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Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Aug 17 2007, 09:42 AM

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Porsche-914-1973-Porsche-914-V8- Conversion_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6430QQihZ014QQitemZ330156560207QQrdZ1QQssp
agenameZWDVW


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Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Aug 17 2007, 09:43 AM

dzfg


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Posted by: Vacca Rabite Aug 17 2007, 09:49 AM

I don't know about the copper tubing for the cooling system, but that car has MUCH awesome.

Zach

Posted by: rmital Aug 17 2007, 10:00 AM

Holy Crap!
....put that one on my Xmas list....

Posted by: URY914 Aug 17 2007, 10:16 AM

Copper tubing? Guy must be a plumber.

HUGE amount of work went into that car.

Posted by: Headrage Aug 17 2007, 10:31 AM

But I would definitely re-route that tubing...

Posted by: woobn8r Aug 17 2007, 10:38 AM

The engine is still in the middle, right?

What's the big hood scoop for? Radiator clearance?

Posted by: balljoint Aug 17 2007, 10:44 AM

Is that where the air exits the rad?

Posted by: Heeltoe914 Aug 17 2007, 10:52 AM

that really is a nice car Looks like a lot of attension went into a good finish.

Posted by: jaminM3 Aug 17 2007, 11:01 AM

I don't understand this one...

Posted by: aircooledboy Aug 17 2007, 11:02 AM

I'm not sure what I think about that hood, but otherwise: DAMN!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: aircooledboy Aug 17 2007, 11:16 AM

Lemme see if I can explain.

A guy took a 914, and he put a V8 in it to make it really fast. Rather than just cram in a poorly planned conversion, he appears to have thought out every last detail right down to appropriate suspension and brake modification, chasis reinforcements and a modified shift linkage. He carried out the conversion in about as bullet-proof and badass of a fashion as he possibly could, apparently leaving no potential problem unaddressed. He customized a few things along the way to his taste, maybe a few over the top, ultimately resulting in a car that any objective car guy would have to respect as being amazingly well executed from an engineering and mechanical point of view.

Posted by: Thomas J Bliznik Aug 17 2007, 11:33 AM

This is a beautiful car. I like the way he changed the hood breaking up the flat lines. Also like the front bumper & grill and just about everything else about the body modifications. I really like it. Lots of great idea's & tastefully done.
I would have let off a few side scoops, but that's just me.

Tom

Posted by: Elliot Cannon Aug 17 2007, 11:45 AM

One of the nicest conversions I have ever seen. I like the side scoops on the rockers and rear quarter panels. Something tells me they are functional and not just for looks. I see a radiator AND and oil cooler. Do I also see air conditioning? I'd sure like to know more about the shifter mechanism. Is that a 915 trans? I also like the heat shieldes around the Magnaflo mufflers as well as other places. All in all just a very nice job. Even if you're not a V8 person, you gotta love this car.
cheers, Elliot

Posted by: zymurgist Aug 17 2007, 11:56 AM

I think this guy did everything the way I would have done it. Lots of attention to detail, no obvious short cuts.

As far as the hood scoop goes, it looks a lot like the stock hood bump on my '77 Vette, the only difference being the spine that runs down the center of the scoop on the 914. I would consider it to be a styling cue to reflect the Chevy power under the, ummm, hood.

Posted by: Brian Mifsud Aug 17 2007, 12:04 PM

Very nice attention to detail. I agree, it appears that each mod was thoroughly thought thru, from beginning to end.

The scoop on the hood I'm pretty sure is not functional because it is designed to flow backwards, i.e. high pressure at base of windshield pushes air into the scoop.
It still is a great idea because it screams Chevy (in an understated way).

If the vehicle was setup for a Moonshot, I'd probably want to change out the copper to Galvanized Water Pipe only because of the potential to work harden and crack. If you run over a curb and damage the copper, you can always stop off at your FLBBS (Friendly Local Big Box Store) and get new pipe and sweat fittings.
Galvanized Water Pipe is not gonna crush easily if you ground out. The sheetmetal floor of the car will yield first, so I don't think that routing is a bad idea. (Stay on the GD road!)

