Approx. cost to convert from tail to side shift? Options

[Cuda911]

Hey all,
.
I'm sure that topic this must be covered somewhere on 914world, but I just couldn't find it.

What's the approx. cost to convert from tail to side shift? (1970 1.7).

I work a zillion hours, so don't have time to do it myself (or space). I would have to pay a shop to do it.

Thanks in advance!

[SLITS]

Complete shift assembly (shifter, front rod, rear rod) = $150

Conversion firewall bushing = $30?

Engine support crossbar, engine bar outboard mounts, new motor mounts (rubber) = $100

Side shifter trans = $200 - $600

So, $480 - $880 in parts

Labor = 4 hours at the most.

My opinion only!

[Dave_Darling]

More for labor from a shop, I would think. I know someone like the Cap'n can do it in less time, but I'm betting the "book rate" for replacing the trans and shift linkage is more than four hours.

Most will say that it's a good idea to replace the clutch while you're in there. Add another ~$500 for the clutch parts, and another hour of labor.

Add ~$50 for all the shift bushings, which should be replaced no matter what.

Not to mention that the "big" parts will likely cost more if you get them through a shop.

--DD

[mepstein]

Make sure all the shift bushings on your tail shifter are in great shape and you might not have to convert. Side shifters are better but not always way better

[flash914]

Middle of doing mine but also doing engine work so the whole package came out. Contact Bruce Stone he should be able to get you most or all of the parts. The job itself is not hard. Thinking about it you need to change the front motor mount so the whole package needs to come out. Gordon

[DBCooper]

More for labor from a shop, I would think. I know someone like the Cap'n can do it in less time, but I'm betting the "book rate" for replacing the trans and shift linkage is more than four hours.

Most will say that it's a good idea to replace the clutch while you're in there. Add another ~$500 for the clutch parts, and another hour of labor.

Add ~$50 for all the shift bushings, which should be replaced no matter what.

Not to mention that the "big" parts will likely cost more if you get them through a shop.

--DD

Hey Dave, your sig describes you as our local Pelican Parts shill so tell me, does that work both ways? I mean can you shill Pelican for us, too? Do they ever do new product development, or is it all by others? If they do then tell them to put together a simple cable shifter package for the tailshift transmissions, make them shift less like older Porsches and more like new Boxsters. Look at that list of parts up there, the hassle, the chance that used side-shift tranny will have problems too, the total cost and I'm pretty sure they could make a cable setup for half that or less that would still shift better than the typical upgraded side-shifter. Any point in asking Wayne the question? Given how often the related subjects come up I'm pretty sure it would become one of those "must have" upgrades.

[carr914]

Pelican is like Summit or Jegs but for Porsche - they are just re-selling parts. Dave doesn't work there, I believe he is an IT Guy

[Dr Evil]

You can save a lot of money if you shop around. I feel the parts prices that SLITS posted are for "Buy it now". However, I have sold those parts for much less when I come across them. Anyone parting a car will have them and they usually just sit on a shelf. Food for thought.

The change is pretty easy. Take a novice a weekend or less. If you lived closer I could do this for you in 4 hours or less.

[rhodyguy]

A complete, shifter to rear coupler including an engine bar AND the correct warm air guide, package should run $180ish+shp. Get the "super" bushing kit with the correct firewall conversion bushing along with new 911 sport trans mounts, solid outboard front and rubber inboard mounts from the bird. No need to farm out the labor unless you want to waste money that could be spent elsewhere.

Damn IPad. Package should include the engine bar brackets and the correct bolts.

[Dave_Darling]

Do they ever do new product development, or is it all by others?

It is very rare for them to do so. They have on a couple of earlier occasions, and they either lost money or just barely broke even. Which is not what you want to do when running a business, generally.

Much of Pelican's business is reselling parts that they can get wholesale. We also offer less-tangible benefits, like the BBS, the Tech Articles, and super people like Glenn and Gordon in our parts department. And even me, wandering around on their BBS and elsewhere...

I don't work at Pelican. I sort of work for them, but certainly not full-time. My "day job" is programming, and it pays a lot better than selling car parts. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/wink.gif)



And as has already been said, you can do the swap for a whole lot cheaper if you do it on your own and hunt down your own parts, versus driving the car to a mechanic and having him do the work and find the parts for you.

--DD

[bdstone914]

Check with John Chambers Motorsports in Escondido.
I just sold him a set of parts to do a side shift conversion.
I sell the conversion parts package less the new bushings for $ 250.

Bruce

[stugray]

You actually can do the swap without removing the engine, but it is hardly worth the extra effort.

