D-Jet FI trigger points Options

[TheIronSausage]

Hi all,

I'm working on a '76 914. It's encumbered by being controlled by the malady that is D-Jetronic. Like every other important component in the system, the fuel injection trigger points seem to impossible to source. I've searched around, and found an article on this site suggesting Volvo sources. That article was from 2011, and I have a D-Jet Volvo, and was unable to find points or any other parts for it two years ago. That Volvo now wears a set of SU carbs as a result. The customer seems insistent on keeping his car as original as possible. In concept I have no problems with that request, but in practice, parts are hard to find, and expensive when found. Do any of you fine folk have a source for these? I'd greatly appreciate any help.

Thanks,
Matt

[JeffBowlsby]

Contact 914sixer or BDstone through this board.

[nordfisch]

Hi Matt,
the points sets are in fact different from the Volvo ones and not interchangeable.

I know some D-Jetters in Europe still own NOS parts, but don't own a Volkswagen or Porsche. I could tell you contacts by request. Shipment from Germany in a letter isn't too expensive.

Another option is to readjust the points. this will reset them to the original values - in my eyes they are then as new in technical aspect.

Have a look at this thread: http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?sho...=271523&hl=

Regards (IMG:style_emoticons/default/santa_smiley.gif)

Norbert

[914Sixer]

I have several used sets. $24 shipped.

[brant]

there were also brand new "knock off" units on ebay for cheap
I'd try those long before I'd put carbs on

[saigon71]

Good used trigger points available from 914Sixer who posted above. Or go the new knockoff route.

I wouldn't consider switching to carbs. Once sorted out, the old D-Jet system is pretty awesome!

Here is the D-Jet bible for reference:

http://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/DJetParts.htm

[TheIronSausage]

Thanks all for your responses. I would try adjusting the ones I have, but they're essentially rusted over from sitting in a super dank warehouse for so long. (914 sixer, PM sent).

So, I'm dying to know. Why do you guys love D-Jet so much? Let me start by saying that I've worked as a vintage sportscar mechanic for about a decade, and I'm familiar with and able to diagnose everything from D-Jet to Motronic, even Lucas Opus. I'm not normally the kind of guy to just slap a set of carbs on a failing injection system. However, every D-Jet car I've starting working on has needed several parts that have to be scrounged in used condition, and in the case of Volvos, at a high cost... For a part that's used, 40 years old, and with no warranty. I've driven Benzes, 914s, and Volvo 1800s and 140s with D-Jet. Some of them ran as they should, and they were fine to live with and were reliable. But they didn't perform any better than my Volvo that I've converted to SUs, and barely maintain. I've spent hours and hours tuning the D-Jet system in a Volvo 1800 to run well despite not having a functioning IAC ($250 used part). It turned out very well in the end. The car wanted a little extra gas for the first five minutes, and then it'd settle down to 800 RPM every time. It never stalled, and pulled fairly hard at WOT.. I can't say it was worth all the time I ate in the process to get the same driveability I've gotten from an hour rebuilding a set of SUs, and an hour of tuning to the car. That customer sold his car when the MAP sensor (affectionately dubbed the grenade by Volvo guys) died on him, and the cheapest one we could find was over $400 for either a used, or questionably "rebuilt" one. When something goes wrong with D-Jet, it can be hours of troubleshooting resistances through the harness, checking components, and finding vacuum leaks. This is the same with L-Jet for instance, but that system is way less susceptible to it's environment, and better built.

I get originality. In terms of everyday use, I as a mechanic can't tell why someone would want to live with questionable reliability, and a dwindling supply of parts to manage their engine's fuel delivery. I'm no parts hanger, I rebuild everything I can, and reverse engineer a lot of stuff. But few things make me grumble like seeing a D-Jet car come in on a rollback. Working on SPICA Alfas is up there.. At any rate, I don't want to piss in any of your Cheerios. I'm genuinely interested to understand the loyalty behind such an antiquated, and easily replaceable system.

Matt

[Mikey914]

I have a set of NOS in the box I can sell you for $120 from my personal stash. Yes not cheap, but a new unused 30+yr old part.

Just PM me.
Mark

[saigon71]

Thanks all for your responses. I would try adjusting the ones I have, but they're essentially rusted over from sitting in a super dank warehouse for so long. (914 sixer, PM sent).

So, I'm dying to know. Why do you guys love D-Jet so much? Let me start by saying that I've worked as a vintage sportscar mechanic for about a decade, and I'm familiar with and able to diagnose everything from D-Jet to Motronic, even Lucas Opus. I'm not normally the kind of guy to just slap a set of carbs on a failing injection system. However, every D-Jet car I've starting working on has needed several parts that have to be scrounged in used condition, and in the case of Volvos, at a high cost... For a part that's used, 40 years old, and with no warranty. I've driven Benzes, 914s, and Volvo 1800s and 140s with D-Jet. Some of them ran as they should, and they were fine to live with and were reliable. But they didn't perform any better than my Volvo that I've converted to SUs, and barely maintain. I've spent hours and hours tuning the D-Jet system in a Volvo 1800 to run well despite not having a functioning IAC ($250 used part). It turned out very well in the end. The car wanted a little extra gas for the first five minutes, and then it'd settle down to 800 RPM every time. It never stalled, and pulled fairly hard at WOT.. I can't say it was worth all the time I ate in the process to get the same driveability I've gotten from an hour rebuilding a set of SUs, and an hour of tuning to the car. That customer sold his car when the MAP sensor (affectionately dubbed the grenade by Volvo guys) died on him, and the cheapest one we could find was over $400 for either a used, or questionably "rebuilt" one. When something goes wrong with D-Jet, it can be hours of troubleshooting resistances through the harness, checking components, and finding vacuum leaks. This is the same with L-Jet for instance, but that system is way less susceptible to it's environment, and better built.