Nice Car!

Posted by: kart54 Aug 17 2007, 12:16 PM

Definitely an interesting conversion but a long way from the nicest around. Howard's Moby would be an example of a nicely done conversion, this ones just OK.
Went to all the trouble to do all this work but didn't paint the underside of the car while there? Redid the entire front trunk but didn't paint it either. That copper tubing will be history on the first speed bump it hits here in the southland. Variety of other issues I see but those are some of the biggies.
Can't believe the guy went to all this money and effort but did such a cheap, half-assed paint job and didn't plan better for the plumbing of the radiator.
Last thing, where do you keep a spare? You've got a jack and a wrench in the trunk but no place for a spare tire of any type.
Randy

Posted by: tdgray Aug 17 2007, 12:29 PM

You're kidding right

Who the F paints the underside of the car if you expect to drive it

Posted by: jimkelly Aug 17 2007, 12:38 PM

i will say this - thank god that RH has made doing a conversion pretty simple and that this level of awesomeness is not necessary for the average joe to have a v8 914. witht hat said - i will say if you are gonna use any sort of metal for water lines under car they need to be strong thick steel as to not bend if a speed bump is hit - copper will crush and then reduce flow and cause over heat and worse if not noticed asap.
jim

Posted by: Jeff Bowlsby Aug 17 2007, 12:42 PM

Is this for power steering? See also the front trunk pics


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Posted by: Phoenix-MN Aug 17 2007, 01:02 PM

If your paying attention to details
see
http://www.phoenixhobbies.com/html/paint.html

Posted by: Grelber Aug 17 2007, 01:08 PM

The car is on consignment with the shop that is selling it. The guys at the shop know almost nothing about the car. (Engine, trans, etc.)

It's also for sale locally for $19,000.

Posted by: BMXerror Aug 17 2007, 01:11 PM

Ummm.... no I don't. I agree that a lot of work went into this car, and that it's unique, but I don't really care for the style of it(Just my opinion). I also don't think you can tell that it's been technically thought out and well engineered because there's a lot of well-done bodywork and some expensive bolt on parts. I mean, the suspension seems to be a good choice, but he doesn't even mention it in the ad. What does that tell you? I'm not saying it necessarily wasn't well engineered, but I don't think you can tell without looking it over in person or, even better, working on it. More importantly, it seems unfair to accuse people of doing a "half-assed" conversion because they don't have the money to make it look as flashy as this one. It doesn't mean their fabrication and design of any custom parts is any lower quality. My $.02. Direct your irate comments this way.
Mark D.

Posted by: aircooledboy Aug 17 2007, 02:51 PM

With all due respect bud, if that's what you see, you either don't know what you are looking at, or are not looking very carefully. Very few of the things that have gotten attention are not custom "one of a kind" pieces. I have spent a lot of time gathering ideas from other people's conversions, and there a many fabrications on this car that I have never seen anywhere else. The body is nice, but that isn't what caught my eye.



It tells me you haven't read the thread or looked at the ad very carefully. The ad is from a car dealer, and a post above says the car is being sold by a broker on consignment.



If anybody wrote that above, I missed it. I saw the paint on THIS car called half ass, but not anybody's conversion. I know what impresses me is that I see several of the areas I would like to improve on my car (which I consider to be an excellent example of a properly done conversion BTW) to have been addressed on this conversion in logical and custom ways.

Posted by: alpha434 Aug 17 2007, 03:00 PM

I'd like to point out the heat shielding. Around the mufflers and around the copper tubing.

VERY nice touch. Attention to detail. Maybe the guy was a helicopter mechanic.

And to justify the copper tubing... The idea was probly to displace as much heat as possible before getting to the radiator and before getting to the engine. Not being as strong might have been an oversight. But I doubt the guy would've "lost" his presence of mind driving over a big speed bump. Not if the rest of his car indicates what he's like.

Posted by: Brian Mifsud Aug 17 2007, 03:02 PM

Yes, you CAN see that things were well thought out. Here are some examples:

1) Rear Oil Cooler Placement, set up on rear bumper in high drag/vacuum part of slipstream for good airflow

2) Careful cable and tubing routing all over the car (I've already said my bit about the cooling lines under the car.. not a big risk). Wire and cables are well insulated and secured.

