good for 40-45 amps, #6 Cu will handle 65 amps, and #4 is good for about 90 amps. I like using the welding cable because there are some many more strands, it is flexible and easier to work with than FLAP, or Home Depot residential or commercial wire.
Posted by: Gint Aug 20 2006, 07:51 PM
What'd you paint those housings with? Looks good.
Posted by: bondo Aug 20 2006, 08:12 PM
where can i get some real h4 housings???
http://www.gowesty.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=70477&Category_Code=
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 10:25 PM
Valspar 55409 "Vanilla". Special plastic enamel.
Color is an exact match. I spent hours trying to clean them up with everything in the book. I took the worst set I had and tried this stuff (I have a couple more sets). The result is what you see.
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 20 2006, 10:31 PM
Hired... only you're not running welding cable in my car.
Posted by: gklinger Aug 20 2006, 11:35 PM
got mine http://www.rallylights.com/hella/7in.asp.
Posted by: LowGT Aug 21 2006, 12:09 AM
Valspar 55409 "Vanilla". Special plastic enamel.
Excellent choice.
<=== works for Valspar.
Posted by: draperjojo Aug 21 2006, 08:02 AM
Hired... only you're not running welding cable in my car.
Personal preference for sure. I like it because it flexible while at the same time carries current very well...welding cable, who'd of thought. My concern is upgrading the alternator and making sure the wire is upgraded also. No sense in putting a 90 amp alternator in to run 70 amps of light when the wire will only handle 50 amps. You know I have to inspect your work don't ya....
Posted by: davep Aug 21 2006, 11:11 AM
Watts = Volts x Amps
simple enough, BUT whats the volts: nominal volts are 12 volts for automotive, fully charged battery is 12.8 volts (if you remove the surface charge after charging up), and charging voltage should be about 13.8 to 14.0 volts. I don't know if they rate the lights wattage at 12 volts, 12.8 or 13.8, suffice to say that is the lights are rated at 60 watts @ 12 volts, then the wattage will be higher when installed. Then the actual voltage at the lights when installed in a car with zz feet of xx guage wire and a relay plus fuse; oh hell, just go measure it. Amp capacity of a wire depends on the guage, the number of strands and the length; not to mention if it is copper or not, and the quality of the copper (present Chinese copper wire is not very good, and the price of copper has at least doubled in the last while).
Anyway, my point is that such things almost have to be engineered individually. My rule of thumb is that there is little excess power available from a stock alternator, and the stock 914/4 alternator is just 50 amps ( the 411 had 55 amp alternator to run the extra gas heaters). So if you add non stock items like high power lights you may want to run dedicated wiring and both a fuse and a relay to link to the stock wiring and switch. Then you probably have to upgrade the alternator and its harness to handle the extra load.
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 24 2006, 10:02 AM
Brian... look at the surround pics.
Posted by: jonwatts Aug 24 2006, 10:06 AM
Valspar 55409 "Vanilla". Special plastic enamel.
Excellent choice.
<=== works for Valspar.
I had trouble googling this color or part number. It looks like Valspar owns Plasti-Kote. Was this a Plasti-Kote paint?
Posted by: bmunday Aug 24 2006, 12:09 PM
Brian... look at the surround pics.
Thanks to the guy in the salmon colored shirt!!!!
Kudos to Mr Shea, Eric was kind enough to take time from his busy schedule to help me out... This place ROCKS!!!!!
Thanks Again "E"
Posted by: Eric_Shea Aug 24 2006, 01:17 PM
No prob. Brian. 
It's a Valspar can. Got a Depot in your neck of the woods? Look in the paint section and look for the paint that adheres to plastic. Should be right up front.
Maybe Dan (LowGT) can weigh in...
Posted by: markb Mar 18 2007, 04:18 PM
<!-- quoteo(post=756607:date=Aug 20 2006, 11:09 PM:name=LowGT) --><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(LowGT @ Aug 20 2006, 11:09 PM)
</div><div class='quotemain'><!-- quotec --><!-- quoteo(post=756518:date=Aug 20 2006, 11:25 PM:name=Eric_Shea) --><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ Aug 20 2006, 11:25 PM)
</div><div class='quotemain'><!-- quotec -->Valspar 55409 "Vanilla". Special plastic enamel. <!-- QuoteEnd --></div><!-- QuoteEEnd -->
Excellent choice.
<=== works for Valspar.
<!-- QuoteEnd --></div><!-- QuoteEEnd -->
I had trouble googling this color or part number. It looks like Valspar owns Plasti-Kote. Was this a Plasti-Kote paint?
Can anybody out there get this paint? Home Depot no longer carries it, snd though I can find it online, I can't find anyone that actually SELLS it.
Posted by: Crazyhippy Mar 18 2007, 04:35 PM
You do have the battery keeping the lights lit.... Yeah the alternator isn't big enough, but the few watts it's short wont drain the battery very quickly.
Besides, how long will you be running all the lights for anyways?
Posted by: bondo Mar 19 2007, 03:50 AM
<!-- quoteo(post=756607:date=Aug 20 2006, 11:09 PM:name=LowGT) --><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(LowGT @ Aug 20 2006, 11:09 PM)
</div><div class='quotemain'><!-- quotec --><!-- quoteo(post=756518:date=Aug 20 2006, 11:25 PM:name=Eric_Shea) --><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Eric_Shea @ Aug 20 2006, 11:25 PM)
</div><div class='quotemain'><!-- quotec -->Valspar 55409 "Vanilla". Special plastic enamel. <!-- QuoteEnd --></div><!-- QuoteEEnd -->
Excellent choice.
<=== works for Valspar.
<!-- QuoteEnd --></div><!-- QuoteEEnd -->
I had trouble googling this color or part number. It looks like Valspar owns Plasti-Kote. Was this a Plasti-Kote paint?
Can anybody out there get this paint? Home Depot no longer carries it, snd though I can find it online, I can't find anyone that actually SELLS it.
Miners carries "fusion" spray paint for plastic. I don't know if it comes in the right color though. I used semi-gloss black on my van's grill, and it does indeed stick to plastic. Unfortunately it made the oem paint crinkle a tad. Still the best looking part of the van though.
Posted by: jasons Mar 19 2007, 09:00 AM
I had trouble googling this color or part number. It looks like Valspar owns Plasti-Kote. Was this a Plasti-Kote paint?
Can anybody out there get this paint? Home Depot no longer carries it, snd though I can find it online, I can't find anyone that actually SELLS it.
Miners carries "fusion" spray paint for plastic. I don't know if it comes in the right color though. I used semi-gloss black on my van's grill, and it does indeed stick to plastic. Unfortunately it made the oem paint crinkle a tad. Still the best looking part of the van though.
I used a "Fusion" Color on mine. "Satin Dover White", it looks pretty accurate to me. BTW, my lights are Hellas. Not sure what bulbs I have though.
Attached image(s)
Posted by: markb Mar 19 2007, 11:02 AM
Thanks! I'll have to make a stop at Miners on the way to the shop this morning.
Posted by: Aaron Cox Mar 19 2007, 11:04 AM
here is a cibie h4 housing to compare to that hella.
Posted by: ClayPerrine Mar 19 2007, 12:58 PM
You could always install a second alternator dedicated to run just the aux lighting on the car. Put a small japanese 90 amp alt where the smog pump mounted and you are all set. Use direct feeds from the alt to the lights, and use a relay to energize the field when you want to turn the lights on. That way you don't have the load from the second alt when running during the day.
Posted by: Aaron Cox Mar 19 2007, 01:02 PM
i actually load tested the draw when all was on .... was still under 50 amps....
thus i have ran all 6 lights
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