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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ I want to drive my 914 but it dont work!
Posted by: JOE M Sep 15 2008, 06:39 PM
I cant seem to get my carbs synced up correctly. I have tried everything but no luck. Let me start by saying I have Weber Redline IDF 40`S. They are the old style with the bigger pumps if that matters. I forget what the the jet size is but I done think thats my problem. I had Rich take a look a month ago or so and if I remember right he said that the size looked about right. I have zero experience with carbs so I am totally in the dark. I did buy a new gasket set and it came with new pumps and some o-rings. It also came with a new float valve. Where I am now is that the car starts right up and idles the balls. It sounds great but as soon as I put it in gear and give a little gas is bogs down. I have the air mixture screws all the way in and the spring loaded screws (not the idle adjust) about 2 turns out.I know that all 4 cylinders are about the same because I have a syncrometer and they all measure about 6~7 on the flow meter. I remember Rich advising me to make th adjustments with the linkage off so thats what I did. All I want is to be able to drive this thing around the block with out it farting and burping. The only thing that should cause farting and burping is beer. If anyone has any thing to offer please help.I am a desperate man and ready to get rid of this thing. Serious I will never get rid of it but I do want to understand better about how to get it to run correctly.I will deal with all the other little things later but my main goal is to get it on the street and have some fun.
Posted by: r_towle Sep 15 2008, 07:05 PM
I have the air mixture screws all the way in and the spring loaded screws (not the idle adjust) about 2 turns out.
did you get the book on webers?
You are flooding it. It loves gas at idle, but you are not providing enough air with the screws all the way in....
You home tommorow? I can get it in about an hour or so of tuning.
Get a decent drop light out there and I can come over after work when your home.
Rich
Posted by: JOE M Sep 15 2008, 07:06 PM
One thing I forgot to add is that I have been moving the distributor a little at a time to see if that makes any changes but it did not. With that sai my timing is a little off but the car starts with no issue.Also I will need to adjust my vavlves at some point.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 15 2008, 07:08 PM
Rich I am home at about 4:15`4:30. If you can help I would appraceate it.
Posted by: r_towle Sep 15 2008, 07:31 PM
Ill bring my tools tommorow.
Rich
Posted by: rhodyguy Sep 16 2008, 09:15 AM
not to be picky. the ones you have closed are the AIR-BYPASS, yes? the spring loaded ones are the idle air mixture screws. you set them equally on the baseline setup and adjust for final tuning/smooth idle with linkage hooked up and the carbs flowing the same. throw the unisyn back on with the linkage hooked up and confirm flow #S.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 16 2008, 09:57 AM
I have the air bypass all the way in. That is what the setup procedure said to do at Weber Redline website. See the highlighted area below. I will need to verify the float position because I think it is off. Rich is coming over sometime tonight so I am in good hands. I think his experience will help determine what is going on.The other problem that I have is that the mixture screws ( spring loaded) do not appear to be correct. There were no o-rings and the cup washer seems way to big.This is probably causing some issue also. I called weber and they do not have any specs on the cup washer so I have no way of knowing if it is correct but it seems way to big from what I see. I will wait for Rich and get his opinion. I have some orings that fit but because the hole diameter on the washer is so big the o-rings slip through it.Below is also a pic of the mixture screw with the swivel washer over it. This is the washer that was on all 4 mixture screws when I got the car.
PIC1.bmp ( 291.21k )
Number of downloads: 52
Posted by: Borderline Sep 16 2008, 11:09 AM
I use the synch-tool twice. The first time to balance the flow at idle with the linkage removed. Then with the throttle linkage connected, I adjust the throttle cable to bring the engine speed up to ~2k. Then I adjust the throttle links to balance the flow again. This works pretty well as that throttle position is where you spend most of your time when cruising around. Also my throttle linkage has a lot of play and this method compensates for slop in the linkage. Don't forget to re-adjust the cable so it idles back down. good luck! 