3) Great Sheetmetal work: all holes/apertures cut into the body are well finished off so no sharp edges to cut cables/wire/hands etc.

4) Weak parts of car reinforced.

5) Heatshields installed where needed.

6) Provision for engine room cooling.

Each of those items indicate to me that this guy understands cars, and has an eye for detail. He also has enough experience to ANTICIPATE problems, and thus, put the solution in place ahead of time.

I don't see many "fancy" bolt-ons, mostly handmade one-off solutions, but they look rugged and sensible. It also looks like you can get access to the service items you need to.

Nice Car

Posted by: SirAndy Aug 17 2007, 03:08 PM

attention to detail (or the lack of) speaks volumes about the quality of the work done.


sorry guys, but that car doesn't do a thing for me ...
Andy

Posted by: zymurgist Aug 17 2007, 03:19 PM

Heat in the cockpit... hmmm, maybe the guy owns a Corvette.

Posted by: jaminM3 Aug 17 2007, 03:29 PM

Yeah, those copper lines are great

And the hood!! Are you kidding? this isn't a Chevelle or Camaro....

Everything else looks OK I guess, I think it is just a little over the top

Posted by: jasons Aug 17 2007, 04:07 PM

LOL, I can relate to that!

Posted by: sww914 Aug 17 2007, 06:07 PM

It looks like a ski boat from the 80's.

Posted by: 914-8 Aug 17 2007, 07:42 PM

One of the things I like about V8 conversions is that everyone that does one has a different interpretation of what a V8 914 should look like. For example, some like to do things that highlight that the car is watercooled (like this silver one), others like to disguise it.

And there lots of different ideas of how to handle the various re-engineering that is necessary. You rarely see 2 V8 cars that are even remotely alike.

This silver one looks like it has had some nice work done on it. But definitely not my cup of tea. Copper plumbing is nice in a house, but just wrong on a car. And styling is subjective and opinion, but almost none of the choices on that car is one that I would have made (hood, multiple oversized openings in the bumper, unnecessary venting of the engine lid, the big fender vents which are useless in an watercooled car, the fake 911 door panels, etc. But the car was his vision of how a V8 should look, not mine!

Will be interesting to see where it ends up.

Posted by: jasons Aug 17 2007, 08:02 PM

I'm not really a Chalon lover, but... I thought this was a really nice V8 car that sold last week.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=150147545696&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=005#ebayphotohosting

Posted by: degreeoff Aug 17 2007, 08:07 PM

Posted by: Pat Garvey Aug 17 2007, 08:22 PM

I will be the first to admit that I know NOTHING about V8 conversions, but am always willing to be educated.

This particular "car" doesn't send off any rockets for me, though it is interesting & apparently well thought out.

But, how much has been invested in this car? Strikes me to be a LOT. So, why do something like this if you can't possibly expect to recoup even half your cost? And, your resale market is unbelievable restrictive (I guess?).

So....why not keep the thing Porsche? You want more poop? Put just about anything Porsche in it (my preference would be a 3.0 - simple & enough hp for me), even a 3.6. Do it yourself & do it right, and you'll still have a market for the 914 when you want to sell. No, you won't recap your costs, but it's a car - not a house.

Or, am I being naive here?
Pat

Posted by: dakotaewing Aug 17 2007, 08:46 PM

Pat -

I do not mean to start anything here... So please don't take it that way -
But, it seems obvious to me you have never driven a 400HP 914 that was well sorted out - If you had, then you would have a much better understanding of what V8 cars are all about -
If you ever have the opportunity, don't pass it up -

Best -

Thom

Posted by: SirAndy Aug 17 2007, 09:47 PM

i have. more than once. with even more than 400 HP. and i still sorta agree with pat.

but that's besides the point. you can stick as many V8's in your 914 as you like. fine with me.

still doesn't make me like that car much ...
Andy

Posted by: Luke Aug 17 2007, 10:29 PM

Don't think he has to worry about crushing the copper ... it sits like a Cayenne ...

