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> WON'T START after driving all day, electrical mystery, Help me get back on the road before Monday!
Chris Pincetich
post Feb 26 2015, 09:48 PM
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So I'm driving home on the twisty roads of West Marin, and my radio cuts out. Then comes back on. Then cuts out. It is wired to the interior light/turn signal circuit if I recall correctly. Turn signals work. NO problems. I get to the Post Office, get my mail, then the car won't start!

Turn key
1) Fuel pump comes on
2) "sound" of something trying to work, possibly starter insides

But, no cranking. Nothing. When I release key from start position, I hear a CLICK.

I got some help, and push started it. It worked! BUT, it ran like CRAP. On acceleration, it popped and even backfired. Whoa. Hardly any power. Limped it home and now it is parked safely in the driveway.

I am so bummed. I have been commuting in the 914, and improving stuff almost every weekend. Just installed a new TPS circuit board, new Optima battery, and cleaned + tightened the battery cables and connections. Ran great this morning!!

D-jet, 1.7 TIV. All fuses OK. Checked rear engine fuses too. 13V across battery terminals.

Been reading and searching the site for help. Found info on bad ignition switches and places to check for voltage drops. I went through the bad ignition switch last year. Maybe it happened again!! Similar symptoms, but why would it run like crap after I push started it if it was only the switch? That has me baffled. What made it run like crap?!?! AND WHY was my radio acting up? I hate electrical gremlins!

D-jet grounds? D-jet "tigger plate" (what't that? TPS?)? Bad CHT?

I can dig into this over the weekend. Gots to fix it by Monday! Maybe I should order a new ignition switch now? What else

Oh yeah, I have the small "eBay" starter. It's now about 8 years old. How do I "jumper" this starter? Just connect the two terminals?

Thanks in advance for any and all help (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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TheCabinetmaker
post Feb 27 2015, 06:52 AM
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Not cranking and running like crap are probably not related. You may have two separate problems. Have you tried to crank it after it cooled off? If it does start when cold, unplug the tps. If it runs better the tps might need to adjusted again. Also check all vacuum hoses and wiring connectors. Make sure the plug with 3 wires on the distributor are plugged in properly. Check dwell and timing
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McMark
post Feb 27 2015, 10:10 AM
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12v at the fuse panel? Maybe the red feed wires between the battery and fuse panel are dropping voltage.
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Dave_Darling
post Feb 27 2015, 11:01 AM
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My first thought was that the battery was flat. 13V is not flat, though! But it does make me suspect all of the connections in the power and ground paths of those circuits. So the red wires, like McMark suggested, plus the grounds.

--DD
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Cap'n Krusty
post Feb 27 2015, 11:12 AM
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Lotta bad batteries will still read 12-13v across unloaded terminals ...

The Cap'n
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rosenfe
post Feb 27 2015, 11:14 AM
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if you search under my name rosenfe -starter motor wont engage march15,2014.you will see apost as to how to jump starter motor.
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Chris Pincetich
post Feb 27 2015, 09:14 PM
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QUOTE(Cap'n Krusty @ Feb 27 2015, 09:12 AM) *

Lotta bad batteries will still read 12-13v across unloaded terminals ...

The Cap'n

Cap'n might be right (IMG:style_emoticons/default/smile.gif)
There was 13v across the relay board with the key ON, and jumpering the starter resulted in the sorry noise and effort from the starter that I usually hear when the battery is basically almost dead. I'll connect the battery to a charger and test it again tomorrow. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

The eBay mini starter was harder to "jumper" than the OEM. The spade connector is inside a plastic chamber, so I needed to connect my trusty tester wire w female connector to it then bend that wire around the hot post.
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Porschef
post Feb 28 2015, 08:27 AM
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Just a thought, possibly your alternator has crapped out and your system is now running solely on battery power?

Might tie the two symptoms together... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)
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thieuster
post Feb 28 2015, 10:34 AM
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QUOTE(Porschef @ Feb 28 2015, 03:27 PM) *

Just a thought, possibly your alternator has crapped out and your system is now running solely on battery power?

Might tie the two symptoms together... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)


It sounds as if the electrical current is unable to perform the full cycle. (I don't know how to explain this better in English, sorry). Did you check all earth straps etc. Intermittent electrical problems (here: all sorts of different electrical components) are often traceable to earthing problems. Ask yourself: what are the various components sharing?

