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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ 914 supercar
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 20 2007, 01:23 AM
So I'm a mechanical engineering student and a big-time racing fan. And I've designed a formula one type car in CAD and I'm thinking about designing another car in CAD with a strong 914 base.
Here's a few things I'm thinking of:
-914 suspension (or 911) geometry, wheelbase, track, etc
-914 transaxle
-probably not a type IV, something else that's more modern
-Fiberglass monocoque or tube frame or combo
-custom aero body (my big part cause I want to be an aerodynamicist) in the low-drag (and some downforce) style of the carrera GT, GT40, McLaren f1, etc
Basically something I could build in several years with some research and design now while I'm in school. I want it light, relatively ( 
) cheap, and of course aerodynamically superior (for mpg and speed). Like a 916 of modern times (at least the concept part)
So what do you guys think?
Posted by: messix Jun 20 2007, 01:32 AM
go light and slippery and you don't need big hp. unless you want it to get big into the triple digits in mph.
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 20 2007, 01:36 AM
True, I like the lotus elise and ariel atom concepts, really really light and 'low' hp and still super fast 
. How much power can be had from a custom built Type IV? like a 2.0+ with lots o' goodies.
Posted by: messix Jun 20 2007, 01:50 AM
True, I like the lotus elise and ariel atom concepts, really really light and 'low' hp and still super fast
. How much power can be had from a custom built Type IV? like a 2.0+ with lots o' goodies.now you're talkin $$$$. look up jake raby/ massive type four
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 20 2007, 01:54 AM
well I'll go for a different engine for less money, cause it'll probably be the same or more power and reliability and not tons of money.
Posted by: TonyAKAVW Jun 20 2007, 02:10 AM
400 HP from a Subaru WRX STi motor is doable, reliable, and weighs less than a type IV.
-Tony
Posted by: dlo914 Jun 20 2007, 02:12 AM
400 HP from a Subaru WRX STi motor is doable, reliable, and weighs less than a type IV.
-Tony
i agree! cant beat japanese reliability! and they're really affordable!
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 20 2007, 02:20 AM
Yeah, a subie would be cool. But 400hp would melt the 914 transaxle no? I saw subaru was coming out with a new diesel boxer-4, how about a diesel supercar? like 150mph and 45 mpg?
Posted by: Johny Blackstain Jun 20 2007, 05:47 AM
Yeah, a subie would be cool. But 400hp would melt the 914 transaxle no? I saw subaru was coming out with a new diesel boxer-4, how about a diesel supercar? like 150mph and 45 mpg?
Bolt it up to a 915 transaxle instead of a 901 & those 400 ponies will stay corralled. However, nothing & I mean nothing beats the sound of a flat six powered by tripple Webbers. I'm sure just about any 3.0, 3.2 or 3.6 could dust my ass, but I'll kill them in the sound competition
Posted by: Hydra Jun 20 2007, 06:44 AM
If the Subaru engine choice appeals to you. why not go all the way and use a subaru transaxle while you're at it. Subaru trannies are cheaper than a 901 and can withstand much more power, while still having a cable operated clutch... my 2 cents..
Good luck
Posted by: Vacca Rabite Jun 20 2007, 08:13 AM
If youe goal is to design a lightweight mid engined car, it would probably be easier to use newer components then the 30 year old VW/Porsche parts off a 914.
Any Honda/Subi/VW engine is going to make more power cheaper. Better trannies are out then then the 901. 914 suspension is a 30 year old design (that happens to work very well, but look and see what is out there now).
I would say to get your influence from the 914, but make it a more modern car.
Zach
Posted by: URY914 Jun 20 2007, 08:36 AM
If youe goal is to design a lightweight mid engined car, it would probably be easier to use newer components then the 30 year old VW/Porsche parts off a 914.
Any Honda/Subi/VW engine is going to make more power cheaper. Better trannies are out then then the 901. 914 suspension is a 30 year old design (that happens to work very well, but look and see what is out there now).
I would say to get your influence from the 914, but make it a more modern car.
Zach
100%Posted by: woobn8r Jun 20 2007, 08:50 AM
You might want to study the 904 as a precursor to your putting "pen to paper" (or clicking your CAD mouse). It has the layout you're looking at, lightweight design and materials, aerodynamic (for it's age) not to mention it's timeless and classic good looks.
A modern 904 could ROCK! (the original sure does)
Oh and I agree...Nothing sounds better than a flat six with carbinators....
