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914World.com _ 914World Garage _ my oil/ engine problems diagnosis ?
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 04:52 PM
take a look guys, by the way I did get her home the other night, and i beat the snow.
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Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 04:54 PM
more
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Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 04:56 PM
...
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Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 04:57 PM
last ones
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Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 04:58 PM
Zach said he would loan me a compression tester, i guess that is my next step.
thanks for looking
joseph
Posted by: yeahmag Mar 3 2009, 06:51 PM
Been a while since I had FI on the car. Could you tell if it was coming from one of the breather tubes for the heads? Any smoke out of the tail pipe while running? I can't imagine anything other than excessive blow by causing that - which the compression test should show you.
Posted by: Jake Raby Mar 3 2009, 06:54 PM
Tons of blow by... Either the rings are shot or the exhaust valve guides are shot, or both..
Posted by: type47 Mar 3 2009, 07:09 PM
Good thing a response I made didn't get posted..... I questioned the compression test.... My lack of skilz...
I would like to know about the "blow by" you (especially Jake) mention. What is it exactly and would it cause that much oil mess? (Just asking for my education).
Posted by: yeahmag Mar 3 2009, 07:21 PM
When combustion gases go flying past the rings they can only escape through the PCV and the head vents. The gases pick up oil and oil vapor(s) along the way giving you a nasty mess (as witnessed above).
Posted by: Jake Raby Mar 3 2009, 07:28 PM
Bad rings can create blowby as they allow gases to fill the crankcase, forcing an oily mess from every orfice...
The same thing happens with bad exhaust valve guides as the exhaust gases pass between the stem of the valve and the valve guide, pressurizing the rocker box and then the crankcase..
Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 3 2009, 07:54 PM
So, when are we going to rebuild your engine 
Posted by: wertygrog Mar 3 2009, 08:06 PM
My engine does the same thing when a hose falls off the head breathers or any other part of the pcv system. Check all your hoses and connections...sometimes they crack or loosen up down by the cylinder head.
Posted by: Vacca Rabite Mar 3 2009, 08:10 PM
Hey Joe,
I'm not in class this week. Next week I have Monday off, but it gets insane again for me right after that. If it is sucky outside, we can warm up your engine by running it in the garage with a hose hooked up to the exhaust pipe. If your valves have not been done in a while, I'll bring feeler gauges too.
If it comes to it that you need to rebuild, all my resources are at your disposal. If you get good numbers, we can look and see if there is something else funky.
I won't lie. I want to help you rebuild your engine. I've got all this crap now, and I want to use it.
Zach
Posted by: championgt1 Mar 3 2009, 08:15 PM
How did your engine run before this mess? The stacked vacuum elbow being disconnected would have been a MAJOR vaccum leak. Is this your oil leak problem. No.
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 09:22 PM
Could you tell if it was coming from one of the breather tubes for the heads?
the hose it is comming from goes into the threeway split thing front left side of the engine, from there i would guess it is coming from the head.
Any smoke out of the tail pipe while running?
yes, espically from hard throtle when i let go of the pedal.
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 09:24 PM
Bad rings can create blowby as they allow gases to fill the crankcase, forcing an oily mess from every orfice...
The same thing happens with bad exhaust valve guides as the exhaust gases pass between the stem of the valve and the valve guide, pressurizing the rocker box and then the crankcase..
so does the engine still gotta come out if it is the valve guides?Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 09:28 PM
How did your engine run before this mess? The stacked vacuum elbow being disconnected would have been a MAJOR vaccum leak. Is this your oil leak problem. No.
the car ran absolutly great, even with the smoke... it is/ was fast. i used a piece of silicon inside the double stack, but im not so sure it was perfectly tight, and from what im learning there is quite a bit of pressure in my case.
Posted by: r_towle Mar 3 2009, 09:33 PM
Bad rings can create blowby as they allow gases to fill the crankcase, forcing an oily mess from every orfice...
The same thing happens with bad exhaust valve guides as the exhaust gases pass between the stem of the valve and the valve guide, pressurizing the rocker box and then the crankcase..
so does the engine still gotta come out if it is the valve guides?Yup and it takes less than a hour to get it out.
Rich
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 3 2009, 09:33 PM
anyone know where this came from??
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Posted by: r_towle Mar 3 2009, 09:34 PM
How did your engine run before this mess? The stacked vacuum elbow being disconnected would have been a MAJOR vaccum leak. Is this your oil leak problem. No.
the car ran absolutly great, even with the smoke... it is/ was fast. i used a piece of silicon inside the double stack, but im not so sure it was perfectly tight, and from what im learning there is quite a bit of pressure in my case.
