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Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 16 2007, 09:58 PM

I have two 914's, a 75 and a 76. I got sick and tired of screwing around with the valve eating VW Type IV piece of sh*t engine in them both so decided to replace both with Buick V6 engines, a fairly straight forward swap as engine swaps go in a 914 (no way I can afford any Porsche 6 cyl motor).

The red 75 was the first recipient of a basically stock 3.8 liter, only mods were an Edelbrock intake, small Holley 4bbl, MSD distributor and ignition, and headers. Plenty of power even in that basically stock configuration. The white 76 is awaiting an already built 4.1 liter (now 4.2 liter) Buick V6 with JE 9 1/2 to 1 forged pistons, cc'd and flowed heads, Isky cam, Manley stainless valves, Isky springs, retainers, lifters, etc. The White 76 will be basically gutted to reduce weight but will remain a street ride.

On the 914club.com forum that weird haircut Andy guy hated Buicks and few people would talk to me. Is it any different here?

Regards,

Don

Posted by: Blood red 914-6gt Jun 16 2007, 10:03 PM

You have a 914 right? Your good in our book. Just don't go ruining your car by puting some weird hood with a big nose on it . So do you have any pics of your cars?

Posted by: markb Jun 16 2007, 10:06 PM

Posted by: Chuck Jun 16 2007, 10:08 PM

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Jun 16 2007, 10:09 PM

FYI- that weird haircut guy is a major player here on the 914world. Lot's of Chevy & Subaru guys here & I'm sure one or two Buick people. Enjoy!

Posted by: SGB Jun 16 2007, 10:16 PM

I like your V-6, but I like my type-IV too. What happened with your valves that pissed you off so much ?

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 16 2007, 10:35 PM

Yes I do. How many do ya want?

This one is the engine.

db



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Posted by: JB 914 Jun 16 2007, 10:38 PM

Welcome, nice ride.

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 16 2007, 10:40 PM

They broke and ate my pistons, typically on the way to or from work. Three motors with valve heads driven vertically into the piston hasn't made for good mojo with me and the Type 4 motor. I have 20K miles on the Buick V6 with not a problem, and the 914 still handles like a 914.

db

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 16 2007, 11:01 PM

I know for most of you he is a great source of info but for me, bummer. I Can't escape him can I?


Since a 914 is a NARP then why should my BV6 914 be any less of a NARP? In fact it should be the ultimate NARP... or am I wrong?

db

Posted by: GWN7 Jun 16 2007, 11:16 PM

You have to understand, it's not that Andy hates Buicks, it's just he was scared by one when he was little (hence the hair).......he's away and this thread will be 4 pages back by the time he gets back, so I have no worries about him hitting me with a fish.......


nice looking car BTW

Posted by: woobn8r Jun 16 2007, 11:24 PM

If it's a 'teener....It's all good baby....

Posted by: So.Cal.914 Jun 17 2007, 12:21 AM

We won't get into that right now, swap looks nice.

Posted by: Joe Sharp Jun 17 2007, 12:33 AM

Don: Your hart is is the right place.

Posted by: michaelt55 Jun 17 2007, 12:38 AM

I own a 914 with a buick V8 215, so welcome!!! I had a 914 with porsche 4 but wanted a little more, hence the V8....


Glad to meet ya!

Michael

Posted by: wertygrog Jun 17 2007, 12:42 AM

Don't worry about other people's usually uneducated opinions...

But I have to toss mine in here...

My dad is a hardcore Buick guy for as long as I can remember (he owns a real GSX and a real GNX) and he has decades of experience with all GM brands, Ford, Chrysler, etc and he swears by Buick all the way. The quality of design and parts is among the best, and that is reflected in the performance numbers and maintainability of Buick engines...and they sound real cool too!

You've obviously found that out yourself haha.

Good luck!

Posted by: neo914-6 Jun 17 2007, 02:47 AM

No one but purists here...

Posted by: Lou W Jun 17 2007, 03:08 AM

I rode in a Buick once

I saved some of the pictures of your engine conversion from the club site.... very nice installation.

