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Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 6 2003, 10:16 AM

Mark of Mark’s Aircooled, has come to an agreement with Charles at LN Engineering on group buy pricing for 103mm (only) Type 4 Nickies.

If we can get 5+ sets LN has agreed to give us a 24% discount on the Nickies, head studs at $259 and SRP 103mm forged pistons at $429. If we have enough (complete) sets Charles has even stated that he will throw in the case through bolts to sweeten the deal.

Please do not bother Charles with any questions about this group buy, the whole point is to make him as little sales work as possible on this deal. I will answer any question as to the details of how this group buy works. You must go through me to get the group buy pricing. Once you have committed your funds Charles will be happy to answer your technical questions. I organized the successful SDS fuel injection group buy last spring, you may ask and do a search over on the STF fuel injection forum as too my creditability on group buys.

I’m sure that Charles will chime in and give his seal of approval on this offer soon.

Please note this is for the 103mm size only, don’t ask for other sizes. You can buy just the cylinders, but only people who buy complete sets will get the case through bolts, again only if we have enough complete sets sold in the buy.

We are considering a mid-March cut off date (TBA), and then once all funds are collected it would be a minimum 6 to 8 week production time before shipping.

This offer is good for the USA and Canada, but we may consider overseas as well. All prices are in US dollars, shipping and any applicable taxes etc. are not included.
Yes I’m Canadian, but LN Engineering will ship all USA orders.

You can contact me at: mhenry69@sympatico.ca or 905-797-2677 daytime EST.

For details on LN Engineering’s Nickies check out: http://www.lnengineering.com/index.html

Posted by: KJJ-74-914 Dec 6 2003, 12:18 PM

I am just starting to tear down an extra 1.8L ii recently bought. I am interested in these cylinders. Would I be able to use the fuel injection, heads and all other parts with these cylinders? What modifications to the fuel system would be required? What other mod would be required?

Thank you for your reply.

Kirk

Posted by: seanery Dec 6 2003, 12:38 PM

what size does 103's with a 2.0 crank make?

Posted by: echocanyons Dec 6 2003, 12:49 PM

These are priced on the website at $2100 and the price will be ~$700?
Thats quite a bit more than a 24% discount, am I missing something?

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 6 2003, 01:00 PM

103 X 71mm = 2.366L
103 X 78mm = 2.599L

Kirk, you do have to machine them in, stock FI will not work.

24% off the cylinder price, I don't have time to do the math as I have to get to a family do, but 25 off of 2000 would be 1500.

Someone do the math, please...I must dash.

Posted by: echocanyons Dec 6 2003, 01:05 PM

Did you mean the dicount was 259 and 429 respectively on the studs and P/C's

This would make the price $1511.00 total for the studds and P/C's this is equal to ~24% percent off.

I understand now, I guess I just misunderstood your first post.

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 6 2003, 02:42 PM

Here guys, i'll clarify the pricing. Retail on 103mm Nickies is $1899. 24% discount brings them to ~$1440. Head studs will be sold at $259 (retail $300 less $41) and Pistons/rings/wrist pins $429 (retail $700 less $271). In all, that's a $750+ discount over retail. I'd be more than happy to field any questions.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 6 2003, 07:03 PM

Thanks Charles,

Now everthing should be clear on the pricing.

Posted by: RD Evans Dec 6 2003, 07:15 PM

Sounds exciting! For us less experienced wrenches...could you give us an idea of the other parts that will be needed to complete an engine. Like a previous poster, I have a 1.8 in my car now that I could use as the core. I realize that the engine will require dual carbs or some other after market fuel system. We here Jake Raby talk all the time about the "combo" so do you have an opinion on what would make a reliable daily driver?

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 6 2003, 08:38 PM

Depends on what you want to do and how much coin your willing to spend.

Combo just means quality parts that are meant to work well together. Mismatched parts will kill power if not the engine. If you’re the DIY type, just post your planned combo here and we’ll tell you if you’re on the right track.

Minimum... 2.0 crank and rods, balanced, web cam and lifters, head work, T1 oil pump, webers and a header

Maximum... above plus, 78mm (or bigger crank, forged even), Ratt cam, ceramic lifters, major head work, aftermarket FI, tangerine header etc. etc.

Hey with Nickies maybe you can turbo a teen!

All can be built to be reliable. We can help.

Posted by: Rgreen914 Dec 6 2003, 11:47 PM

This sounds like a great way to build a "big block" with premo parts; gets the mind working overtime! With that extended cut-off it gives plenty of time to decide on a combination (and save up money). Does the price of the pistons go for any stroke/compression height or is it just for standard combos? My first inclination would be for stroker but maybe not 78 mm.