From what I have experienced with lots of motors, not just type 4, is if you get smoke on the highway when you let off the gas pedal, its rings.
Rich
Posted by: r_towle Mar 3 2009, 09:34 PM
oh, the oil is from your Head vent hoses and the lines going into the intake manifold
Rich
Posted by: Vacca Rabite Mar 4 2009, 08:46 AM
oh, the oil is from your Head vent hoses and the lines going into the intake manifold
Rich
That would be my guess too.
Zach
Posted by: Vacca Rabite Mar 4 2009, 08:53 AM
by the way, if it is bad rings...
the only constraint for finishing a top end rebuild in time for Hershey in April is machine shop wait time. I know two machineists in town that can deglaze and score the cylinders. Get rings from Jake. Your bottleneck will be heads if (okay, when) they need work (which they will if its valve guides).
Options options. this need not take all summer if it needs a new top end.
But, i'd start calling head shops now and asking about wait times.
Zach
Posted by: 904svo Mar 4 2009, 01:25 PM
Way off the deep end, but did you check the oil pressure switch? if its loose
it will cause a problem of splashing oil around. It's located by the distributor.
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 4 2009, 01:50 PM
Way off the deep end, but did you check the oil pressure switch? if its loose
it will cause a problem of splashing oil around. It's located by the distributor.
i dont have an oil pressure guage, do i still have the switch? if so could someone point it out to me in one of my pics. i will check it.
thanks
Posted by: yeahmag Mar 4 2009, 02:23 PM
The switch would not pump oil in to the air cleaner... You will find you have low compression when you do the check.
Posted by: type47 Mar 4 2009, 02:35 PM
Way off the deep end, but did you check the oil pressure switch? if its loose
it will cause a problem of splashing oil around. It's located by the distributor.
i do i still have the switch?
yes, it is factory installed. Look for the wire coming out of the cooling tin just beside and behind (toward the rear of the car) the distributor. The wire is green with red stripe if I recall.
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 17 2009, 01:04 PM
I just finished the compression test..... drumroll......
#1 107
#2 97
#3 120
#4 120
Keep in mind, i just did my first valve adjustment, by myself. Zach came over and showed me the ropes...
....Thanks Zach......
....so I either did somthing wrong or the left side of this engine is BEAT. Do you think i should attempt to adjust the valves on that side again or pull it? I am pretty sure i did a good job on the valves, note to myself (always have valve cover gaskets when doing adjustments, PO had some kinda silicon there, and i dont have anything to put back on em yet. Small mess on the garage floor, but that should not effect the compression right.
lastly give me an opnion about lucas oil additive i just bought 2qrt. Dont do it or what. I figure get new gaskets add lucas, drive it for 100+ miles and do another test. 
can someone slap me I am trying not to pull this engine 
Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 17 2009, 01:51 PM
Well, since the two on the samer side, 1 and 2, are low I would consider that ther head may have a problem in seating, twisting, etc. Did you check the head nuts on that side for tq? Is there any reason you should have bad rings? Did you put a tsp of oil in the bad barrels and then recheck to see if that improved the numbers? = bad rings.
Just a few thoughts
Posted by: jsayre914 Mar 17 2009, 02:41 PM
Well, since the two on the samer side, 1 and 2, are low I would consider that ther head may have a problem in seating, twisting, etc. Did you check the head nuts on that side for tq? Is there any reason you should have bad rings? Did you put a tsp of oil in the bad barrels and then recheck to see if that improved the numbers? = bad rings.
Just a few thoughts
i have not tried that... i will try it later, grocery shopping first.
i was thinking in my mind somthing was wrong there, do rings usually wear equal all around or does it seem very likley that 1 and two could wear much faster than 3 and four??
Posted by: Drums66 Mar 17 2009, 02:45 PM
The AAR valve you are using the 4th photo
is common to a 1.8 how does that work for you???
I know it's off topic!
Posted by: yeahmag Mar 17 2009, 03:43 PM
The combination of oil in the air cleaner and low numbers are pretty much all you need to know. You need to do a top end rebuild at the very least.
I haven't been around these motors as much as Type I's, but I have yet to see a motor that had bad rings that didn't have a bad cam.
Posted by: Dr Evil Mar 17 2009, 03:56 PM
Ah ya, if you are getting oil in your filter you are pressurizing your case via bad rings. Time to pull the 1,2 side and at teh very least put new rings on. Thats is all else is OK.
Posted by: yeahmag Mar 17 2009, 04:00 PM
I would think it unwise to do just the 1-2 side. If you are gonna bother you might as well do both sides, get the heads looked at, check the cam for wear, etc...
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