Posted by: BarberDave Jun 17 2007, 07:40 AM

Tolerance is ONLY spoken here !!!!!!!

Porsche 6's, & V-8's, chevy's,fords,Buicks,Subies and any thing else you can

squeeze in there . As long as it starts as a 914.

I do take issue with your use of " piece of shit " toward the type four engine

most here run them ,withoutstanding success, and longevity.

Most droped valve issues are from worn out ,and poorly maintained engines!!!

Also there is a Guy in Georgia Jake Raby who builds Type 4's, that will hand you
your Hat, and out live your Buick .

Any way And Happy Fathers day all

Dave

Posted by: Johny Blackstain Jun 17 2007, 08:18 AM

Don- I'm not the person to have this discussion with. To me a NARP is a 924, 928, 944, 996, Cayenne... or in other words it has to have an air cooled, boxer engine to be a "real" Porsche. This little issue has bothered me since I was a kid which is why I own 2 914s'- a real 4 & a real 6 . They're Porsches', period. This, of couse, is just my opinion. I'm the last of the old dinosaurs .

As for the Buick power in your Teener- I am very familiar w/ the 3.8 & think it's a bad ass engine. When that puppy came out in the late 70s' it rocked. There were many Buick V6 powered race cars, both open wheeled & closed & it was a very dominant engine. Mom had a 3.8 in her Century station wagon & I worked on that engine all the time (maintenance). It was one of the 1st engines made in the USA w/ extensive research into turbocharging & fuel injection systems from the factory.

Just relax & enjoy the "world" brother- your teener could be hamster powered here, it's still a teener.

Posted by: computers4kids Jun 17 2007, 08:53 AM

Don It's all good! I vaguely remember your conversion on the 914club...I love the look and simplicity...how about some more pictures.

As far as others opinions..."we all have them," but I think you'll find the atmosphere here at 914world refreshing. Here we can agree to disagree without personal attacks. Andy is a great guy and was a major player in saving our 914 playground when the club when nuclear in December.
Looking forward to hearing more about your conversions!




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Posted by: Phoenix-MN Jun 17 2007, 09:06 AM

Hi Don,
Remeber me? As it has been said, the Buick V6 rocks and welcome, mine is finally assembled and ready to mate up to the tranny. Here's a pic of the engine.
3.8L .030 over
9.5:1 pistons
double roller timing chain
ported heads
Harland Sharp roller rockers
Lunati cam
Holley Intake
Sanderson Headers
Holley TBI fuel system

Posted by: Bobby Anderson Jun 17 2007, 09:10 AM

wow. how do you fit that in the car? do you have to take off the rear trunk?

Posted by: Phoenix-MN Jun 17 2007, 09:15 AM

Nope, they fit quite nice, no major surgery of the engine comparment to slip the V6 in.

Paul

Posted by: tdsmoonchild Jun 17 2007, 09:49 AM

Sweeeet!

Posted by: SGB Jun 17 2007, 10:36 AM

Holy schmoley thats gotta be fun, Batman.

Posted by: JPB Jun 17 2007, 11:00 AM

As said to most of you porsche perv types,"I gots ta get me onea dem ther!"

How many ponies homeskillet? Looks sickly good by the way.

Posted by: sww914 Jun 17 2007, 11:03 AM

Purist here. You already know what I'd say. Welcome.

Posted by: Howard Jun 17 2007, 11:19 AM

Why would anyone want to 'improve' a 914?

Posted by: Chuck Jun 17 2007, 11:19 AM

How many horsepower? Weight? Does this thing eat up transaxles like a V8?

Posted by: krazykonrad Jun 17 2007, 02:01 PM

At least you didnt put a TIV in a Buick!

You are certainly welcome here. I'm a purist, but I am also envious of the HP advantage you have over me!
Konrad
72/4 with a 2.3

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:14 PM

Hello Paul,

Wow that is a sweet looking engine. I too bought a set of the TA Performance valve covers for my 4.1. Best looking valve covers I've seen.

With regards to your alternator mount, did you fabricate it? That's the only thing that has given me a problem, I need to find a mount like your that mounts the alternator down lower left (driver side) solidly.