Another possible problem: dirty fuse contacts. The fuse looks okay, but the tips are often clogged up with some sort of dirt/corrosion. Emery paper is your friend here. And, check the 12 volt side of the coil for the same dirt problems. Again, emery paper is your friend.

Menno
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thieuster
post Feb 28 2015, 10:34 AM
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QUOTE(Porschef @ Feb 28 2015, 03:27 PM) *

Just a thought, possibly your alternator has crapped out and your system is now running solely on battery power?

Might tie the two symptoms together... (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)


It sounds as if the electrical current is unable to perform the full cycle. (I don't know how to explain this better in English, sorry). Did you check all earth straps etc. Intermittent electrical problems (here: all sorts of different electrical components) are often traceable to earthing problems. Ask yourself: what are the various components sharing?

Another possible problem: dirty fuse contacts. The fuse looks okay, but the tips are often clogged up with some sort of dirt/corrosion. Emery paper is your friend here. And, check the 12 volt side of the coil for the same dirt problems. Again, emery paper is your friend.

Menno
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Tom
post Feb 28 2015, 02:25 PM
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Check the red wires at the battery positive, especially their connectors. If you have broken strands and or corrosion, cut them back an inch or so and install new connections.
Tom
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r_towle
post Feb 28 2015, 02:34 PM
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Pull the battery and bring it to Sears.
Have them load test it to remove that doubt.

Rich
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Chris Pincetich
post Feb 28 2015, 07:03 PM
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OK, after trickle charging the battery, the engine starts and runs fine (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
BUT I am not getting more than 12.5V now when the engine is running.
I replaced the voltage regulator with a new one that fits (NAPA Auto Parts, ECH VR503). Still not getting >12.5V while the engine is running.
ALSO, weird, the with multiple ON/OFF cycles, watching the "G" alternator light on my stock combo gauge, it did not always illuminate?!?! Seems like this must always turn on for the alternator to start charging. It did MOST of the time. Weird.

I think I have a bad alternator. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/sad.gif)

I'll probably also take the battery in for a load test soon too. I just bought it, may be killing it, and it might be replaceable under warranty if I act quickly.

AM I missing something (IMG:style_emoticons/default/confused24.gif)

Thanks for all the help so far (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)
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r_towle
post Feb 28 2015, 07:27 PM
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How are you checking the voltage while running?
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Chris Pincetich
post Feb 28 2015, 07:56 PM
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QUOTE(r_towle @ Feb 28 2015, 05:27 PM) *

How are you checking the voltage while running?

Correctly, I hope (IMG:style_emoticons/default/biggrin.gif)

With the engine having just started, I rev it up for 20 seconds or so. Then, it drops to idle, and I go back to the battery and put my volt meter on both posts. I've also tried touching the volt meter to the input wires only, not the battery terminals. Reading 12.5V

Multiple ON/OFF cycles caused it to drop to about 12.3V

I have not driven the car around because I don't want it to die on the road near my house, which are twisty, narrow roads on hills. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/driving.gif) (IMG:style_emoticons/default/beerchug.gif)

Any advice?
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Chris Pincetich
post Feb 28 2015, 07:59 PM
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The alternator belt is on, and seemingly correct tension.
Tomorrow I plan to get under the car and check the alternator more closely: belt tension, mounting position, wiring etc..
AND trickle charge the battery back up to 13V
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Porsche930dude
post Feb 28 2015, 08:07 PM
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youre battery sounds ok but youre alternator certainly isnt putting a charge to it. It should be atleast 13.5 when running weather the battery is charged or not.
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Spoke
post Mar 1 2015, 07:51 AM
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You can do a quick test of the alternator's ability to charge by removing the voltage regulator and shorting the D+ and DF connections on the relay board. This is equivalent to the VR signaling the alternator to produce maximum voltage. You should see about 16V on the battery.
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stugray
post Mar 1 2015, 12:36 PM
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Explain more about the alternator light and it's odd behavior.

It should turn ON when you turn the key to on, then turn OFF when the engine starts running.

Any behavior other than that will tell us where the problem is.
I forget who our resident expert on Alternators is.
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rhodyguy
post Mar 1 2015, 12:55 PM
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Have you cleaned the alt bulb and the socket? Sorry if already posted.
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