Printable Version of Topic

Posted by: Flat VW Oct 25 2006, 03:08 PM

I have come across a 65 Sunbeam Tiger I and I am smitten.



Help--- before it is too late.

I look foward to reading your opinions, especially you old guys--- YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE--


John



P.S.http://www.sunbeamtiger.co.uk/

Posted by: jimkelly Oct 25 2006, 03:13 PM

wasn't that the GET SMART car ??

that is cool factor enough for me : )

Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Oct 25 2006, 03:13 PM

British. Little, if any, foot room. 260 CID Ford, stuffed in there, and a bit too far foreward, at that. Feet get REALLY hot after a few miles. Goes nicely in a straight line, but it may suffer from less-than-optimal handling. Fairly collectible. The Cap'n, old enough to remember them well.

Posted by: brer Oct 25 2006, 03:14 PM

just be easy on the gas through corners and you'll be alright.

Posted by: brant Oct 25 2006, 03:17 PM

They don't corner well compaired to the cars they were competing against: mustangs and cobra's

there is one in my vintage club that is fast.
but the driver is the first person who will tell you that they don't corner well and its taken him literally 20 years to get this one to go as well as it does...

oh.. he breaks down every event too...

I'll look for a picture
brant

Posted by: bondo Oct 25 2006, 03:18 PM

Make sure it's real! Many an Alpine has been converted. There's a registry somewhere, and there must be a web page on what to look for to spot a real one. The only one I can think of is that the originals had the exhaust routed through the frame. (possible to duplicate, but not easy)

Posted by: jhadler Oct 25 2006, 03:21 PM

Too late friend...

Yeah, the Tiger's a pretty nifty ride...

260 cu in Ford V8 under the hood. So it was a mover and a shaker in its day. Nice lookin' too as it was a brit car with 'mericun iron driving the wheels.

Still, it's not _that_ impressive from a performance viewpoint. Still saddled with a rigid rear axle, and for all it's weight (2500 lbs) had only 160-170 horsepower.

Makes for a great vintage race car though!!!

-Josh2

Posted by: Travis Neff Oct 25 2006, 03:24 PM

"OT: Somebody Slap Me Before It's Too Late!"

well, ok.

Posted by: brant Oct 25 2006, 03:26 PM

Here is the one I was thinking of.
owner said that its been a race car for years and years and that its been a long hard challenge to get the handling decent. As you can see from the owners trailer, he has the resources to put lots of cubic $$$ into this car for development and his handling problem wasn't caused by being forced to use old tires... ha


Attached thumbnail(s)

Posted by: Flat VW Oct 25 2006, 03:34 PM

Thanks Cap'n-- I admire your experience.




Nope this is the real deal, all the correct paper, I believe.

Exhaust thru the frame, I thought it did not get worse than heat exchangers. ( Adolph's revenge )

John

P.S. It appeals to me as it is of similar weight, size, and power as my smashed car.

P.P.S. Maybe even less of a nod toward safety too......

P.P.P.S. It has the hood scoop too (not the exact car as pictured above).

Posted by: byndbad914 Oct 25 2006, 04:15 PM

For a race car, I would stay with the 914. For a VERY cool weekend cruiser car, that Tiger is hard to beat. The little 260 can be replaced with a 289/302 and there are plenty of performance options for that setup if you desire to go that route. Yeah, they don't corner all that great but if you use it as I mention, really neat little cars.

But my blood runs Ford blue for the most part, so I am biased. Hard to believe a built a Chevy for my own 914...

Posted by: grantsfo Oct 25 2006, 04:17 PM

They do great burn outs!

Posted by: jd74914 Oct 25 2006, 04:31 PM

They are sweet cars. I'd love to restore one. Tigers are my favorite British car ever

I think I'm a little young to be the objest of your solicitation though.

Posted by: TINCAN914 Oct 25 2006, 04:54 PM

Very cool cars...
Had a guy down the street in Cal that had one in his shop yard. He was going to restore it years ago.. Wonder if he ever did.? I always thought they were cool...
Missed it by that much....

Posted by: markb Oct 25 2006, 04:56 PM

A good friend of mine restored one, and shows it often. He absolutely loves it. Does the occasional AX, but he's never said how well he does. It's no 914.

Posted by: JPB Oct 25 2006, 05:52 PM

Cute car and worth getting if you have the room and the extra cash. It was big with the chics who had one.

To late?

Posted by: SLITS Oct 25 2006, 05:54 PM

Cons:

It's a Ford
It was made by Rootes Group
It won't corner worth a shit
Parts (Ford) are cheap
Parts (Rootes Group) - may be rarer than a virgin at the Chicken Ranch
Requires a midget with small hands to change spark plugs
It's a Ford (slighty worse than a Fiat).
It looks like a bad Desoto
It was a Limey car

Pros:

Not many were made (no one wanted to buy them)
They were reasonably fast in a straight line
They were somewhat comfortable to sit in( if you were Billy Barty )

Posted by: Elliot Cannon Oct 25 2006, 06:04 PM

If I remember right, the engine area was so crowded, you had to remove a small access panel on the firewall to get to one of the aft spark plugs. Not real practicle but high on cool factor. Some of the race cars had too much torque for the frame and would bend them a bit.
Elliot

Posted by: sjhowitson Oct 25 2006, 06:17 PM

Get it Now !!! Those little cars are cool. Not as cool as our cars, but still very cool.