But you may wsh to consider a Rotary out of an Rx8...compact, light, only 3 moving parts in the engine....and much more efficient than the older model rotaries. (Mazda won LeMans on fuel economy in 1991)
Posted by: mrdezyne Jun 20 2007, 09:25 AM
I like the idea, go for it! But beware of linking it in any form to a 914 on this forum, the purist patrol will attack when you are at your weakest. They are like a heard of oompa-lumpas that come out and start whacking your knee caps with little ball peen hammers... annoying little pests... 
A substantial front suspension setup with coilovers might be a more modern spin-off, although for buget sake stick with what works and its hard to beat what Porsche used to set the standard years ago.
I fully agree with a modern powerplant and transaxle as so many have suggested. Subaru is about as close as you can come to a modern Type IV and you get to keep that very desirable boxer growl. Find an Imprezza RS or WRX STI at your next local auto-x event (with BORLA exhaust is a bonus) and ask the guy if you can tag along with him for a run through the cones, you will be sold.
As for a modern twist on design, I leave you with this lovely example to ponder. This is the only photo I have but it appears to be an amazing piece of workmanship, all metal fab (aluminum?) body with hints of 914 heratige, supposedly it is based on a 914 roller. Does anyone else have more info or photos? I LOVE THIS!!!!
Attached image(s)
Posted by: Jake Raby Jun 20 2007, 09:25 AM
Add the radiator and kill the car. If you want a watercooled 914, just buy a Fiero.
Posted by: 914nerd Jun 20 2007, 09:34 AM
You could also build a big horsepower turbo type IV
No radiator, plenty of potential for power, and you retain the original weight distribution
That coupled with a light, well designed Fiberglass body would make a hell of a car
Posted by: sww914 Jun 20 2007, 10:18 AM
I like the idea, go for it! But beware of linking it in any form to a 914 on this forum, the purist patrol will attack when you are at your weakest. They are like a heard of oompa-lumpas that come out and start whacking your knee caps with little ball peen hammers... annoying little pests...
A substantial front suspension setup with coilovers might be a more modern spin-off, although for buget sake stick with what works and its hard to beat what Porsche used to set the standard years ago.
I fully agree with a modern powerplant and transaxle as so many have suggested. Subaru is about as close as you can come to a modern Type IV and you get to keep that very desirable boxer growl. Find an Imprezza RS or WRX STI at your next local auto-x event (with BORLA exhaust is a bonus) and ask the guy if you can tag along with him for a run through the cones, you will be sold.
As for a modern twist on design, I leave you with this lovely example to ponder. This is the only photo I have but it appears to be an amazing piece of workmanship, all metal fab (aluminum?) body with hints of 914 heratige, supposedly it is based on a 914 roller. Does anyone else have more info or photos? I LOVE THIS!!!!
That's beautiful!
Posted by: marks914 Jun 20 2007, 10:32 AM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
Attached image(s)
Posted by: Johny Blackstain Jun 20 2007, 11:16 AM
beware of linking it in any form to a 914 on this forum, the purist patrol will attack when you are at your weakest. They are like a heard of oompa-lumpas that come out and start whacking your knee caps with little ball peen hammers... annoying little pests...
Yes, & here's why: monocoque construction- called a 956 or 962. Tube frame- 550, 718RSK, 906, 907, 908, 909, 910, 917 & 936. Composite- 904. All these designs are mid engined Porsches, the 904 & 906 being the most street friendly. If you want to redesign the 914 then take a look at the neo 914 here on our board. Or explore the Boxster & the Cayman, the new 914s of today. Annoying little pest ain't I
?
Posted by: RoninEclipse2G Jun 20 2007, 11:31 AM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
pretty!
Posted by: mrdezyne Jun 20 2007, 11:54 AM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
SEXY SWEET MOTHER OF PEARL! That is a brilliant design...
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 20 2007, 12:11 PM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
Definately, something like that is cool, and the other one higher up is pretty sweet too, the origianal 914 is alright, but I want something realllllllly slippery so we'll see what the windtunnel gives us. As for the subie engine and transaxle, that sounds like a good modern upgrade, I'd just have to figure out the rear suspension and all to go with it. As for the front suspension, maybe like a 911 front suspension with coilovers and the more modern bits?
Posted by: KELTY360 Jun 20 2007, 01:01 PM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
Wow! I wonder how slippery that is? Great looking design. Really like the kick-up behind the door. Sets up the flare at rear wheels beautifully. This interpretation of a 914 would be a good place to start.
