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> How much stiffer with solid or tied in roof?
Mueller
post Dec 12 2004, 11:17 AM
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New car has no cage, I know the 914 tends to flex and that the factory welded steel roofs on the 916 for what I guess was to help stiffen them, or was it for other reasons??

The 'glass top should help a little, but I was wondering about attaching tubes or the like from the factory roll bar to the windshield hoop to stiffen the car up....

Has anyone played with this before??
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Bleyseng
post Dec 12 2004, 11:34 AM
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An X brace would help alot to stiffen things up, but how stiff is the windshield frame anyway?

Geoff
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neo914-6
post Dec 12 2004, 11:45 AM
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Mike,
Don't have historical data on the 916 but I plan to use engman's lower bracing if I don't use a cage. Here's a hack solution! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
Felix


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GWN7
post Dec 12 2004, 11:45 AM
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I saw this on one car. Don't know how functional it would be.

LOL same pic (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

This post has been edited by GWN7: Dec 12 2004, 11:47 AM


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neo914-6
post Dec 12 2004, 11:47 AM
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(IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif)
And this is on an original 914-6 currently at ~600 on eBay!
Felix
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airsix
post Dec 12 2004, 01:07 PM
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Mike,
It's so funny to ready your threads like this becuase you usually post about something that I'm actually scratching my own chin about. I've thought about doing a cross-brace like this myself. I was thinking about maybe doing a box-steel 'X' of light-guage steel and glassing it into the undersid of the roof. Then tie it in to the targa bar and windshield frame w/ removable plates.

Now that I've got a new daily driver I'm just going to do a cage though.

-Ben
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ein 6er
post Dec 12 2004, 01:24 PM
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this is the brumos gt
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ein 6er
post Dec 12 2004, 01:24 PM
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ein 6er
post Dec 12 2004, 01:25 PM
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michel richard
post Dec 12 2004, 01:42 PM
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I thought I read somewhere that the 914, new and un-rusty, was designed to be just as stiff as a 911 coupe. Has anyboldy else heard of this ?

Michel Richard
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campbellcj
post Dec 12 2004, 01:48 PM
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I know even with an 8-point welded cage, the tub still has "some" flex, because I have a skin targa top attached with dzus fasteners and it squeeks and rattles quite bit. That tells me there's a little motion going on. I figure it's the A-pillar (windshield frame) since the cage is tied into the targa bar. The A-pillar on any roofless car or even a sunroof car is inherently gonna flex.
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Bleyseng
post Dec 12 2004, 01:49 PM
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Maybe 911 Targa.......
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sixnotfour
post Dec 12 2004, 02:22 PM
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On the 914-6Gt pages the Gt in the Collier collection shows a picture of a reinforcing plate added at the base of the windshield frame. along with the bolted X-braced Gt top.
The factory must thought it would help ?
new car and the wheels are turnin already (IMG:style_emoticons/default/cool.gif)
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Jeroen
post Dec 12 2004, 02:24 PM
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Like Geoff already mentioned, the windshield frame is pretty weak
The first factory race cars cracked their windshields because of the reinforced roofs
Later they also reinforced the pilars of the windshield frame

So... get Engman's kit and be done with it...
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airsix
post Dec 13 2004, 01:42 PM
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QUOTE(ein 6er @ Dec 12 2004, 11:24 AM)
this is the brumos gt

Cool. That's almost exactly what I was talking about. I expected the cross-brace to be lighter and the tie-ins to be beefier, but that's the general idea I was talking about.

-Ben M.
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Eric_Shea
post Dec 13 2004, 07:36 PM
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I've "heard" they're much stiffer.

Troy put the A-Pillar mod on Gint's car. Came out awesome. These things crack a-pillars, especially when autocrossed or raced.

When I restored my 911 the a-pillars were cracked. The factory did the reinforcement to prevent cracking. A-pillars are weak, weak, weak.

Here's a couple of pictures that Andy came over and took... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/laugh.gif) (actually, the camera was pointed directly at the light so it didn't like to focus properly.)


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Eric_Shea
post Dec 13 2004, 07:37 PM
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Flat VW
post Dec 13 2004, 08:52 PM
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Never push the car from the a pillars, I have my two boys, my wife and most of my friends "trained" by now! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/chairfall.gif)
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Slowpoke
post Dec 13 2004, 09:19 PM
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I usually drill some holes in A-pillars and shoot in some expanding hard foam insulation. Not the home depot crap. But, the commerical stuff. Underneath the weather strip area and behind the A-post trim gets it in all the voids. It seems to add some strenght to the A-pillars and cowl area. Some cheaters back in the old days use to shoot foam into the sills, A-post and frame rails on some cars to strenghten the car a little. Not me, but other cheaters. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif) Undercoating usually did a good job at hiding it under the car. At least that's what I heard. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/unsure.gif)
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Brett W
post Dec 13 2004, 09:58 PM
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If you add steel into the top you are hanging some major wieght up high in the chassis. It will have an affect on how the car feels. I think you would be better off laminating the stock top with some sort or honeycomb material and fiberglass. Anything you could do to make it stiffer with out using the steel the better.

The two part expanding foam works well. I know Ford is using it in some of its new vehicles. Make sure the chassis has no rust in the frame rails. Then fill with a commercial two part expanding foam. This will do wonders for the frequency of the chassis.

Engmans kit is a great addition for the average joe. Most cages that are put in cars only add weight and safety. Hopefully when I get some time after the first of the year I am going to be doing some torsional testing on my chassis. I just have to finish the chassis jig first.
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