Posted by: boxstr Aug 17 2007, 11:11 PM

Sweet front hood prop.....


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Posted by: andys Aug 18 2007, 10:05 PM

Can anyone identify the seats in that car?
Thanks,
Andys

Posted by: drive-ability Aug 18 2007, 10:45 PM

I think you have a little bit of skinny tire and high riding hight. Speaking for myself with a V8 car I like the extra suspension travel and a softer ride. That may be what he's doing as well.
Nice job, I'm not a fan of the hood, or side scoops and the radiator intake is a bit over done. Otherwise a good job

Posted by: michaelt55 Aug 19 2007, 03:44 AM

Well..thats why people have individulaized 914's. Not everyone wants a 4 or six, or even likes the slope nose, or chalon, or 916 versions. I am sure everyone thought I was nuts to sell my 73 with a Raby 2056 for a V8 porsche. And mine wasn't the ground punding 400 hp type. But I am glad I did and I enjoy my car. I think this guy put alot of thought into it and I think I like most of it. So why pick it apart? Just say wow...this guy had his own vision and either thumbs up or down.

Posted by: SirAndy Aug 19 2007, 02:16 PM

because that's all we old farts have left to entertain us ...

think "Statler & Waldorf" from the Muppets Show ...

Posted by: Series9 Aug 19 2007, 02:40 PM

Well the guy doesn't know how a rear sway bar works.

The brackets are in the wrong place, rendering the bar completely nonfunctional.

That alone, calls into question his ability to build a quality car.

Posted by: Series9 Aug 19 2007, 09:38 PM

What? No replies?

Look. Horizontal drop links do absolutely nothing. The bushing brackets are about 2" too far aft.

It seems typical of the type of person who puts an American V8 in a 914. They're looking for 1/4 mile performance, while having no understanding of how a sports car actually works.

Have a look at the white outlines:


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Posted by: Series9 Aug 19 2007, 09:52 PM

OK. Here's how it should look.

See that the drop link is vertical?

That's how it goes:


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Posted by: Series9 Aug 19 2007, 10:28 PM

Bullshit. He covered cool parts with shields and left the CVs uncovered.


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Posted by: SirAndy Aug 19 2007, 10:34 PM

i like the Joe!


Andy

Posted by: LarryR Aug 19 2007, 10:35 PM

Well said I could not agree more.

Posted by: Eric Taylor Aug 19 2007, 10:43 PM

I saw this car in person friday night. I was driving home from dinner and it caught my eye as a beautiful 914. So I stopped and looked at it in the dark.

I will have to say this is a beautiful car. When I first saw it I figured it was a six because it looked so we'll done. When I looked at it closer I saw the luvers and a few more american hot rod style features and saw it was a V8 from the window tag. At first I thought gross. V8 car's arn't really me thing because I think many of them are done on a budget and corners are cut. When I looked at this car It seemed different. This car is really well done. The paint is great the complete silver look is beautiful and the personal touches fit the style of the car. While the v8 is not my thing, this is a beautifully done car. Whoever get's this car should be very proud of the quality of it. I really admire the work that has gone into.

Anyway it's a sweet car and if anyone want's me to take a look at it closer I would be MORE than happy to do it ! :)The shop that is selling it deals in really nice sports cars. Mostly british stuff but they have this and a 930 on the show room floor. Most of the car's from there are really high quality.
Eric

Posted by: Series9 Aug 19 2007, 10:50 PM

That may be so, but I assure you that my little 3.6 will KILL that stupid 5+Liter V8.

If a guy doesn't know how a sway bar works.......

Posted by: jasons Aug 19 2007, 11:02 PM

Not if Chuck Norris is driving the V8.

Edit: or maybe Mike Ditka too.

Posted by: TROJANMAN Aug 19 2007, 11:15 PM

Joe,
You're my hero

Posted by: michaelt55 Aug 20 2007, 01:30 AM

Granted, you probably know what you are talking about but your method of getting it across is a tad manic. Whoever built the car, obviously knew something about cars. Maybe not an expert on 914's but knows the 911 on some type of car.

