Turbo tie rod and alignment Options

[emerygt350]

Sooo... I figured a fun morning job would be turbo tie rods. The rubber was shot and the outer tie rod was so shot that together they gave me about a half inch of lateral wobble on the wheels.



All good now. Brought it in for an alignment. That was hilarious. Only place that could get it on their setup was the Ford dealership (they had open appointments and I have a very low and long front airdam). I warned the very excited technician about the dog leg but he did not understand. I scooted off to the lounge to watch. Eventually I saw 5 techs all standing around igiving advice to the poor 20 something. Finally they brought a guy in his sixties over to drive it up on the ramps. He did teach the kid and they all really enjoyed driving it. One of the techs came in to ask if it had a turbo (it does sound a little like a blow off valve when you release the throttle). Anyway, it made their morning. They worked on it quite a while and tested it between mods. Just the tie rods as far as adjustments went. They ended up at .10. I do have big 40mm spacers and big staggered Fuchs (225/50/16) so the cars footprint is very different from a stock 914 (14 inches wider).

The car is tight now and very predictable but I feel like it's less alive under the fingers (perhaps I was just used to the sudden random changes in direction?) and it doesn't 'self straighten' as much as it used to. They told me to drive it and see what I thought and they would be happy to modify it. Anyone know what I am trying to describe and whether I should do anything about it? It feels great in the Twisties, but requires a little more attention on the highway. The new tie rods were very stiff so perhaps they just need to be worked in a little as well.

[Cfletch]

Sooo... I figured a fun morning job would be turbo tie rods. The rubber was shot and the outer tie rod was so shot that together they gave me about a half inch of lateral wobble on the wheels.



All good now. Brought it in for an alignment. That was hilarious. Only place that could get it on their setup was the Ford dealership (they had open appointments and I have a very low and long front airdam). I warned the very excited technician about the dog leg but he did not understand. I scooted off to the lounge to watch. Eventually I saw 5 techs all standing around igiving advice to the poor 20 something. Finally they brought a guy in his sixties over to drive it up on the ramps. He did teach the kid and they all really enjoyed driving it. One of the techs came in to ask if it had a turbo (it does sound a little like a blow off valve when you release the throttle). Anyway, it made their morning. They worked on it quite a while and tested it between mods. Just the tie rods as far as adjustments went. They ended up at 10. I do have big 40mm spacers and big staggered Fuchs (225/50/16) so the cars footprint is very different from a stock 914 (14 inches wider).

The car is tight now and very predictable but I feel like it's less alive under the fingers (perhaps I was just used to the sudden random changes in direction?) and it doesn't 'self straighten' as much as it used to. They told me to drive it and see what I thought and they would be happy to modify it. Anyone know what I am trying to describe and whether I should do anything about it? It feels great in the Twisties, but requires a little more attention on the highway. The new tie rods were very stiff so perhaps they just need to be worked in a little as well.

Sounds like too much negative camber in the front- too much in the sense of its not what you are used to. Camber in corners is good because the wheels quick to move lefft and right, but on a freeway its less good because its twitchy. See if that tracks with your meaning of attention on the highway? Caster in a similar way, helps your wheels get back to center so if there's some issues there that could also explain what you might be trying to explain in regards to self straightening.

All that to say is it might be helpful for the print out of their specs they adjusted the car to so we can see if something is considered excessive or not in general. It could be excessive or just not what you are used to based on the description so we might want to see that readout if you could upload that.

[emerygt350]

[Jack Standz]

We have a similar setup except for 35mm spacers all around.

Have gotten so tired of poor alignments that we do it ourselves.

Sounds like all they did was set toe. They didn't tell you before and after measurements?

That doesn't cut it in my book. Sorry, but suggest you go somewhere else next time.

[emerygt350]

I told them to only adjust the toe. It was perfect (to me) before so I figured they could do the least damage sticking with the tie rods, which of course were off due to me replacing them. Perhaps I should just have a complete alignment done? Makes me nervous...

[Jack Standz]

Rachet strap the steering wheel centered.

Wheels off and a couple levels clamped to the rotors and measure the distance between the levels at approximately 13" in front of spindle center line and behind it. We find that 3mm toe-in works for us.

Lots of places to find articles and videos on how to align your car. Generally, it can be faster than taking someplace.

[emerygt350]

What would 3mm equal in degrees? Just wondering to compare what my guys did. Don't make me do trig...

[TheCabinetmaker]

You need a complete 4 wheel alignment. Just adjusting toe won't get it. You need caster,camber, and rear toe set too. Find an old guy that can align a bug or 911s.

[Jack Standz]

+1

Or do it yourself, if you're comfortable with doing so. With care and competence you can do a good job.

Rear toe can/should be checked, but changing it on a stock 914 is an issue. Camber, yes.

[Jack Standz]

For setting rear toe:

https://tangerineracing.com/shop/ols/produc...ng-arm-brackets

[emerygt350]

The car feels much better now after 200 miles, or at least I am getting used to it. Got caught in a crazy downpour leaving Ithaca, lightning struck a tree right next to me as I drove by. Car did really good hitting massive puddles on the road. With the old tie rods it was a little bit of Russian roulette when you hit a big puddle. Perhaps I was too used to my worn out tie rods. I think I will wait and find a competent VW/Porsche shop for a real alignment if it comes to that. Or try it myself.

[Dave_Darling]

Your document doesn't say if it is toe in or toe out. The behavior makes it sound like toe out. (You should double check that with them!!)

Front toe out will make the car feel nimble and darty. Like the nose really wants to turn--in part, because it actually is just starting to turn all the time. It is good for initial turn-in, but at the cost of wanting to wander if you take your attention away from it.

Toe-in is more stable, but feels less agile. You can take your hands off the wheel without the car trying to turn one way or the other.

We generally recommend a very very small amount of toe-out in front for track-oriented cars, and a small amount of toe-in for street cars.

--DD

[emerygt350]

I will swing by there Monday and find out. I would think they would put -.10 if it were in but I guess anything is possible.