Here's a pic of me after a day spent defunking the underneath with degreaser, paint stripper, steel wool, and pressure washing.

Don


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Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 19 2007, 02:31 PM

He's harmless. Just tell him you hate weird haircuts and you'll be even

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:37 PM

No offense meant to anyone with a Type IV engine. I was only referring to my piece of s*** Type IV engines. I have long followed Jake Raby's work on the Type IV. He is a master with them.

Don

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:42 PM

Here's my engine/trans setup before installation (this is the 3.8L engine).


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Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:46 PM

This is a pic from below just after installation.


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Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:48 PM

This was the last valve that went in my Type IV.


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Posted by: GWN7 Jun 19 2007, 02:49 PM

Sorry that car can't be clean....your not dirty or wet enough



*Edit: Ok looks clean from here

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:51 PM

Radiator, fans, battery relocation, etc.


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Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:54 PM

It was a very hot day. I dried out quickly.

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 02:57 PM

After installation and off the jack stands... minus glass front bumper.


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Posted by: Phoenix-MN Jun 19 2007, 02:58 PM

"Hello Paul,

Wow that is a sweet looking engine. I too bought a set of the TA Performance valve covers for my 4.1. Best looking valve covers I've seen.

With regards to your alternator mount, did you fabricate it? That's the only thing that has given me a problem, I need to find a mount like your that mounts the alternator down lower left (driver side) solidly.

Here's a pic of me after a day spent defunking the underneath with degreaser, paint stripper, steel wool, and pressure washing.

Don"

Don,
I sort-of copied the alt mount fron the Champion site and fabricated the parts my self.
http://www.championgn1.com/gn1/products_altbracket-gn1.html
I didn't make any drawings for it, just "carved the aluminum as I went along. I could trace the parts for you if you want to take a stab at it. Let me know

Paul

Posted by: SirAndy Jun 19 2007, 03:01 PM

huh?

you must have met my evil twin over there ... i don't hate Buicks. or any other conversion for that matter.

i do have a personal preference for porsche engines, but's that's just me. don't let that bother you.

as far as i'm concerned, everybody is welcome here, regardless of what engine drives their 914 ...
Andy

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 03:02 PM

Running, first road trip to Lucky Peak Lake, Idaho.


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Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 03:20 PM

Paul, if it's not too much trouble I could definitely use the tracings, at your convenience. I need to fabricate two alternator mounts (one for the 3.8 and one for the 4.1).

I'm using the original Type IV alternator bolted to the head with a spacer to align it with the engine pulley, and I know it is not going to last as the summer comes on here since it has no cooling. I've been wanting to switch to a GM alternator but couldn't find a proper mount to position the alternator correctly.

Thank you for the kind offer of the tracings.

Don

Posted by: zymurgist Jun 19 2007, 03:20 PM

Welcome, Don! I find that 914 folks tend to be more accepting of a variety of different cars than some other groups. (Except if you own a 911, be prepared to get your fair share of abuse. )

914s are all good, no matter what powerplant you use. I'm a T4 fan myself, but I also think that one should build a car not for the masses but for the guy who pays the bills. You've got a sweet ride... I can't say that I've ever seen a 901 that looked good enough to eat off of before I saw your pictures.

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 03:24 PM

Oops! Sorry Andy. I remember you once posted on the other site that you hated Buicks. Maybe you meant the Roadmaster.

Don

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 03:30 PM

Ken,

Thank you for the kind words.

re: the 901, I sealed off all openings and seals thoroughly then blasted the 901 with silica sand then replaced the seals just to be sure. It has turned a darker gray patina since then but still looks very clean.

Don

Posted by: horizontally-opposed Jun 19 2007, 04:12 PM

I dunno Don, your car sure looks fine to me...

Very clean and tidy conversion. And I've always liked Buick V6s!

pete

Posted by: Eric_Shea Jun 19 2007, 04:15 PM

(hat wear'n pick-up truck drive'n *^%#&)

Posted by: ruddyboys Jun 19 2007, 04:23 PM

Car looks great, just wondering, with the holes cut in the wheel well, if you drove in the rain wouldn't you get a lot of water were rust would start and water on the battery? Also on the front it looks like you replaced the trunck seal with that corregated plastic you cover wire bundles with?