I think Andy was right...you have nothing better to do than pick this car apart. If I had made the mistake building the car and "messed up" an otherwise good build, I would hope you told me where I went wrong. Not hold me up for a public flogging and show your depth of knowledge.

Not everyone has the same idea of "the perfect car". I happen to like this one...shows some originality and some thought. Don't like the hood though...

Michael

Posted by: euro911 Aug 20 2007, 02:01 AM

I think he/they did a pretty good job constructing this car. The mistakes in the suspension and heat shielding could be modified with some inexpensive fab-werk ... and the front decklid can always be replaced ...

It's definitely nicer looking and probably more reliable than my 914

Posted by: charliew Aug 20 2007, 02:19 AM

I think when the car is sitting on it's wheels the angle of the links will improve. The wheels are at full droop. He has the springs set to ride higher so they will force the arms farther down when it's on a lift. His car may squat quite a bit when he takes off hard. Your yellow car sets quite a bit lower so the rear arms don't drop as far when the weights off the wheels. The bar could have already been on the car and he didn't notice the angle. He probably has never raced the car anywhere but at the stoplight, don't try him there with your porsche 3.6. you might get a lesson in torque. Also the shields are on the mufflers to prevent the heat from getting to the oil cooler it looks like to me. He put the bulge on the hood for the same reason I've got one on my k5 Blazer, he liked it.
Charlie

Posted by: Series9 Aug 20 2007, 08:35 AM

It's simply not true. The bar is mounted to the wrong place on the chassis. That bar doesn't work.




My car isn't particularly low, and it doesn't matter anyway.



I promise you, that won't be the lesson. That engine alone weighs 175 pounds more than mine. The total installation is at least 250 pounds heavier.

The lesson: Power:weight is all that matters. That V8 has to make 100 hp more than mine just to offset its weight.

Posted by: Series9 Aug 20 2007, 08:40 AM

Hi. My name is Joe. I prefer the term "passionate".



OK. This was fun. Moving on.......

Posted by: Joe Sharp Aug 20 2007, 09:19 AM

Alright!!!!
This is a wake up call...I've been ignoring this thread until now.
If you want to increase the quality of the 914's in our World you had better start thinking about the details that you think have been done so well. How many u-bolts are on in that car? What? WTF is a u-bolt doing in a Porsche? It has heat shields everywhere, why? We need to educate each other in order to bring up the quality of the cars or suffer from the cars never being no more than the bastard that the porsche owners decided they should be back in the 70's.
I only spent about 5 minutes getting pissed about what We (the collective) know about cars. This is a point that I totally agree with brad roberts.
If you find a back yard solution for your car and it is fit for a Volkswagen don't put it on your Porsche.....

Posted by: zymurgist Aug 20 2007, 09:48 AM

Heh. Judging by your avatar picture and your location, I should say so!

Posted by: jasons Aug 20 2007, 10:29 AM

If I could have an unlimited budget to build a car, I would want to build your RS almost exactly (or buy it outright). And I think that silver car looks like ass with the cowl induction hood, and parts from home depot. But c'mon, you came here (this thread) looking for a fight. You posted once, no one cared, then you went out of your way to make sure someone would give a shit.

SO, I think we should somehow arrange for Chuck Norris to drive that silver V8 and race you in your RS. Lets put talk aside, and get to 'man' business here.

Posted by: Brian Mifsud Aug 20 2007, 12:32 PM

That's a sharp eye Joe, and I do agree that the installation of the sway bar is wrong. Now, not to kindle an arguement, but that sway bar WILL work however, just in a significantly reduced range of motion (and it may be so significantly reduced, that is is useless). He could fix that by installing longer links, or moving the pivot point forward as you say.

Good call on the CV boots not being protected well. He DID have the awareness however to understand that shielding was important, he just lacked your infrared-eye

It's amazing how the variety of opinions on V8 Cars clash/crash/come together in this thread. I think people in general appreciate evidence of hard work, and skilled hands. The car has imperfections still, but remember, the motivation to modify (in the eye of the beholder) is the individuals' perception of imperfection (lack of power) and their quest to fix that. I find looking at and comparing cars like this fun because of the creativity and imagination of the builder and will always welcome posts like this.

