Build List for a -6 conversion, preparing a budget - what do I need? Options

[tadink]

Hey all -

can someone point me to a good comprehensive build list / budget for a 3.0 conversion on a 1.7L vehicle? It has been pointed out by numerous posters that it is hard to budget for, and that whatever number I choose is going to be too low - but it might be useful for the forum to have a fairly complete "what do you need" list for the inexperienced amongst us - at the LOW end of the range. I realize that for each item if you go nuts and buy new / gold plate the stuff it will be lots more, but in order to get a project on the road at the low end, what am I looking at????.....I'll start (but I envision this in an excel spreadsheet with numbers low/high/ideal next to the items). I'll compile the excel sheet and share with the group when we're done -

2.7 - 3.0 - 3.2L Donor engine - running $4,000 - 5,000 - $10,000
Refurb if needed - $???
CIS brains or Carbs - $???
Clutch - $????
Trans (915?) - $2,000 - 3,000
Engine Tin - $???
Oil Cooling system - cooler and lineset - $1,000
Upgraded CVs - ????
5 Lug rear hubs - ????
5 Lug Fronts w/ brake upgrade - $1,000
Fuel distribution system - $????

What am I missing?

And Andy - how do we share excel files or similar with the group?

Cheers and Happy Holidays everyone - I hope Santa brings us all good Porsche stuff this year!

td

[tadink]

oops, forgot:

engine mounts - $????
Trans mounts - $????
Chassis stiffening - $????

[SLITS]

1.) Engine ... your choice .. $2000 - $10K
2.) Engine Mount ... I prefer the RJ weld in ... $525 with hardware (Maddog is a copy and cheaper).
3.) Engine Tin (up to 3.2) .... $450
4.) Oil Tank .. stock $800 - $1200 ... aftermarket aluminum $750 ... Peterson Round $400 (fit in front trunk).
5.) Filler neck for #4 .... $250 or use a 911 setup
6.) Oil console (for filter) .... $50+ (911 setup)
7.) Oil Lines (stock like 914/6) ... $700 ... If you modify for an oil cooler and don't use stock lines, $700 should cover them all.
8.) Heat Exchangers --- stock $800 - $2400 depending upon condition. If you don't need heat, headers are about $450
9.) 911 muffler (early) $600 new ... used $????
10.) 2.0L /4 muffler hanger .... $40 new ... used $???
11.) 911 oil temp / oil pressure gauge ..... $150 +
12.) For CIS you will need the correct fuel pump / fuel accumulator / filter ... Bosch New $600? ... Chinese $70 off eBay. Accumulator ... $200+, Filter ... $125+
13.) Ignition system ... Bosch CDI system (and hopefully you have the engine harness) .... $500
14.) For a carbed system .... Carbs, manifold, linkage, bellcrank on tranny ... $2K
15.) /6 throttle cable ... $60
16.) Add in for additional hoses & such ... $300
17.) Clutch will be stock /4 2.0L up to 2.7L (6 bolt flywheel). Anything after requires modification of the 9 bolt flywheel ... Kennedy Engineering. (Use the stock 914 transmission).
18.) 6 Bolt early 911 flywheel ... $250 new ... $125+ used

Don't think I left anything out .... and none of this addresses the 5 lug conversion, bigger brakes, wheels, chassis stiffening kit (I don't use it ... waste of money on a street machine).

[Nine_14]

how do we share excel files or similar with the group?

Save a screenshot to your hard disk and post the file as a pic.

[AZ914]

Slits pretty much covered it. Here are a few more items that may come up:

tachometer to match the engine ($50-$200)
oil cooler if running a big six (~400+)
oil line fittings (varires)
wiring harness (varies)

Obviously there are a lot of 'while you are in there' things, like new stainless fuel lines, engine bay seals, block off plates, yada yada.

[brant]

one more item:

- modified shift bar


and if you are going to include the 5 lug into this list then add the price of wheels, aluminum wheel nuts, shocks, ball joints, tie rods, fresh pads, caliper rebuilds, lines, etc....

[brant]

Trans (915?) - $2,000 - 3,000

I'm not sure you can do a 915 trans for that price at all
Most folks don't do a 915

isn't the 916 conversion kit that much alone, without the machining, without the rebuild, without the trans, and without the regear, without hydraulic clutch, without cable shifters, etc.....

I would think even a street 915 conversion would get to 4k - 5k real quick
most 914/6 conversion cars stick with a 901, probably for this reason

[JmuRiz]

Good list, I have a spreadsheet tracking my parts/costs...but since I haven't finished yet I'll wait to post till I find out what I've forgotten about. I always find stuff I need when putting it back together. If you want a copy of my list, PM me and I can e-mail it to you.