I get originality. In terms of everyday use, I as a mechanic can't tell why someone would want to live with questionable reliability, and a dwindling supply of parts to manage their engine's fuel delivery. I'm no parts hanger, I rebuild everything I can, and reverse engineer a lot of stuff. But few things make me grumble like seeing a D-Jet car come in on a rollback. Working on SPICA Alfas is up there.. At any rate, I don't want to piss in any of your Cheerios. I'm genuinely interested to understand the loyalty behind such an antiquated, and easily replaceable system.

Matt

Hi Matt:

Sorry to hear about your D-jet experience with Volvo's. My experience has been completely different with D-Jet in a 2.0 914. This car serves as my daily driver 9 months out of the year. It's not a perfect system...but once sorted out, I've found it to provide excellent power, reliability, economy, and overall drivability. One tap of the ignition and it's running, each and every time.

You bring up some fair points about parts availability...but that is changing too. Jeff Bowlsby makes new D-jet FI wiring harnesses and Tangerine Racing has produced a rebuild kit that includes a new diaphragm for the MPS's. Dave Sprinkle makes new TPS boards. This being said, I'm still putting together a spare of each FI component to take with me on road trips just in case.

I'm not anti-carb or stuck on originality. Other FI alternatives are out there for our Type 4 engines...but they are not cheap either. Quite simply, D-Jet has served me well.

Hopefully this sheds some light on your question (at least in my case). Maybe it's just our differing experiences that cause our differing opinions on the D-jet.

Cheers! (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

[Mikey914]

Yes the stock FIA system when sorted out provides excellent drivability and fuel economy. Hey, it's a Volkswagen, right?

[TheIronSausage]

It could very well be a mixture of my prejudices as a mechanic working on broken junk, and my prejudices as a mechanic who comes into cheap or free broken junk that I end up daily driving. Since I've never owned anything nice (over forty antiques, eight currently) that adds up to a lot of great stories about getting hilariously stranded, and grumbles about common failures. In my experience of owning one, and repairing dozens of others, I guess I see it as a system more prone to failure than most.. I'm a bigger fan of KJet/CIS, as in my other two Volvos. I've completely rebuilt or replaced almost everything mechanical on my $600 '81 245 with about 400,000 on it, but not once in three years of driving the wheels off of it have I had to touch the injection system. Same with my rolling parts wagon, a '74 145.. I bought it to part out to the other two cars, but it starts every time, and keeps truckin. The parts wagon has easily seen twenty years of absolute neglect and botched repairs. Annoying, I needed the parts.

[JeffBowlsby]

I have been driving a D-jet 914 for nearly 20 years, a good portion of that time as a daily driver, and never any issues. I have found it to be a basic FI system easy to understand and maintain, very reliable and all parts are available. For me, no other alternative would be a better choice for a stock 914, which is the way I like them.

[TheIronSausage]

Okay. Those sound like rational answers instead of blind loyalty. I'll have to give D-Jet a fighting chance, and try not to let my past experience with it jade me so much. Bowlsby, I agree that it's easy to understand. As for parts availability, I'd still have a strong case against that. There aren't any new parts produced. By the way all, I've been getting stuff from Brad Mayur at 914ltd.com. Do you guys have any other sources?

Matt

[BeatNavy]

Okay. Those sound like rational answers instead of blind loyalty. I'll have to give D-Jet a fighting chance, and try not to let my past experience with it jade me so much. Bowlsby, I agree that it's easy to understand. As for parts availability, I'd still have a strong case against that. There aren't any new parts produced. By the way all, I've been getting stuff from Brad Mayur at 914ltd.com. Do you guys have any other sources?

Matt

There are a variety of sources here, some new, some NOS, much used. Bruce is best known for brand new wiring harnesses. I have one of his FI harnesses and recommend it highly. Some items, like the MPS, can be repaired with a kit from Tangerine Racing. 914Rubber has a couple of items, too (e.g., gaskets, TPS board, etc.). If you're looking for something specific, put a WTB on the classifieds or just ask the Forum where it can be sourced. Someone will have what you're looking for or at least point you in the right direction.

I have a love/hate relationship with my D-Jet. It took me a while to get my 1.7 running well. Once I did I promptly upgraded to a 2056. Then THAT took a while to get the bugs out. I'm hoping once I'm "there" it will be good for a while.

[saigon71]

Okay. Those sound like rational answers instead of blind loyalty. I'll have to give D-Jet a fighting chance, and try not to let my past experience with it jade me so much. Bowlsby, I agree that it's easy to understand. As for parts availability, I'd still have a strong case against that. There aren't any new parts produced. By the way all, I've been getting stuff from Brad Mayur at 914ltd.com. Do you guys have any other sources?

Matt

MPS rebuild kits - Chris Foley at Tangerine Racing:

http://tangerineracing.com/otherproducts.htm

New TPS board - Dave Sprinkle on 914world.com

New wiring harness - Jeff Bowlsby on 914world.com

[914Sixer]

Points on the way in the morning.