Posted by: Series9 Aug 20 2007, 01:32 PM

I actually first looked because I hoped to see some nice engineering.

As for a race with Chuck, get him on the phone. I'm in.

Of course, it'll have to be a drag race because I'm sure that car doesn't turn or stop any more.

Posted by: charliew Aug 20 2007, 08:51 PM

I would really like to try the shifter out. I don't see any mechanical way to reliably twist the tranny shaft with spherical ball ends.

Charlie

Posted by: aircooledboy Aug 20 2007, 08:58 PM

I'd like to know where those numbers come from. I see people throw around numbers like that in nearly every V8 thread. I don't know for sure, but my gut tells me there is no way your 3.6 w/ cooler, tank & lines is 250 lbs less than an aluminium head 350. It's probably less, but not 2-fity. If you can back that position up, I'd like to see it.





I've never called bullshit before, but I've gotta do it here. That's some pretty fancy math there. If in order to keep up with your car a V8 has to make up 100 hp to offset that 250 lbs I'm not buying anyway, that means your car must be making 1hp/2.5lbs. So, either your car is making about 880hp, in which case congrats are in order, or your car weighs about 875 lbs, which is amazing based on the pics I've seen, or is in order.

Everybody is entitled to their personal opinion on the merits of a particular conversion, but I get tired of the made up numbers to justify the "V8s suck" point of view.

Posted by: michaelt55 Aug 20 2007, 09:08 PM

Joe,
I have a 215 all aluminum V8 in mine, weighs the same or less than your 6 with all its equipment. Its roughly about 215 hp by the dyno here in Houston. Only thing I gave up was the center of gravity and not by very much. As soon as I get rid of this tail shifter, I think even you would have to admire the torque and driveability of the engine. I also have a 1150 lb fiberglass kit car with a 2056 in it. The V8 eats it for lunch.

I try not ridicule anyone on this board, regardless of their views. I think that is one reason the board split was due to the "passionate" posts by people. I hope history does not repeat itself. This thread is done in my opinion


Michael

Posted by: URY914 Aug 20 2007, 09:20 PM

Posted by: drive-ability Aug 20 2007, 10:37 PM

Series9

I love the way my V8 runs, I don't know how quick a 3.6 would be but I guess its quite a gas to drive. I built my car for a tad over 16k, what do you have in your project? I guess a bit more or ?

Posted by: Joe Sharp Aug 21 2007, 03:02 AM

I thought this thread was about the quality of the car in the e-bay add.

Posted by: jasons Aug 21 2007, 07:55 AM

I've been following this thread somewhat closely and it has actually had a profound affect on me. No bullshit and I aint sharing why, you wouldn't care anyway.

Anywho.....

It was about that and it had just about been played out. But posts like these...



And....



.... Are going to illicit a response. Dontyathink? I'm not saying anyones right or wrong technically or socially, but you can't expect opinions this strong to not be countered by opinions just as strong. I mean when someone starts talking Porsche engine swaps, we are bordering on a passion that is exceeded only by Religon and Politics. And we all know most of those debates end with bad feelings.

Posted by: jmmotorsports Aug 21 2007, 08:26 AM

It seems typical of the type of person who puts an American V8 in a 914. They're looking for 1/4 mile performance, while having no understanding of how a sports car actually works.

I think Ford when they built the GT40, Jim Hall with the Chapperel,lola t-70, McLaren all had a pretty good understanding of how a sports car works when they put what you call stupid V8's in them.

I have a 914 V8 that stpos and goes around corners every bit as well as your car dose. And I don't need Chuck Norris or anybody else to drive it for me.

Jerry

Posted by: drive-ability Aug 21 2007, 02:52 PM

For me it was a few flakes who decide to just start comparing there cars to others. If you get off on putting down others best efforts I suggest showing off you little car in a Ferrari forum. My guess your best effort will be laughed off the site. I'm done

Posted by: jaminM3 Aug 21 2007, 04:37 PM

Can we see more pics of the car in your avatar? It looks sweet..