Would building a 2.7/6 engine on spec be worth it?, Just thinking about next winters projects Options

[Mark Henry]

I have a good 2.7 core, good case, std crank, good heads that are half done on rebuild and some new parts already.
Would it be worth building as an on spec (for sale) rebuilt engine?
It would be done right, likely mild performance with JE pistons, replated cylinders, new valves and cams. I can even twin plug it.
What about turnkey? I have a fan, cooler, shroud, etc. and I might update my 914 intake so I could even do webers.

What would it be worth?
Should I do stock or mild performance?
Long block or turn key?

I've tried selling as a core a couple years ago, but no one was interested except for a couple of lowballers.
Now /6 prices are going up and up, but the 2.7 still seems to be considered the bastard child.

Not fishing for a sale, too busy to do this right now, just wondering if it's worth doing on spec.

[Mark Henry]

Or should I do it and just keep it as a spare to my 3.0 (IMG:style_emoticons/default/idea.gif)

[JmuRiz]

Tough question, I know a stock 2.7 that's running well with CIS and a cam upgrade is supposed to be cool. Would probably be cheapest too.

Going P/Cs, hotter cams and carbs cost a lot, but may be more desirable to a larger base of customers.

I was going to just do a cam swap on mine until we dug deeper and found issues.

The thought of a spare for the 3.0 is probably the best bet (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

[GeorgeRud]

Henry Schmidt at Supertec seems to like them, but there is work to make them right and I wonder if the market will give you a return on your time and investment. If you want to do it as a nice project, go for it.

[mepstein]

You really need to price out time and materials and see if you can make a profit. Then decide.

[Bgyglfr]

Speaking for the long block alone, Thanks biggest concern for any buyer would be the case modifications necessary to make it a long lasting motor (line bore, oil bypass, case savers, shuffle pin, etc). Check Ollies for pricing. General rule of thumb is $2k in case work. If those are done properly and documented, the motor would be valuable. Without those mods, many will question the quality of the build and you won't be able to get much more than core money. $2-$3k. A properly built, well documented 2.7 hot rod long block can be approaching $10k built. I've seen RS spec motors (including mfi) go upwards of $20k.

[IronHillRestorations]

One of my favorite engine builders, Pat Williams, does a very nice build on a 2.7 with all the good updates, and Motec injection using MFI throttle bodies coil on plug, and stock air filter assembly for a great early look.

[Steve]

I would also post the question on the pelican parts 911 technical forum.
If I had the money and extra 914, I would want a 2.7 with solex cams, case savers, time certs, race ware studs, webers, etc. it would be a fun awesome sounding motor.

[JmuRiz]

One of my favorite engine builders, Pat Williams, does a very nice build on a 2.7 with all the good updates, and Motec injection using MFI throttle bodies coil on plug, and stock air filter assembly for a great early look.

Wow, that would be super cool to have MFI bodies hiding EFI...if only I had the money (but it's being 'wasted' on the engine rebuild to begin with).

[Mark Henry]

Speaking for the long block alone, Thanks biggest concern for any buyer would be the case modifications necessary to make it a long lasting motor (line bore, oil bypass, case savers, shuffle pin, etc). Check Ollies for pricing. General rule of thumb is $2k in case work. If those are done properly and documented, the motor would be valuable. Without those mods, many will question the quality of the build and you won't be able to get much more than core money. $2-$3k. A properly built, well documented 2.7 hot rod long block can be approaching $10k built. I've seen RS spec motors (including mfi) go upwards of $20k.

Price wise I think you're at least 5 years behind the times. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/shades.gif)

[Mark Henry]

One of my favorite engine builders, Pat Williams, does a very nice build on a 2.7 with all the good updates, and Motec injection using MFI throttle bodies coil on plug, and stock air filter assembly for a great early look.

I could do that.

[Mark Henry]

Speaking for the long block alone, Thanks biggest concern for any buyer would be the case modifications necessary to make it a long lasting motor (line bore, oil bypass, case savers, shuffle pin, etc). Check Ollies for pricing. General rule of thumb is $2k in case work. If those are done properly and documented, the motor would be valuable. Without those mods, many will question the quality of the build and you won't be able to get much more than core money.

I can do everything but the line bore and crank grinding in-house, I'm looking at the tooling cost to do the line bore in-house as well,
I already do VW type one cases, and 36hp cases, never done a 356 case but it's the same 36hp tooling.
Right now I'm busy tooling up for 996 engines.
I could document the build right here.

[Mark Henry]

You really need to price out time and materials and see if you can make a profit. Then decide.

I agree Mark, I keep a T4 bus engine in stock but as a rule I've never keep T1 and 4 engines in stock because no two builds are the same.
I have a good idea on costs and I have this core, but anything in the future the core would be the variable. Likely if I did this it would be the one and only spec engine.

[JmuRiz]

I can do everything but the line bore and crank grinding in-house, I'm looking at the tooling cost to do the line bore in-house as well, I already do VW type one cases.
Right now I'm busy tooling up for 996 engines.
I could document the build right here.

That's a huge benefit to be able to do all that in-house.
I'll regrettably post how much my build costs when I get the bill and get back from the hospital recovery (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

I guess I should start a build thread one of these years (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

FWIW to those wondering: My builder said a client wanted a full 356 engine done correct, with no core or anything to put down. All-in it was a $20k job to get all the parts to do a plug-play setup! It really helps to have a core and all the bolt-on bits. Thanks goodness I had a core engine and good weber 40's bought for only $3500 years ago.

[Larmo63]

I've seen /6 engines all over the place, price wise. I saw a 2.4 rebuilt long block for sale (for a long time) on the Bird and other places. He was asking $16.5 originally. Didn't include a fan or intake either.

Keep in mind that 914 guys are cheap bastards, and market it to 911 guys?

[Mark Henry]

Jim you beat me to the edit (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)
I can also do the 36hp cases, I'm positive that the 356 case is the same tooling.

[Mark Henry]

I've seen /6 engines all over the place, price wise. I saw a 2.4 rebuilt long block for sale (for a long time) on the Bird and other places. He was asking $16.5 originally. Didn't include a fan or intake either.

Keep in mind that 914 guys are cheap bastards, and market it to 911 guys?

I do cost effective and good value...I don't do cheap.

[Bgyglfr]

If you Tool up for line boring mag 911 cases, you might find yourself very busy. From my understanding that's in big demand right now. I even have two that need done.

As far as pricing, I don't think $2-$3k for a core 2.7 long block is far off. 5 years ago I bought a running 3.0 for $2k. That was the going rate then. I used to pick up running 2.2 long block for $1k to $1200 all day. Those were the days.

[11tenths]

Mr. Henry, Sir-

I sold my 3.2 Carrera because with stock injection it sounded more like an Airboat than a sportscar. Bought a carb'd 914/6 conv with a built 2.7 that gave me goosebumps and an uncontrollable grin every time I fired it up. It just crackled. Certain engine combos just hit it.
I bet if you built up that motor your way, put it on a dyno and did a video with GOOD audio, the sound alone would sell it.

- Harry

[Bgyglfr]

Mr. Henry, Sir-

I sold my 3.2 Carrera because with stock injection it sounded more like an Airboat than a sportscar. Bought a carb'd 914/6 conv with a built 2.7 that gave me goosebumps and an uncontrollable grin every time I fired it up. It just crackled. Certain engine combos just hit it.
I bet if you built up that motor your way, put it on a dyno and did a video with GOOD audio, the sound alone would sell it.

- Harry

I agree. I never really like the motrinic cars. They just don't have the throttle response of the earlier cars. Even CIS cars seem better to me. That said, I've never driven one that had the chip done.