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 21 2007, 02:38 AM
well it seems that if I try and make a 914-type body more slippery, eventually I'll just get to a cayman 
, so maybe a different direction is needed... especially after we've replaced all the mechanical bits with 911's or subies or something else. so we really have taken this out of the 914 world . maybe I'll go back to my F1 typish cars or a prototype racer.....
Posted by: So.Cal.914 Jun 21 2007, 04:36 AM
make it look something like this? modern 914
Mark
Definately, something like that is cool, and the other one higher up is pretty sweet too, the origianal 914 is alright, but I want something realllllllly slippery so we'll see what the windtunnel gives us. As for the subie engine and transaxle, that sounds like a good modern upgrade, I'd just have to figure out the rear suspension and all to go with it. As for the front suspension, maybe like a 911 front suspension with coilovers and the more modern bits?
Here's a design far superior to anything above.
Attached image(s)
Posted by: BahnBrenner914 Jun 21 2007, 11:58 AM
that deserves a 7 barf salute. There's scoops on there I can't even figure out what they're for. and the aero is pretty bad considering it's a from-stratch car.
And the body panel right behind the door!!!!! what the hell is that? that is a really huge gap, looks like it's been rear-ended or something.
Posted by: So.Cal.914 Jun 21 2007, 12:19 PM
Sence you liked it soooo much, here is a couple more.
Posted by: jaminM3 Jun 21 2007, 12:56 PM
I like the idea, go for it! But beware of linking it in any form to a 914 on this forum, the purist patrol will attack when you are at your weakest. They are like a heard of oompa-lumpas that come out and start whacking your knee caps with little ball peen hammers... annoying little pests...
A substantial front suspension setup with coilovers might be a more modern spin-off, although for buget sake stick with what works and its hard to beat what Porsche used to set the standard years ago.
I fully agree with a modern powerplant and transaxle as so many have suggested. Subaru is about as close as you can come to a modern Type IV and you get to keep that very desirable boxer growl. Find an Imprezza RS or WRX STI at your next local auto-x event (with BORLA exhaust is a bonus) and ask the guy if you can tag along with him for a run through the cones, you will be sold.
As for a modern twist on design, I leave you with this lovely example to ponder. This is the only photo I have but it appears to be an amazing piece of workmanship, all metal fab (aluminum?) body with hints of 914 heratige, supposedly it is based on a 914 roller. Does anyone else have more info or photos? I LOVE THIS!!!!
Wow, this is pretty cool. So is the sketch above..
Posted by: neo914-6 Jun 21 2007, 01:36 PM
If you want to redesign the 914 then take a look at the neo 914 here on our board.
BTW, I met mrdezyne at last years SEMA, he is neo's "illegitimate brother"
While designing the neo914 concept I wanted to keep some semblance of the 914 character (upright windshield, fender pods, and targa band). I felt if you depart so far from the 914 you may as well start with a clean sheet design and call it something else. The drivetrain is modern but I still have the antiquated trailing arms and torsion fronts albeit with needle bearings.
Define your goal well, gather your cash, schedule the time and go for it...
Posted by: 914-8 Jun 21 2007, 02:45 PM
That one always reminds me of the car designed by homer simpson:
Posted by: So.Cal.914 Jun 21 2007, 05:07 PM
That one always reminds me of the car designed by homer simpson:
You mean their different?
Posted by: 914-8 Jun 21 2007, 05:47 PM
slightly. homer had enough taste to not put TWO sets of exterior rear view mirrors on the driver's side.
Posted by: mrdezyne Jun 22 2007, 09:41 AM
Define your goal well, gather your cash, schedule the time and go for it...
Regardless of what other advice you get on this thread, WRITE THIS DOWN. Felix has been/is going through a form of what you wish to attempt. Find his thread and do some reading. He has a very well thought out and orchestrated project. The crowds that gathered around NEO914 each day at SEMA can attest to that. Time is your friend, use it well and try not to get in a hurry, you don't want to end up with another "Homermobile"... (I should know, I've currently used 2 years and still have no rolling chasis.. HA!) Figure a time line and double it, figure a budget and triple it. Does that sound about right Felix?
Nice example of updating a 914 and keeping the heritage...
Attached image(s)
Posted by: alpha434 Jun 22 2007, 11:19 AM
Put one of those Hyabusa V-8s in it.
Drivetrain is always the biggest selling point in a supercar.
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