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Posted by: Justinp71 Jun 19 2007, 04:32 PM

Why would you run a buick v-6 over a small block v-8? I would imagine that the motor would cost the same amount.

Does the power or size of the v-6 fit the 914 better?

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 04:47 PM

I don't drive the 914 in the rain, the top leaks terribly. Mine is a fair weather car.

The front trunk seal was off the car and I put the corrugated plastic on there to keep the sharp edge from cutting me while I was working on the radiator install.

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 04:53 PM

The size fits better. With a V8 one must run an external mechanical drive or electric water pump, the back trunk is usually notched to clear the distributor, and the transmission must be mounted about an inch and a half to the rear and down about the same amount. The V6 fits with factory water pump in place and no other mods (beyond forward engine mount). I guess it's just a matter of what one wants. I figured I could make plenty of power with the V6.

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 05:01 PM

Thank you Pete. But it does have some rust issues, but then it's just my daily driver. The white 76 that I'm putting the 4.1 liter BV6 in will be my hot rod, it came out of California and suffers very little rust.

Don

Posted by: Phoenix-MN Jun 19 2007, 05:30 PM

Don,
PM me with your address and I'll try and get the tracings done in the next day or so. I'll drop them in the mail to ya along with a cd with pictures of the mount in various stages of assembly on and off the motor.

Looks like we both are using the same dual fans, does yours cool well?

Paul

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 19 2007, 05:40 PM

Thank you Paul! I'm headed home from work so will PM you from there.

My radiator is still not shrouded and I have had no cooling problems even in 100 plus temps here in southwest Idaho. The fans really move some air.

Don

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 20 2007, 09:50 PM

Tonight I cut shrouding templates from corrugated plastic (looks like cardboard but is made of plastic) glued in place with 3M super adhesive to see if it makes a difference. If it does then I'll use the templates to cut the shapes from aluminum and put in place permanently. Foto attached of the templates (the screwdrivers and wood blocks are there to hold templates in place while glue dries).



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Posted by: GS Guy Jun 21 2007, 07:03 AM

Don,

What fans are you guys running? I'm looking for a nice compact fan set-up and I like the built-in shrouding you've got.

Jeff

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 21 2007, 11:10 AM

Jeff,

My fans are the Flex-A-Lite Dual 10 (Model 310) with adjustable thermostat control. The best price I've seen them at are on eBay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/310-Flex-a-lite-Dual-10-Fans-adj-thermostat_W0QQitemZ260064689105QQcmdZViewItem

Don

Posted by: horizontally-opposed Jun 21 2007, 11:25 AM

I would so love to see someone do a front-mounted radiator setup that makes better use of the space at the front of the 914 -- whether it would be as simple as a space-saver spare mounted upright on the bulkhead or as complicated as custom ducting to preserve a little of the stock trunk or even a fuel cell mounted low so a chunk of the upper compartment could be reclaimed.

Or, could the area in front of each wheel be re-worked for smaller radiators that could have straight-through venting from the foglight grilles and then into the wheel wells? That'd probably be a lot o' work, though...

I've seen several conversion cars done really well at the engine compartment, but none with a truly space-efficient cooling setup up front. I suspect it wouldn't be easy, but it would vastly improve the useability and appeal of these cars...

Posted by: dbledsoe Jun 21 2007, 03:32 PM

I am getting ready to start on another conversion in my white 76 (another Buick V6 conversion) and I was thinking along the same line as you. I plan to evaluate other cooling options up front, or possibly something in the rear beneath the car. I recall seeing one or two conversions where the radiator was laying flat in the bottom of the front trunk. The floor of the front trunk was cut out and the radiator sat in the opening and air was drawn in the front, passed over the top, and exited out the bottom, a shelf was then built above the radiator that allowed the spare tire to lay flat and still left some room around the spare and above it for tools, kit, etc.