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 7 2003, 07:05 AM

Your mind is working overtime!!!! Mine is going

Nickies were out of my league till this deal came along, but I still need time to save up my pennies. I just figured how long it would take me to get the coin, asked Charles if this sounded like a good cut off date and he said sounds good.

(Honey.... I know what I want for Christmas...)

Does the price of the pistons go for any stroke/compression height or is it just for standard combos? My first inclination would be for stroker but maybe not 78 mm.

I know Charles will want to know the specs on your engine, Charles will have to answer this one but I can't see it being a problem.

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 7 2003, 09:33 AM

Mind working overtime is a good thing :-)

Just let me know whether or not you'll be running a 71 stroke or a 78 stroke, as I'll provide different pistons for the most common combinations.

I personally have a 102 x 71 with 2L 914 heads in stock configuration and I love it. I'd have to say, hands down, that my 2320cc powered automatic VW squareback is significantly faster than my hotter cam'ed 2L in my 914, even with 1000+ lbs more weight and sucky gearing! A 2320 (or 2366 with 103s) is an awesome engine with gobs of torque across the entire powerband. Fairly inexpensive too, since you can re-use 2L components (if starting from a 2L) and don't need to splurge on headwork, a new crank, or rods. Simple to assemble too since you don't need to worry about clearancing, reduced base circle cams, etc. I'm running a webcam 91 grind w/ 1.51 ratio rockers, but if I had to do it all over again, I would have used ceramics and a hotter cam.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: Mark Henry Dec 14 2003, 08:35 AM

bump

Posted by: BravoHotel Dec 14 2003, 01:33 PM

Charles,

I am intrigued by the group buy, and curious about what kind of performance I could attain in the "Fairly inexpensive" & "Simple to assemble" category. Here are the big picture specs on my engine. The PO did the build-up so I have no first-hand knowledge beyond what I am about to type. I do have all of the receipts, though, if you need more info than this:

- Original 2.0L from a 1975 model...complete rebuild in 1994...no has appx 18-20K miles
- HD oil pump
- new cam and lifters (duration = 280 deg / lift = .435 in)
- new US spec pistons and cylinders
- new sodium filled valves, springs, guides, standard bearings
- new dual 40mm Webers w/ K&N filters (new, not rebuilt)
- Bosch 050 dist w/ Pertronix pointless ign, MSD 6AL, Bosch blue coil, Magnecore Ign Wires
- Lightened flywheel w/ six spring clutch

It runs great and pulls very strong right now, but I am interested in more power. What would the group buy combo do for me and what kind of extra things would I have to do to assemble the engine? Is is a bolt-together proposition?

Thanks for the help
Brian

Posted by: Jake Raby Dec 14 2003, 05:08 PM

THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS A GENERIC COMBO!!!!!!! The COMBO MUST BE MADE FOR THE VEHICLE. DRIVING STYLE AND TEMPERATURES/ALTITUDES HAVE A GREAT EFFECT ON PERFORMANCE COMBOS!!

I hate to yell, but this severely causes issues with folks that I deal with all the time!!

When you go with Nickies, the combo will change, or should change due to the fact that the engine is much more efficient and will run cooler.

Charles and I will be working out a deal for customers who buy Nickies and buy the rest of their parts from me. I have used more Nickies than anyone in the world, and have developed combos just for them........ All it takes is the customer buying the rest of their internals (atleast 1K bucks worth)from me to get those combos and my configuration service for free...Thats configuration right down to dyno proven jetting settings and timing settings........ that don't exist anywhere else, and if it does no one will share it with ya!!!!!!

So even if guys do the group buy with the Nickies, they still have to have the other compatible parts... I can fill those needs without guesswork- Just bolt it together.

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 14 2003, 05:37 PM

Here are some estimates with Brian's existing cam, stock 2L heads, etc. Remember, these are estimates, but will give a ball park figure. There is no substitute for a dyno cell and a proven combo, like Jake has said. These numbers are also reflecting a damn good exhaust, like a triad at the least, but figures are shown with a tangerine system.

2366, 10:1, 40 IDF


2366, 10.5:1, 44 IDF


2366, 11:1, 48 IDF


Like Jake has said, it's all in the combo. I'd say that the 2L bottom end would most definately need to be counterweighted (and whole rotating assembly race balanced) and if you did use 2L rods, ARP bolts and cryo'ing at the least. Dual HD springs as well as ceramic lifters would be essential to keeping the valvetrain happy at >7k rpms. If you're looking to save by re-using the 2L components, a 2366 is a nice way to go, but most definately Jake's services from parts to balancing to cam selection would be absolutely necessary to guarantee any combo!

