Alloy calipers for the 914..., Coming soon to a store near you! Options

[Carrera916]

I personally seconded Mark Henry's comment.....I got screwed big time last week and it will be in the open eventually when I'm ready.....

hell, find out who's the california distributor and I'll make sure the aussie company is aware of who they select....

j

[Allan]

QUOTE (tat2dphreak @ Nov 17 2005, 02:27 PM)

those rims are bitchin!! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif) (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/aktion035.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif) Starting to think twice about that 5 lug conversion...

[Rick_Eberle]

It's not (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/stromberg.gif)
I think it's one of the type 1 crowd. I'll see if I can get some more details next week.

[TINCAN914]

Jerry,

If you were screwed by these guys let us know..
I don't want anyone to get bashed unjistly, but then again, hate to see others be taken.

I am interested in the rims, andat a later date the calipers. I'm not interested in getting screwed on the purchase. It seems like alot of others are interested in spending some cash as well..

Thanks

[tat2dphreak]

QUOTE (Headrage @ Nov 17 2005, 07:56 PM)

QUOTE (tat2dphreak @ Nov 17 2005, 02:27 PM) those rims are bitchin!!  :headbanger:  :headbanger:  :headbanger: (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif) Starting to think twice about that 5 lug conversion...

why go 5 lug when you can do Mueller's Brakes and Rims like this?... these are sweet!

[Brando]

QUOTE (Rick_Eberle @ Nov 16 2005, 11:38 PM)

QUOTE will the calipers have any added features such as larger pistons? Dunno. QUOTE will they split open to allow for running on vented rotors as the stock units can be done? Dunno. QUOTE do you know if the rims are VW offset or 914 offset? 36mmET, same as a 15x6 five-lug fuchs, or 20mmET, for VW.

Please find out if they are split calipers...

Also, if they're making with larger pistons. If they're casting their own calipers, why not go with 4 pistons in each caliper?

[MattR]

QUOTE (bmunday @ Nov 18 2005, 04:45 AM)

If you were screwed by these guys let us know.. I don't want anyone to get bashed unjistly, but then again, hate to see others be taken.

Brian, i think you misunderstood. Steve is a snake. He is not involved in this. I dont know why anyone would mention his name... seems like a stupid thing to joke about with it being such a sensitive subject on the board.

[lapuwali]

Several reasons to not go four-piston. One, you can buy alloy four-piston calipers today from Wilwood, et al. They just need adapters. Two, a two-piston caliper would be cheaper to make. Three, if he's providing these to F-Vee racers, there may be rules about how many pistons are allowed.

The main reason to go four (or six or eight) pistons is that you want the same piston area spread over a "longer" arc of the rotor. The advantage here is you're gripping more of the rotor at the outer edge, which improves the leverage of the grip at the axle. With a different rotor, you can also remove the center section of the rotor (that the thinner but longer pads don't grip anymore) and replace it a lighter "hat", perhaps made out of aluminum. A glance at the front brakes on most recent sporting motorcycles is an excellent illustration of this.

However, if you're not going to change to a new style of rotor (which comes with its own costs, and may violate racing rules), then multiple pistons don't buy you much. You'll get some increase in leverage, but you can also increase braking power with slightly bigger pistons, too, for less money. You're already cutting weight significantly by using alloy instead of cast iron for the caliper body. It's also probable that these new calipers could use stock size pads, which simplifies long-term maintenance and reduces costs.

So, it's the usual cost v. improvement tradeoff. Alloy calipers with 40mm (up from 38mm stock) pistons that bolt on and use stock pads would be a very nice addition to the market, giving you better braking force with less weight and no hassles. Do the same for $100 per caliper and you'd have people lining up round the block for them. Do it for the rear with a stock handbrake setup and you're causing a riot. If they're also split and spacers can be easily made for them, and if the rears also have bigger pistons, then I can envision a kit available for under $1000 that gives vented rotors at all four corners with a working handbrake, less weight, an adjustable prop valve that's actually useful, all with four-lug wheels, alongside another bolt-on kit for under $500 that provides better brake balance and less weight (all unsprung), using stock rotors.

[Mark Henry]

QUOTE (MattR @ Nov 18 2005, 02:29 PM)

QUOTE (bmunday @ Nov 18 2005, 04:45 AM) If you were screwed by these guys let us know.. I don't want anyone to get bashed unjistly, but then again, hate to see others be taken. Brian, i think you misunderstood. Steve is a snake. He is not involved in this. I dont know why anyone would mention his name... seems like a stupid thing to joke about with it being such a sensitive subject on the board.