Posted by: r_towle Sep 16 2008, 06:37 PM
I have the air bypass all the way in. That is what the setup procedure said to do at Weber Redline website. See the highlighted area below. I will need to verify the float position because I think it is off. Rich is coming over sometime tonight so I am in good hands. I think his experience will help determine what is going on.The other problem that I have is that the mixture screws ( spring loaded) do not appear to be correct. There were no o-rings and the cup washer seems way to big.This is probably causing some issue also. I called weber and they do not have any specs on the cup washer so I have no way of knowing if it is correct but it seems way to big from what I see. I will wait for Rich and get his opinion. I have some orings that fit but because the hole diameter on the washer is so big the o-rings slip through it.Below is also a pic of the mixture screw with the swivel washer over it. This is the washer that was on all 4 mixture screws when I got the car.
PIC1.bmp ( 291.21k )
Number of downloads: 52Oops, forgot.
I spent all day roofing my FIL house...I am beat tired.
Can we do this Wed night, same time?
Rich
Posted by: r_towle Sep 16 2008, 06:39 PM
Those are the wrong washers.
Let me see if I have any...dont think I do...no more carbs here, but a pile of parts...
I will bring what I have, its a box of weber stuff from lots of cars.
Rich
Posted by: JOE M Sep 16 2008, 06:40 PM
I have the air bypass all the way in. That is what the setup procedure said to do at Weber Redline website. See the highlighted area below. I will need to verify the float position because I think it is off. Rich is coming over sometime tonight so I am in good hands. I think his experience will help determine what is going on.The other problem that I have is that the mixture screws ( spring loaded) do not appear to be correct. There were no o-rings and the cup washer seems way to big.This is probably causing some issue also. I called weber and they do not have any specs on the cup washer so I have no way of knowing if it is correct but it seems way to big from what I see. I will wait for Rich and get his opinion. I have some orings that fit but because the hole diameter on the washer is so big the o-rings slip through it.Below is also a pic of the mixture screw with the swivel washer over it. This is the washer that was on all 4 mixture screws when I got the car.
PIC1.bmp ( 291.21k )
Number of downloads: 52Oops, forgot.
I spent all day roofing my FIL house...I am beat tired.
Can we do this Wed night, same time?
Rich
That works for me but I will not be home untill 6. Is that o.k with you?
Posted by: r_towle Sep 16 2008, 06:53 PM
yes, actually better...I have to finish the roof tommorow...so 6 is cool.
Where do you work, location wise?
You need to get the right washers...I can tell you who might have them local to your work...lunch run..
Rich
Posted by: JOE M Sep 17 2008, 05:12 AM
yes, actually better...I have to finish the roof tommorow...so 6 is cool.
Where do you work, location wise?
You need to get the right washers...I can tell you who might have them local to your work...lunch run..
Rich
Rich
I work in Tekwsbury Ma. on RT38 near the Home Depot.
Posted by: r_towle Sep 17 2008, 08:50 AM
yes, actually better...I have to finish the roof tommorow...so 6 is cool.
Where do you work, location wise?
You need to get the right washers...I can tell you who might have them local to your work...lunch run..
Rich
Rich
I work in Tekwsbury Ma. on RT38 near the Home Depot.
http://www.autobahnperformance.com/
Posted by: JOE M Sep 17 2008, 11:02 AM
yes, actually better...I have to finish the roof tommorow...so 6 is cool.
Where do you work, location wise?
You need to get the right washers...I can tell you who might have them local to your work...lunch run..
Rich
Rich
I work in Tekwsbury Ma. on RT38 near the Home Depot.
http://www.autobahnperformance.com/
Rich,
I called them ( the link you sent) and they said they have nothing. How critical is that washer. I have some swivel washers at work that I can open up a little and might work. I guess I am wondering what the function of the washer is other than a surface for the spring to rest on. It looks like it helps to hold compression on the spring but I am unsure. I am going to try to call Weber and see if replacements are available but I think I went down this road before.
Posted by: 904svo Sep 17 2008, 12:00 PM
There missing on my carbs also!!!! They are shown on the parts list. guess I'm
going to have to make them.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 17 2008, 12:36 PM
Rich,
I called a couple of other local places and no one has them. Do you think it`s worth it to make some adjustments or is it a waste of time right now? They sound like they are hard to come by. Not sure what to do!
Posted by: JOE M Sep 17 2008, 12:40 PM
There missing on my carbs also!!!! They are shown on the parts list. guess I'm
going to have to make them.
I will let you know what I end up doing. I might try to make some out of swivel washers that I have.
