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Posted by: DNHunt Oct 20 2006, 05:51 PM

This engine is cursed. Time for another teardown. At the least a rering but, I'm gonna check everything I can on the way down.

Dave


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Posted by: messix Oct 20 2006, 05:54 PM

time for a sbc if'n this doesn't work.

Posted by: JPB Oct 20 2006, 06:18 PM

DAMIENNNNNNNNNN! Ahh you look like you may need a Scuby Smack.

Give into the dark side............and don't look back.

Posted by: DNHunt Oct 20 2006, 07:34 PM

Naw I believe in cooling with good clean air. Blessing with holy water may be in store.

Dave

Posted by: boxstr Oct 20 2006, 07:38 PM

I think it should be 999.

Posted by: 9146986 Oct 20 2006, 08:50 PM

I think it's trying to tell you to get a ..........6???

Posted by: mstein95 Oct 20 2006, 08:59 PM

Assisting Dave remove ole 666 was a treat. I have to admit I was probably the best flashlight holder ever. Thanks again Dave for the crash course in 914 engine removal. I owe you a cold one....or two.



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Posted by: Brett W Oct 20 2006, 10:11 PM

Whats wrong with it this time?

Posted by: Brett W Oct 20 2006, 10:11 PM

Whats wrong with it this time?

Posted by: Eddie914 Oct 20 2006, 10:22 PM

Dave,

Sorry to hear ole #666 is "haunting" you again. Must be too near Haloween.

IIRC "Haloween" is slang for "All Halos Eve" ... the day before (eve) All Saints Day.

Must mean that on the First of November #666 is going to run like a saint!

I'll keep my fingers crossed for you. Wish I was closer to be able to help out.

Good luck!

Eddie

Posted by: DNHunt Oct 21 2006, 06:59 AM

Poor ring seat again. This is the second set of pistons and cylinders I've tried. First were Nickies and JE pistons and I fussed with them 3 different times. Oil consumption was in the range of a quart every 300 miles and compression in 2 cylinders was poor. Leakdown was from 12 to 60% and into the case. Anyway Jake and Charles took these back and replaced them.

This interesting this time. These are the FREE REPLACEMENT jugs and slugs from Jake and Charles and the pistons are KB's with Hastings rings. Their support has been great. All the numbers are a little better this time but not right and the bad holes the first time are the poor holes this time. Because of that fact I can't help but wonder if the problem is somewhere beside the jugs so, I'm going to check everything on the way down. Cold leakdown test, endplay, deckheight, check rod bearings and measure everthing including the cylinders on the way down.

Here's the other part. I have to take responsibilty for the problems if it's the rings cause I redid the top end when Jake was on his honeymoon in France and I made a couple of decisions that affected the rings. KB says to use a very large ring gap on the first compression ring (.028 in my case). This is so the portion above the top ring land doesn't go Kablam. I followed KB's suggestion but, Jake wanted it to be .016 because of the aluminum cylinder's expansion. The second issue is a little harder to explain but, it arises from the fact that part of the oil control ring land overlaps the wrist pin. KB puts a pin in the land to keep the ring from rotating and they suggest a ring gap of .065 to fit over the pin. Jake came up with a cool way to notch the ring so the gap deoesn't have to be this wide. It is shown in Jake's build articles in "Dune Buggies and Hot VWs". I didn't see that so I put that huge gap in. It is certainly possible that this time around all the problems arise from the way I installed the rings but, I can't be sure so I'm going to look at everything.

I usually fall asleep thinking about this problem. I've wondered if the crank is ground wrong so the pistons sit cocked. Measuring deck height on both sides of the piston and looking at the rod bearings wear should give me an idea of whether the rods are not perpendicular to the crankshaft center line. Has endplay grown and is the crank thereby out of position? Are the rods bent or bushed wrong? Is the case deck bad? Are the cylinders round and true? I have a lot of questions to answer. I'd appreciate any other suggestions.