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/agree.gif)

I mistook the reference as someone had the inside skinny that (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/stromberg.gif) was the US rep.
It is a stupid thing to joke about IMHO.

BTW do a search on "onion" and "Type 4 parts" and you'll see why I have a low opinion of this guy.

[TINCAN914]

QUOTE (MattR @ Nov 18 2005, 10:29 AM)

QUOTE (bmunday @ Nov 18 2005, 04:45 AM) If you were screwed by these guys let us know.. I don't want anyone to get bashed unjistly, but then again, hate to see others be taken. Brian, i think you misunderstood. Steve is a snake. He is not involved in this. I dont know why anyone would mention his name... seems like a stupid thing to joke about with it being such a sensitive subject on the board.

Oh don't I feel (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/051103-stupid4.gif)

Thanks for settin my straight Matt.

[Mueller]

QUOTE

with less weight and no hassles. Do the same for $100 per caliper and you'd....

less weight would be nice, I'm sending Eric Shea a 110 pound package and it has nothing but stock 914 calipers in it (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/icon8.gif)

[crash914]

my bad.....

I will go slap myself with a wet noodle.....

I do like the idea of alloy calipers....the bmw ones are very heavy also..

[Mark Henry]

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/slap.gif)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif)

[davep]

These are supposed to be ATE calipers are they not?
The picture shows something similar to our front calipers, that is, no parking brake.
As a front replacement that is a step backward from the 42mm pistons.
If they have a rear caliper with integral parking brake (ala 914) then that would be interesting. But what would the piston size be.

More info needed, and some good pictures would be nice.

[lapuwali]

QUOTE (davep @ Nov 18 2005, 02:23 PM)

These are supposed to be ATE calipers are they not? The picture shows something similar to our front calipers, that is, no parking brake. As a front replacement that is a step backward from the 42mm pistons. If they have a rear caliper with integral parking brake (ala 914) then that would be interesting. But what would the piston size be. More info needed, and some good pictures would be nice.

The ones on the site are Beetle calipers, and they are ATE calipers. I believe this guy is making new calipers not yet shown on the site, and there's no knowing if they're ATE or not. My mistake on the 40mm thing. For some reason, I was thinking the stock /4 fronts were 38mm, when they're 42mm. The stock rears are 36mm, and something bigger would be a plus.

Of course, so many people like the 19mm MC "upgrade" even with stock front calipers that going to a 40mm front with a 17mm MC would still give you a shorter/firmer pedal, but not as much as putting a 19mm MC in with 42mm calipers.

[Rick_Eberle]

From what he told me, they are going to be a direct replacement, in alloy, of the stock calipers.

They are still a few months away, so not on the website yet. I'll try to get more detail next week.

[davep]

Stock front /4 is 42mm, stock front /6 is 48mm.
Stock rear /4 is 33mm, stock rear /6 is 38mm.
Stock M cyl /4 is 17mm, stock M cyl /6 is 19mm.
FWIW the 411 (donor of the 914/4 front calipers) also used a 19mm M cyl, and the 911S (with the same piston sizes as the 914/6) used a 20mm M cyl.

As for alloy, I take it you mean aluminum, although strictly speaking an alloy is any mixture of metals.

Due to the complexity of the 914/4 or 914/6 rear calipers I cannot imagine that they would be cheap. Certainly much more expensive than the fronts. Please keep me posted though. I wonder if they need a Canadian distributor?

[Eric_Shea]

After reading through the thread. I'm excited about the new caliper.

I can only imagine (because of the complexity of the piston parking brake mechanism, rebuild kits etc.) that these will be stock replacements that use the stock pistons and internals. I'm also guessing it's the 33mm pistons not the 38mm 914-6 because those are unobtainable like the calipers. Way too small of a market to build a special batch with all new parts.

Have them machine some new inner adjuster gears while they're at it!

So... an aluminum body? Cool. 914 rears are about 8lbs. each. I'm guessing you could save about 3lbs. per side.

They "could" be made to fit a 911 rotor. If they're still in the design phase that would be my suggestion.

[r_towle]

any updates on this?

[Brett W]

If this company is going to copy the stock caliper, only out of aluminum, you will have problems. Aluminum calipers have lower stiffness than a stock cast caliper. You will need more material in the aluminum caliper than you will with a steel caliper.

Look at how the materials are laid out in some of the really nice Aluminum multipiston calipers. One of the problems with the stock setup is not the calipers but the rotors. Lack of mass to absorb and dissipate the heat is the real root of the problem.