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision performance

Posted by: Jake Raby Dec 14 2003, 06:11 PM

With 40s its never making that kind of power....

Engine Analyzer is a great tool but it also has many, many variables that can "Make it or break it"

The stock 2.0 bottom end is strong, BUT to make big HP for that kind of revver the stock rods are way too short, way too heavy and the bolts are way too weak for any type of high revving performance.... The 24mm wrist pins are also heavier and require a heavier foging of piston to keep the pin area strong.....

At the least run a crank with a TI journal, (The journal is twice as strong as stock TIV from near .170" more diameter)a strong H beam rod and then a nice lightweight 22mm pinned piston.....

The stock parts will work, but you ain't making 175 ponies, especially not with those short assed rods.

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 14 2003, 06:24 PM

I agree, the 170 horses it's estimating with 40s have to be bogus and asking the 2L bottom end to happily turn >7k rpm on a daily basis is questionable if 100,000 mi or more is required of the motor. With the mods that Jake is suggesting, we're getting closer to a better 2366 combo, but it will still require matching of headwork and cam to make it a perfect match- something that Jake already has under his belt. I would recommend to anyone going in on the group buy to work with Jake and I on the rest of your combination to ensure the best possible combo for your application!

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: Jake Raby Dec 14 2003, 07:33 PM

There is no substitute for a good combo!!

Posted by: Brad Roberts Dec 14 2003, 10:45 PM

For those of you following along at home. READ THIS THREAD.

B

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 15 2003, 09:20 AM

And for you west coast teeners, call Brad. He'll hook you up with a set of Nickies and a Raby combo from the comfort of your own state :-)

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: cnavarro Dec 17 2003, 10:01 PM

bump

Posted by: Brad Roberts Dec 18 2003, 02:52 AM

Damn. Now I have to answer the phone.


B

Posted by: Mark Henry Jan 4 2004, 08:28 AM

bump

Posted by: Brad Roberts Jan 4 2004, 12:08 PM

I need to start walking around our events with a Nickie cylinders around a gold chain hanging on my neck. That will gather some attention. Maybe some GREEN hair to go with it.. YEAH !!

I'll make you proud Charles.


B

Posted by: crash914 Jan 4 2004, 03:52 PM

Ok, I am in.

I just pulled the engine today and started to tear down the engine.

It would be nice to push the deliver a little sooner.....I need mo' power.....

herb

Posted by: cnavarro Jan 5 2004, 05:45 AM

I'll leave that up to Mark to decide; i'll be more than happy to fulfill the group buy at the listed price when the minimum is met, or, when he decides to close it out.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: Mark Henry Jan 5 2004, 07:23 PM

We have four guys on the list and one maybe.

Two would like them now but the rest need the time to get their coin together.

FYI when I did the SDS group buy I had 11 guys on the list. When it came time to "shit or get off the pot" 5 guys bailed. Just saying this to let you guys know that this isn't a done deal yet, but it's still early and things are looking very good.

Posted by: fraggle00 Jan 8 2004, 10:44 PM

no hurries here.... I'm still getting the cashola together. sold my trailer ($1200) and hoping my stock goes up by march so I don't have to cash advance the things!! BUT I AM IN!

and based on the other threads on lifters, I think a set of ceramics may be in my future as well. you guys scare me and I don't want to nuke a motor that is going to have (apparently) a lot more money thrown at it than I initially estimated. Going to chat with Jake on the 14th!

Posted by: Mark Henry Jan 25 2004, 12:23 PM

For you Cali guys, stop by and meet Nickie the LN Engineering
booth at either the Porsche Literature Meet in Los Angeles, CA on
January 31st or Dunkel's the following day in Orange County, CA.

Posted by: crash914 Feb 10 2004, 11:49 AM

bump...........

Posted by: cnavarro Feb 21 2004, 08:10 AM

We will be closing out the group buy on Feb. 29, 2004 to new signups. Those of you who finalize your orders by the end of this month will get the thru-bolts and shipping for free in the US- $2128, a savings of almost $1000, considering prices went up starting the beginning of the year due to increases in aluminum prices. Here is your one and only chance at the group buy. I will be finalizing all orders, so please send your emails to charles@LNengineering.com by the end of the month.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance

Posted by: cnavarro Mar 16 2004, 08:47 AM

For those of you who didn't finalize your order yet, you have until the end of March to get your order in.

BTW, 95-98mm Nickies for the 911 are on their way, to shortly be followed by 100mm + bore sizes.

Charles Navarro
LN Engineering
http://www.LNengineering.com
Aircooled Precision Performance