In fact, some things I wasn't sure about have been covered above...like the fuel pump/accum/filter for a CIS engine.
Any suggestions for a pump that'll work with CIS and future EFI (so I don't have to buy one later)?

I don't know if I'd worry about the transmission...I'm just keeping my rebuilt ~1k miles ago 901. Wish I had it rebuilt with a TB diff, maybe next time I will.

[TravisNeff]

The only issue with the fuel pump on a CIS car, is that CIS runs at something crazy like 80 PSI, most other FI systems will required less than half that pressure.

[SLITS]

The only issue with the fuel pump on a CIS car, is that CIS runs at something crazy like 80 PSI, most other FI systems will required less than half that pressure.

75 psig out of the pump to the Fuel Distributor where it is regulated down to 55 psig approximately. The warm up regulator will further modify the pressure from about 45 - 55 psig based on throttle opening and temperature of the engine.

Ebay CIS Fuel Pumps

Sorry, I was off on the current pricing ... $129 - $495

[andys]

75 psig out of the pump to the Fuel Distributor where it is regulated down to 55 psig approximately. The warm up regulator will further modify the pressure from about 45 - 55 psig based on throttle opening and temperature of the engine.

Ebay CIS Fuel Pumps

Sorry, I was off on the current pricing ... $129 - $495

Would you happen to know the output (l/hr) for that pump?

Thanks,

Andys

[Rand]

how do we share excel files or similar with the group?

Use Google to create an online spreadsheet. It will import your Excel sheet. Then make it public and share the link to it. Google Drive has come a long way. I don't even use MS Office anymore.

There's a good conversion thread in the classic forum that's worth reading.

[SLITS]

75 psig out of the pump to the Fuel Distributor where it is regulated down to 55 psig approximately. The warm up regulator will further modify the pressure from about 45 - 55 psig based on throttle opening and temperature of the engine.

Ebay CIS Fuel Pumps

Sorry, I was off on the current pricing ... $129 - $495

Would you happen to know the output (l/hr) for that pump?

Thanks,

Andys

No, I have tried to find Bosch Fuel Pump Specifications and have never found a complete list.

If the pump is for K, KE Jetronic, it will work just fine. They will be 5 - 6 Bar. 4 bar and below won't work as they are for EFI systems

[tadink]

THANKS GUYS -

I'll consolidate onto one spreadsheet and share it via Google Drive (Great Idea Rand!).

Once it is on G-drive, anyone can update / revise and it can be a resource for the group.....

yay!

td

[tadink]

OK< I'm ready to publish. If you can see this link - you have access to the spreadsheet. If you make any changes to the thing, please record your changes made, add comments if you wish, and use / share / enjoy.

https://docs.google.com/a/sunreports.com/sp...gtLU5iMmc#gid=0

Sorry the link is sooooo long - I cannot find a way to make it shorter so we'll have to suffer.....if you have trouble accessing pls let me know and I'll try to help.

td

[SLITS]

As you requested ............

[patssle]

If you did an MSD instead of Bosch ignition - you could split that cost. Don't forget the pressure plate.

[Cracker]

You need a rather generous "miscellaneous" line. If I missed it I apologize. Your time obviously is not a line item cost but ask those that have spent a few YEARS doing the conversion - it has to be accounted for. Best option for most enthusiasts is to find a fair priced example and save all that time that you can never, ever get back!

[Series9]

Get a good 3.2. Pay to have a shop check it out and pay a reasonable price for a GOOD 3.2. ($7-8k)


After that, plan another $9k to finish it correctly by a professional or $9k for you to make the mistakes yourself, repay to correct your mistakes, and then, eventually arrive at the finish line.


Smaller engines are pointless because they have substantially fewer hp and cost only a couple of grand less (to accomplish correctly). If you do go small, you can save on an external oil system and custom clutch. A 2.4E is the biggest I go without the external oil system. The 2.4E is a really good engine for a 914, but the chances of finding a used one that doesn't need to be at least topped ($5k) is pretty remote.

Carbs are truly terrible. Get the 3.2 and enjoy digital FI as the factory intended. A stock 3.2 is an absolute joy to drive in any 914. Regardless, get an engine with FI. Any FI is better than carbs.

The 2.4E or S has MFI. MFI pumps are very expensive to repair, so make sure you get a running engine in very good condition.

The 2.7 and 3.0 have CIS. It's a good, reliable system that runs well but has power limitations due to the mild cams that are required to keep the system in tune.

The 3.2 has Motronic. This is basically the progenitor of all modern FI systems. To this day, all Porsches are delivered with FI in the lineage of the original Motronic. Turn the key and go.

.....End of stream-of-consciousness conversion info.........

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[brant]

there is a tank and tin in the classifieds right now
very nice pieces too...

1200 for the tank
800 for the tin