Posted by: SGB Sep 17 2008, 08:50 PM
The right washers do have a cup like shape (think donut dliced lenghtwise) to hold the o-ring against the base of the adjuster screw. I'm thinking they would be pretty important in the fine-tuning, but you have more serious mis-balence between the sides. I'm hoping you are confident your valves are correct. Not just "OK", but correct. The valve adjustment is really the first step of a carb synchronisation.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 18 2008, 05:24 AM
The right washers do have a cup like shape (think donut dliced lenghtwise) to hold the o-ring against the base of the adjuster screw. I'm thinking they would be pretty important in the fine-tuning, but you have more serious mis-balence between the sides. I'm hoping you are confident your valves are correct. Not just "OK", but correct. The valve adjustment is really the first step of a carb synchronisation.
I think my valves are off alittle but probably not horrible. I will get in there and check again. I am still looking for a good procedure on how to set them the best way. I tried the pelican parts article and it was kind of confusing how it was written. It`s not horrible but sort of confusing.
Posted by: r_towle Sep 18 2008, 08:35 AM
The right washers do have a cup like shape (think donut dliced lenghtwise) to hold the o-ring against the base of the adjuster screw. I'm thinking they would be pretty important in the fine-tuning, but you have more serious mis-balence between the sides. I'm hoping you are confident your valves are correct. Not just "OK", but correct. The valve adjustment is really the first step of a carb synchronisation.
I think my valves are off alittle but probably not horrible. I will get in there and check again. I am still looking for a good procedure on how to set them the best way. I tried the pelican parts article and it was kind of confusing how it was written. It`s not horrible but sort of confusing.
I can show you once we get the damn thing running right.
Do it, hit buy it now and be done with it..
Get a regulator also.
Still need that.
New fuel lines would help.
Rich
Posted by: JOE M Sep 18 2008, 11:42 AM
I am going to get some fuel line either tonight or tomorow and than decide what I can afford and either go back to stock F.I or buy the carbs on E-Bay. Not sure yet.I did see an add today on craigs list for a 1.7 engine complete (F.I) for $200 so I might shoot the guy an e-mail and see if he has everything needed for F.I. Plus his add claims that all 4 cylinders have good compression so it may be worth looking at for a rebuild for the future.
Posted by: r_towle Sep 18 2008, 03:32 PM
I saw that too..
Offer him less...
Rich
Posted by: JOE M Sep 19 2008, 05:41 PM
I went out and got about 10 feet of fuel line and a regulator. I hooked up the line in the engine bay only (I will go under the car later) and I hooked up the regulator. I set it to 2psi for starts and turned the key to check for leaks and found that fuel is spilling out of the regulator where the screws hold the body together. Piece of crap but thats what you get for twenty bucks I guess. Oh well back to the drawing board. I will be taking the regulator back tomorrow and get a new one.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 21 2008, 07:19 AM
The good news is that I now have some modern fuel line in the bay. I still need to install under the car but at least the may is modern rather than 1972 fuel line .lol.I returned the regulator but there were no more in stock so I am still without a regulator. I will need to look around for one.
Posted by: JOE M Sep 23 2008, 05:32 AM
Well I made a little more progress last night. I spent a couple hours pulling the carbs out and cleaning all the jets. I re-installed them and found that the constant drip is now a drip at idle every now and than. The car does seem to run much smoother but when I put any load on it it still bogs down. I was able to make a trip around the block and actually got into 4th gear. I did alot of research and found that these older style webers have a historical problem with dripping fuel at idle. It must be a design issue. I still need a regulator because I have no idea what my pressure is. I have an old facet pump and I think from what I have read it puts out about 7psi. I think that when all is said and done I will end up with some new carbs or back to stock F.I.
My next task will be to set the valves because I know they are off. I guess I am wondering how much valve adjustment might be hurting me now. Is it possible to tune the car without the valves being set properly? Another day and another problem. I love porsche 914!!!!! Now I know what everyone was saying when I first joined this forum and most replies were welcome to the insanity. Now I know what everyone was talking about but all in all I am learning alot. Thanks to all for helping and mostly to Rich for stopping by and helping. Now point me to a good article or procedure for adjusting valves. I tried Pelican but i got confused.
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