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> Help! Car won't shut off!!, Turn key off, car keeps running
PorscheTom
post Mar 14 2005, 11:43 AM
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Hello all,

After fixing a problem with falling off heater parts, (Thanks Mark!) I finally got my 914 back on the road yesterday.

Took it for a drive, started right up after sitting for over a month, off I went. When I returned I turned the key off and the engine kept going just like I had not moved the key! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/ohmy.gif) What the hell!?

To stop it, I put it in gear and let out the clutch with the brake on, killed it. Gen and Oil lights came on. It restarted fine - no starter issues there - then I killed it again. I then disconnected the negative terminal of the battery (large spark ensued when I pulled it off) and walked away from it.

Side note that I'm not sure makes any difference...since I've owned the car when I first start it the left & right turn signal indicators in the tach glow. Reciently, they've been glowing pretty brightly, then after running awhile they will pretty much go out. Strange, I know. Don't know if it's related to this issue or not.

Anyway, the car has never done this before. Anyone have any ideas on where to begin looking for this problem. I'd rather not sign over my paycheck to the auto electric guy but I guess I will if I have to. I want to drive my car! (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/driving.gif)

Any advice would be appreciated.
Regards,
Tom
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iiibdsiil
post Mar 14 2005, 11:50 AM
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I believe the turn signal indicators glowing like that is a bad ground, although someone here will know for sure.

If that is so, then that is probably a good place to start in search of your problem.

Maybe your car just wants to be driven more?
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Dr Evil
post Mar 14 2005, 11:52 AM
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Make sure the starter is not turning/engauged while the engine is running. If you have an external start relay, it could be faulting. If the starter is not constantly engauged, then try the ignition switch in the collumn. What year is it? When you killed it with the clutch, was everything still energized? Accessories? Be carefull not to catch your car on fire due to a short drawing too much current through your 30 year old wiring.
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McMark
post Mar 14 2005, 11:57 AM
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Is your ignition switch weird? As in do you have to turn the key extra hard to make it kick over? Could be a bad ignition switch. With the key off and the battery hooked up, use a tester light to see which fuses are getting power. That'll help figure it out.
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kkelly
post Mar 14 2005, 01:02 PM
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Either your ignition switch has a problem, or you have a ground short somewhere. A lot of electrial circuits are wired into the ignition switch besides the starter.

Try removing the fuses (one by one) for the turn signals, highlights, etc. See if that works before digging into the steering column to replace the ignition switch.

Kevin.
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Joe Bob
post Mar 14 2005, 01:11 PM
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Have you changed the ignition system to a higher output/discharge type? I did and the D+ wire on the alternator needed an inline diode to keep from energizing the ignition when it was off....
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ninefourteener
post Mar 14 2005, 01:17 PM
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I had a similar problem with my last teener... except instead of it not turning off, I would be driving down the highway and it would just urn off for no reason, and I'd be coasting to a stop.

Turns out, it was the switch inside the ingtion cylinder in the steering column.

After continuously trying to start it over and over again, something inside broke, and the key would spin around in cirlcles--LOL

I got the part from Tweeks, it was like 12 or 13 dollars, and according to them, its a high purchase item. Might be worth checking out.

M
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PorscheTom
post Mar 14 2005, 03:27 PM
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Hello Guys,
Thx for the replies.

Here some more info for those who asked questions:
Dr. Evil: The starter is not dragging while the engine is running. There is no external 'hot start' relays in the system. Yes, everything was still energized just as though I had just turned the key on but not taken it over to the start location.

McMark: that's the problem, I cannot get the switch to turn off. If I reconnect the battery up, the car power is back on even though the key is in the off position. My ignition switch did not have any symptoms like hard to turn and so forth prior to this. I can remove the key from the lock without turning it off but I think that is just a key issue, not the ignition switch.

Kkelly: interesting thought. I could remove each fuse one by one each time reconnecting the battery until I either have all of the fuses out or the power is turned off. I might try this.

Mikez: No, still has the stock ignition and FI system.

ninefourteener: Yes, my first thought was the ignition switch as well.

I think I'll clean up all of the ground connections, then try to fuse testing. If that does not produce any new symptoms I guess I'll dive into the ignition switch and change it.

Anybody else have any suggestions...? (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/idea.gif)

Thanks for the advice. (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wavey.gif)
Regards,
Tom
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Dave_Darling
post Mar 14 2005, 03:45 PM
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Mine would stay running as long as I had the left turn signal on. Turns out the "parking light" function was feeding power back through the ignition switch, and that was enough to run the ignition and keep the engine going!! I had swapped a single-filament bulb in for the dual-filament rear turn signal bulb, and that cross-connected a "hot" and a ground when the parking light feature was on.

It isn't always just the wires that can lead your car to being mis-wired....

--DD
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ovilla
post Mar 14 2005, 04:10 PM
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I had the same problem and I ended up just replacing the ignition switch. That did it for me. Good luck!
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ewdysar
post Mar 14 2005, 06:33 PM
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MikeZ,

My 327 Renegade conversion runs on after the ignition is turned off. I'm running MSD so I might be having the problem that you described. When the ignition switch is off, the alternator light comes on, the gauges go dead and the fuel pump shuts down. The engione will run until the carb runs dry. I've found that putting on the brakes (appears to bring the system voltage down by about a 1 volt when the lights come on) kills the engine.

What is the diode that you're talking about?

Eric
'75 914 327 SBC
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Joe Bob
post Mar 14 2005, 06:59 PM
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My electrical friend brought it over....1-2 amp directional diode. I bet if you went to the MSD website they will have one...common problem I hear.
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jones
post Mar 14 2005, 07:14 PM
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Christine (IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/unsure.gif)
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SirAndy
post Mar 14 2005, 07:53 PM
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QUOTE (iiibdsiil @ Mar 14 2005, 09:50 AM)
I believe the turn signal indicators glowing like that is a bad ground, although someone here will know for sure.

it most certainly is.

quick fix (oh my god, is that really me talking?):
add a separate ground to the bulbs, that way, you bypass whatever faulty ground you have in the system.
works like a charme. (but you still have a faulty groiund somewhere!)

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif) Andy

PS: Discalimer:
i am i no way responsible for your burned up car due to faulty wiring. expressed or implied. never. i am no automotive electrician nor do i play one on TV. sorry ...
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PorscheTom
post Mar 15 2005, 10:59 AM
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SirAndy,

Do you think that the bad ground might also keep the car from shutting down when I turn the key off?

Thanks,
Tom
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Rhodes71/914
post Mar 15 2005, 11:31 AM
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Can a bad ground lead to battery drain even when the key is off?
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SirAndy
post Mar 15 2005, 12:34 PM
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QUOTE (Rhodes71/914 @ Mar 15 2005, 09:31 AM)
Can a bad ground lead to battery drain even when the key is off?

i don't think so, but a faulty ignition switch can do that for you ...

(IMG:http://www.914world.com/bbs2/html/emoticons/wink.gif) Andy
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PorscheTom
post Apr 11 2005, 10:43 AM
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Hello guys,

Just thought I'd add a final post to this question I asked in case someone else has a similar problem...

I replaced the ignition switch last Sunday and that was it. Not hard to do at all with the PP tech tip. (I bought the switch from PP also).

I cleaned up the ground points as well. I still have the glowing turn signal indicators but I'll chase that one down here shortly.

Anyway, thanks to all who replied. It's fixed and running again now...finally!
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