I have taken out my trans rebuilt, and put back in without taking the engine out.
You could even pull the core out of the trans housing and swap all the parts if you are daring.

And I have removed the engine mount bar without removing the engine.
Just see what happens if you get the whole engine/trans in THEN try getting the side shift bar into the tunnel and you will learn how to do that yourself....

[DBCooper]

And as has already been said, you can do the swap for a whole lot cheaper if you do it on your own and hunt down your own parts, versus driving the car to a mechanic and having him do the work and find the parts for you.

Yeah, I'm aware Pelican doesn't do new products, but figured that since you're an insider, and a shill at that, maybe we could benefit from your considerable influence convincing them to make an exception. And maybe make a few bucks too, since I don't think I've ever met a happy tailshifter. Big market, relatively.

Well sure, that was just an estimate, understood, but the point is that if/when you do all work to your tailshifter the best case result is a car that shifts like a sideshifter, something a lot of sideshifter owners are not all that satisfied with. So then you're looking at the prospect of a Rennshifter, Chris's rear linkage improvements, etc, in other words ANOTHER considerale pile of money. It's the same basic transmission, so it seems you could skip all the expensive intermediate steps by simply improving the tailshifter's linkage. And I'd bet you'd find cables would improve sideshifters too, meaning a lot more market potential. No? Don't agree? Fine, but not too difficult to test the hypothesis.

If Pelican's not the place then who? Whatever you do please don' t suggest George.

[Dave_Darling]

Paging Mikey.... He can pitch it to Morph, and if Morph puts it together you've got a good chance of it being good.

Or Racer Chris. If he puts it together, you know it will work well. Plus he's a master fabricator.

--DD

[Cuda911]

Thanks, guys. So, it doesn't sound cost-prohibitive. Less than a coupe grand, including minor "while you are in there" stuff?

I'm looking at a '70 1.7. I assumed it had a tail shifter, but someone is telling me the car may already have a side shift. I'm supposed to get better details about the car sometime this week, but trying to gather as much info in advance as possible.

[Dave_Darling]

If the linkage goes into the trans at the tail cone, it's a tail shift. If it goes in there in front of the intermediate plate, it's a side shift. The side shift will have a curved rear shift rod, and a curvy cast engine mount with a big hole that the rear shift rod goes through. The tail shift will have a straight rear shift rod with an offset at the firewall, and a straight square-tube type engine mount.

--DD

[kevin311]

If someone takes this on please let me know. I would be happy to provide any info or measurements from my tail-cable shift project.

Kevin

And as has already been said, you can do the swap for a whole lot cheaper if you do it on your own and hunt down your own parts, versus driving the car to a mechanic and having him do the work and find the parts for you.

Yeah, I'm aware Pelican doesn't do new products, but figured that since you're an insider, and a shill at that, maybe we could benefit from your considerable influence convincing them to make an exception. And maybe make a few bucks too, since I don't think I've ever met a happy tailshifter. Big market, relatively.

Well sure, that was just an estimate, understood, but the point is that if/when you do all work to your tailshifter the best case result is a car that shifts like a sideshifter, something a lot of sideshifter owners are not all that satisfied with. So then you're looking at the prospect of a Rennshifter, Chris's rear linkage improvements, etc, in other words ANOTHER considerale pile of money. It's the same basic transmission, so it seems you could skip all the expensive intermediate steps by simply improving the tailshifter's linkage. And I'd bet you'd find cables would improve sideshifters too, meaning a lot more market potential. No? Don't agree? Fine, but not too difficult to test the hypothesis.

If Pelican's not the place then who? Whatever you do please don' t suggest George.

[DBCooper]

I forgot about your project Kevin (this 'getting old' shit really sucks), but it's perfect food for thought: CABLE TAILSHIFTER PROJECT, as an alternative.

Please, post what dimensions you have so folks know what's involved. And how much did it end up costing you? Maybe that will be enough to inspire someone to take it on. Unless of course you want to do it yourself...

[bdstone914]

You actually can do the swap without removing the engine, but it is hardly worth the extra effort.

I have taken out my trans rebuilt, and put back in without taking the engine out.
You could even pull the core out of the trans housing and swap all the parts if you are daring.

And I have removed the engine mount bar without removing the engine.
Just see what happens if you get the whole engine/trans in THEN try getting the side shift bar into the tunnel and you will learn how to do that yourself....

No, you can not do the swap with the engine in the car. The engine has to be out to replace the forward shift rod. You also have to replace the one piece engine mount bracket with the two brackets for the side shift engine bar.