New motor ideas, 2.0 liter rebuild (or bigger) Options

[realred914]

2.0 liter four is apart, needs work. would like some performance upgrade while it is being gone thru. thinking of a displacemnt increase. would like ot be able to run the D-Jet still.

what are the piston size options? draw backs of any (are cylinder walls too thin on any of thge big bore sets? is case machinging required? etc..

what are best brands?


also ideas on valve sizes and cam selection would be appreciated.


looking for a modest perfromance boost, but still able to retain the D-jet system
already have the ealry 2.0 liter exhaust system.

let me know what you all have done, and what is available.

thanks

[rick 918-S]

Jake or McMark

[orange914]

as far as i know the early d-jet (if it's 1.7) can't be modified do the trick for a 2.0 or 2056. you'll need to put together or purchase complete a 2.0 d-jet components.

i converted my 73 from 1.7 to 2056 d-jet, and am glad i went thru the conversion. great power, temp.'s and m.p.g. if you're carefull and do it right. lots of teeners here can guide you thru it or go to the 914 info. section to find the proper matching components.
http://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/DjetParts.htm

[Tom_T]

IIRC - the "Raby 2056 kit" upbuild that McMark does gets about 110-115 hp with the D-jet from a 2.0 GA set-up.

http://www.914world.com/bbs2/index.php?showtopic=42456

(IMG:style_emoticons/default/popcorn[1].gif)

[realred914]

as far as i know the early d-jet (if it's 1.7) can't be modified do the trick for a 2.0 or 2056. you'll need to put together or purchase complete a 2.0 d-jet components.

i converted my 73 from 1.7 to 2056 d-jet, and am glad i went thru the conversion. great power, temp.'s and m.p.g. if you're carefull and do it right. lots of teeners here can guide you thru it or go to the 914 info. section to find the proper matching components.
http://members.rennlist.com/pbanders/DjetParts.htm

Already have a stock 2.0 liter D-jet.



I am looking for a parts list of componenets to pump up displacement and perfromance, but still be able to run the stock D-jet (maybe treeked as needed)

tradisrad has a 2.1 big bore kit in his motor, what other piston options are their that would still work with the D-jet? is there a 2.2 piston set available, and will it work with D-jet (2.0 liter style) (assuming correct cam and valve and such?

at what displament does the Stock D-jet (2.0 liter style) run out of gas so to speak? how big can I go?

how does vlave size effect tunability of the stock D-Jet?



I am looking for a parts list of potential parts for my engine build.

thanks!

[DanT]

take the 94 mm cylinders and have them punched out to 96mm. Get some KB 96mm aluminum pistons, use a Raby 9550 cam, and button it all up with a clean build.
This is what I did running stock Djet with some minor tweeking of MPS. Ran beautifully in all situations...
Great street or track motor.

[realred914]

take the 94 mm cylinders and have them punched out to 96mm. Get some KB 96mm aluminum pistons, use a Raby 9550 cam, and button it all up with a clean build.
This is what I did running stock Djet with some minor tweeking of MPS. Ran beautifully in all situations...
Great street or track motor.

i think that is the set up that tradisrad has, the 96 mm pistons,
is there anything large that will work (I want a faster car than tradisrad!!)

I just wonder how far I can go with displacement before the D-jet cant handle it.

[DanT]

2056 is about it. anything larger like 2270 will require carbs or a semi custom FI setup..
This is directly from Jake when I spoke with him on the phone several years ago when I built this motor.
I have a good friend that is building the exact same motor right now with parts sourced from Jake.

[jeeperjohn56]

I did exactly what you want to do, I have a 73 2.0 with d-jet system,and went with the big bore kit 96 PC's and then handed it over to McMark at Orginal Custom's for the build, He knows what cam is best and had the heads done by a professinal machinist. He also did my install, it was nice getting a turn key start, and I didn't get dirty. I have been enjoying it ever since. Give Mark a call he will work with you on what you want he's here in this site for number (vendors area). John (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif)

[orange914]

if you want to spend the time & energy you can get some good deals on the needed parts to do it yourself here. off the top it sounds you'll basically need:

20 longblock and the (2) tin peices for 2.0 914 heads
do you have the 2.0 intake runners/manifold w/ your 2.0 d-jet?
have the m.p.s. tuned (for 2056)
bore the 94mm to 96mm jugs (for a 2056)
have decks & line bore checked
jake 9550 or comp. web cam

extras like these are what i did & really worth it in my book:
balance rotating ass.
lighten flywheel to 11 lbs.
get titanium (i think... duh...) and set the valve train geometery
pertronix or simular electronic ignition

[Bleyseng]

I have heard of a 103x71 motor working with Djet and I was going to build one myself to see "IF" it would work with a Raby cam. Tuning is the big issue but I can do that. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)
I think a 98x71 motor would work fine with a Raby cam and valve sizes of 42x36 or 38. Larger intake valves start blocking the intake charge and slowing down the velocity so avoid the impulse to go to bigger unless you go carbs. 98mm would have to be nikkies unless you can find a set of old birals. People use the 96mm cylinders because its cost effective to use old 94mm ones as they are excellent cylinders and can be bored out cheaply. New pistons are made to fit for your application forged or cast.