Posted by: Howard Oct 25 2006, 06:37 PM

:echo on:

Foul handling, under braked, over powered, flex chassis, Lucas electrics, foot cooker (over size 9 won't fit), harsh riding POS.

Buy it!!!!!!

Posted by: rick 918-S Oct 25 2006, 07:01 PM

nice examples are moving up the value chain.
Buy it! specially if it's cheap.

Posted by: Flat VW Oct 25 2006, 07:13 PM

Thanks Travis.

Posted by: Dave_Darling Oct 25 2006, 08:28 PM

Yeaaaaah!!! I want one of those myself. Don't have anywhere to keep it, nor any money to buy it, but I still want one!

They seem to have gotten well past the depreciation stage, and are appreciating relatively quickly. If you don't get one now, you may not be able to afford one later... At least, that's the message I get from the "car collector" mags.

--DD

Posted by: propricer Oct 25 2006, 08:38 PM

Buy / build a 914-8 ... more performance / less money.

Posted by: markb Oct 25 2006, 08:43 PM

IIRC, engine fitment was aquired by giving a big guy a sledgehammer & telling him to go at it while standing in the engine compartment. No joke. Also, IIRC, Carroll Shelby was the designer of the prototypes.

Posted by: Slowpoke Oct 25 2006, 08:49 PM

I owned a 66 Tiger in the 69-70 time frame. It was a great little car. It never broke down on me. It had plenty of power and I always like the way the shifter vibrated when I was getting on it. I still have the owners manual and warranty book around here somewhere. My understanding of them is that they have a really bad habit of rusting in areas where you can not get to. It seems like the rocker panels are triple walled or something like that. Really check it good for rust in the frame and rocker panel area. It serious money to get that area fixed correctly. Make sure you get all the orignal parts that came with the car, if your into getting crazy money for it later. I think the Triumph TR8 is a much better deal for the money, cuz Tigers generally go for more than I would pay for one. Those TR8's can be bought for less than 5K in nice condition. Oh, I sold mine for $1700 in 1970, that seems like a mistake today.

What killed the car was Chrysler bought out Rootes Group to get the car that became the Plymouth Arrow, and they tried to put a small Chrysler engine in the Tiger and it didn't fit. At least that's the way I remember it. I could be wrong also I guess.

Posted by: jimtab Oct 25 2006, 09:03 PM

My best friend had a '65 when we were in college(65-69) and he was working at Lockeed...he had the money to doll it up, bought it used with like 20k on the clock...drove it for a couple months and said ....too slow...went to the Ford hotrod guys and said I want it to go fast...they said how fast, he said really fast, they said ...how much money do you have...long story short it ended up with a 292 hi-rise setup and 2 big 4bbl carbs...and it was FAST. I drove it a couple days a week off and on when we traded cars(the guy was wierd for 356 cars) and it handled. When he did the engine he did cobra brakes and some suspension upgrades. And, they do handle...but you steer with the throttle, the wheel just gets things started...and they're ass happy, and more power doesn't help that. The hotfoot is true, very true. Parts can be tough but Alpines make donor cars except for the lump. If the price is even reasonable...buy it, they are more fun than a barrel of titties when you're driving them. And, hell, it was good enough for Maxwell Smart....

Posted by: boxstr Oct 25 2006, 09:28 PM

Very collectable, if it does not need major rust repair and the price is right , I would buy it. Enjoy it and drive it. Then when you get tired of it sell and make some profit.
I had one many years ago, wish I had it back along with the Lotus Super 7, Frog eye Sprite and E type Jag convertile.
Someone mentioned the Sunbeam Tiger registry, http://www.rootes1.com/index.asp get in touch with them and see if the Vin is on their records it will help you follow the history of the car.
Good luck and have fun.
Craig

Posted by: drew365 Oct 25 2006, 09:31 PM

I owned a '67 Mark II. That was the last year, it had the Ford 289 and a little 5 point Chrysler emblem on the lower fender. A real hybrid. I owned it from about '86 to '91. I loved it and still miss it to this day. Most of what has been posted is true. If I got stuck in traffic on a hot summer day my feet would feel like they were going to melt. I ran it one year at the Virginia City Hillclimb, it would go like hell between corners but the rear suspension would bounce the drive tire up and down like a basketball trying to power out of a corner. Put the top down and go cruising on a summer evening and memories would be made to keep for a lifetime. I think it was the first car I ever bought and sold at a profit.

Posted by: Flat VW Oct 25 2006, 10:29 PM

Who the H*ll is, (or was) Billy Barty?