The good news is I sure have learned a lot.

Dave

Posted by: JPB Oct 21 2006, 07:11 AM

Total seal rings bro or is that a no no voodoo witch doctor thing. Are you blowing blue smoke and what do your plugs look like?

Posted by: Bleyseng Oct 21 2006, 08:13 AM

Total Seal??
nah, its the red intakes that causeing the VooDoo on you.!

Posted by: sixnotfour Oct 21 2006, 12:57 PM

There truely is some kinda message there 666
Six sIx siX= 914-6

Posted by: JPB Oct 21 2006, 01:03 PM

I just read a post that Jake put about the total seal rings not fitting right in T4 cans and such. They seem to work for T1s WTF?

It could have been the latest rage back 5yrs ago when I read about them and now they might be getting phased out, idono? Big can/turbo dudes loved them it seemed.

Four is a bore and six is for trix!!

Posted by: Jake Raby Oct 21 2006, 01:05 PM

He is also making an upgrade to LE 200 heads this time....

Dave has the worst luck of anyone I have ever assisted with parts/ engine kit. He has remained very positive and respectful through the trials and tribulations that he has experieneced with his experiences.

Charles and I have worked with him the best way we possibly could, replacing questionable components and trying to observe the issues to ensure they do not happen to anyone else.

I won't be around much after this weekend, Dave you know where to find me.. I have some checks that I want you to do to that case that are based on my most recent findings, contact me for details.

BTW- did your new heads get there yet?

Posted by: Bleyseng Oct 21 2006, 02:05 PM

Nope, I signed for them when the FedEx truck came as I was waiting at the bottom of the long driveway.....hehe, I have them and am holding them for Randsom!!!!

Posted by: Brett W Oct 21 2006, 02:08 PM

How are you breaking this engine in? You say you poor ring seal, what was the leakdown rate? You did a hot leakdown test right? Are you sure the valve guides and seats are in good shape?

What is the bore and stroke and rod length of this engine?

Posted by: Jake Raby Oct 21 2006, 02:21 PM

Its a 2270 78.4X96 with a 5.4" rod..

I have 600+ engines with the same specs as it, in my records as complete engines, kits-etc.. Never had this issue with any of them, not one....

On several occasions I have offered to take this engine back here, do a full tear down and inspection with reassembly followed by days of dyno time.. Dave chooses to fight with whatever the issue is himself.

Each time that he has assembled this engine there have been small issues that could have led to the issues, the first time his EFI was super rich, etc, etc...

Posted by: pete-stevers Oct 21 2006, 02:24 PM

yup i hear the chant.....all the way up here.....
i hear....faintly....but repetitously
SIX......
......
SIX........
.........
SIX.......
..........
..........
i dave have given into the voice......
can you hear......the voices calling....

Posted by: Bleyseng Oct 21 2006, 05:58 PM

Dave has learned alot doing this and I think that is the invaluable lesson plus his son Jerry has been there with him the whole time.

Good stuff!

To learn you must try....even if you fail or make mistakes along the way.

Posted by: DNHunt Oct 22 2006, 07:19 AM

Jake, I haven't gotten them yet, when did they ship? Geoff, if you are holding them hostage, I'm not going to fool around. I'm sending my wife right over there.

Dave

Posted by: Bleyseng Oct 22 2006, 08:40 AM

Send her over as she wouldn't know the difference between those LE heads and a set of Bus heads I have sitting here!

Will You take some pics of them when they do arrive.

Posted by: DNHunt Oct 22 2006, 08:45 AM

I wasn't planning on having her bring back just one set of heads. This is gonna be a take no prisoners raid and to victors go the spoils.

Dave

Posted by: Rotten Robby Oct 22 2006, 09:07 AM

QUOTE(pete-stevers @ Oct 21 2006, 01:24 PM)

Posted by: Rotten Robby Oct 22 2006, 09:15 AM

QUOTE(DNHunt @ Oct 21 2006, 05:59 AM)