This is why the 2056 motor is soo nice for 914. Using the basic engine combo, changing a few parts to improve it and using the Djet to get about 115-120hp. This is with SSI HE's and a Bursch exhaust system, heat and hp.


Back to the 103x71 combo limits which looks like the limit of the intake system. The plenum and runners run out of air at 2.3L it seems. But this is theory and I think it still will work with tuning. Larger stroke isn't an option IMHO. I think this combo would be in the 150 hp range and rev nicely to 5500rpms before running out of air. It would have to use a CFR header for exhaust, forget heat!

[tradisrad]

take the 94 mm cylinders and have them punched out to 96mm. Get some KB 96mm aluminum pistons, use a Raby 9550 cam, and button it all up with a clean build.
This is what I did running stock Djet with some minor tweeking of MPS. Ran beautifully in all situations...
Great street or track motor.

i think that is the set up that tradisrad has, the 96 mm pistons,
is there anything large that will work (I want a faster car than tradisrad!!)

I just wonder how far I car go with displacement before the D-jet cant handle it.

dave you may put more hp in your car, but I bet you don't do the suspension upgrades like I did. you've got the V6 that blows my doors off, but you cant corner like me! so there! and if you out do me too much your gonna have to find someone else to install it!!!!

[JmuRiz]

Jake's combo for a 2056 can get you 120hp, with the D-Jet, I think that's probably the best you could ask for and would really wake the car up, just think, 20% more power...

Since you are in CA, talk with McMark.

[realred914]

take the 94 mm cylinders and have them punched out to 96mm. Get some KB 96mm aluminum pistons, use a Raby 9550 cam, and button it all up with a clean build.
This is what I did running stock Djet with some minor tweeking of MPS. Ran beautifully in all situations...
Great street or track motor.

i think that is the set up that tradisrad has, the 96 mm pistons,
is there anything large that will work (I want a faster car than tradisrad!!)

I just wonder how far I car go with displacement before the D-jet cant handle it.

dave you may put more hp in your car, but I bet you don't do the suspension upgrades like I did. you've got the V6 that blows my doors off, but you cant corner like me! so there! and if you out do me too much your gonna have to find someone else to install it!!!!

I think tradisrad will be installing poly bronz suspension on my car very soon.



is there an option between the 96 mm 2.05 liter and the considerably larger 2.2 liter?


can I go with 97 or 98 mm pistons? what is available for the cylinders?


What are Birel cylinders and where to get them? is machining required to fit them into the case?


what is limit on bore for stock cylinders before the walls get unacceptably thin?


thanks!

[Jake Raby]

Several years ago I proved that the capability of the stock FI system to be easily tuned for more performance was 2056cc and 115HP. Over time I have made small tweeks to the camshaft to allow 120HP from that same engine, but that seems to be the maximum.

If you want to take risks and spend time effort and money to attain more power from a bigger stock FI equipped engine you have that option, BUT be forewarned that success probably isn't in your future.

Fact is that going bigger with the STOCK FI will generally net LESS power than a properly sized and outfitted engine. Bigger isn't better if you want to drive your car instead of working on it.

Cam, CR and cylinder head preparation are all much more critical when using the stock FI arrangement. Most cams simply will not work.

115-120 REAL HP is a HUGE boost to the engine's power. The biggest gain is in the engine's RPM range and how it pulls over a much more usable and broader portion of the tach... Thats what makes the car quicker, faster and more well behaved.

[Bleyseng]

If you want easy build a 2056 with 120hp and to beat your friend install shorter 3rd and 4th gears. That really makes the car quick!

[realred914]

If you want easy build a 2056 with 120hp and to beat your friend install shorter 3rd and 4th gears. That really makes the car quick!

actaully I am near as quick as Tradisrad with my stockish 2.0 (now apart, so sad) cuase he has 205 60 tires and I have 195 50 tires so I rev up faster (he can cruise at high speed better however)

I definatly want to optimize this engine build thins time.

[Jake Raby]

I definatly want to optimize this engine build thins time

Then call me... :-)

(sorry, couldn't resist!)

[realred914]

I definatly want to optimize this engine build thins time

Then call me... :-)

(sorry, couldn't resist!)

Jake: I will be able to give you a ring later. I know tradisrad has your cam in his motor (with 96 mm pistons) I also understand you do some trick head work that really optimizes the motor. I would be interested in that also.

Since your cam does work with the stock FI that is a big plus for me.

thanks

[BK911]

The 1.7 Djet wont work on a 2056?