John

Posted by: Howard Oct 25 2006, 10:36 PM

and google Billy Barty



Attached image(s)

Posted by: Cap'n Krusty Oct 25 2006, 10:37 PM

An actor, one who is seriously vertically challenged. The Cap'n

Posted by: Flat VW Oct 25 2006, 10:43 PM

I googled Sunbeam and this is what I got:




John

Posted by: Michael N Oct 26 2006, 01:36 AM

I owned a 67 Alpine with 1725cc engine and another one with a Toyota 20R engine in it. Granted the engine was not a 260 or 289 so it is hard to compare straight line speed, although I can tell you even with the lighter engines the handling was poor at best. Kinda like owning a boat: happy to buy it , happier to sell it.

Posted by: gregrobbins Oct 26 2006, 01:50 AM

I watched a Tiger giving a 914-6 with a good driver a run for its money at the Palm Springs Vintage race last year. Good battle until the Tiger blew a water hose.

How do you fit in the car? Do you think you would use it for Track or pleasure? Or just a collector?

See you Monday. Thanks again for tonight.

Posted by: blitZ Oct 26 2006, 05:25 AM

Don Adams liked the Tiger so much, he accepted one as part of his salary for Get Smart. His daughter eventually wrecked it.

Would you believe a small british convertible and a Ford V8?


Attached image(s)

Posted by: IanStott Oct 26 2006, 05:29 AM

Waaaaay back in the early seventies, I went to quite few of those races in mall parking lots where you went as fast as you could through the pylons hoping to not spin out and hit a light standard base made from cement! Lots of British Leyland products every week as there was some kind of club, many of my friends had hopped up MGB's, a very fast midget, a few Mini's, a GT6 plus, etc. a Sunbeam Tiger showed up at 2 of these events, it had a 289 and blew the socks off everybody. I agree with the previous comment about handling, but one must remember once you have driven a well handling car like a 914 the handling weaknesses in other cars becomes very apparent. For me, if you can afford the Tiger and it is in good shape grab it, I thought it was a sexy car back in the day and still is, just don't race it and ruin it trying to beat cars that it can't run with! My 10 cents (inflation) worth!

Ian Stott
Moncton
Canada

Posted by: shelby/914 Oct 26 2006, 01:10 PM

Buy it, Buy it, Buy it, and if you don't PM me. I know two guys in Denver who say they are looking for one. Probably not seriously but a phone # might get them off the dime. Only drove one once, it was real scary as it had the cobra kit installed. Ended up with a 66' Mustang GT since I had one daughter and another on the way. We have several Tigers run our open track events with the Colorado Exotic Car Assoc. It's not really racing, just sort of like a DE. Do they break, sure, but then again most 914's live on jack stands. You never mentioned $, but I was talking to an owner at our last event and he said that $25k should buy a nice driver.

Variety is the spice of life. A little British mixed with Ford is a good deal.

Posted by: drewvw Oct 26 2006, 01:18 PM

When my father was a younger man his buddy had a newish tiger in the late 60's - early 70's. They were at Watkins Glen watching the races as they often did.

Well almost everybody gets a little revved up after watching and the way back home to Rochester is filled with awesome country roads. My pops said he pulled out of the track and did a constant 120+ pretty much all the way home (he knew what he was doing). Said it was scary as hell but also one of the most memorable rides of his life.


Buy It! I love sunbeam tigers and most people who own them seem to as well. I hear there is a strong contingent in Colorado for some reason.

Posted by: Qarl Oct 26 2006, 01:58 PM

I have a friend that's owned one for 20+ years. He did a complete nut and bolt restoration on the car a few years back and knows the car very well.

He lives in Redlands, CA. If you want me to put you in touch with him, let me know. (send me a PM)

Nice car.

Good power in light weight package....

Karl

Posted by: LS6/914 Oct 26 2006, 11:24 PM

One of my roomies in college (late 70s) had a Sunbeam. One of the favorite friday events would be to run Chuckanut drive. There was also a black 914 on campus. The rest is history, Sunbeam blisters the straight leading to Chuckanut drive, spins at the third corner and makes the guardrail modern art. 914 slows to pass and asks if he can send a tow truck. Buy the Tiger!

Posted by: Tobra Oct 27 2006, 07:49 PM

I know I have always wanted one, the guys with them on the Alpine 500 have always broken down, but I want one anyway

Posted by: tdgray Oct 28 2006, 09:09 AM

Soooo

Did ya buy it

Inquiring minds want to know

Posted by: rjkavanagh Oct 28 2006, 09:21 AM

Yep, great in a straight line. Awsome little cars, but make sure it's a true Tiger.

Posted by: itsaporsche914 Oct 28 2006, 09:38 AM

hey john, i ve spotted one also , not sure if its for sale. roughly 7th st and dunlap area. its been on a car lift for months , maybe years

Posted by: Tobra Oct 28 2006, 07:11 PM

Just saw two, one broke down, one offering assistance