Value of a 200k 2.7 core motor with complete CIS? Options

[RoadGlue]

I have a friend with a 200k mile 2.7 motor with the complete CIS system intact. The motor ran when it was pulled and its been properly stored. I know of all the pitfalls of the 2.7 sixes and I have a machinist friend who specializes in Porsche motors that's willing to help me rebuild and update the motor (tensioners, helicoil studs, etc) for next to nothing. Thinking it might be a good way to break into the six world.

Soooo, any idea of what that motor, in its current shape is worth? He had no idea and is pretty much letting me set the price.

Thanks!

[PeeGreen 914]

$500. With all the work and money you will spend rebuilding it I wouldn't pay much more for a 2.7' with that high of milage.

[SLITS]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif)

Depending upon how long the CIS was stored for will either cost you a lot of time cleaning the system or a shitpile of money in rebuilt parts to make it work correctly (fuel distributor, WUR, injectors).

Then we add for the fuel pump, accumulator and filter ..........

Both my sixes were CIS and I LOVE IT!!!!

I also love the phrases "Running when parked", "Running when pulled", etc .... Bah!!! Unless you hear it before it's parked or pulled, it ain't nuthin'.

[carr914]

$500. With all the work and money you will spend rebuilding it I wouldn't pay much more for a 2.7' with that high of milage.

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) $500

T.C.

[RoadGlue]

Thanks for the info! Let me see what he says. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[r_towle]

I love the "ran when parked" saying also....the follow up question is....when was it parked? 20 years ago?

To me, from what I have heard, you will need to remove the head studs and fix that issue.
So, that means you need to tear the motor down to just the case.

At the end of it...JP seems to love his motor and they can be made to scream....but you are starting with a pile of parts...
Its just all bolted together.

Given my lack of CIS love...I would sell that and go to carbs.

Rich

[RoadGlue]

I have no illusions that this would be anything but a full rebuild, from line boring the case to helicoiling the head studs, going with carrera tensioners, etc etc etc. The "ran when parked" (around 10 years ago) was only put out there to say that this motor didn't grenade at any point and should make a good core to start with. This is one of my best friends who is selling the motor and he's a no bullshit sort of guy.

I've never feared starting with a pile of parts. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)

[McMark]

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/agree.gif) Ran when parked isn't supposed to mean put it in and run it. It's supposed to mean all the parts are there and not destroyed.

[r_towle]

Given that he is your friend....500-1k seems to be a decent number for a core six motor...at least if you can find one.

If I was standing there...it would already be in my truck.
I would not only go for it...bring a six pack of beer and get it for 500.

Rich

[J P Stein]

There is a lot of "stuff" about the 2.7L, some true, some BS.
Without writing an extensive article, I'll pass on some thoughts & experience.

Lets start with the case.

They warp. Spending big bucks for a line bore is not money well spent. It's cheaper to find one that is straight enuff to *line hone*. They collapse across the split and the main bores are no longer round......but undersize perpendicular to the split. A line hone (or drag hone) will get them back to size.....*if the bores are straight.*
The proper insert for studs are "case savers".

The best head studs (IMO) are full thread divilar 993 studs. Henry at Supertech also makes some with the proper expansion rates tho I've never used them. I believe his price is more friendly to boot. This is one place not to scrimp on lesser fasteners. I would never use steel fasteners here.

The machine shop bill (a local outfit) for the drag hone, crank turn, polish, & mag inspect.....case savers.....around 500. Note, do not turn a crank undersize these days. The price of non standard rod & main bearings will stop your heart. A Std/Std crank can be had for around 400.....less than 1/4 the price of them bearings...I shit you not......I have one BTW. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) I also have a lovely first under crank...perfect paperweight.

EBS is a good place to have your heads done. Spring for new valve springs (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
They will check out your valves. Prices are reasonable. I needed all new intake valves ....plus the springs and the bill was around 850 ...tho this was some time back.

New CIS P/Cs are more expensive that RS P/Cs last I looked. The RS cylinders are very difficult to wear out and these sets can often be found in used, in spec condition.

"E" or Solex cams & Webers really wake up the engine and make for an excellent street motor. Gas mileage suffers but you have a lot more fun.

KEEP THE MOTOR COOL. That way the case won't warp. If you can find a non South West motor....one from a cooler climate...there will be less chance of warpage. The late 76 & the 77 motors have the "oil mod" from the factory.
An external oil cooler is money well spent.

Get Bruce Anderson's book & read it twice. "Porsche 911 performance Handbook".

I got a long block for 500. Never pay more than for what you can part out an ughknown motor....unless your mom says it's a good one.

[sww914]

I got a pile of parts bolted together "recently rebuilt" by some dickwad that wasn't qualified to rebuild a Lego toy for $1000.00 with a good pair of Webers and some other bits. I'm happy with the deal because I could sell the Webers for more than I paid for the engine. I'd pay $300.00 in this environment. Sitting for 10 years means that the cylinders probably got water in them at some point, or rat pee, or coffee, or acid rain, or something else that trashed them. Good pistons and cylinders are expensive, Chinese knock-offs are not. Cheap Chinese knock-offs are OK for like jackstands or a drill bit sharpener but not good enough for something that you use every day.

[pcar916]

I had a Bruce Anderson (911 Performance Handbook) spec 2.7L in my 914 when I bought it in '94. Wonderful motor, and one of my favorite exhaust notes.

I was going to build an identical spare 7 seven years ago. With my labor included, the cost would have been $14k. To be fair that was with Competition Engineering doing machine work that I don't have the tools for.

If you don't demand that sound, and for that kind of money, it would be more reliable to put in a 3.0, 3.2, or 3.6L motor.

[J P Stein]

When I built my 2.7L (since rebuilt), I got a 500 dollar short block...missing some valve train bits. Tore it down as a rebuild had been done 9 years before then it sat on a shelf. It had RS P/Cs (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif). Sold the pistons for 500 bucks.....I now had a free motor. Bought 9.7:1 pistons, Solex cams, found a good deal for some Webers , & 993 studs.
When I was done I had about 6500 in it.

After 7 years of flogging I rebuilt it using 10.5:1 Mahle P/Cs ....a good buy @ 2800
NOS. The rebuild then cost about 4500. Part of that was a Std/Std crank as the afore mentioned U/S bearings were outragous @ around 2K for rods & mains.

Part of the BS of which I spoke is the cost of working on a 911 motor. *If you do it yourself*and do some quality shoppin', they are quite affordable. I am fortunate in having a local, competent maching shop near by....I dunno if they know how to properly pronounce Porsche tho (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif) . If you send an engine to Jerry Woods (for instance).....well, bend over. 80 hours @ 100 bucks (fairly standard) per hour is gonna kill ya. If you send it to "sixnotfour", he'll treat you right......so would I for that matter.